Identified! MD - Glen Burnie, WhtMale Skeletal 29UMMD, 18-30, in trash can, Apr'85 - Roger Kelso
- Thread starter PonderingThings
- Start date
The Maryland Medical Examiner is doing some further dental comparison between "Oscar Doe" and missing Air Force Sergeant David Michael Loew.
Previous dental comparisons were inconclusive. A positive ID could not be made, but neither could it be ruled out.
Sgt. Loew's case is posted in the Missing in the 1980's topic area of Websleuths.
Below is a link to a missing veterans website which has a photo of Sgt. Loew:
David Michael Loew
Previous dental comparisons were inconclusive. A positive ID could not be made, but neither could it be ruled out.
Sgt. Loew's case is posted in the Missing in the 1980's topic area of Websleuths.
Below is a link to a missing veterans website which has a photo of Sgt. Loew:
David Michael Loew
mrsNKY
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First time reading this case. Very interesting indeed, so many things could have happened to him. In looking thru this case, I have a feeling, this man got scared and ran. I feel so much was happening to him financially, he was frightened. Career military, his superiors getting involve and possibly forcing him to withdraw money, he didn't have.
I do not know for certain that "Oscar" Doe is Sgt. David Loew. Both cases are open and unsolved at this point. Many similarities, but no solid linking of the two cases.
One thing I noticed in the Doenetwork file on "Oscar" is that the key fob on his key ring looks very much like the rank insignia of an Army Chief Warrant Officer 2 (CWO2). All branches of the armed forces have Warrant Officer ranks but the key fob most closely resembles that of the Army insignia.
Usually a Warrant Officer is someone who progressed through the enlisted ranks to at least the rank of E-6 and who has a strong level of experience in a specialized field. These would normally be persons older than "Oscar".
The single exception to this is the Army's Flight Warrant Officer Program in which young men between the ages of 18 and 33 can enlist specifically for helicopter flight training. It is possible that this young man had gone through that training and progressed to the rank of CWO2. Or possibly, a Warrant Officer gave him the keychain - or dropped it at the body dump site.
One thing I noticed in the Doenetwork file on "Oscar" is that the key fob on his key ring looks very much like the rank insignia of an Army Chief Warrant Officer 2 (CWO2). All branches of the armed forces have Warrant Officer ranks but the key fob most closely resembles that of the Army insignia.
Usually a Warrant Officer is someone who progressed through the enlisted ranks to at least the rank of E-6 and who has a strong level of experience in a specialized field. These would normally be persons older than "Oscar".
The single exception to this is the Army's Flight Warrant Officer Program in which young men between the ages of 18 and 33 can enlist specifically for helicopter flight training. It is possible that this young man had gone through that training and progressed to the rank of CWO2. Or possibly, a Warrant Officer gave him the keychain - or dropped it at the body dump site.
Artistic rendering and reconstruction of the victim; Victim's keys
Date of Discovery: April 23, 1985
Location of Discovery: Glen Burnie, Anne Arundel County, Maryland
Estimated Date of Death: About 5 months to years prior
State of Remains: Not recognizable - Decomposing/putrefaction
Cause of Death: Homicide
Physical Description
Estimated Age: 16-25 years old
Race: White
Gender: Male
Height: 5'8" to 5'11"
Weight: 155-165 lbs.
Hair Color: Brown
Eye Color: Unknown
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Slim build.
Identifiers
Dentals: Available. The victim may have been treated at a dental school because the quality and extensiveness would be costly from private practice.
Fingerprints: Not Available
DNA: Available
Clothing & Personal Items
Clothing: Gray (or blue/black) wool sweater, off-white long-sleeve Limited Edition button down shirt with snaps on the collar, khaki (off-white, tan, or beige) pants with cuffed legs and adjustable buttons on the side of the waist band and a metal zipper (size 28/27), brief style underpants, white or off-white undershirt, and black leather lace up shoes with "Bonded Cellulose" stamped on the inside bottom (Bonded Cellulose patent filed on April 3, 1970; Patent #3643353).
Jewelry: Unknown
Additional Personal Items: Plastic comb, coins, nail clippers, small cannister, three folded sheets of paper, and a ring of keys including what appeared to be an apartment/hotel key with some letters.
Circumstances of Discovery
The victim's skeletal remains were found during the excavation of the construction site for Marley Station Mall in Glen Burnie. The body was found in a metal trash container.
Investigating Agency(s)
Agency Name: Maryland Office of the Chief Medical Examiner
Agency Contact Person: Charlotte Noranbrock
Agency Phone Number: 410-333-3225
Agency E-Mail: N/A
Agency Case Number: 142852A
Agency Name: Anne Arundel County Police Department
Agency Contact Person: Homicide Unit - Cold Case Squad
Agency Phone Number: 410-222-4731 or 4700
Agency E-Mail: N/A
Agency Case Number: 1985-055625
NCIC Case Number: U158161438
NamUs Case Number: 1891
Information Source(s)
Namus
WBALTV News
Anne Arundel County Police Department
theshadow45
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"Oscar" has been unidentified for 34 years today.
Sleuthster
Verified - friend of Wendy Huggy
Posted this to a missing person thread here. Glen Burnie is right next to Laurel MD - MD - Lawrence Fishman, 29, Silver Spring, 28 November 1980
Sleuthster
Verified - friend of Wendy Huggy
Not ruled out on Namus. Hair same color, height weight simular. LF photo shows him in simular shirt pullover sweater as Doe was wearing.I wonder if one of the key's is from a GM Olds Cutlass. The R key is noted as possibly a motel/hotel. Could have stayed in area. Wish we had a photo of LF showing teeth.
It could be possible that "Oscar Doe" is Mr. Fishman, but the length of time (5 years) between Fishman's disappearance and the locating of "Oscar" in the trash can would tend to argue against it.
One thing which is likely is that "Oscar" was probably murdered rather than his having committed suicide or died accidentally - based on his being loaded into a trash can and dumped in a remote location.
The keys are an interesting clue. The two larger keys are old 1970's vintage house keys which went to locking door knobs. By 1985 they were obsolete and no new construction used that type of knob/key. The smallest key seems to be for a padlock.
General Motors cars of the 1960's through the 1980's all had 2 keys: one for ignition and one for doors and/or trunks. The ignition key had a rectangular ring end, while the door/trunk key had an oval one. The working end of those keys was changed with each model year, so IF the medium size key is a GM key, it would be easy to determine what model year car it went to - although not what specific make/model of car. GM made Chevrolet, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Buick, and Cadillac.
The Key fob is also of interest. The emblem on it seems to be that of an Army Warrant Officer's rank insignia. I have wondered if someone so relatively young might have been an Army Helicopter Pilot - or might have been close to someone who was.
You might contact Anne Arundel Police cold case officers with your suggestion. I have spoken with them before and they were very interested in this case and possible solutions.
Larry Fishman "Oscar Doe"
Last edited:
carbuff
Well-Known Member
We submitted Fishman in connection to a UID found not far from where Fishman abandoned his car. Someone sent the information to the FBI and they checked it immediately. They take fugitives seriously.
LAWRENCE WILLIAM FISHMAN — FBI
LAWRENCE WILLIAM FISHMAN — FBI
"Oscar" Doe's key ring
Note the insignia on the key fob, and compare it with the Vietnam era insignia of an Army Chief Warrant Officer (CWO2) below.
Vietnam era subdued Chief Warrant Officer (CWO2) insignia. The shiny version of this insignia would have had two black squares on a gold background.
Note that the Army changed the appearance of their Warrant Officer rank insignia bars starting about 1972, but there was a "change over" period while the older style bars could still be worn.
Note the insignia on the key fob, and compare it with the Vietnam era insignia of an Army Chief Warrant Officer (CWO2) below.
Vietnam era subdued Chief Warrant Officer (CWO2) insignia. The shiny version of this insignia would have had two black squares on a gold background.
Note that the Army changed the appearance of their Warrant Officer rank insignia bars starting about 1972, but there was a "change over" period while the older style bars could still be worn.
Sleuthster
Verified - friend of Wendy Huggy
Let us know what happens.ty
My previous post concerning Army Warrant Officer rank insignia and its possible connection with "Oscar" Doe's key fob only showed one version of that insignia. From 1956 to 1972, the insignia was brown paint on gold metal. Starting in 1972, the bars were changed to silver with black paint on them. The CWO2 bars, as changed in 1972 initially had the two black squares wider apart than the current style shown below.
Army Warrant Officer Rank insignia after 1972 to present.
WO1
CWO2
Earlier version of the post 1972 CWO2 rank insignia with wider space between black squares and a comparison with that and Oscar's key fob:
Army Warrant Officer Rank insignia after 1972 to present.
WO1
CWO2Earlier version of the post 1972 CWO2 rank insignia with wider space between black squares and a comparison with that and Oscar's key fob:
Here is a view of the other side of Oscar's key fob. Clicking on the photo will enlarge it.
It is very hard to see and the image on the other side seems to show through as well. I can make out a star on the left side near the rim, and what appears to be a circle surrounded by five clouds on the right side of it. In the center, there appears to possibly be a seated figure holding something in an upheld hand just above the star. I have not been able to connect this with any particular organization insignia or religious medal. Any thoughts?
Sleuthster
Verified - friend of Wendy Huggy
To me it looks like Letters on the back side across the middle with some symbol like a crown underneath if you zoom in. Like REE and another letter. Not sure if those are the letters though. Also it looks like its a bit corroded over the letters like white spots. That's just what I see.
Here is a view of the other side of Oscar's key fob. Clicking on the photo will enlarge it.
It is very hard to see and the image on the other side seems to show through as well. I can make out a star on the left side near the rim, and what appears to be a circle surrounded by five clouds on the right side of it. In the center, there appears to possibly be a seated figure holding something in an upheld hand just above the star. I have not been able to connect this with any particular organization insignia or religious medal. Any thoughts?
carbuff
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I wasn't real clear there. We got a ruleout on that case within a week or two, so I was suggesting that submitting "Oscar's" case directly to Fishman's FBI link might get a faster result.
Sleuthster
Verified - friend of Wendy Huggy
Ok, so it was submitted for another UID not Oscar.
carbuff
Well-Known Member
Correct.
Hey guys. I just wanted to let you all know that Oscar’s identity should be released next week. He was a member of my family. I cannot say much else about the details. (I don’t even know all the details) The letter will be published next week with real pictures of him. Thanks for your concern.