The ransom note

[Dragognosis]

"So why the claim for "Victory" which is surely a miltary allusion"

Surely not. It's a religious allusion.

 

[fr brown]

BPD said that the boots were not a match. That implies that the logos were slightly different because apparently the shoeprint cannot be sized. I own a pair of the Columbus boots Burke supposedly had and I made logo imprints. They're on FFJ in an appropriately-named thread on the first page of the JonBenet forum. I haven't compared logos with the photo of Helgoth's alleged boots in Paula Woodward's book, but my off-the-cuff impression is that they are not that all-fired different.

One final word. Hi-Tec Columbus boots seem to have been produced to celebrate the quincentennial of Columbus's discovery of America, so kind of a stunt boot. The pair I purchased from ebay (not so long) ago are badly matched; the boots look like they were made on different lasts. One of the boots looks dumpy (and lumpy) from the back. I'm not sure it would be usable. My point is that these shoddily-made Columbus boots probably wouldn't be in the stores beyond 1992 and 1993. If the boots were purchased during those years, it's unlikely they would fit Burke in 1996. He wouldn't be wearing them.

But I think the bootprint is old for other reasons. It seems to me that if it were fresh at the time of the murder, there would likely be more detail of the heel and toe in the print.

 

[Tadpole12]

Didn't BR admit to owning that brand of boot?

 

[fr brown]

Didn't BR admit to owning that brand of boot?

Yes, when Patsy is interviewed in 2000, she's told that Burke and Fleet Junior confirmed that Burke had Hi-Tec boots with a compass attached. I can confirm that one of the Columbus Hi-Tec boots I own has a small compass attached to the lace.

I guess John Ramsey forgot this because he misleads Elizabeth Vargas on this point.

 

[fr brown]

One final word. Hi-Tec Columbus boots seem to have been produced to celebrate the quincentennial of Columbus's discovery of America, so kind of a stunt boot. The pair I purchased from ebay (not so long) ago are badly matched; the boots look like they were made on different lasts. One of the boots looks dumpy (and lumpy) from the back. I'm not sure it would be usable. My point is that these shoddily-made Columbus boots probably wouldn't be in the stores beyond 1992 and 1993. If the boots were purchased during those years, it's unlikely they would fit Burke in 1996. He wouldn't be wearing them.

But I think the bootprint is old for other reasons. It seems to me that if it were fresh at the time of the murder, there would likely be more detail of the heel and toe in the print.

I just saw a post on FFJ that shows an advertisement from 1994 for these kind of boots.

 

[Sillybilly]

Numerous posts removed.

Stop the back and forth nonsense in this thread or timeouts will be issued.

 

[UKGuy]

I just saw a post on FFJ that shows an advertisement from 1994 for these kind of boots.

fr brown,
That Burke owned a pair of Hi-Tec Columbus boots suggests the footprint in the wine-cellar just might be his, there is nobody else currently in the frame.

Also to back this up, Burke himself is alleged to have been in the wine-cellar Christmas Day Afternoon.

James Kolar, Foreign Faction, Excerpt

I learned, over the course of my inquiry, that it was Burke who had actually been responsible for tearing back the paper of the presents while playing in the basement on Christmas Day, and I wondered why Patsy would claim responsibility for doing this. Patsy had also told investigators that the unwrapped box of Lego toys in the same room was being hidden for Burke's upcoming January birthday.

I didn?t give much thought about the presence of Christmas presents in the room at the time, but would later think these played a role in some of the events that took place on Christmas day.

So why is Burke so eager to admit being present at the crime-scene the same day it took place? Could it be, he needs to explain away the footprint, except he travels back in time to imprint it?

This episode it similar to the 911 call, no he was asleep, no, that is not his voice, I looked and he was sound asleep, then Yes he was awake during the 911 call

e.g. denial that anyone owns a Hi-Tec Columbus boots, oops then Burke does own a pair because FW knew he did, so its hands up time, except Burke then says he visited the wine-cellar during the day.

JR uses the same strategy with Lou Smit over the torn gifts, i.e. he denies that Patsy ever knew there were gifts in the wine-cellar, implying only he did.

Then, oops a revalation, Patsy says she did know and it was her who opened them !

Its all smoke and mirrors of course, and can be tailored to suit your favorite theory.

.

 

[Dragognosis]

"Also to back this up, Burke himself is alleged to have been in the wine-cellar Christmas Day Afternoon."

Source that.

 

[Interested novice]

Adequate Sized Attaché?

The number of dollar notes required to fulfil the requirements of the ransom note is 1,900 by my maths.

A typical attaché (according to Quora at least) houses 10,000 notes. The dimensions of a slimline attaché I found on the net i estimate still holds 7,000.

Someone could check my maths. It seems to me evidence that the ‘foreign faction’ hasn’t done this thing before as they are unfamiliar with the capacity of an attaché case. I think you’d struggle to find an ‘inadequate attaché ’....

 

[Interested novice]

Oops I meant 1,900 notes and have corrected above..

 

[UKGuy]

Adequate Sized Attaché?

The number of dollar notes required to fulfil the requirements of the ransom note is 1,900 by my maths.

A typical attaché (according to Quora at least) houses 10,000 notes. The dimensions of a slimline attaché I found on the net i estimate still holds 7,000.

Someone could check my maths. It seems to me evidence that the ‘foreign faction’ hasn’t done this thing before as they are unfamiliar with the capacity of an attaché case. I think you’d struggle to find an ‘inadequate attaché ’....

Interested novice,

hasn’t done this thing before as they are unfamiliar with the capacity of an attaché case.

Sure thing. That's because the RN is fake, part of the staging, just like the wine-cellar and its contents, i.e. a fabricated crime-scene, just think what you could dream up if you based a theory on all that?

.

 

[Interested novice]

Interested novice,

Sure thing. That's because the RN is fake, part of the staging, just like the wine-cellar and its contents, i.e. a fabricated crime-scene, just think what you could dream up if you based a theory on all that?

.

That was my point too UKGuy though subtly stated. There is enough evidence to support your view already, though I thought the ‘adequate sized attache’ comment was an aspect I hadn’t seen evaluated before..

 

[Dragognosis]

Please post UKGuy's theory and the evidence that supports it.

 

[UKGuy]

That was my point too UKGuy though subtly stated. There is enough evidence to support your view already, though I thought the ‘adequate sized attache’ comment was an aspect I hadn’t seen evaluated before..

Interested novice,

I think it had been mentioned in the passing but nobody had done the maths. More attention was given to Crims referring to a case, sack, swag-bag, etc as an attaché case, complete with accented character !

Which all fed into Patsy's noveau riche affection for French culture, she painted and collected antiques, etc, and named JonBenet with this in mind.

.

 

[secretslob]

Adequate Sized Attaché?

The number of dollar notes required to fulfil the requirements of the ransom note is 1,900 by my maths.

A typical attaché (according to Quora at least) houses 10,000 notes. The dimensions of a slimline attaché I found on the net i estimate still holds 7,000.

Someone could check my maths. It seems to me evidence that the ‘foreign faction’ hasn’t done this thing before as they are unfamiliar with the capacity of an attaché case. I think you’d struggle to find an ‘inadequate attaché ’....

You are correct that almost any regular-sized briefcase or shoulder bag would have been large enough to fit the number of bills requested by the "foreign faction". I think the reference to an adequately-sized attaché could be an indication that John (or possibly John and Patsy acting together) originally planned to smuggle JonBenet's body out of the home in the "out-of-place" suitcase found in the basement under the window. The line in the note gives John an excuse to take a suitcase out of the home.

If that's true, the plan obviously changed at some point and JonBenet's body ended up in the wine cellar instead (where Fleet White managed not to see it when he peeked in, maybe because it hadn't yet been moved there).

I've probably read the note 100 times over the years, and the attaché reference has always stuck out as a possible pretext for getting the body out of the home.

 

[NanaNZA]

I think the note was originally a joint effort between John and Patsy. John dictating and patsy writing. Then perhaps John went to do something else and she did a slight rewrite.

 

[UKGuy]

You are correct that almost any regular-sized briefcase or shoulder bag would have been large enough to fit the number of bills requested by the "foreign faction". I think the reference to an adequately-sized attaché could be an indication that John (or possibly John and Patsy acting together) originally planned to smuggle JonBenet's body out of the home in the "out-of-place" suitcase found in the basement under the window. The line in the note gives John an excuse to take a suitcase out of the home.

If that's true, the plan obviously changed at some point and JonBenet's body ended up in the wine cellar instead (where Fleet White managed not to see it when he peeked in, maybe because it hadn't yet been moved there).

I've probably read the note 100 times over the years, and the attaché reference has always stuck out as a possible pretext for getting the body out of the home.

secretslob,

originally planned to smuggle JonBenet's body out of the home in the "out-of-place" suitcase found in the basement under the window.

Possibly as an idea, but in practice unworkable, could be Pasty authored the RN as John tried to stuff JonBenet into the samsonite case, remember those references to her fibers being in the case, when this failed they just tweaked the plan, since hiding her away is the same as removing her in a suitcase?

I've always thought that the Ramsey's game plan never actually materialized as expected, so some steps were omitted, this probably led John to recognizing, JonBenet will have to be found, but if she is found where she was, then currently hidden, everyone would recognize no intruder would bother hiding her away?

.

 

[Dragognosis]

There no evidence John was involved in what was done to JonBenet.

There is evidence he found the body in the morning.

 

[blankenship]

"So why the claim for "Victory" which is surely a miltary allusion"

Surely not. It's a religious allusion.

How so?

 

[IvyLew]

Maybe the RN isn't the killer speaking to John but John speaking to the killer. Suppose that the Ramsey's found JBR dead earlier in the night. John knows who did it, Patsy screams. John has a frighting message that he wants to get to the killer. The RN is created as a path to transmit John's message, to the killer. To make sure that the press would print the ransom note, the Ramseys wrote it as outrageous as possible. So the Ramseys were successful getting their message to the killer. It came via newspaper and was delivered straight to the killer's dark address.