Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #97

[marisab67]

If they’re going to consider reverse genealogy I suggest they start with Jay Leno’s family. (Just Kidding!)
(On another “chin” side note - I actually have a cat with a Jay Leno chin.)

This is killing me because once upon a time my dad made a comment about me to this effect. Most other people have always gone with Monica Lewinsky.

 

[mtnlites]

You wouldn’t happen to live in Genoa City, Wisconsin would you

You wouldn’t happen to live in Genoa City, Wisconsin, would you?

Ha ha, no. Much further south. I can recognize the posts of my people, though.

 

[TheVisual]

Dr. Oz is doing a show on Susan Powell. Next up is John Douglas(Mindhunter). Profiler. Now EST.

 

[MsBetsy]

Aren’t the lines a bit regular to be a human form?

(Image analysis NancyDrew)

I thought it looked like a concrete block, but then again maybe it is a square- shaped person. Jmo

 

[margarita25]

I wonder what “JP” would have looked like a couple years ago with a full head of thick brown hair?
These cases are just so whacked beyond comprehension.

JP?

 

[marisab67]

My daughter moved from Cali to Courderay, WI for 2 years, so, YES, I do know exactly what you mean.

Are you from Merced? I also lived in Oakdale for a few years growing up and experienced a bit of the same kind of duality. Ranchers are treated much differently regular townsfolk. If the perp was driving a King’s Ranch truck, they’d be the last to be questioned.

 

[Deleted member 278]

Dr. Oz is doing a show on Susan Powell. Next up is John Douglas(Mindhunter). Profiler. Now EST.

The Truth About French Fries!

 

[ocgrad]

IMO, we need to be extra careful about dissecting DC's words. LE had to issue a clarification after the PC because DC muddled parts of it. Still, the logic of some of his statements, taken in sequence, is not always coherent.

We don't know that he muddled parts of it. If the purpose was to communicate to the killer and those covering for him he may have worded it exactly as designed. He said he knew there would be a lot of questions.

 

[margarita25]

They must not have dna in this case because if they did the new genealogy stuff would be a good thing to use in this case. Unless LE is just stubborn and refusing to use it.

Why would they be stubborn and refuse to use it?

The only reason I can think of why they wouldn’t use it is if it were to consume the entire sample. But even then...

 

[mtnlites]

Small town in mid-America = religion, in most cases. Nothing unusual about bringing it into almost everything, it seems. Often see search groups stopping to pray etc...

As far as horrific crime, stuff of nightmares etc...any discovery of murdered young teens, who were almost universally expected to be found alive but lost, would be both horrific and the stuff of nightmares. Any if any sexual assault did take place...that would certainly add to these emotions.

I don’t think bringing religion into the PC was any more than part of a general profiling-advised scripting that was suggested. Or even just his (the speaker...cannot think of his name) own feelings coming into it.
Jmo

I agree. Maybe it's uncommon to hear the reference in PCs, but religion literally gets worked into most every conversation here. From checking out at our only McDonalds ("God bless you and have a good day") to the garbage man this morning quoting something from Revelations in regards to the storm that was coming, to the conversation I had with my non-church going neighbor as I walked my dog. It's just a part of everyday life around here. My Delphi family and friends almost always mention something in a spiritual context when talking about this crime. While the comments in the PC *may* have held some sort of alternative context, they could have just as easily (and probably more likely) just have been Carter's own feelings working their way through the speech. Even the movie THE SHACK is about a child's murder and how the person found their faith again. Again, could very well be personal.

And I agree that the murder of two young girls is already horrific enough to make LE remember the case or to fill them with horror. As I've said before, a dead child is already bad enough. You will always remember the sight of one. There doesn't need to be additional atrocities done to the bodies to warrant LE's comments about how BG left them or how it could be the stuff of nightmares. Someone killing a child is pretty much a nightmare in and of itself.

 

[jkloc420]

‘The new genealogy stuff’ takes time and work and sometimes a bit of luck. DNA Doe has cases they’ve been working on for more than a year—and I think that identifying a missing person, which is what they do, is much easier than identifying a murderer. (If you get close and start talking to people, you may well have someone say: ‘my cousin ran off and we never heard from her again.’ Unlikely that someone will say: ‘sure my cousin’s a murderer.’)

thats not how it works, they work the dna back to potential suspects, then they go and get that persons dna by disgarded stuff in some cases.

 

[mtnlites]

JP?

Jake Patterson

 

[jkloc420]

Why would they be stubborn and refuse to use it?

The only reason I can think of why they wouldn’t use it is if it were to consume the entire sample. But even then...

Same reason le is just now releasing more info after two years.

 

[MassGuy]

Same reason le is just now releasing more info after two years.

Saying that law enforcement is being “stubborn,” isn’t based on any known facts.

We don’t know what they know, how they know it, or what specifically motivated this release.

 

[margarita25]

Nice. Haven't seen many comprehensive "profiles" in here since the new sketch came out (although I may have missed them).

We should get some more of that going, I'll post mine here in a bit.

For me, my initial impressions as everything is unfolding seem more clear as opposed to coming back later. While re-evaluation based on facts and knowledge ascertained through the passage of time and the “course of the investigation” are of course important, imo there has been nothing new since day 1 which would alter my “profile”, so to speak. As I said, much of what was said in the latest PC imo is straight out of BAU standard profiling with a personalized approach imo, which MO, retired FBI agent, mentioned as well (BAU).

With the new information now that BG could be younger, of course this would have an impact on the perp’s profile as far as his experience, awareness space, etc, but for me my profile is pretty much the same now as it was back then, predator hunter, etc.

I’ll try to dig for my original profile, no guarantees I’ll be able to find it.

I do recall some discussions where some members here submitted their profile ideas; there was even a Criminology Forensics student who created a profile for her class and shared it on the thread, iirc. Of course this is all speculative.

ETA:
I looked back but there are just waaay too many posts and threads to find anything upon a cursory search.

 

[jkloc420]

‘The new genealogy stuff’ takes time and work and sometimes a bit of luck. DNA Doe has cases they’ve been working on for more than a year—and I think that identifying a missing person, which is what they do, is much easier than identifying a murderer. (If you get close and start talking to people, you may well have someone say: ‘my cousin ran off and we never heard from her again.’ Unlikely that someone will say: ‘sure my cousin’s a murderer.’)

The person running off dont have nothing to do with identyfing. They run the dna and it pretty much puts you at the scene. At that point you dont need anyone saying my cousin or whomever is a killer

 

[gitana1]

The religion angle is interesting to me as well as the reactions of many with respect to religion somehow being involved.

If you are in the camp that believes that the PC was specifically scripted, then the reference to “The Shack” is highly relevant and as such, brings religion to the equation. Whether LE believes the killer comes from a religious background, or did what he did because of a warped religious ideal, is in play. I am in the camp that sees the Christian themes woven into the PC. I believe there was a reason for that. Only time will tell.

Religion has been used by VERY bad people for centuries as a protective shield, or been used in warped reasoning to commit horrible atrocities. Being religious does not give one an immediate “pass” in my book.

However, if the killer is an upstanding church going member of the community, I can see how he would be passed over in favour of a more unsavoury POI.

I think the thing to remember here, at this moment, is that NO ONE is beyond reproach. No matter who you are, or what your background, you are fair game as the killer, or an enabler.

MOO and ALL THAT JAZZ.

I don't know. I don't think there's any way possible that the FBI, Indiana state police, Carroll County Sheriff and Delphi Police have failed to thoroughly investigate a possible perp due to their standing in the community or religious ties.

 

[wary]

thats not how it works, they work the dna back to potential suspects, then they go and get that persons dna by disgarded stuff in some cases.

That’s my point—that working the DNA back to a ‘potential missing person’ can be a lot easier than working it back to a ‘potential murderer.’ Look at the stats on how many potential suspects you can have if all you have are third or fourth cousin matches.

 

[jkloc420]

Saying that law enforcement is being “stubborn,” isn’t based on any known facts.

We don’t know what they know, how they know it, or what specifically motivated this release.

It is going cold is what motivated it. They are trying to form new leads. Means the other leads have stalled.

 

[ocgrad]

Same reason le is just now releasing more info after two years.

I did read in one of those articles researching familial DNA that it is finally starting to explode with some high profile results. But it has taken a while to take off because a lot of departments still consider it a last resort and put all their old standby investigative methods first. Only recently the case of the older couple murdered in AZ I think was quickly solved using it as a first line method.