GUILTY - Tammy Moorer - trial for Kidnapping Heather Elvis, 8 Oct 2018 *Appeals denied* #11

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Just finished Thread #2, not much there...

@NFYIAMY said:
Does anyone know if or how well the area around and behind LB’s was searched back at the time of the initial investigation? I can’t recall and can’t find anything in my notes. ‍♀️
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I didn't even know where that place was at first but now that I do I believe it was a part of the searches done by CUE that included people on horseback.

@jillycat said:
I would like to take Aaron out to lunch.

I would also like to understand how deleting a Google account permanently eliminates all records associated with that account, given how such a footprint doesn't easily disappear, and given Google's data collection practices.
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I would imagine Google still has it somewhere and it could be subpoenaed, however back then remember how big of an issue it was with the tech companies not wanting to turn over people's information due to privacy concerns. Also, the M's had iPhones so I don't know if their Google accounts would have helped that much. Heather's was a Galaxy, like mine, and you basically need to be logged into google to do anything on it.

@Soulmagent said:
I thought the courtroom would be packed !I remember not following this case to closely because it was a fast moving busy thread.
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Also, everyone was still cleaning up after Florence, there was a lot of people displaced or evacuating from flooding, it was a nasty situation so it would have prevented some who otherwise would have been free to attend from being able to make it to Conway.

HAHAHA, I love everyone's responses to Joyce Aland. She was my freaking hero. The annoyance, the side-eye, the whole southern "bless your heart" mannerisms and calling him sir. That epic moment where he stopped for a moment and she picked up the pitcher to pour herself a drink with a giant sigh. I was watching live and remember laughing and thinking that was 100% something I would do but would be wishing it was coffee and even showed my coworkers and they agreed that 100% was me eye-rolling my way into next week.
 
NL did a great job tying all the evidence together at trial. I'm so grateful the jurors were able to see through TM's crap. But there was so much that wasn't presented. Those of you that were here from the start, remember what a large role social media played in this case. It was the first time I had ever experienced that in a case. Just when you thought TM had reached a whole new low, she upped the anti! Mostly IMO it was a whole lot of look here, not there. If she mentioned something, you needed to pay attention. A number of times she was providing a possible alibi. Sex all over town that night-they were stalking Heather. Her pregnancy in jail-she found out they had video of Sid at WalMart. We actually should create a post with all the other examples, it would be interesting to see them in bullet form. That visit to his parent's house is significant, I'm just not sure exactly how.

CarolinaAsh welcome back. Looking forward to discussing the possibilities of where you think Heather may be.
 
I just saw a commercial for the Disney Collection from Zales on TV. After watching Tammy in action on YouTube, it brought a smile to my face to think of her in prison possibly seeing that commercial on a tv.... Hope Sidney tells what he knows.
 
Knox said:
NL did a great job tying all the evidence together at trial. I'm so grateful the jurors were able to see through TM's crap. But there was so much that wasn't presented. Those of you that were here from the start, remember what a large role social media played in this case. It was the first time I had ever experienced that in a case. Just when you thought TM had reached a whole new low, she upped the anti! Mostly IMO it was a whole lot of look here, not there. If she mentioned something, you needed to pay attention. A number of times she was providing a possible alibi. Sex all over town that night-they were stalking Heather. Her pregnancy in jail-she found out they had video of Sid at WalMart. We actually should create a post with all the other examples, it would be interesting to see them in bullet form. That visit to his parent's house is significant, I'm just not sure exactly how.

CarolinaAsh welcome back. Looking forward to discussing the possibilities of where you think Heather may be.
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Thanks! And I agree that at the start this thing was definitely a three-ring-circus. TM thought she was the master of ceremonies and acted accordingly. That is to say with extreme ego and theatrics. I'm also sure that visit was significant and am not sure how. I'm kind of wondering if it was to placate SM. I figure maybe he knew it wasn't going to last but was too chicken to tell her they were going to get caught so he somehow managed to tit-for-tat a visit to his parents before the whole thing came crumbling down. Because he doesn't seem like a bad guy like she is clearly awful. He seems like he is too easily controlled and manipulated is all. And I do think that he probably didn't know what was going to happen to HE until it was too late.

As for what I think happened, everyone says they don't think TM would want HE near her, but I disagree. I think she's a sadist. I think she took HE at LB and took her back to the compound restrained, and the SM drove HE's car to her apt, and then PTL. I think he was supposed to somehow make other contacts on her phone from PTL so that it would throw people off but I think he panicked after trying to call TM so many times and forgot, and I do think he tossed the phone but not from PTL directly, remember he was training for a Disney Marathon that following January, so he was used to running and such. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he ran from home down the wood trails into WWR since their house is right on the edge of it. Keep in mind that Winter 2013 may have overall been cold, but that particular night we had an above average heatwave come through so it was relatively nice out and it was a full moon. I also am not sold that HE met her fate that night, I feel like TM may have wanted to have fun with her first (remember, I think she's a sadist) and probably made HE watch her and SM. (sorry if you just ate...) but ultimately I believe she is under that concrete firepit area in their yard. I am seriously hoping that they bring in GPR to see if there's any reason to get a warrant to excavate now that TM has been found guilty. (This is speculation and my opinion and I have no insider knowledge as to how accurate this is.)

Also not sure if any of the other locals have mentioned this or even really know but there has been some LE turnover since this started that may help. For one thing, HCPD has a new Chief of Police, Chief Hill. He came from somewhere up north (I wanna say Jersey) and has been trying to whip the department back into shape (Heads up if you visit, one of his pet peeves is traffic laws so watch your speed and stuff. I have noticed them out a LOT more first hand.) He is not part of the good ol' boy network, and he seems pretty dedicated to making Horry County respectable again. He was also pretty freaking awesome during Hurricane Florence and the subsequent flooding with keeping everyone informed and having a real visual presence of the HCPD helping the community, who was coming to help us, and keeping residents updated on social media. He even has an account on Nextdoor and was sending out messages to residents of the county on there. So I'm hopeful that if he gets pulled into this and at a point where he can do something, he will.
 
CarolinaAsh said:
Thanks! And I agree that at the start this thing was definitely a three-ring-circus. TM thought she was the master of ceremonies and acted accordingly. That is to say with extreme ego and theatrics. I'm also sure that visit was significant and am not sure how. I'm kind of wondering if it was to placate SM. I figure maybe he knew it wasn't going to last but was too chicken to tell her they were going to get caught so he somehow managed to tit-for-tat a visit to his parents before the whole thing came crumbling down. Because he doesn't seem like a bad guy like she is clearly awful. He seems like he is too easily controlled and manipulated is all. And I do think that he probably didn't know what was going to happen to HE until it was too late.

As for what I think happened, everyone says they don't think TM would want HE near her, but I disagree. I think she's a sadist. I think she took HE at LB and took her back to the compound restrained, and the SM drove HE's car to her apt, and then PTL. I think he was supposed to somehow make other contacts on her phone from PTL so that it would throw people off but I think he panicked after trying to call TM so many times and forgot, and I do think he tossed the phone but not from PTL directly, remember he was training for a Disney Marathon that following January, so he was used to running and such. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he ran from home down the wood trails into WWR since their house is right on the edge of it. Keep in mind that Winter 2013 may have overall been cold, but that particular night we had an above average heatwave come through so it was relatively nice out and it was a full moon. I also am not sold that HE met her fate that night, I feel like TM may have wanted to have fun with her first (remember, I think she's a sadist) and probably made HE watch her and SM. (sorry if you just ate...) but ultimately I believe she is under that concrete firepit area in their yard. I am seriously hoping that they bring in GPR to see if there's any reason to get a warrant to excavate now that TM has been found guilty. (This is speculation and my opinion and I have no insider knowledge as to how accurate this is.)

Also not sure if any of the other locals have mentioned this or even really know but there has been some LE turnover since this started that may help. For one thing, HCPD has a new Chief of Police, Chief Hill. He came from somewhere up north (I wanna say Jersey) and has been trying to whip the department back into shape (Heads up if you visit, one of his pet peeves is traffic laws so watch your speed and stuff. I have noticed them out a LOT more first hand.) He is not part of the good ol' boy network, and he seems pretty dedicated to making Horry County respectable again. He was also pretty freaking awesome during Hurricane Florence and the subsequent flooding with keeping everyone informed and having a real visual presence of the HCPD helping the community, who was coming to help us, and keeping residents updated on social media. He even has an account on Nextdoor and was sending out messages to residents of the county on there. So I'm hopeful that if he gets pulled into this and at a point where he can do something, he will.
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Hi Carolina,

Interesting post!

I have often wondered if Sidney believed that Tammy only wanted to talk with Heather, maybe chew her out for going after her husband, but never that TM would kill her.

I am also in agreement with you in thinking Heather is not in a landfill after being placed in Longbeard's dumpster. How creepy if she was under their Mickey firepit. I wish that LE would have torn that up or used radar (or whatever is used to detect things underground). Heather deserves to be found and respectfully laid to rest. Her family, I think, would rest a bit easier if they could visit Heather. I hope that the kidnapping conviction will reopen the murder charges. Maybe it would be incentive for LE to revisit the Moorer property and seek more evidence against them. As I said before, Heather deserves to be found.

ETA: Thank you for pointing out that you think CUE searched the Longbeard's area. I wonder if anyone had a look in the dumpster or that little pond. But... Probably by the time CUE went there to search, the dumpster would have been emptied. I don't think this is where Heather ended up, but it would have been useful if this theory could have been ruled out.
 
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So I was mid Thread #3 when I went to bed last night and it didn't seem like it was going to be very active on replies from me, so at work today I started to read again and had to stop because it hit the part where someone finally lit the fireworks (aka. Officer Lynch from NMBPD.) so now I am back at it and I can't wait to see the reactions on here. It was explosive right?
 
Okay I'm on to Thread #5 next, the only thing I got is that you guys are awesome, and that it drove me insane not being able to interject about the text regarding the ad (aka the bi-lo ad her sister asked for.)
 
CarolinaAsh said:
Okay I'm on to Thread #5 next, the only thing I got is that you guys are awesome, and that it drove me insane not being able to interject about the text regarding the ad (aka the bi-lo ad her sister asked for.)
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With your theory of him having her car and driving it to her place, ( by the way, that's my theory also) do you really believe with the timing of that text that it was about an advertisement for Bi-Lo? Or do you think "he ad" has a different meaning due to the great timeline that is on the media thread? I'm not sure where it is in the threads if you are coming across it.
 
dixiegirl1035 said:
With your theory of him having her car and driving it to her place, ( by the way, that's my theory also) do you really believe with the timing of that text that it was about an advertisement for Bi-Lo? Or do you think "he ad" has a different meaning due to the great timeline that is on the media thread? I'm not sure where it is in the threads if you are coming across it.
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Oh no, I have no doubt it was about the ad. It was sent that morning so, why would her address have anything to do with it when they'd been stalking her for weeks. They already knew where she lived. Besides the text was to TM's sister. It was a direct response to her asking them to bring her the bi-lo ad because she was couponing and was going to bi-lo in the morning. I don't know if AC knew anything at the point she asked about it but TM probably saw it as a good way to cover her rear and give her an alibi. So she pointedly texted AC she had gotten the ad so there was a record she had been to the grocery store, in case someone saw their truck out at that time of night. Otherwise, she wouldn't have bothered she'd have just handed her the ad when she brought the kids out. In fact, that actually makes it even more suspicious when you consider AC's testimony. She asked TM to bring her a bi-lo ad, and even after she had said to her to nevermind because it was online TM still texted to tell her she had gotten it. If she had really gotten it wouldn't she have met AC at the back door to hand it to her, knowing she was going to bi-lo in the morning, and then walked home with her kids? But instead, AC testified that she let the kids out the back door and locked it behind them and that TM and SM were unlocking the house. So, why would she not give her the paper ad, unless she never had the paper ad and it was just a ploy to attempt to set up a weak alibi?

Of course, all MOO.
 
CarolinaAsh said:
As for what I think happened, everyone says they don't think TM would want HE near her, but I disagree. I think she's a sadist. I think she took HE at LB and took her back to the compound restrained, and the SM drove HE's car to her apt, and then PTL. I think he was supposed to somehow make other contacts on her phone from PTL so that it would throw people off but I think he panicked after trying to call TM so many times and forgot, and I do think he tossed the phone but not from PTL directly, remember he was training for a Disney Marathon that following January, so he was used to running and such. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he ran from home down the wood trails into WWR since their house is right on the edge of it. Keep in mind that Winter 2013 may have overall been cold, but that particular night we had an above average heatwave come through so it was relatively nice out and it was a full moon. I also am not sold that HE met her fate that night, I feel like TM may have wanted to have fun with her first (remember, I think she's a sadist) and probably made HE watch her and SM. (sorry if you just ate...) but ultimately I believe she is under that concrete firepit area in their yard. I am seriously hoping that they bring in GPR to see if there's any reason to get a warrant to excavate now that TM has been found guilty. (This is speculation and my opinion and I have no insider knowledge as to how accurate this is.)
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RSBM

Hi CarolinaAsh, so good to see you posting again! I can't believe after all the time I've invested in following this case over the years, I actually missed Tammy's trial. I've been busy with other things. Something made me check WS and I'm now on Thread #6 of Tammy's trial. Thought I'd jump ahead to see what folks are saying.

I snipped your post because I agree with what you've said. I've always believed that HE is buried either on their property, somewhere under that "overly landscaped" front yard, or in the extensive woods behind their house (or, maybe sounds weird, but in a secret room/bunker on their property or in those woods). TM would absolutely want to have that kind of control. Leaving HE's body in the water at PTL or in the dumpster at Longbeard's would leave too much of a chance that she would be found. And it's clear to me that TM is quite sure HE will never be found. Under the concrete firepit sounds like a good possibility. I've never understood why LE never seemed to be interested in digging up that yard/driveway. I also think they brought HE back to the compound alive and dragged out whatever her fate was. TM and SM had no qualms torturing the Elvis family (taunting them on FB, harassing the searchers, filing charges against Heather's dad, etc.), and I believe that was just an extension of whatever they did to HE. Makes me so sad, just typing all that out.

Let's hope HE is found and her family can finally give her a proper burial.
 
LookingForClues said:
RSBM

Hi CarolinaAsh, so good to see you posting again! I can't believe after all the time I've invested in following this case over the years, I actually missed Tammy's trial. I've been busy with other things. Something made me check WS and I'm now on Thread #6 of Tammy's trial. Thought I'd jump ahead to see what folks are saying.

I snipped your post because I agree with what you've said. I've always believed that HE is buried either on their property, somewhere under that "overly landscaped" front yard, or in the extensive woods behind their house (or, maybe sounds weird, but in a secret room/bunker on their property or in those woods). TM would absolutely want to have that kind of control. Leaving HE's body in the water at PTL or in the dumpster at Longbeard's would leave too much of a chance that she would be found. And it's clear to me that TM is quite sure HE will never be found. Under the concrete firepit sounds like a good possibility. I've never understood why LE never seemed to be interested in digging up that yard/driveway. I also think they brought HE back to the compound alive and dragged out whatever her fate was. TM and SM had no qualms torturing the Elvis family (taunting them on FB, harassing the searchers, filing charges against Heather's dad, etc.), and I believe that was just an extension of whatever they did to HE. Makes me so sad, just typing all that out.

Let's hope HE is found and her family can finally give her a proper burial.
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I liked this, but I don't like it because I hate this story and idea and it makes me sad and angry.
 
Also, listening to TMs trial over again, AC was texting her from two different phones that night. One from her actual number and another from a number not associated with any name. I barely caught it but I did. I don’t know why they didn’t make a bigger deal about that. Makes you wonder....
 
AddysMom7610 said:
Also, listening to TMs trial over again, AC was texting her from two different phones that night. One from her actual number and another from a number not associated with any name. I barely caught it but I did. I don’t know why they didn’t make a bigger deal about that. Makes you wonder....
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Good catch, I missed that. Could it have been TM's father's phone? While deliberating, the jury had asked for his telephone number. Something must have prompted them to do so.
 
jash said:
Good catch, I missed that. Could it have been TM's father's phone? While deliberating, the jury had asked for his telephone number. Something must have prompted them to do so.
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Whoever’s phone it was didn’t have a name associated with it. So who knows but I’d put a lot of money on it being one of the family members. It REALLY struck me when the jury came back with that question.

I wish they had looked at ACs and WCs phone records and pings. I fully believe we would have HEs location or at least know more about where she was placed if this had happened.
 
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