OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#45

[KentuckyMama]

BBM
It would make sense. I got to thinking, with that many horses, they'd probably have more than two around. One hanging in the riding barns, an extra next to the stud barn, etc... and a couple in the closet w/their hunting gear. So the two sets that someone bought, are being said, by FW, to have been bought as protection for G3 (b/c he was friends w/CR1, and maybe it was thought that G3 knew something).

Fredericka Wagner "later added that she bought both vests for her son, fearing one would not fit. She bought her son two different kinds because if it didn’t fit or he didn’t like one, she could send it back". FW said of G3 "he wore it a little bit" to humor her. RW refused to wear one, so it would appear that the two vests were for G3, to choose from. The BPVs were found, over a year, after the murders. I guess they forgot to send back the one he didn't wear.

Note; G4 is 6'1" and 250#, JW is 6'1 and 165#, and G3 is 6'6 and 274# per booking at their respective county jails. I'd like to know the sizes of the vests.

Pike County massacre: Wagner grandmas head back to court - will charges be dropped against 1?

Honestly, I'd never think to hire security. I'd not wear a BPV. Be more alert? Absolutely. Carry? Highly likely. Move in w/my mil? I'd rather make a machine gun nest, in my own home.

For the last part, I definitely agree. Normal people would do normal things like that. Normal and this family have never been introduced, I don't think. They were living on her land, and probably off her most of the time anyway. That's why I said hire security. If she were truly worried for the reasons she gave, none of what she did is logical.

 

[Merrygirl]

I hope direct tv carries it in my package!

Well, I again checked the Oxygen app today and it still shows 6-8 pm on Sat 3/30 and there is no posting on Sun 3/31. However, on the TV (I have Dish) it shows 6-8 on Sat TBA and lists the show @ 7-9 pm on Sun so who knows for sure. It keeps changing but I’m not sure which to rely on.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Jmo yes I could see a 76 year old hearing about bpv and going online and buying one without research. Jmo

She stated she paid 1000.00 for the order. If she paid that much for something she was going to know what she paid for. Fred does not strike me as someone who does not care about money so just throws it away without knowing exactly what she is paying for. Looking at how she takes people to court for a few hundred dollars of rent tells you that.

It is a myth that rich people don't care about the price of things. They did not get rich by throwing their money away recklessly. Keep in mind that even the Queen of England has standing orders to her servants not to turn the lights on in Buckingham Palace unless absolutely needed to save on the cost of light bulbs.

While Fred is not Queen Elizabeth, I am absolutely certain that she does not waste money on buying something without knowing exactly what she is paying for. She didn't get wealthy by indulging in compulsive buying and making large purchases for items she didn't have a clue about.

JMO

 

[Betty P]

I too know alot of people walking thru woods, huntings etc, none wear bpv vest, for hunting they wear orange and when it is hunting season, i simply dont just go strolling around our woods. Truthfully i did not even think it was legal for joe citizen to own a bpv vest.

A quick online search shows its legal to own a bullet proof vest in Ohio, but only if you haven't been convicted of a prior crime or if the body armour was worn in the commission of a crime.

Lawriter - ORC - 2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification.

2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification.


(A) Imposition of a two-year mandatory prison term upon an offender under division (B)(1)(d) of section 2929.14 of the Revised Code is precluded unless the indictment, count in the indictment, or information charging the offense specifies that the offender wore or carried body armor while committing the offense and that the offense is an offense of violence that is a felony. The specification shall be stated at the end of the body of the indictment, count, or information and shall be stated in substantially the following form:

"SPECIFICATION (or, SPECIFICATION TO THE FIRST COUNT). The Grand Jurors (or insert the person's or the prosecuting attorney's name when appropriate) further find and specify that (set forth that the offender wore or carried body armor while committing the specified offense and that the specified offense is an offense of violence that is a felony)."

(B) As used in this section, "body armor" means any vest, helmet, shield, or similar item that is designed or specifically carried to diminish the impact of a bullet or projectile upon the offender's body.

Amended by 129th General AssemblyFile No.29, HB 86, §1, eff. 9/30/2011.

Effective Date: 03-22-2001 .

Wagners were not charged with wearing body armour during the murders, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. We've already identified a few other criminal violations they committed, but weren't charged with. Obviously, prosecutors had to pick and chose which charges to file to avoid overwhelming the jury.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

unless there is evidence these BPVs were used in the murders, they won't be useful in the conviction of the W4. JMO

There are good reasons for having them, remember the Sheriff's call to defend oneself. It's a personal choice like owning defensive weapons.

Why having just 2? Well, there are plenty of reasons. One likes them, the other not. They are expansive, ...and so on.

I do hope there is more to the perjury case against FW than just that. She is of a certain age, it's normal not to remember every detail. I am much younger than her, i don't keep receipts for items. Ebay or Amazon, I receive the item by mail, I might not remember.

So you are telling me that if you pay 1000.00 for something on Ebay or Amazon you are not going to know what you bought? You are going to forget what you spent that 1000.00 on?

JMO

 

[Betty P]

Well, I again checked the Oxygen app today and it still shows 6-8 pm on Sat 3/30 and there is no posting on Sun 3/31. However, on the TV (I have Dish) it shows 6-8 on Sat TBA and lists the show @ 7-9 pm on Sun so who knows for sure. It keeps changing but I’m not sure which to rely on.

Their web site schedule shows tomorrow and Sunday evening. So it looks like they're running the 2 hr show each night.

Schedule

 

[Betty P]

So you are telling me that if you pay 1000.00 for something on Ebay or Amazon you are not going to know what you bought? You are going to forget what you spent that 1000.00 on?

JMO

Good point. Maybe you might forget about buying some shampoo or a book or CD, but not $1000 for body armour.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I agree, I also believe my 80 yo mother would buy them if she thought I was in danger. Based solely on the transcript I see nothing that would cause an unbiased person to consider perjury. 4 weeks ago I ordered some computer cables online. I think ebay, but could have been Amazon, or even Walmart.com. If there is a date on the vests dated after the murders, I don’t see what FW lied about. I think this is a pressure tactic by the state.

BBM

Did you pay 1000.00 for those cables? Did you know exactly what you were ordering and what they would be used for? If the cables had cost 1000.00 would you have paid a bit more attention to what you ordered and where you ordered them from in case they got lost in shipping and you had to call the company and find out why your cables didn't arrive? Or you had to return them for a refund because the company sent you the wrong ones?

Those BPVs cost 1000.00 according to Fred in her testimony. She didn't forget where she ordered them. She didn't know where they were bought because she didn't buy them. Simple as that. And the minute she said she did she committed perjury and by trying to cover for Billy who probably ordered them and used her account she was obstructing justice.

That's why IMO AC was smiling when Owen argued his "I guess I did, I thought I did" buy them "15 days after the murders" "Amazon, Ebay" defense. Because it's not about where she bought them or when she bought them, it's about her saying she was the one who bought them in the first place.

JMO

 

[FrescaandSouthernComfort]

Good point. Maybe you might forget about buying some shampoo or a book or CD, but not $1000 for body armour.

Wonder if FW left feedback.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Wonder if FW left feedback.

Good point. Ebay usually hounds you to death with emails until you do. So Billy probably did.

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

Does GW3 still have his Pretrial today at 1:30pm?

 

[Ann99]

Everything in this post is my opinion, speculation only.
I’m not sure it matters (except for perjury charge) who bought the vests, armor, etc.
What really matters in the end, is who wore equipment and when.
And - how old are the vests, etc.

Are they “replacement” pieces for older equipment that “Someone”** may be able to testify to or provide an affidavit that Wagners, (maybe Billy specifically) had owned and had in possession before 4/2016, and had been seen wearing the equipment.

The purchase date and age of BPV, etc, plates, etc. is important if they were meant to replace older BPV, older plates that were used in April
2016.
In reading about vests, body armor, the technology is continuously evolving. Frequent changes. Wags may not have realized there are many small details that can be used to identify manufacture dates...

** “Someone” apparently was questioned/ testified in a hearing ...(could be the individual who may not be available) but the Court Reporter from that hearing may be able to testify.
My Speculation that it pertains to this topic of BPV’s , plates, etc.

 

[KentuckyMama]

Where to watch today's pretrial... Let the hunting for a feed begin! Hopefully it won't be like yesterday with four tabs open and constant refreshing of pages.
Anyone have a link so far?

 

[Ann99]

Where to watch today's pretrial... Let the hunting for a feed begin! Hopefully it won't be like yesterday with four tabs open and constant refreshing of pages.
Anyone have a link so far?

This station has announced that they will cover all hearings and also actual trials

Watch

 

[Ann99]

I missed this yesterday. One reporter tweeted:

......It appears Fredericka was praying as she waited for her lawyers to go over motions with the judge behind closed doors.......

 

[KentuckyMama]

This station has announced that they will cover all hearings and also actual trials

Watch

Thank you very much! I will bookmark that one.

 

[Julia966]

Since you mention it, I thought you might like to see these again.
Miss Geneva, Junk, and Angela Canepa...A picture is worth a thousand words.....

https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/...0&height=405&fit=bounds&auto=webp

https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/...0&height=390&fit=bounds&auto=webp

https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/...0&height=390&fit=bounds&auto=webp

I do love Miss Geneva so very much.

 

[Jayejayehilltop]

A quick online search shows its legal to own a bullet proof vest in Ohio, but only if you haven't been convicted of a prior crime or if the body armour was worn in the commission of a crime.

Lawriter - ORC - 2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification.

2941.1411 Offender wore or carried body armor specification.


(A) Imposition of a two-year mandatory prison term upon an offender under division (B)(1)(d) of section 2929.14 of the Revised Code is precluded unless the indictment, count in the indictment, or information charging the offense specifies that the offender wore or carried body armor while committing the offense and that the offense is an offense of violence that is a felony. The specification shall be stated at the end of the body of the indictment, count, or information and shall be stated in substantially the following form:

"SPECIFICATION (or, SPECIFICATION TO THE FIRST COUNT). The Grand Jurors (or insert the person's or the prosecuting attorney's name when appropriate) further find and specify that (set forth that the offender wore or carried body armor while committing the specified offense and that the specified offense is an offense of violence that is a felony)."

(B) As used in this section, "body armor" means any vest, helmet, shield, or similar item that is designed or specifically carried to diminish the impact of a bullet or projectile upon the offender's body.

Amended by 129th General AssemblyFile No.29, HB 86, §1, eff. 9/30/2011.

Effective Date: 03-22-2001 .

Wagners were not charged with wearing body armour during the murders, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. We've already identified a few other criminal violations they committed, but weren't charged with. Obviously, prosecutors had to pick and chose which charges to file to avoid overwhelming the jury.

Learn something new everyday!

 

[Jonas_Klein]

So you are telling me that if you pay 1000.00 for something on Ebay or Amazon you are not going to know what you bought? You are going to forget what you spent that 1000.00 on?

JMO

Was it 1000 or a a few hundreds? What is 1000 for FW?

She knows what she bought. She does not remember on which web site she bought it.

 

[Aydrianna523]

This station has announced that they will cover all hearings and also actual trials

Watch

Thx for this! I'm planning on trying to follow this one.