CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #7

[Tortoise]

Oh god Alleles. Snore.zzzzzzzzzz

 

[fridaybaker]

Respectfully snipped by me friday...

His comments about Summer aren't that bizarre to me... it was discussed long before I ever heard the words come from Merritt's mouth, by random people on the internet. JMO

Missy, I thought it was discussed because CM mentioned it in an interview? Okay, maybe I'm not being/thinking clearly. What I meant was CM saying that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him". When you say it was discussed long before... do you mean that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him" or simply people were speculating whether she may have been poisoning him. The difference being are we talking about people generally wondering whether Joey's symptoms were caused by poisoning -perhaps by Summer-, or are we talking about Joey thinking Summer was poisoning him?

Whew. Sorry if this is clear as mud.

 

[Bernina]

Replying to a post about "hair".

CM told LE he HAD been in the Trooper (passenger side) apprx. 6 weeks prior to go to a paintball event.
If his hair was collected from the interior of the Trooper, it would easily be explained away by this.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Ocean, I think your theory as to why CM might have been poisoning Joey if, in fact, he was, is fascinating! Somehow, it struck a chord with me. I can see it. In trying to remember what we know about this from long ago, I do think that Joey was actually hospitalized for a couple of days, due to the feelings of "wooziness", etc. -The poisoning-like symptoms.

They did blood work, IIRC, and didn't find anything, but in a routine case of someone being admitted to hospital for those symptoms, I'm not sure it's very likely they would do tests for substances that might be causing it. Usually, they would do more metabolic-type tests then, if finding nothing, discharge the patient and see if the symptoms continue/return.

Unfortunately, all this is quite speculative! Interesting, though, and I think you may be on the right track. His comments about Joey thinking SM was poisoning him were bizarre. It sounds more like something that was on HIS mind, rather than something that was actually happening. Why would Joey eat anything at home/stay there, etc., if he thought his wife were trying to kill him? Wouldn't he be worried about his children, etc.?

Thank you. Of course he would.

Yes, indeed it was totally bizarre.

We have to put into context WHO was saying these bizarre things including how he relished in disparaging Summer.

This was being said by the very man who is now on trial for murdering all of the McStay family.

The jury will not be concerned about what others might have said. Thats an irrelevant issue for them. What HE said, is highly relevant.

Iirc, many of the internet masses crushed Summer in the ground relentlessly 24/7 365. That's another part of this case that is so very sad when the poor woman had been murdered in cold blood.

They will solely concentrate on what the accused has said, concerning any, and all of the 4 McStay family members.

Just wait until the jury listens, and watches his CNN bizarre interview all the while knowing they are now sitting in judgement of that very same man.

Of course they will be given a transcription to read at the time also, so they don't miss one word he said throughout it's entirety.

Imo, it will make the hair rise up on the back of their neck. Now they know he lied, because he alone stands accused. It will make them look at this interview far differently now.

Jmo

 

[missy1974]

Missy, I thought it was discussed because CM mentioned it in an interview? Okay, maybe I'm not being/thinking clearly. What I meant was CM saying that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him". When you say it was discussed long before... do you mean that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him" or simply people were speculating whether she may have been poisoning him. The difference being are we talking about people generally wondering whether Joey's symptoms were caused by poisoning -perhaps by Summer-, or are we talking about Joey thinking Summer was poisoning him?

Whew. Sorry if this is clear as mud.

It's clear enough haha

I have gone back into the old threads here. Unfortunately, there is a huge amount of discussion from the old CourtTV/InSession board that is no longer around That's where I posted about this case when they first went missing. Mikey came and posted with us as well, but I don't recall exactly when it was, but it was definitely within the first weeks/months (I recall because some of the posters actually went and handed out flyers at the border and were helping him and the family with this).

But just to put the timing into perspective....

I was able to find an article in the wayback machine from March 31st. Where this was stated:

Susan Blake, McStay’s mother, said she had a sense something was wrong before the family vanished. “Joe told me he wasn’t feeling good that day,” she said. “His equilibrium wasn’t right and I felt that something was wrong.”

New Leads on the Missing McStay Family - New evidence has surfaced on the whereabouts of the disappearance of the McStay family suggesting they may have planned to intentionally disappear in Mexico authorities said. Joseph McStay his wife Summe...

A quote from another article, which I was unable to get on the wayback site but is in an old post here...

"My son had been sick since last August and he’s normally a very healthy person," said Blake. "He’s an excellent surfer and soccer player. I even went to the hospital with him to try and see what was wrong; we thought maybe it was stress."

This is when the speculation began here at WS's. You can go read the comments.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...-2-children-bonsall-4-feb-2010-3.99105/page-6

I feel like I knew about his illness before that from IS board through Mikey... but can't be certain. I may try to access my old bookmarks later and see what I can find ... I will have to pull out my old laptop for that (my new one didn't like me trying to get into them last time I tried LOL)

Interestingly enough, I also saw some posts that mention that Summer's mom believed it was Summer in the border video.

 

[missy1974]

They are back from morning break.

 

[mrjitty]

Just thinking.......the Trooper had to be found at the Border or this case would have become foul play VERY quick.

The Trooper couldn't have been left anywhere else, it couldn't have been left unlocked to be stolen, it couldn't have been dumped at a wrecking yard, placed at a random shopping mall, side of the road, or abandoned in the desert. The interior and exterior of the vehicle could NOT be absent of DNA, fingerprints, etc.

It HAD to be found so LE would assume the family left of their own volition. It HAD to have the car seats from the Dodge put in it so all 4 members of the family would be assumed to have been in it. It had to have DNA and fingerprints. And it had to be a in a place that towed vehicles so it would be impounded and LE could find it if they ran the plate. It had to be found in a place where the family's whereabouts would take it out of the local and US LE agencies ie., Mexico.

Any other situation would have put a lock down on everything McStay: house, business, financial accounts, etc.

The killer had to keep the family "alive" as long as he could so the murders and fraud wouldn't be found out.

BIB

This is why I am so fascinated by the staging of the crime scene.

For me the crime scene is the trooper, the desert graves and the house - all viewed together.

Typical in these situations is just to dump the victim(s) in a shallow grave so that they can be "missing" - and actually, provided the grave is not found, it is effective in terms of hindering murder charges. Murder charges without a body remain rare. However the bodies do often turn up eventually ...

But in this case the staging was not merely to conceal the bodies.

IMO this was an elongated staging - which developed with time to think.

 

[mrjitty]

I don't know, I really go back and forth on the issue with it being at the border. I mean most people believe it was staged to look like the family went into Mexico. But Chase himself said it couldn't be the family in the video, or at least Joseph. He could have totally played it off and said yes, that's them.

But why didn't he? I think it may have to do with the reason he staged because he wanted control. He wanted to control the narrative. He may have wanted people to believe someone, of Hispanic heritage (maybe painter) abducted and/or killed the family and they themselves fled into Mexico. I remember thinking this scenario at the time because fugitives on the run frequently flee into Mexico. So he ditches the vehicle 160 miles in the opposite direction from where the family actually is, thinking they'll never be found because no one will ever look there. He abandons the Trooper at the border instead of across at the risk of being captured on camera and he would be documented as coming back through customs.

This may be a lot to infer on my part, but indulge me and consider this. Chase was feeding RB to some level. RB first reported that Summer may have killed Joseph and fled. Chase suggested in the Dailymail that she was poisoning Joseph. RB made accusations that Summer was having an affair with someone driving a black sedan. Chase could have fed that to RB as well. So Chase, seeing the video says "No that's definitely not Joseph" but he doesn't say it's not Summer or the kids. Is he holding back because he wants people to think it's Summer with another man?

In all comments from Chase, in interviews and online, he's defended Joseph, Mike, and to some extent even Dan. Never, ever Summer. Who's to say a lot of the rumors circulating regarding Summer weren't started by Chase himself, commenting in online forums.

That's my soapbox.

I think you may be right, as that narrative works better if the bodies ever turn up

 

[Force Ten]

Did Chase ever give any type of "theory" of what happened to them?

As far as Summer in the video goes... I think there were family members that told Dugal that it may be her on that video, IIRC from testimony, her mother was one of them. It was part of his excuse for not being able to do more. IMO

I didn't think it was just Chase that implied or pushed that Summer might have poisoned Joey. I recall early on when they were first reported missing, there was a lot of talk about that once it was known that Joey had some unexplained illness for months.

I have not read the RB book, have no intention to, so no idea where he got his ideas from, but I don't believe that it was his theory. Lots of posters had that theory very early on, he just ran with it and wrote a book.

ETA: I guess I should make it clear that I distinctly recall having discussions about Summer, Joey's illness, her name changes, her age, etc. So it's hard to think that the theory came from any particular person. JMO

I don't recall any posters accusing Summer of poisoning Joseph and that causing his illness before Chase did. Of course if posted here they would have been deleted. I do remember a lot of people were quite shocked when he came out and suggested it.

Chase never did offer a theory. Now that I think about it, the CNN reporter never asked what thought happened or who killed them but did ask Patrick.

I've found only two comments he made before the family was found. Once that happened, he came out to assert damage control IMO.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't recall any posters accusing Summer of poisoning Joseph and that causing his illness before Chase did. Of course if posted here they would have been deleted. I do remember a lot of people were quite shocked when he came out and suggested it.

Chase never did offer a theory. Now that I think about it, the CNN reporter never asked what thought happened or who killed them but did ask Patrick.

I've found only two comments he made before the family was found. Once that happened, he came out to assert damage control IMO.

So its likely some posters believed all of the bad things he had to say about Summer?

If so, it certainly shows how easily he can manipulate others into believing him.

If he can do this to others that have never met him, then he certainly has this same ability to fool those who do know him.

Imo

 

[Bernina]

Screen shot, DNA, don't know what exhibit number it is. Lawyer kept milling around in front of the screen.

 

[Plumeria5]

Replying to a post about "hair".

CM told LE he HAD been in the Trooper (passenger side) apprx. 6 weeks prior to go to a paintball event.
If his hair was collected from the interior of the Trooper, it would easily be explained away by this.

I wonder if the paintball event was true if CM orchestrated going so that he could explain away DNA found later. Not sure he was planning 6 weeks in advance however.

 

[JMarsh]

So its likely some posters believed all of the bad things he had to say about Summer?

If so, it certainly shows how easily he can manipulate others into believing him.

If he can do this to others that have never met him, then he certainly has this same ability to fool those who do know him.

Imo

I wonder if the paintball event was true if CM orchestrated going so that he could explain away DNA found later. Not sure he was planning 6 weeks in advance however.

There are pictures of Joey and Chase suited up to play paintball.

 

[JMarsh]

It's clear enough haha

I have gone back into the old threads here. Unfortunately, there is a huge amount of discussion from the old CourtTV/InSession board that is no longer around That's where I posted about this case when they first went missing. Mikey came and posted with us as well, but I don't recall exactly when it was, but it was definitely within the first weeks/months (I recall because some of the posters actually went and handed out flyers at the border and were helping him and the family with this).

But just to put the timing into perspective....

I was able to find an article in the wayback machine from March 31st. Where this was stated:

Susan Blake, McStay’s mother, said she had a sense something was wrong before the family vanished. “Joe told me he wasn’t feeling good that day,” she said. “His equilibrium wasn’t right and I felt that something was wrong.”

New Leads on the Missing McStay Family - New evidence has surfaced on the whereabouts of the disappearance of the McStay family suggesting they may have planned to intentionally disappear in Mexico authorities said. Joseph McStay his wife Summe...

A quote from another article, which I was unable to get on the wayback site but is in an old post here...

"My son had been sick since last August and he’s normally a very healthy person," said Blake. "He’s an excellent surfer and soccer player. I even went to the hospital with him to try and see what was wrong; we thought maybe it was stress."

This is when the speculation began here at WS's. You can go read the comments.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...-2-children-bonsall-4-feb-2010-3.99105/page-6

I feel like I knew about his illness before that from IS board through Mikey... but can't be certain. I may try to access my old bookmarks later and see what I can find ... I will have to pull out my old laptop for that (my new one didn't like me trying to get into them last time I tried LOL)

Interestingly enough, I also saw some posts that mention that Summer's mom believed it was Summer in the border video.

When people go unexpectedly missing or are found murdered or both, everything in their lives is suddenly coated in an ominous patina. It's possible, if not probable, that Joey's illness was nothing more than that, a circumstance that happens to thousands if not millions, every day.

 

[missy1974]

I don't recall any posters accusing Summer of poisoning Joseph and that causing his illness before Chase did. Of course if posted here they would have been deleted. I do remember a lot of people were quite shocked when he came out and suggested it.

Chase never did offer a theory. Now that I think about it, the CNN reporter never asked what thought happened or who killed them but did ask Patrick.

I've found only two comments he made before the family was found. Once that happened, he came out to assert damage control IMO.

So when were his comments?

Before the family was found, there were a ton of theories out there, and yes, they did start early on, and no, I don't believe they were deleted at the time. Like I said, unfortunately, the IS board is no longer around, and I believe it was discussed more there than here at the time, back in 2010. I have to say JMO because I can't prove it lol But I don't recall getting involved in the discussion here after IS was closed and I recall the discussion. But anyone that was following along in the early days/months/years, should not have been shocked at that theory, as it was not new, but again, JMO. My point is that it could have been a theory he picked up and ran with, just like and possibly with the help of Baker. There were many theories to choose from. JMO

 

[JMarsh]

Missy, I thought it was discussed because CM mentioned it in an interview? Okay, maybe I'm not being/thinking clearly. What I meant was CM saying that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him". When you say it was discussed long before... do you mean that "Joey thought SM was poisoning him" or simply people were speculating whether she may have been poisoning him. The difference being are we talking about people generally wondering whether Joey's symptoms were caused by poisoning -perhaps by Summer-, or are we talking about Joey thinking Summer was poisoning him?

Whew. Sorry if this is clear as mud.

Chase may, in part, have become a target of this investigation because he has no filter. He just says what he thinks. My impression from interviews is that Summer was actually on a lot of people's mind as responsible for the family's disappearance. This case has been riddled with innuendo from day one. And will probably continue to be forever.

 

[missy1974]

So its likely some posters believed all of the bad things he had to say about Summer?

If so, it certainly shows how easily he can manipulate others into believing him.

If he can do this to others that have never met him, then he certainly has this same ability to fool those who do know him.

Imo

Did you follow the case early on ocean? There was a lot of not nice things said about Summer Chase never spoke publicly about the McStay's that I recall early on, which actually made him look more suspicious LOL

Force Ten says only 2 comments before the bodies were found.

I'm not gonna keep on it, but this "poisoning theory", I read it long before Chase ever said.

 

[Sharyne]

But what was the frequency of McGyver calling JM? Is it as many calls on a daily basis as was stated between JM/CM? CM was so worried about his friend he never placed a call to him after 02/05. His BEST FRIEND supposedly. I love how you fail to see anything suspicious about that.

1. 13m13 minutes ago
   #McStay - Sgt. Ryan Baker testifies the last call from Merritt's phone to Joseph McStay's phone was on Feb. 9, 2010.
   
   0 replies0 retweets0 likes
   
2. 
   20m20 minutes ago
   #McStay - Proseuction recalls Sgt. Ryan Smith to the stand. The jury is being shown checks handwritten by Joseph in 08, 09, giving examples of how Joseph wrote payee name, etc...

I'm confused again. So many have posted that CM never tried calling JM after the 4th or 5th, yet per Sgt. Ryan Baker above, he called as late as Feb 9th

 

[JMarsh]

So its likely some posters believed all of the bad things he had to say about Summer?

If so, it certainly shows how easily he can manipulate others into believing him.

If he can do this to others that have never met him, then he certainly has this same ability to fool those who do know him.

Imo

This really brings to mind the power of belief in general. Belief can cement itself into the mind, and even in the face of established truths, can defy reason. That's why for me, it is so important to make certain our beliefs are influenced not by speculation but by hard facts and reliable evidence.

It's not a bad thing to be a little cynical and skeptical of everything, until the information about to be absorbed is fully vetted.

 

[Bernina]

I wonder if the paintball event was true if CM orchestrated going so that he could explain away DNA found later. Not sure he was planning 6 weeks in advance however.

He had a protracted "pause" before he answered the detective, but he DID say he never drove the Trooper.