CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #7

[Chelly]

8m8 minutes ago
#McStay - Next witness for the state is Donald Jones, he's a retired criminalist for San Bernardino County.

 

[JMarsh]

All premedia stuff should not be admissible in the courtroom. By going over previous murder cases, everyone lies and make up BS just to entrap the suspect. CNN gets it wrong all of the time.

California Rules of Evidence § 350
No evidence is admissible except relevant evidence.

California Rules of Evidence § 352
The court in its discretion may exclude evidence if its probative value is substantially outweighed by the probability that its admission will (a) necessitate undue consumption of time or (b) create substantial danger of undue prejudice, of confusing the issues, or of misleading the jury.

 

[JMarsh]

I believe it was transfer DNA in the Trooper. How does one drive a car without dropping a strand of hair?

That is an excellent point. Also how does one leave DNA and no fingerprints?

 

[Chelly]

Cathy Russon is actively tweeting the #RussellHolbrook murder trial, among others, today. Just a guess, but I don't think we will see many McStay trial tweets from her. Right now, on the stand, witness is explaining DNA and the live stream is troublesome as usual.

Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 20

 

[JMarsh]

do you clean on a regular basis? I realize that short hair is more of a problem but since I have long hair, I find in everywhere. Was he wearing a hazmat suit?

Ha. Sorry had to laugh. For Chase to have done half the things he is given credit for doing by the DA, he would not only have required a partner, but all involved would have needed to be geared up in hazmat suits.

 

[missy1974]

we are getting a lesson on DNA in trial
Up to now, I was only half listening (trying to keep up on tweets in the Berreth case lol)

I missed why he retired, but got the back end of it, basically, something was changing that he didn't like, not that it was bad, but not what he was in the field for (something like that lol) Assuming it was mentioned so the defense couldn't bring it out first ;-)

 

[missy1974]

Cathy Russon is actively tweeting the #RussellHolbrook murder trial, among others, today. Just a guess, but I don't think we will see many McStay trial tweets from her. Right now, on the stand, witness is explaining DNA and the live stream is troublesome as usual.

Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 20

hmmm my livestream is good today.... I've probably just jinxed it though LOL

Watch Live: McStay Family Murder Trial Day 20

 

[Mony Mony]

I feel like I am in a college 101 class on DNA.

 

[missy1974]

I feel like I am in a college 101 class on DNA.

At least he has a nice voice to listen to LOL This is the blah blah blah testimony to me... just give us the details of what you did buddy LOL

ETA: Thinking of @citygirl ... this is the stuff you were dreading LOL

 

[Plumeria5]

Chase seems quite engaged in the DNA evidence. Who is to his left where he seemed interested in looking at?

 

[missy1974]

Chase seems quite interested in the DNA evidence. Who is to his left where he seemed interested in looking at?

I think Maline sits beside him. I see him right now.. he looks bored. I wish they had better camera views... I can't even tell if he is looking at the witness, down, the guy beside him, the pro's, the jury.

 

[missy1974]

Just got a quick view of the Judge... someone should make sure he is awake

 

[Force Ten]

Just thinking.......the Trooper had to be found at the Border or this case would have become foul play VERY quick.

The Trooper couldn't have been left anywhere else, it couldn't have been left unlocked to be stolen, it couldn't have been dumped at a wrecking yard, placed at a random shopping mall, side of the road, or abandoned in the desert. The interior and exterior of the vehicle could NOT be absent of DNA, fingerprints, etc.

It HAD to be found so LE would assume the family left of their own volition. It HAD to have the car seats from the Dodge put in it so all 4 members of the family would be assumed to have been in it. It had to have DNA and fingerprints. And it had to be a in a place that towed vehicles so it would be impounded and LE could find it if they ran the plate. It had to be found in a place where the family's whereabouts would take it out of the local and US LE agencies ie., Mexico.

Any other situation would have put a lock down on everything McStay: house, business, financial accounts, etc.

The killer had to keep the family "alive" as long as he could so the murders and fraud wouldn't be found out.

There have been posts saying "why would someone kill a family of 4 if a person was caught stealing, about to loose their job, or busted for whatever illegal act they had perpetrated"? Well, mass shootings in the work place due to firing, and disgruntled employees killing their employer and sometimes their employer's family isn't all that far fetched and most of the perpetrators didn't have a criminal record.

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

 

[Chelly]

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

Good theory Force Ten. You have me rethinking.

 

[missy1974]

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

Did Chase ever give any type of "theory" of what happened to them?

As far as Summer in the video goes... I think there were family members that told Dugal that it may be her on that video, IIRC from testimony, her mother was one of them. It was part of his excuse for not being able to do more. IMO

I didn't think it was just Chase that implied or pushed that Summer might have poisoned Joey. I recall early on when they were first reported missing, there was a lot of talk about that once it was known that Joey had some unexplained illness for months.

I have not read the RB book, have no intention to, so no idea where he got his ideas from, but I don't believe that it was his theory. Lots of posters had that theory very early on, he just ran with it and wrote a book.

ETA: I guess I should make it clear that I distinctly recall having discussions about Summer, Joey's illness, her name changes, her age, etc. So it's hard to think that the theory came from any particular person. JMO

 

[missy1974]

Getting into the DNA now... showing Chases DNA markers. At least I hope they are lol

 

[fridaybaker]

Another poster (sorry I've forgotten exactly who), but what they believed, has stuck with me since seeing it posted yesterday.

It was their belief that it was CM who may have been poisoning Joey. It's true CM seemed to have been around Joey more than anyone which would give him many opportunities to do so.

I've been thinking why CM would do this. Everything he does is because he thinks it gives him the advantage. Imo

So I can understand why he was the one who was making Joey so ill.

By doing so in his carefully crafted con way, he could tell Joey he had nothing to worry about if he became so ill he couldn't run his business.

He would promise Joey if that it came to that, he would see HE kept his business up, and running himself.

We already know he is a very convincing con artist. We do have to give him full credit for that.

Even after ripping so many others off in the past, he had no problems whatsoever, convincing the other two business gentlemen he dealt with, after Joey's murder to participate in another one of his congames.

It shows he is excellent in deceiving others who believed every lie he told them, hook, line, and sinker. So many victims of CM fell for every lie he told them.

I certainly believe he thought Joey believed every lie he had told him. If he poisoned Joey then poisoner suspects like this do so under the false pretense they truly care about their victim/s wellbeing, when it's the total opposite.

I wish Joey's body had been found right after CM buried him in the desert. Then a full toxicology could have been done on Joey.

So I think there is a possibilty this wasn't the only time he had tried to murder Joey.

How long had it been when Merritt's duties weren't any longer as the main welding fabricator for Joey, but he had been reduced to doing more mundane jobs for Joey? How long had it been since Joey had loaned him money to pay off his gambling debts?

Oh did he take that loaned money and really pay them off or used them to gamble more?

Imo

Ocean, I think your theory as to why CM might have been poisoning Joey if, in fact, he was, is fascinating! Somehow, it struck a chord with me. I can see it. In trying to remember what we know about this from long ago, I do think that Joey was actually hospitalized for a couple of days, due to the feelings of "wooziness", etc. -The poisoning-like symptoms.

They did blood work, IIRC, and didn't find anything, but in a routine case of someone being admitted to hospital for those symptoms, I'm not sure it's very likely they would do tests for substances that might be causing it. Usually, they would do more metabolic-type tests then, if finding nothing, discharge the patient and see if the symptoms continue/return.

Unfortunately, all this is quite speculative! Interesting, though, and I think you may be on the right track. His comments about Joey thinking SM was poisoning him were bizarre. It sounds more like something that was on HIS mind, rather than something that was actually happening. Why would Joey eat anything at home/stay there, etc., if he thought his wife were trying to kill him? Wouldn't he be worried about his children, etc.?

 

[missy1974]

Unfortunately, all this is quite speculative! Interesting, though, and I think you may be on the right track. His comments about Joey thinking SM was poisoning him were bizarre. It sounds more like something that was on HIS mind, rather than something that was actually happening. Why would Joey eat anything at home/stay there, etc., if he thought his wife were trying to kill him? Wouldn't he be worried about his children, etc.?

Respectfully snipped by me friday...

His comments about Summer aren't that bizarre to me... it was discussed long before I ever heard the words come from Merritt's mouth, by random people on the internet. JMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

I find your theory very believable.

Like every murderer before CM, and those who will come afterwards, they always have a purposeful intent in mind in everything they say, and what they do.

Imo

 

[Tortoise]

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

That would also align with him telling detectives that Joey was trying to hide the finances from Summer, as well as Chase' dislike of her.