AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #25

[cluciano63]

I have always felt like this could be someone the family has encountered in the course of their lives, and they sound like they do as well, imo. They seemed to say they had some ideas and you can’t have ideas about someone you have never hears of or met, imo. Unless they are guessing at motives rather than individuals.

 

[1987]

And either way, they still did not leave evidence, apparently. I think that fact is what mystified and baffled the sheriff. He could not understand how nothing would be left behind if he or they had been inside for any length of time. Jmo

there could be something there and not found...yet. it also could be something that has been found but matches a rule out test because had been known to have recently been there. we don't know who all has been tested as a rule out and we don't know who all may have had reason to have left prints or dna. moo.

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

Did he really say it multiple times? I only heard it the one time, during the radio interview (sorry I don’t have a link, and I don’t remember the station)...he said something to the effect of “being in there for 4 minutes”, but then right after that it almost sounded as though he was correcting himself, or kind of backtracking from that, explaining that they arrived in 4 minutes after being dispatched.

Maybe I should go listen to the interview again, as now I’m wondering if I missed other articles because you said that the sheriff said it multiple times.
I may be wrong in my impression, but I kind of thought he misspoke in a way. I mean, I know he said right after that about how if the perp was in the house 25 min, there would be more evidence left, as opposed to being inside for a minute or so. But I don’t really think he meant 4 minutes literally...I think he said 4 minutes because that number has been reported and written about so many times. I feel like that “4 minutes” has just become a part of the story, much like the 2 shots fired...even though we have no factual information on that.

It might very well be that it was only 4 minutes, but how could he possibly know that for sure? I don’t see how any of us can be clear on that at this point.

Backtracking. Yes. Clouseau? Clueless? Hope for the former.

 

[bizzle2]

Did he really say it multiple times? I only heard it the one time, during the radio interview (sorry I don’t have a link, and I don’t remember the station)...he said something to the effect of “being in there for 4 minutes”, but then right after that it almost sounded as though he was correcting himself, or kind of backtracking from that, explaining that they arrived in 4 minutes after being dispatched.

Maybe I should go listen to the interview again, as now I’m wondering if I missed other articles because you said that the sheriff said it multiple times.
I may be wrong in my impression, but I kind of thought he misspoke in a way. I mean, I know he said right after that about how if the perp was in the house 25 min, there would be more evidence left, as opposed to being inside for a minute or so. But I don’t really think he meant 4 minutes literally...I think he said 4 minutes because that number has been reported and written about so many times. I feel like that “4 minutes” has just become a part of the story, much like the 2 shots fired...even though we have no factual information on that.

It might very well be that it was only 4 minutes, but how could he possibly know that for sure? I don’t see how any of us can be clear on that at this point.

I've never taken the 4 minutes as literally. I think he was just using that because it was how long it took them to get to the house. Based on the 911 call, response time, the call log, and other info I'd estimate the perp was in the house for 2-9 minutes. There are some ways they may have a really good estimate of how long, but it's impossible to say whether or not they know because they're not saying.

As far as saying it multiple times, there was another point during that same interview where there was a facebook question by someone asking:

"How long had the parents been dead for? Do you think someone may have been there much longer than originally believed?"

Sheriff's Answer: I don't know their time of death, but we don't believe so.


I'd add that it's not just this interview alone that makes me think the timeline is shorter. Another thing is that if you remember LE asking about about anyone who saw the cars in the area. They only asked for 12:30am-1:30am. If LE believed the crime started at 12:31am, which is when the neighbors told media that they heard the shots, then they would have extended that timeline to earlier. They'd have wanted to know about those vehicles being in the area earlier than 12:30am. I mean, LE knows for a fact the perp left the house by 1am, yet they still extend the timeline when looking for the vehicles to 1:30am.

Every indication from LE has been that their working timeline for the crime is a pretty narrow 2-9 minute window. Is it possible that they are wrong? Of course it is! But they know a lot more than we do, and when they give multiple indications about a timeline I am going to go with what they say.

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

CNN.com - Transcripts
I don’t think I’ve seen the boat discussed, forgive me if it has been.
I thought I had read something about the neighbor talking about being out at his boat with his dog but couldn’t find it again searching. It was in a video lol. Just read this transcript and it’s there.
SMREKAR: “No, and I don`t sleep well at night and I was about at the boat. 1:00 --ish and our dog was on the porch and he was doing some light noises”

Is he saying he was out with the dog around 1ish yet heard or noticed nothing??

Thank you. That 1 a.m. time frame has long bothered me.

 

[bizzle2]

I was certain there had to be some footprints... and that would at least give a clue to size/height...

Then watched the full 57 minute interview with sheriff... where he answers random questions... about halfway threw he says you’d hope for fingerprints or shoe prints but no.. I was stunned at that..

Made me think booties on shoes or perp simply never even set foot in house..you would think fibers on booties would be left or leave a weird imprint... makes me think never a step in house...

Shooting 2 in entryway is conceivable..
Getting jayme to walk out of house and go with perp without entry makes me think at the least jayme knows perp... Or makes my head hurt cause I don’t want this perp to get away with it...Or dexter moved to baron wi.

The booties are an interesting thought. Would definitely mean there was a fairly sophisticated level of planning if that is the case.

I was surprised too that there were no shoeprints. It sounded like a fairly bloody scene so I would have thought there was a shoeprint of some kind, but sounds like there wasn't.

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

The booties are an interesting thought. Would definitely mean there was a fairly sophisticated level of planning if that is the case.

I was surprised too that there were no shoeprints. It sounded like a fairly bloody scene so I would have thought there was a shoeprint of some kind, but sounds like there wasn't.

Booties leave a foot print when walking through blood.

 

[MsFacetious]

I do not suspect family of nothing. I suspect someone connected to family, with family having no part aside from being kind.

Anyway I do not make rules lol...was just saying what I thought to be policy here. Just my opinion as always.

Whatever we find I feel sure L.e already knows. But one can always submit a tip if they come across something that could be important and possibly overlooked...jmo

I definitely think there are things that cannot be posted here but SHOULD be submitted as tips! If you find something that you think should be considered but it might not be totally obvious, send it in! Just because we can't discuss it doesn't mean that LE doesn't need to know about it.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

Thank you. That 1 a.m. time frame has long bothered me.

Reading the transcript, there’s a conflict in the statements as the Mrs claims they were in bed while the Mr remarks being “on the boat” (assuming on a trailer in the yard?) These neighbors frustrate me as does the media for not noticing the discrepency in statements . . .

From transcript:
18:25:17] BANFIELD: Can I ask you Joan --

SMREKAR: It was a lot closer than usual, that we would hear something at that time of night.

BANFIELD: Even though this is fairly rural, you are right next door, correct?

SMREKAR: Right.

BANFIELD: Yes. Can I ask you, just prior to hearing those two shots, as you said, a couple seconds apart, would you have been in a position to hear

any other shots before or after? Was there anything noisy that you may have missed?

SMREKAR: When we came home, we noticed nothing different in the neighborhood. And there was nothing prior to that. No noise, no nothing.

And when that happened, it was so overpowering, the noise, we did not hear anything else. There was no -- we hear the shots, like I said, from the

woods, and they`re not anything near the sound of this gun.

BANFIELD: Can I ask you about the Closs family? I mean, this is just such a horror that is been visited on them. I think most people are wondering,

what were they like?

SMREKAR: They were very quiet people. We only saw them come and go from their home. We took mail up to them that got delivered to us, and they

didn`t even want to come to the door. They were just quiet, preferred I guess to be alone. You didn`t see them out in the yard doing anything. At

least we didn`t.

BANFIELD: Did you ever see Jaime with any friends? Or did she ever come and go and get picked up by friends in vehicles of any kind?

SMREKAR: That I can`t tell you, I just know that the school bus dropped her off?

BANFIELD: And you would see her dropped off daily in front of the house by the school bus?

SMREKAR: Yes.

BANFIELD: But other than that, you didn`t see collections of friends coming and going from that house?

SMREKAR: No. We didn`t even know they had any children. They just weren`t out there doing things.

BANFIELD: That is remarkable. And that night, I guess it goes without saying you didn`t hear any vehicles coming or going, especially right

around the time of the gunshots?

SMREKAR: No, and I don`t sleep well at night and I was about at the boat. 1:00 --ish and our dog was on the porch and he was doing some light noises

and I knew something was up. But I could not see anything anywhere that looked or felt out of line. And I told the FBI people that have been here

a couple times.

I said, you know, from now on, if I hear something that doesn`t sound appropriate for that time of night. I`m going to call in immediately,

because we just thought it was maybe a neighbor chasing a bear out of their yard, you know.

BANFIELD: Well, Joan, don`t think anything otherwise, because I`ve lived in a rural area for a long time, and there are just many sounds that you

wouldn`t think twice about. Thank you for being on with us, and thank you for helping us sort through these very difficult details. I want to bring

in Karen Smith if I can. She is a retired detective with the Jacksonville Sheriff`s Office and a forensic specialist.

 

[Jazzy5980]

I don't understand why we can post interviews from family but not other articles about family. what I would like to post is not social media, it is a news article, but it dates to before the crime so I don't think I can post it.

Sounds interesting. Probably a question for mods.

 

[bellyup]

If the entry way to the home is carpeted it really removes much chance for useable footprints. Especially if someone only took a couple steps inside. Or none at all.

The concrete walkway isn’t likely to give much in the way of footprints either if it were a dry night.

Breaking in the door could have been done with the butt of the gun (not a foot).

It would be great to find floorplans of homes in the area. I think I have a pretty good idea of the layout based on windows and style / age of home.

I don’t think the perp would have had to take more than 3-4 steps max to have a shot at the bathroom door / doorway.

This is all just convincing me that this was very specifically planned.

 

[bellyup]

Reading the transcript, there’s a conflict in the statements as the Mrs claims they were in bed while the Mr remarks being “on the boat” (assuming on a trailer in the yard?) These neighbors frustrate me as does the media for not noticing the discrepency in statements . . .

SMREKAR: That I can`t tell you, I just know that the school bus dropped her off?
BANFIELD: And you would see her dropped off daily in front of the house by the school bus?
SMREKAR: Yes.

SMREKAR: No. We didn`t even know they had any children. They just weren`t out there.

Also. The school bus dropped her off but we didn’t even know they had kids.

I think the neighbors heard shots at some point. I don’t think they have any idea of when it was or exactly what they were doing. I don’t think it’s intentional or malicious on their parts but I do doubt their memory with the inconsistencies.

 

[cluciano63]

I think they could tell if death had occurred just minutes before, or an hour, even a half hour perhaps. But for sure if they had just died versus an hour earlier imo.

 

[human]

I go back and forth on whether the shots the neighbors heard are related. They said the shots were just seconds apart. If that's the case then it seems those would have been the two fatal shots. But based on the call log, James and Denise were not found near each other. So either one of them moved after the shots occurred, or the shots aren't related at all.

I would hope if it was someone else shooting they would come forward and say that they were shooting at that time. Maybe at an animal. But that does not seem to be the case

 

[thaddeusjames80]

Also. The school bus dropped her off but we didn’t even know they had kids.

I think the neighbors heard shots at some point. I don’t think they have any idea of when it was or exactly what they were doing. I don’t think it’s intentional or malicious on their parts but I do doubt their memory with the inconsistencies.

Wait a minute, that makes no sende, why lie? "We didn't know they had kids but they see the bus drop her off every day" is that what they said?

 

[bellyup]

Wait a minute, that makes no sende, why lie? "We didn't know they had kids but they see the bus drop her off every day" is that what they said?

Reverse order but yes.
“I just know the school bus drops her off.”
Then (right after)
“We didn’t even know they had any children.”

ETA: To be clear I don’t believe these people are lying, per se. I believe they are elderly and suddenly forced into a public lime light and sometimes feel like they should have answers so they say what makes sense or what their (not crisp) memories or musings are.

 

[human]

Also. The school bus dropped her off but we didn’t even know they had kids.

I think the neighbors heard shots at some point. I don’t think they have any idea of when it was or exactly what they were doing. I don’t think it’s intentional or malicious on their parts but I do doubt their memory with the inconsistencies.

I take it to mean that they did not know there was a child at the house until they saw the schoolbus comtimue to drop her off

 

[Deleted member 102539]

SMREKAR: No, and I don`t sleep well at night and I was about at the boat. 1:00 --ish and our dog was on the porch and he was doing some light noises

and I knew something was up. But I could not see anything anywhere that looked or felt out of line. And I told the FBI people that have been here

a couple times.

Interesting.

 

[esoxlazer]

CNN.com - Transcripts
I don’t think I’ve seen the boat discussed, forgive me if it has been.
I thought I had read something about the neighbor talking about being out at his boat with his dog but couldn’t find it again searching. It was in a video lol. Just read this transcript and it’s there.
SMREKAR: “No, and I don`t sleep well at night and I was about at the boat. 1:00 --ish and our dog was on the porch and he was doing some light noises”

Is he saying he was out with the dog around 1ish yet heard or noticed nothing??

This is my first post here, so I apologize if I didn't use the quote feature properly...

My take on the neighbors quote is that something was lost in translation/transcription due to their accent (I know quite a few folks, myself included, that sound like we're from Canada...especially words with "o", "ou" or "oa" sounds). This is only my opinion, and I could certainly be wrong, but I think:

"and I was about at the boat."

--was really--

"and I was out and about."

Not sure that it matters if they were out by a boat or just out walking the yard, I just remember this being brought up before in an earlier thread as well and figured I'd toss in my $.02.

Thank you all for the thoughtful and civil discussion! I found WS at the start of this case and have now spent more hours than I'd like to admit searching through these threads and many others. Its just nice to see people being decent to each other on the internet for a change!

 

[Timekeeper65]

Welcome esoxlaser!