CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #42 *ARREST*

[PommyMommy]

Yep and given that, how did they pick this particular landfill to decide to search? Seems like a real long shot. I'd choose a river over a landfill, were I PF. Lord knows, both of those could also be lies from KK. For all we know, whatever remains were left, after the fire, could be up around Gooding, Idaho.

Maybe they're looking for the trough.
MOO

 

[Reachingfornettles]

I'm curious as to why MG, Kks BFF, when she heard that KB was missing did she check her gun? Did she know of the brazen disregard for human life KK displayed 3x or is she saying that she only knew PF asked her to attempt it? She had to have known that she was missing on Thanksgiving Day, so why would she think of her gun. Wonder what her next reaction was when she seen that her gun was fired and missing a single bullet? Did she call and ask KK....hey Girl WTH was my gun messed with? And is that about the time that KK called MG Said the FBI is going to call you? I mean are you going to warn a friend without asking them to stretch the truth? I wouldn't call my friend otherwise, just so I don't incriminate myself ....IMO

 

[Artis]

From page 9 of the affidavit:

65. On or about November 22, 2018, Lee stated that Frazee called her and instructed her to come to Colorado and told her she "had a mess to clean up." Lee stated she couldn't come until the 24th of November, and when she did come, she brought bleach, gloves, a hairnet, shoe covers, and other supplies from Idaho. Your Affiant submits that when Frazee discussed a "mess," Lee understood that as Berreth had been killed. Cell phone call and text records support the fact that Lee and Frazee did indeed have conversation on the 22nd of November, 2018 as Lee reported.

Good info BUT all that tells me is that PF called KK on Thursday afternoon. I does not tell me where her phone was located. The rest is all her narrative.

 

[kkdj]

I don't believe we will ever hear a word from PF. But yeah. His defense will likely try to implicate KK and based on the avid desire of many to see her as the actual murderer, it could work.

Would that require him to take the stand?

 

[Love Never Fails]

I don't disagree he was at the house at all - I just think it was not between 1-4:30 - when his phone pinged at KB's. I think he showed up later - 5:30 or so which causes one to wonder what did SF2 mean when he said a little later than 2:30????

What am I missing? He called his mother at 4:24 PM from KB’s condo. And yet his brother says he was at the ranch at 2:30 or a little later. So is it possible he ran home for a quick lunch to say he was there and then left and went back to KB’s condo and called his mom from there? But why?

Maybe he took the baby to his mom to watch while he went back to KB’s to gather the gun, her purse, and her body to dispose of them?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Isn't Aug 2018 also when KB was in California for rehab? Could these papers be so PF could seek medical care while KB was out of town, or was he planning to seek custody?

The August paperwork was concerning custody. Below is the screenshot that talks about the December 12th paperwork that said that five people could be the health caretaker.

Source, arrest affidavit

 

[gliving]

If believe the search of SF/PF residence produced two documents related to baby K: an August 2018 non-filed "custody type" document naming baby K; and a December 2018 medical directive for baby K by PF, naming a number of persons authorized to act in this capacity-- excluding KB from the list (implication KB excluded because she was known deceased by PF). I apologize that I don't recall if this information was in the arrest afdvt, hearing testimony, or perhaps both. Anyone?

ETA: Shout out to this brilliant, sleuthing community, for your constant, generous courtesy extended me.

IDK. I just reread all the tweets from several reporters who were in the courtroom that day. The only mention of papers found during the search of PF's home are the ones dated from Aug 2018. Can you backtrack and find the ones from Dec? tia

 

[Blueberry2720]

Do we know if these main characters have taken polygraphs? and if so, the results?

 

[Reachingfornettles]

Yeah, that was weird. With PF in jail, who was a threat to any potential witnesses?

Anyone he talked to could say" get her " before she testified...IMO

 

[Love Never Fails]

IMO whoever else knew about the murder

Maybe LE were still looking for a third party or friend of PF’s who would kill for him. If so, he had some kind of influence, didn’t he? And if so, KK could still be in danger. But good...let her sweat it out.

 

[SandyQLS]

.

This was at the beginning of the hearing before it was clearly testified to that KK was not in CO until 11-24.

So the wording made the reporter assume it was KK.

In fact, PF showed up at her home on Thanksgiving. Once again, why on earth would the DA try to elicit testimony from her about another defendant being present on CO on the day of the murders, at PF's probable cause hearing?

Ya'll. We need to use common sense. The DA isn't stupid. They prepare carefully. They wouldn't try to use the probable cause hearing to get in evidence that another possible culprit was there and thus could've been the murderer instead of the guy they're trying to bind over for trial, at that probable cause hearing.

Obviously they were trying to get SF to testify as to when PF arrived at her home on Thanksgiving.

I seem to have entered the thread at an inopportune moment during a heated argument not of my making last night and I regret it.

I agree with you that CBI Slater was specifically addressing that PF and KB phones were moving in tandem, and that it was not about KK phone pinging locally. It's all in the context of the totality of Slater's testimony that can be reviewed in tweets on pages 51-52 of thread#39.

But I have found no specific statement from Slater excluding KK from being present in CO or anywhere prior to 11/24 except that MG states they exchanged cars on 11/23. The topic of KK's whereabouts on 11/22 is not addressed in the Prelim testimony that I can find.

I agree with you that in western US spoken English, 'the' and 'a' (defendant) can be virtually indistinguishable especially in poor acoustics. Maybe someone with a relationship can tweet Sam K and ask him to clarify his understanding since he was there and experienced the hearing.

Thanks for the reminder that this Prelim was only to establish probable cause re: PF - that makes sense to maintain as a background at all times to the information presented. I was left with the impression of careful, selected wording, and that the Prosecution has a great deal more that they have not revealed.

 

[Herat]

What am I missing? He called his mother at 4:24 PM from KB’s condo. And yet his brother says he was at the ranch at 2:30 or a little later. So is it possible he ran home for a quick lunch to say he was there and then left and went back to KB’s condo and called his mom from there? But why?

Maybe he took the baby to his mom to watch while he went back to KB’s to gather the gun, her purse, and her body to dispose of them?

I believe LE ‘s report states that PF’s cell phone was in KB’s place from about 1:30 through 4:30

Do you really think he would run home for lunch without his phone at this point?

 

[Ccging]

Question for our WS attorneys....so IF PF had actually met with an attorney re custody back in August would that info be beneficial for SF to use in her pending motion re custody?

I don’t think he ever met with an attorney re custody and when those docs are shown at trial they will be something he prepared Pro Se. Again AFTER KB was killed, backdated them to back up his story.

 

[PommyMommy]

Does it specify what day he was at the bank?

Yes, November 22.

I'm curious as to why MG, Kks BFF, when she heard that KB was missing did she check her gun? Did she know of the brazen disregard for human life KK displayed 3x or is she saying that she only knew PF asked her to attempt it? She had to have known that she was missing on Thanksgiving Day, so why would she think of her gun. Wonder what her next reaction was when she seen that her gun was fired and missing a single bullet? Did she call and ask KK....hey Girl WTH was my gun messed with? And is that about the time that KK called MG Said the FBI is going to call you? I mean are you going to warn a friend without asking them to stretch the truth? I wouldn't call my friend otherwise, just so I don't incriminate myself ....IMO

On 12/14, KK called MG and told her the FBI might be asking her about KK borrowing her car.

MS saw a news article and checked her gun and thought it was suspicious that it was in a different condition.

After the FBI interviewed MS, MS reported to the FBI that KK had called her, lied to her, was apologetic and said she was going to cooperate with LE.

Source: Page 8 of the affidavit (paraphrased)

 

[Reachingfornettles]

Two possibilities are 1) she didn't go down right away and the beating took place across a few rooms, and 2) he was walking around with the bat dropping blood everywhere. Or both. Also, it is a pretty small condo. The kitchen and the living room are close and smallish.

I'm also wondering that maybe the friend MG or MS (sorry) gun was used to shoot a bullet into the tote, just incase it was found and then they could say she shot herself? Maybe not but why was the gun used...I know of a person who put themselves in a box to commit suicide because they didn't want to mess the house up. jMO maybe not a good one tho.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

@Tippy Lynn, a tweet from the preliminary hearing which was copied to your timeline caused a great deal of confusion last night. In no way is this your fault - the acoustics in the courtroom are bad, there were many tweets that were later corrected/clarified, and several that were poorly worded.

Not everyone was able to follow the entire trial by tweet or read the articles linked below to know that it was PF's phone being pinged and that Slater testified that KK was in Idaho on November 22, the day KB was murdered. Please, when you have time, will you edit your timeline to avoid future confusion? Thanks for all you do!


Witness reveals how Patrick Frazee allegedly killed Kelsey Berreth, disposed of her body
Slater testified that Kenney was not present during Berreth's murder, but arrived in Colorado on November 24 to clean up the crime scene. She described the scene inside Berreth's home as "horrific."

Details of alleged gruesome bloody cleanup revealed in case against fiancé accused of killing Kelsey Berreth
Lee said Frazee called her on Nov. 22 and told her to get to Colorado to clean up, Slater said. Lee arrived on Nov. 24 with rubber gloves, a hospital gown, bleach, trash bags and booties, Slater testified.

Patrick Frazee going to trial in Kelsey Berreth murder case (UPDATE: Arrest affidavit inside article)
Kenney states she received a call from Frazee on Nov. 22. Frazee allegedly said, "You got to get here now. You got a mess to clean up." On Nov. 24 Kenney claims she was on her way to Colorado with a clean-up kit.

Affidavit details events leading up to Berreth’s death
On Nov. 22 around 4:30 p.m., while she was in Idaho, Kenney received a text from Frazee: “You need to get here now. You’ve got a mess to clean up.”

She told authorities that when she received that text, she “understood that as Berreth had been killed,” according to the affidavit.

While Kenney wasn’t present for the alleged murder, she said Frazee described it in detail.

Patrick Frazee allegedly had blindfolded Kelsey Berreth, bludgeoned her with baseball bat
She said she was in Idaho, and Frazee described the deed and enlisted her to come to Colorado to help him clean up the crime scene and create the appearance that Berreth had left town of her own will — partly by sending messages from the victim's phone.

Landfill search for Kelsey Berreth’s remains starts Tuesday
While the former nurse wasn’t present for the alleged murder, she said Frazee described it in detail.

ETA: This is not a complete compilation of the confusion!

@PommyMommy and everyone....

Sorry, I've been busy with work and real life and I haven't been able to read every post.

Should I update the Nov. 22 - 4:37 pm bullet on the timeline to this :

At 4:37 pm Nov. 22, PF called an Idaho number. Slater says PF’s phone pinged off a tower in Divide, CO, when he made that call. Shortly after, PF received a return call from that number and his phone pinged in vicinity of KB’s home, it hit off a tower, southwest of KB’s townhome. Slater said KK was in Idaho on November 22, the day KB was murdered.

 

[Artis]

“We wouldn’t even know where the murder happened in the apartment even, which room or where it happened at all, without her testimony,” said Dan May, district attorney for Colorado’s Fourth Judicial District.

Kenney’s witness role explains plea deal leniency, lawyer says

Dang it. I have to leave for an appointment but just want briefly reply.

BS, Dan May.

It was Kelsey's family (her bro, I believe) who spotted blood in the bathroom, leading to a more thorough examination by LE. It is THAT that identified Kelsey likely being killed at home, not KK's story. He's making excuses because their crappy deal has let off a dangerous and violent psycho who was a party to this crime.

 

[ajaylee]

What am I missing? He called his mother at 4:24 PM from KB’s condo. And yet his brother says he was at the ranch at 2:30 or a little later. So is it possible he ran home for a quick lunch to say he was there and then left and went back to KB’s condo and called his mom from there? But why?

Maybe he took the baby to his mom to watch while he went back to KB’s to gather the gun, her purse, and her body to dispose of them?

I wonder if SF has a landline or a cellphone. That call made no sense to me either. Presumably PF told SF he had something to do, and presumably he gave a bit of a timeframe: "back in a couple hours". I can't see why he would leave the ranchette for the condo, which is only 25-30 minutes away, and then call SF as soon as he got there.

 

[Reachingfornettles]

Delete

 

[oviedo]

What am I missing? He called his mother at 4:24 PM from KB’s condo. And yet his brother says he was at the ranch at 2:30 or a little later. So is it possible he ran home for a quick lunch to say he was there and then left and went back to KB’s condo and called his mom from there? But why?

Maybe he took the baby to his mom to watch while he went back to KB’s to gather the gun, her purse, and her body to dispose of them?

para 12 and 13 video surveillance at 13.24 and 15:36 of PF at KB's. Walmart was 12:54 - 13:17 - pretty tight IMO. Not sure what to think about SF2 and his recollection of when PF and baby were at SF's.