Burke Ramsey Files 750 Million Dollar Lawsuit Against CBS #2

[searchinGirl]

You're making up stuff about the golf club incident, I do believe. But I suppose I could have overlooked the stuff about being hit twice in the head, once in the leg, so please supply your source.

He hit her in the backswing so he couldn’t see behind him. She had to have walked into it. It’s got to be the most common thing. My own grandchild hit me with a club because I didn’t get out of the way fast enough. I’m just not as agile as I used to be. He didn’t wait, he couldn’t see. Common sense.

 

[fr brown]

Thanks for the reply. You may well be right. I have studied the letter but not the handwriting in detail. As I say you may be right but I think I am and I actually believe I know who wrote it. Anyway we will have to beg to differ but good luck with your research.

Steve Thomas says that Patsy was the only person who changed her handwriting from exemplar to exemplar (thereby exhibiting consciousness of guilt). I provided one example earlier. After she was provided with a xerox of the ransom note, a trait that had previously been below the level of consciousness came to her attention.

Below is an example of how Patsy's manuscript a changed between sessions. I'm using photocopies of Patsy's handwriting from Forensic Linguistics by Gerald McMenamin. The first exemplar on Jan. 4 was probably dictated to Patsy by Arndt; the next ones are probably copied by Patsy from her first exemplar. I don't know about the February 28 session, but by then she'd had a good long gander at a xerox of the ransom note and, I'm guessing, had reviewed with her attorneys what she needed to change.

Ransom Note: 10 am

January 4:
Patsy 1: 10 a.m.
Patsy 2: 10 a.m.
Patsy 3: 10 a.m.

After the Jan 4 session, Patsy's lawyers are provided a photocopy of ransom note.

February 28:
Patsy 4: 10 A.m.
Patsy 5: 10 A.M.

(The period after the a in "Patsy 1" might be a tail on the a. But since the other manuscript a's on the page don't have tails and the dot appears to be separated from the letter, I think it's a period. That would also make it consistent with the other exemplars from that session. But that particular period appears to be squeezed in there. Was it an afterthought?)

 

[fr brown]

Once in the head, once in the leg.

TT: Okay. What about any injuries, any major injuries, any major injuries to JonBenet?

PR: She, Burke hit her in the face with a gulf club one time, and the leg…

OK, I misread some of it. I thought you said she'd been hit twice in the face.

As far as the golf club incident goes, Steve Thomas says that the plastic surgeon thought Patsy was over-reacting. You left out that part. And as far as asking myself why "Patsy sanitized the event where Burke had beaten JBR with a golf club," what I'm asking myself is where did you get that from?

 

[jaejae]

Steve Thomas says that Patsy was the only person who changed her handwriting from exemplar to exemplar (thereby exhibiting consciousness of guilt). I provided one example earlier. After she was provided with a xerox of the ransom note, a trait that had previously been below the level of consciousness came to her attention.

Below is an example of how Patsy's manuscript a changed between sessions. I'm using photocopies of Patsy's handwriting from Forensic Linguistics by Gerald McMenamin. The first exemplar on Jan. 4 was probably dictated to Patsy by Arndt; the next ones are probably copied by Patsy from her first exemplar. I don't know about the February 28 session, but by then she'd had a good long gander at a xerox of the ransom note and, I'm guessing, had reviewed with her attorneys what she needed to change.

Ransom Note: 10 am

January 4:
Patsy 1: 10 a.m.
Patsy 2: 10 a.m.
Patsy 3: 10 a.m.

After the Jan 4 session, Patsy's lawyers are provided a photocopy of ransom note.

February 28:
Patsy 4: 10 A.m.
Patsy 5: 10 A.M.

(The period after the a in "Patsy 1" might be a tail on the a. But since the other manuscript a's on the page don't have tails and the dot appears to be separated from the letter, I think it's a period. That would also make it consistent with the other exemplars from that session. But that particular period appears to be squeezed in there. Was it an afterthought?)

Thanks for the post I will read through it. It's just I honestly do not believe the study of handwriting is a precise science. You have to also allow for the fact any killer may have been disguising their handwriting. Other people may be right but I believe the Ransom Note was written as a sick 'joke'. In my opinion it worked because it has had people going around in circles since including FBI Profilers. These are my opinions of course.

 

[fr brown]

Thanks for the post I will read through it. It's just I honestly do not believe the study of handwriting is a precise science. You have to also allow for the fact any killer may have been disguising their handwriting. Other people may be right but I believe the Ransom Note was written as a sick 'joke'. In my opinion it worked because it has had people going around in circles since including FBI Profilers. These are my opinions of course.

It's not a study of handwriting. It's just common sense.

Iirc, the ransom note a's are mostly of the a type with a few a's thrown in. While your suspect might write "a" like that, I think it's probably rather unusual in the population. Like the ransom note writer, Patsy habitually wrote a lot of a's intermingled with some a's before the murder, but after she was shown a copy of the ransom note, she scrubbed the a's from her handwriting to the extent that when Nedra gave Steve Thomas a list of names Patsy had written, one of the names had the "a" crossed out and an "a" substituted.

 

[andreww]

OK, I misread some of it. I thought you said she'd been hit twice in the face.

As far as the golf club incident goes, Steve Thomas says that the plastic surgeon thought Patsy was over-reacting. You left out that part. And as far as asking myself why "Patsy sanitized the event where Burke had beaten JBR with a golf club," what I'm asking myself is where did you get that from?

Basically from her police interviews. In the first interview that I quoted she definitely mentions that she was hit twice, which I still find hard to fathom doing on a backswing. You will notice that the question specifically asked for "major injuries" and Patsy brings up this incident. Her description of the injuries is as follows...

TT: Any stitches or anything like that?

PR: No, it was just kind of a skin abrasion, she had a little scar, a little teensy little scar there, but it just kind of squashed the skin up and something to stitch it. She had a black eye, and…

In her second interview she doesn't mention the hit to the leg. Its also interesting to notice the difference in seriousness between her description of the injury and the actions she took. "it was just kind of a skin abrasion", yet she felt the need to take JB to the emergency room and a plastic surgeon.


13 PATSY RAMSEY: That was '93, I

14 believe. And he, you know, he was out there

15 with his little Whiffle ball, golf balls, and

16 she walked up behind and he kind of clipped her

17 right on the cheek. And she screamed bloody

18 murder.


1 She had a little, I don't remember which eye it

2 was, little abrasion. I took her to a plastic

3 surgeon just to see if there was anything to do

4 to help there. He said it will go away. You

5 know.

Given that Burke was under 3 at the time I'm not saying that its evidence that he is a murderer. What I am saying is the incident is suspicious and that it is quite likely that Patsy was downplaying the extent of her injuries. I'm also saying that it would be very unlikely that a 2-1/2 year old would hit his sister twice by accident. Could Burke at that young of an age, been violently lashing out at Jonbenet? It certainly is possible, however, given the interviewers really didn't seem that interested in the incident and didn't press for further details, its impossible to say.

 

[fr brown]

Basically from her police interviews. In the first interview that I quoted she definitely mentions that she was hit twice, which I still find hard to fathom doing on a backswing. You will notice that the question specifically asked for "major injuries" and Patsy brings up this incident. Her description of the injuries is as follows...

TT: Any stitches or anything like that?

PR: No, it was just kind of a skin abrasion, she had a little scar, a little teensy little scar there, but it just kind of squashed the skin up and something to stitch it. She had a black eye, and…

In her second interview she doesn't mention the hit to the leg. Its also interesting to notice the difference in seriousness between her description of the injury and the actions she took. "it was just kind of a skin abrasion", yet she felt the need to take JB to the emergency room and a plastic surgeon.


13 PATSY RAMSEY: That was '93, I

14 believe. And he, you know, he was out there

15 with his little Whiffle ball, golf balls, and

16 she walked up behind and he kind of clipped her

17 right on the cheek. And she screamed bloody

18 murder.


1 She had a little, I don't remember which eye it

2 was, little abrasion. I took her to a plastic

3 surgeon just to see if there was anything to do

4 to help there. He said it will go away. You

5 know.

Given that Burke was under 3 at the time I'm not saying that its evidence that he is a murderer. What I am saying is the incident is suspicious and that it is quite likely that Patsy was downplaying the extent of her injuries. I'm also saying that it would be very unlikely that a 2-1/2 year old would hit his sister twice by accident. Could Burke at that young of an age, been violently lashing out at Jonbenet? It certainly is possible, however, given the interviewers really didn't seem that interested in the incident and didn't press for further details, its impossible to say.

JonBenet was four when it happened so Burke would have been seven, maybe. The plastic surgeon said it would go away. JonBenet had walked up behind Burke. From that you extrapolate that Burke had beaten JonBenet.

This was far from a major injury by any estimation. Far from downplaying and sanitizing, it sounds like Patsy was maximizing and exaggerating.

 

[Cottonstar]

There was mystery DNA on her. How do you explain that?! Law enforcement blew it right in the beginning. The only crime Patsy had was leaving doors unlocked that night. Someone obviously was in that house.

Sounds like Reddit. Both John and Patsy Ramsey told numerous people that they checked and locked all doors.

 

[Cottonstar]

He hit her in the backswing so he couldn’t see behind him. She had to have walked into it. It’s got to be the most common thing. My own grandchild hit me with a club because I didn’t get out of the way fast enough. I’m just not as agile as I used to be. He didn’t wait, he couldn’t see. Common sense.

Actually, before the murder, Patsy told her friend that Burke had lost his temper and hit her with the golf club. Common sense. All siblings have hit, pushed, and clobbered one another at some point. It’s what they do. It’s sibling rivalry. It’s child psychology.

 

[searchinGirl]

Actually, before the murder, Patsy told her friend that Burke had lost his temper and hit her with the golf club. Common sense. All siblings have hit, pushed, and clobbered one another at some point. It’s what they do. It’s sibling rivalry. It’s child psychology.

It’s golf.

 

[cherrymeg]

It’s golf.

I remember hitting my brother in the shin with a mini golf club. Certain activities brought out the worst in us.

 

[fr brown]

Actually, before the murder, Patsy told her friend that Burke had lost his temper and hit her with the golf club. Common sense. All siblings have hit, pushed, and clobbered one another at some point. It’s what they do. It’s sibling rivalry. It’s child psychology.

You're talking about Judith Phillips? She was on the tv program, right? I think I was shocked at how she was talking about a little boy she had known. If I'm not mistaken, she used to think that Patsy did it. Now she gets to be on tv if she thinks Burke did it.

 

[cherrymeg]

JonBenet was four when it happened so Burke would have been seven, maybe. The plastic surgeon said it would go away. JonBenet had walked up behind Burke. From that you extrapolate that Burke had beaten JonBenet.

This was far from a major injury by any estimation. Far from downplaying and sanitizing, it sounds like Patsy was maximizing and exaggerating.

Does that seem extreme to take a kid to a plastic surgeon? Getting stitches is one thing but a plastic surgeon sounds over the top.

 

[UKGuy]

You're talking about Judith Phillips? She was on the tv program, right? I think I was shocked at how she was talking about a little boy she had known. If I'm not mistaken, she used to think that Patsy did it. Now she gets to be on tv if she thinks Burke did it.

fr brown,
The thing is, none of us know who did it. If the case is BDI them all the legal participants will be held to silence.

This would explain why we have never heard from Doug or Susan Stine, both with real inside knowledge: Susan Stine can tell us all about the genesis of the 911 call at the R's Christmas Party and Doug what BR knows about the case.

Imagine you being shocked at how nasty little boys can be, they learn early on to mimic their immediate social hierarchy, i.e. same as a Baboon's, top down, and enforced with violence.

Its a patriarchal thing, check out Elephants who have females in charge and have outlasted many, now extinct species.

I would be interested as to why Judith Phillips thinks the case might be BDI since she is a former Ramsey insider, she knows personal stuff none of us can imagine.

Although the case might be JDI, PDI, BDI or any combination thereof. BDI has so many incidental coincidences that sum up to to the current BDI theory playing out in the media, this means you have to shoot down BDI, otherwise it will not go away.

There is nothing to prevent speculation that BR went Postal on JonBenet after returning from the White's and the parents covered it all up?

.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

He hit her in the backswing so he couldn’t see behind him. She had to have walked into it. It’s got to be the most common thing. My own grandchild hit me with a club because I didn’t get out of the way fast enough. I’m just not as agile as I used to be. He didn’t wait, he couldn’t see. Common sense.

I agree. It's happened to me with a cricket bat.

I watched the program that laid the blame at Burke's door with their theories and not one held up, imo. I stated my opinion back then when it first aired and haven't changed my mind.

The fingerprints (BR) on the bowl? JBR may have gotten a dirty bowl from the sink or took one out of the dishwasher not yet washed, if the bowls were up high in a cupboard, JBR probably couldn't reach to get a clean one, that answers the fingerprint theory. Does a little girl care about cleanliness, if the bowl looks clean, it's clean.

The 911 call, if it's Burke asking, 'What did you find?' why would he ask that if he's involved in harming JBR and the cover up? JR said Burke was in bed, he wouldn't be the first parent to keep a child out of the investigation, and yet it did nothing in the end because Burke is saddled with the last resort theory because Patsy is dead, so BR killed JBR because he's a jealous psychopath and cunning as a fox, he has disgusting habits of a 9 yr old child because no other child has them and all the dysfunction in his family is due to him. smh

Patsy was not a stable person and the medication and her illness could tip an already neurotic person over the edge. Imo, she's the one who accidentally killed JBR and either acted alone or with JR's assistance in the cover up. She was protecting herself, her name and reputation in society and her lifestyle, BR was not her concern.

 

[searchinGirl]

I agree. It's happened to me with a cricket bat.

I watched the program that laid the blame at Burke's door with their theories and not one held up, imo. I stated my opinion back then when it first aired and haven't changed my mind.

The fingerprints (BR) on the bowl? JBR may have gotten a dirty bowl from the sink or took one out of the dishwasher not yet washed, if the bowls were up high in a cupboard, JBR probably couldn't reach to get a clean one, that answers the fingerprint theory. Does a little girl care about cleanliness, if the bowl looks clean, it's clean.

The 911 call, if it's Burke asking, 'What did you find?' why would he ask that if he's involved in harming JBR and the cover up? JR said Burke was in bed, he wouldn't be the first parent to keep a child out of the investigation, and yet it did nothing in the end because Burke is saddled with the last resort theory because Patsy is dead, so BR killed JBR because he's a jealous psychopath and cunning as a fox, he has disgusting habits of a 9 yr old child because no other child has them and all the dysfunction in his family is due to him. smh

Patsy was not a stable person and the medication and her illness could tip an already neurotic person over the edge. Imo, she's the one who accidentally killed JBR and either acted alone or with JR's assistance in the cover up. She was protecting herself, her name and reputation in society and her lifestyle, BR was not her concern.

I can’t agree with you about Patsy. But everyone who plays golf knows that the golfer can’t be penalized for someone else walking into his backswing.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

I can’t agree with you about Patsy. But everyone who plays golf knows that the golfer can’t be penalized for someone else walking into his backswing.

I'd like to hear your thoughts about Patsy. I'm not solid about her, I'm open minded with regards to her and John and what went on in that household.
Ironically, my main issue is with Burke being made the patsy.

 

[Cottonstar]

You're talking about Judith Phillips? She was on the tv program, right? I think I was shocked at how she was talking about a little boy she had known. If I'm not mistaken, she used to think that Patsy did it. Now she gets to be on tv if she thinks Burke did it.

You were SHOCKED and DISMAYED huh? Well, the truth does that to people.

 

[Cottonstar]

I can’t agree with you about Patsy. But everyone who plays golf knows that the golfer can’t be penalized for someone else walking into his backswing.

And the beat goes on.

 

[andreww]

I can’t agree with you about Patsy. But everyone who plays golf knows that the golfer can’t be penalized for someone else walking into his backswing.

If she had just been hit in the head, I could believe she walked in to the backswing. However, he hit her more than once! Once in the head, once in the leg.