GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #71

[molly1255]

Went back and listened to NK's interview with the CBI agent again. It was painful, but here's a few more contradictions:

NK states CW was sleeping in the basement. The CBI agent called her on that and asked her if she understood his whole family had been out of town. We know CW stated he spent nearly every night at NK's. Just when did she think he was sleeping in the basement?

She starts out the interview stating that CW was always kind and never said anything bad about Shanann. She later launches into a tirade about how Shanann didn't acknowledge him because she was always on the phone and on social media, and that he was in a bad financial place because of Shanann, Shanann didn't reciprocate, etc. Which is it NK - he was always kind about Shanann, or he badmouthed her? It can't be both.

She also goes into how she is so financially savvy. She then ruminates about CW's financial problems - he's broke, she was concerned about his financial issues and she isn't sure if he was financially irresponsible, they were living way above their means, and she was so concerned she even asked him if he had a 401k. I don't get how she's financially savvy if she was considering partnering up with him.

All JMO.

 

[NuttMegg]

I always liked the one where she thought it was in bad taste to go into the house of a married guy, her lover, while the real wife was away. Yet she did, at least twice that the cops finally got out of her, she ate at least 1 meal there, rummaged through the upstairs private rooms, commented on the number of books the children had, and never bothered to explain how she was able to come and go from SW's house on one of America's favorite outdoor vacation days...4th of July. I wonder if it pissed her off to have to crouch down on the floor of the lexus so cw could drive into the garage with her.

 

[NuttMegg]

What were some of NK’s contradictions??

Crime Tube has 428 minutes of NK interviews all together.

 

[Misy]

Thanks - I found the letter on YT. They showed other examples of CW's handwriting, and I'm no expert, but it looks like his writing.

I seem to recall DA Rourke being asked about the letter and he said "what letter"? I got the impression he'd heard about it, but never got a copy of it. It's not in the discovery.

If the sister brought the letter to the attention of his defense, my guess is the defense would not want to touch it with a ten foot pole because that letter could be used against CW as evidence of his pre-planning.

I imagine that the meeting CW had with his parents and sister when he was in NC was full of some crazy drama regarding Shanann being evil and ready to commit murder. The exact opposite was true as CW was the one who was ready to commit murder.

Just crazy!

I don’t know where I saw or heard this so hope this is not against TOS. Pls remove if it is. But the thing about the letter is that when CW came to NC and after nutgate, and after he told his family that he was done with SW, they (at least his mom and sister) feared for his safety thinking SW might lose it when he tells her if his wish to separate. So they urged him to write the letter. He apparently thought it was silly, but did it anyway. And then his sister kept it. Wish I could remember where I know this from!

 

[NuttMegg]

I don’t know where I saw or heard this so hope this is not against TOS. Pls remove if it is. But the thing about the letter is that when CW came to NC and after nutgate, and after he told his family that he was done with SW, they (at least his mom and sister) feared for his safety thinking SW might lose it when he tells her if his wish to separate. So they urged him to write the letter. He apparently thought it was silly, but did it anyway. And then his sister kept it. Wish I could remember where I know this from!

Oh I think it came from the ex mrs k fb page. Where the most rabid of the anti SW/anti victim stuff is generated. Where did you learn that the mother and sister were told that he was "done with SW", do you have a link for that?

 

[molly1255]

I don’t know where I saw or heard this so hope this is not against TOS. Pls remove if it is. But the thing about the letter is that when CW came to NC and after nutgate, and after he told his family that he was done with SW, they (at least his mom and sister) feared for his safety thinking SW might lose it when he tells her if his wish to separate. So they urged him to write the letter. He apparently thought it was silly, but did it anyway. And then his sister kept it. Wish I could remember where I know this from!

Whatever it was that brought about the idea for that letter, it was crazy, made-up drama. JMO

 

[molly1255]

Oh I think it came from the ex mrs k fb page. Where the most rabid of the anti SW/anti victim stuff generates. Where did you learn that the mother and sister were told that he was "done with SW", is there a link for that?

I know you didn't ask me this question, but Ronnie was in the know. In one of Ronnie's LE interviews, he stated that CW came over to their house the last night he was in NC and he told them he was done, didn't love Shanann anymore, etc.

Just speculating, but I think he probably also told them about NK at that time.

 

[NuttMegg]

I know you didn't ask me this question, but Ronnie was in the know. In one of Ronnie's LE interviews, he stated that CW came over to their house the last night he was in NC and he told them he was done, didn't love Shanann anymore, etc.

Just speculating, but I think he probably also told them about NK at that time.

I've heard that too, and I don't quibble that he possibly told Ronnie et al about the mistress, but it's a pet peeve of mine when they present that letter as something written because the sister and mother were afraid that SW would get violent and murder her own babies if she heard that CW wanted to leave. That's straight from Kbashvictim land.

IMO there is not one iota of proof, except for his acting like a jerk, being distant, etc, that he ever bothered to tell SW he wanted a separation. As late as Monday he was telling the realtor that he would stop by the house she had potentially found for the FAMILY. Not just for SW. So much of that stuff generated from the EXmrsK sites is designed to lay a basis for SW being Oh so angry that she flew off the handle and murdered her children. Which is exactly where I file the back story from the mother and sister and Ksites about the purpose of the letter, something meant to trash SW.

If anything it gave him justification in his warped putrid mind to kill them all. After all, if sis and Mom suggested that SW would do it, why shouldn't he?

 

[Misy]

Oh I think it came from the ex mrs k fb page. Where the most rabid of the anti SW/anti victim stuff is generated. Where did you learn that the mother and sister were told that he was "done with SW", do you have a link for that?

See, that’s why I hate to post things when I don’t have a link or in this case can never even remember. But I’m not on facebook. (Yes I’m that one last person on the planet who has never been on Facebook) so I know it can’t have been from there. Maybe some other YT video I saw. Maybe mommyramblings. Do y’all know her? Is she part of this group? She mentioned “we websleuths” recently and I don’t know if she meant like here, this site, or just “web sleuths” in general. Anyway the story was they sort of actually made him write the letter ...he thought it was stupid.... but ya know, did what he was told.

 

[NuttMegg]

See, that’s why I hate to post things when I don’t have a link or in this case can never even remember. But I’m not on facebook. (Yes I’m that one last person on the planet who has never been on Facebook) so I know it can’t have been from there. Maybe some other YT video I saw. Maybe mommyramblings. Do y’all know her? Is she part of this group? She mentioned “we websleuths” recently and I don’t know if she meant like here, this site, or just “web sleuths” in general. Anyway the story was they sort of actually made him write the letter ...he thought it was stupid.... but ya know, did what he was told.

Some people (like NuttMegg) are super-sensitive to where all the anti-victim/anti-SW fictions came from. You almost have to have been following the case since the first week to see it develop to lay the case, mainly from the family and attention-seeking victim bashers, IMO, that CW did not kill the kids, because SW was so angry at the thought he might leave that she killed her kids. That he was coerced by the DA to sign that plea agreement (!) Or, maybe he did kill them but SW pushed him too far too often so it was her fault. And of course she MADE him wear patches, and you never know what-all a guy who is sleep deprived from honking his mistress will do, poor thing. (As late as a few days ago this is being pushed by kvictimbasher. Mixed in with the support groups for abused spouses (CW), abused children (SW wouldn't give the girls sweets when they demanded, she cut Bella's hair funny), etc.
So yeah, I'll call them out on this BS.

 

[Poedelini]

I wonder how many people believe in the fact that NK was at the house when it all happened. I do. Super curious if she still will be arrested for it.

 

[NuttMegg]

I wonder how many people believe in the fact that NK was at the house when it all happened. I do. Super curious if she still will be arrested for it.

We didn't get to see some of the discovery, but I don't see, from what has been released, that she has an alibi. 111 minutes of conversation shortly before SW was murdered. And, on Saturday night some words between them as to why he even needed a babysitter, and why the babysitter couldn't spend the night.(Per NK interviews)
Why did the dogs react in the basement? It was significant enough for Tammy to mention the basement to him on Feb 18, but he changed the subject. IIRC. So much of this case boils down to things that are so hard to believe for the average person so for me it's hard to rule things in or out. It's all so horrid.

ETA: the police mention to NK in one of the interviews that they might have to get court order or other permission to check out her GPS locations. So maybe despite the fact she erased so much data from her phone they were able to follow her GPS readings that night to rule her out.

 

[Seattle1]

See, that’s why I hate to post things when I don’t have a link or in this case can never even remember. But I’m not on facebook. (Yes I’m that one last person on the planet who has never been on Facebook) so I know it can’t have been from there. Maybe some other YT video I saw. Maybe mommyramblings. Do y’all know her? Is she part of this group? She mentioned “we websleuths” recently and I don’t know if she meant like here, this site, or just “web sleuths” in general. Anyway the story was they sort of actually made him write the letter ...he thought it was stupid.... but ya know, did what he was told.

After rumblings of a "just in case letter" by CW, I recall mum Cindy spoke about it on one of her last interviews on national tv. MOO

ETA: I also don't do fb, and my recollection is direct from Cindy.

 

[Only4Justice]

Went back and listened to NK's interview with the CBI agent again. It was painful, but here's a few more contradictions:

NK states CW was sleeping in the basement. The CBI agent called her on that and asked her if she understood his whole family had been out of town. We know CW stated he spent nearly every night at NK's. Just when did she think he was sleeping in the basement?

She starts out the interview stating that CW was always kind and never said anything bad about Shanann. She later launches into a tirade about how Shanann didn't acknowledge him because she was always on the phone and on social media, and that he was in a bad financial place because of Shanann, Shanann didn't reciprocate, etc. Which is it NK - he was always kind about Shanann, or he badmouthed her? It can't be both.

She also goes into how she is so financially savvy. She then ruminates about CW's financial problems - he's broke, she was concerned about his financial issues and she isn't sure if he was financially irresponsible, they were living way above their means, and she was so concerned she even asked him if he had a 401k. I don't get how she's financially savvy if she was considering partnering up with him.

All JMO.

Great post. Thanks

 

[ReckoningDay]

They (NK/CW) spent the night at her house on the 3rd July, her birthday, according to him (IIRC she doesn't say that)
1)In the morning they were sleeping in because of no work, according to him
2)Shan'ann called or texted? And he got right up, went outside to get the call (or text, I've forgotten)
3) According to him, he leaves right away to go home where it's supposed, by us, he can send her photos of him acting like Mr. Mom, cleaning the house. Also NK doesn't like his leaving too much. (I think that was CW saying that)
4) According to NK, she went over to his house later on the 4th to help him with diet app. She says she went in the front door, he was vacuuming and had furniture and stuff nearly blocking the door. I don't think we've seen a video of her entering that time, or other time(s).

So here's what I think happened: (not an original theory, others have mentioned parts)
He was at her house, he did get messages from SW, he did go home. (on July 4)

However, I think NK went with him in the Lexus so they could pull into the garage with her on the floor.
And later he took her home or to wherever she had stashed her toyota pickup. Also there is a video floating around with him doing a bunch of pushups in his living room, then looking up at someone who purrs approval, sounding like a woman.

Why would anyone believe that she just walked up to his door and knocked on the afternoon of the 4th? Practically no one in the neighborhood was working on the 4th July, everyone would have been having barbeques, gardening, frisbee throwing, dog walking, car washing, etc. And we're to buy it that she just drove over, and walked in the front door? Wouldn't SW have seen the doorbell video, unless he disabled it for a minute or so.

The other time, if we believe there were just 2 times (I don't) she dropped him off and left right away she says. I don't believe that, either, that they were driving around the neighborhood together in plain sight.

OTOH, I can't see her parking in that construction area behind the house, her truck would have stuck out like a sore thumb, and I don't believe she sneaked in by the back unless it was the middle of the night, but then how far did she walk to her car? Too visible, IMO.

.I know you were referring to the night of the 12th August or morning 13 August, but by that time I think they had perfected the clandestine visits of NK to SW's home.

As usual, you make excellent points!

 

[ReckoningDay]

Misogyny right. To call her out for her lying,sneaky, underhanded manipulations. Wiping her text messages clean. Acting all put out when investigators wanted her to hand her phone over. ( HELLO quadruple murder here) She cared more about getting her data put on her new phone than she does Shannan,Bella,Celeste,and Nicko.
Lying to investigators about knowing anything about Shannan, or her being pregnant. "Almost feeling bad about Screwing a married man in His,and Shannan's home.
Chris isn't the only manipulative,conniving liar, NK is not some innocent who had no idea what she was doing.
She honed in on Chris and pushed him to be with her.

She was and is a despicable person. She deserved to have to actually live with CW after spending so much time trying to make it happen.

 

[ReckoningDay]

I literally wish I could have just given her a hug the way she looked walking up to that door.. and knowing that within a short time she would be gone. It's so sad.. Can just picture her walking in.. setting the suitcase by the stairs.. taking off her flip flops.. walking to the kitchen and setting her purse down.. maybe looking around then walking upstairs to peek in the girls bedrooms and finally going to her room to change and lay down. all while CW is laying in the bed plotting her demise. such a sick, sick man to perpetrate that upon any woman, especially your pregnant, exhausted wife. I hate that her last moments were full of sadness and stress, but I have hope she's peaceful with her girls and baby boy now.

Where is the picture of her walking up to the door? Can you please post or send me a direct link?

 

[NuttMegg]

Where is the picture of her walking up to the door? Can you please post or send me a direct link?

If you google "shanann returning home" on youtube, it's there on various channels. Here's one from CBS MSM.

 

[molly1255]

I've heard that too, and I don't quibble that he possibly told Ronnie et al about the mistress, but it's a pet peeve of mine when they present that letter as something written because the sister and mother were afraid that SW would get violent and murder her own babies if she heard that CW wanted to leave. That's straight from Kbashvictim land.

IMO there is not one iota of proof, except for his acting like a jerk, being distant, etc, that he ever bothered to tell SW he wanted a separation. As late as Monday he was telling the realtor that he would stop by the house she had potentially found for the FAMILY. Not just for SW. So much of that stuff generated from the EXmrsK sites is designed to lay a basis for SW being Oh so angry that she flew off the handle and murdered her children. Which is exactly where I file the back story from the mother and sister and Ksites about the purpose of the letter, something meant to trash SW.

If anything it gave him justification in his warped putrid mind to kill them all. After all, if sis and Mom suggested that SW would do it, why shouldn't he?

JMO, I have no clue if the "letter" is something CW wrote while still in NC or if someone close to him wrote it after the murders. The DA won't acknowledge it's existence. It's not in the discovery. If his defense team ever saw the "letter" they likely threw it right back at the person who presented it to them. JMO, it's akin to Scott Peterson telling Amber Frey that he lost his wife before Laci went missing.

On the last night he was in NC, CW apparently went to his parent's house and announced he was going to divorce Shanann. This would have been delightful news to them, as they despised her. Someone in the brain trust may have warned CW that given Shanann's emotional instability (one of their favorite themes), that when Shanann found out, she would be capable of doing something awful and he better document this in writing, in advance, just in case she did something.

CW is the same guy, who during his interrogation, was asked whether Shanann did something to the girls. He really ran with that one. I can see the suggestion that Shanann might do something horrible when she learned he was going to divorce her as being something that would really roll around in his pea brain.

What he came up with was Shanann disappeared with the girls after he told her he wanted a separation.

Amazing, JMO.

 

[NuttMegg]

JMO, I have no clue if the "letter" is something CW wrote while still in NC or if someone close to him wrote it after the murders. The DA won't acknowledge it's existence. It's not in the discovery. If his defense team ever saw the "letter" they likely threw it right back at the person who presented it to them. JMO, it's akin to Scott Peterson telling Amber Frey that he lost his wife before Laci went missing.

On the last night he was in NC, CW apparently went to his parent's house and announced he was going to divorce Shanann. This would have been delightful news to them, as they despised her. Someone in the brain trust may have warned CW that given Shanann's emotional instability (one of their favorite themes), that when Shanann found out, she would be capable of doing something awful and he better document this in writing, in advance, just in case she did something.

CW is the same guy, who during his interrogation, was asked whether Shanann did something to the girls. He really ran with that one. I can see the suggestion that Shanann might do something horrible when she learned he was going to divorce her as being something that would really roll around in his pea brain.

What he came up with was Shanann disappeared with the girls after he told her he wanted a separation.

Amazing, JMO.

Sounds right. I actually listened to Ronny's interview the other day when we were talking about it but never heard him say that CW was divorcing SW, I kept dozing off. Is the term "mush mouth" allowed here? As in speaking while eating oatmeal mush.
I figured that letter was also influenced by "the revenge of nutgate" ie SW thinking that Ma Watts had tried to kill Cece. So they accused SW of killing the family, tit for tat.