Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #102

[Rocky1]

Maybe Libby's sister posted SM about it, taking them there? It amazes me how open with everything, every little detail kids put onto social media and there's so many platforms to do so.

That could be, but, to me anyway, Libby's sister didn't know Libby was going to the bridge until a half hour or less before they went either. That wouldn't give the guy much time to get there IMO.

 

[ab01]

From what others have said here it certainly does appear a registered SC user must add other registered users who are able to view photos shared by SC - it wouldn’t have been viewable publicly.

But as with all apps, only a user name and p/w is required so anyone having access to that information is able to sign on whether or not they’re the person who set up the app. Because I wonder how careful teenagers are about secure and hard-to-guess passwords and how common is it for them to share access to apps?

I also have no doubt LE has or is dwelling deeply into a possible internet connection which may’ve proved extremely complex. It was reported Libby was also a user of FB. I’m curious by what means did she ask her dad for a ride home? Phonecall, text, FB messaging? Or did she mention their plans to FB friends in advance of sending the SC photo? An imaginary scenario - “Abby and I are going to take photos at the bridge this afternoon”. A friend replies “oh send me some pics!”

My point - was there a reason Libby shared the pic via SC as soon (or almost as soon) as it was taken that day? Rather than intending to later post it on FB or Instagram?

In the days of home computers I think it must’ve been easier to track down stalkers to a specific physical address by setting up surveillance of all people entering and exiting the residence. However now with public wifi and mobile devices, particularly burner cellphones, it’s far more difficult to determine who’s actually at the other end of an internet connection.

There is specific information that can be gleamed by investigators even from personal devices, much of that information is encrypted but they do have capabilities to uncover specific details related to such devices even over public wifi.

Additionally Said public posts would be available to investigators as well as the public as a whole. We have heard of no such posts and I don't believe they ever existed. I have no doubt this information would have made its way to news media very early on if ever existed via locals pointing it out to reporters etc.

As far as a private message that someone may have seen bc of looking at another individuals device, Well I'm sure any of those individuals would have been questioned extensively early on if such pm ever existed.

with all that said anything is possible at this point, maybe Investigators overlooked something or someone.

I just think its more likely than not that information never even existed

JMO

 

[Theforeigner]

My theory:
If the police really KNOW that the killer lived in or was closely connected to Delphi;

Then I strongly believe that:
The killers motive was to silence one of the girls.
That one of the girls had knowledge about the killer that could destroy his life.
That the girl had threatened to tell.
The killer knew the girl would be at the trail/park like overheard someone close to he girl.
The killer used MO that made it look like a different kind of murder than it actually was.
The killer participated in the search, and maybe was part of the group at the crime scene.

I just don't believe that a person connected to that small community would choose to commit a sick and sadistic fantasy driven violent sexual double murder in his own small town were people know him.

 

[kc1023]

HLN ticker a moment ago:

COPS: WE'RE CLOSE TO FINDING TEENS' KILLER

and they were showing clips of the WishTv interview yest

(no link, live TV)

 

[tresir2012]

I'm still leaning towards those initial statements, "One of two things happened," Bursten said. "That was a chance encounter. That's possible. Don't think it's likely but it's possible. Or, that person knew they were going to be there. That's possible as well. Those are things we're looking into."

UPDATE: Delphi teen records audio before murders

Police have information on Delphi murders but not releasing it yet

This link from within your link mentions the autopsy had been done but that they would not release COD until toxicology reports were back. I have not seen that ever mentioned before. If the girls deaths were brutal, as reported, why would toxicology be required? Or is that just standard?

 

[Crazy4having3]

My theory:
If the police really KNOW that the killer lived in or was closely connected to Delphi;

Then I strongly believe that:
The killers motive was to silence one of the girls.
That one of the girls had knowledge about the killer that could destroy his life.
That the girl had threatened to tell.
The killer knew the girl would be at the trail/park like overheard someone close to he girl.
The killer used MO that made it look like a different kind of murder than it actually was.
The killer participated in the search, and maybe was part of the group at the crime scene.

I just don't believe that a person connected to that small community would choose to commit a sick and sadistic fantasy driven violent sexual double murder in his own small town were people know him.

The thing that makes me believe that they didn't know this person is the cellphone recording that has been discussed where they mention the "creepy guy". If they knew him, wouldn't they use his name? Of course, none of us have heard this footage so there may be more to it than we even know. MOO.

 

[Charlot123]

Absolutely but in today’s digital world it’s very unlikely that LE wouldn’t be able to uncover who was using said fake profile.

It can be done through vpn etc. but said individual would need to be extremely tech savvy imo

Even secure vpn tunnels are not completely anonymous to investigators abilities

Well, not necessarily a fake profile. I googled - one may use a friend’s phone; he needs the same phone for verification, but it is easy. Probably the friend went out.

You can make fake snaps, too.

https://www.quora.com/Can-someone-send-a-fake-Snap

As to other accounts, such as FB..,OMG, I can tell you how many fake accounts I saw.

The problem is, the girls might have befriended the person and forgot about him.

 

[MassGuy]

My theory:
If the police really KNOW that the killer lived in or was closely connected to Delphi;

Then I strongly believe that:
The killers motive was to silence one of the girls.
That one of the girls had knowledge about the killer that could destroy his life.
That the girl had threatened to tell.
The killer knew the girl would be at the trail/park like overheard someone close to he girl.
The killer used MO that made it look like a different kind of murder than it actually was.
The killer participated in the search, and maybe was part of the group at the crime scene.

I just don't believe that a person connected to that small community would choose to commit a sick and sadistic fantasy driven violent sexual double murder in his own small town were people know him.

That’s what “sick and sadistic fantasy driven violent sexual” predators do; they hunt close to home, atleast early on.

This is the logic that has hampered investigations in the not so distant past, “someone from here, couldn’t do this.”

People don’t kill two teenage girls, because one of them saw something. That doesn’t happen with any regularity.

That’s movie type stuff.

What does happen with some frequency, is sexually motivated murder.

I think that’s far more likely here.

 

[TL4S]

Below, is Sgt Riley suggesting somebody recently provided information about the car? Otherwise I’m scratching my head over why he’d be acting nonchalant over a prior “important tip” if it was information on the murderer they were looking for.

BBM

May 7, 2019
ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'
Speech to Text for ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'
Below is the closed-captioning text associated with this video. Since this uses automated speech to text spelling and grammar may not be accurate.
“.....news 18 spoke to state police sergeant kim riley about the changes over the last two weeks...........
.......we're still loking for the car that was parked in the lot. if somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible. > the importance of the car also ties into why police now believe the killer is local.riley says he was able to get around quickly on the day the girls were killed, and seemed to know the area. remember, that car would have been seen between noon and 5 on february 13, 2017, at the old d- c- s parking lot marked on this map.police are asking anyone who saw áany cars there that day, to call and give them a description. 3 because they believe the killer is local, and because the case has received so much of their focus over the last two years, news 18 also asked riley if there was a chance the killer could be someone police have already interviewed.he answered quote: "somebody may have already interviewed him. i'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened ... the person apparently gave the investigating officers the information they were looking for... we have to trto go back and check on the information that we have received."again, here is that tip line information if you have anything police ought to know about.the preferred method, the email, is abby and libby tip at c- a- c- o- s- h- r- f- dot- com.you can also call investigators at 844-...”

If this is May 7th, but then no mention of the car during the last interview, maybe somewhere in between they found their answer? Wouldn't that be great?

 

[Rocky1]

Was it random? Did he know them? Did the girls, or one of them know him? Would it have been clear on the audio if they were unknown to each other? If random, how did he know they would be there? Now with the knowledge he works/worked or lives/lived in the area do we still think he is unknown to them and the community? Why does no-one seem to recognise him?

All good questions.
IMO, and nothing to base this on, he had no way of knowing they'd be there. That's why I think it was random.
Do we have knowledge he works/worked in the area?
I would hope by now that LE has combed through all that by now, ie, time cards, absentees, changes in personalities combined with photos. etc.
Someone mentioned he may be a truck driver? there's only a few small truck stops in the area, and would they have cams? Would said truck driver be at a business delivering product, then walk away from his truck for a few hours leaving it back up to a loading dock abandoned? Maybe so, but I doubt it.

 

[Charlot123]

Police have information on Delphi murders but not releasing it yet

This link from within your link mentions the autopsy had been done but that they would not release COD until toxicology reports were back. I have not seen that ever mentioned before. If the girls deaths were brutal, as reported, why would toxicology be required? Or is that just standard?

Toxicology is. But longest I heard of, six months? Not two years? And their was probably prioritized.

 

[dub]

Below, is Sgt Riley suggesting somebody recently provided information about the car? Otherwise I’m scratching my head over why he’d be acting nonchalant over a prior “important tip” if it was information on the murderer they were looking for.

BBM

May 7, 2019
ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'
Speech to Text for ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'
Below is the closed-captioning text associated with this video. Since this uses automated speech to text spelling and grammar may not be accurate.
“.....news 18 spoke to state police sergeant kim riley about the changes over the last two weeks...........
.......we're still loking for the car that was parked in the lot. if somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible. > the importance of the car also ties into why police now believe the killer is local.riley says he was able to get around quickly on the day the girls were killed, and seemed to know the area. remember, that car would have been seen between noon and 5 on february 13, 2017, at the old d- c- s parking lot marked on this map.police are asking anyone who saw áany cars there that day, to call and give them a description. 3 because they believe the killer is local, and because the case has received so much of their focus over the last two years, news 18 also asked riley if there was a chance the killer could be someone police have already interviewed.he answered quote: "somebody may have already interviewed him. i'm not going to say they have or have not, but there's a possibility that has happened ... the person apparently gave the investigating officers the information they were looking for... we have to trto go back and check on the information that we have received."again, here is that tip line information if you have anything police ought to know about.the preferred method, the email, is abby and libby tip at c- a- c- o- s- h- r- f- dot- com.you can also call investigators at 844-...”

My suspicion--not necessarily related to the car, but in reference to having previously interviewed BG--is that someone alerted LE to BG, but did so with a random SM-driven or malicious tip. In other words, someone fingered the right guy for the wrong reason.

If that's the case, then when LE interviewed the guy, they probably didn't go about it too thoroughly because it resembled on the surface all of the sketchy BS tips they were receiving. I'd guess that this tip came in at least a few months after the murders--after the release of the OBG sketch, most likely around the time that DN was being investigated.

 

[Boxer]

Deleted by me, duplicate.

 

[tresir2012]

It's probably been said before but does anyone know if the girl's social media was set for public viewing? TIA

At one time it was because early on it was possible to see Libby's Instagram posts. It may still be available. I remember posters posting condolences.

 

[MassGuy]

My suspicion--not necessarily related to the car, but in reference to having previously interviewed BG--is that someone alerted LE to BG, but did so with a random SM-driven or malicious tip. In other words, someone fingered the right guy for the wrong reason.

If that's the case, then when LE interviewed the guy, they probably didn't go about it too thoroughly because it resembled on the surface all of the sketchy BS tips they were receiving. I'd guess that this tip came in at least a few months after the murders--after the release of the OBG sketch, most likely around the time that DN was being investigated.

That’s certainly possible, but that doesn’t have to be the case.

It’s a small town, and I’m sure that hundreds of people have been interviewed, both formally and informally.

Just playing the odds, it’s likely that someone in his circle has spoken with law enforcement, if he himself has not.

 

[Jerrod]

HLN ticker a moment ago:

COPS: WE'RE CLOSE TO FINDING TEENS' KILLER (no link, live TV)

August 14th, 2017 (6 months after the murders):

“We are getting closer every day. I know that is cliché but we are. We are stronger than ever and we are getting more people involved, so I think that the time is coming,” said Sgt. Holeman.

Also:

"Sgt. Holeman tells us several people have come forward and said they saw the killer walking on the trails the day Abby and Libby were killed. Those people helped develop a composite sketch that was released last month."

Lead detective in Delphi murders confirms police have more audio from phone, DNA evidence

 

[BNA]

Perhaps there is some sort of language use here? Some parts of the US people say you'all some people say, Guys sometimes, dude. I wonder if Guys is indicative of ID?

Is there a language map of the USA

My perception of the "guys" on the recording is that is was said as a greeting/acknowledgement, maybe with a nod of the head. The stuff we had heard earlier seems to be in said in a different tone...maybe at a different time.

 

[enelram]

That’s certainly possible, but that doesn’t have to be the case.

It’s a small town, and I’m sure that hundreds of people have been interviewed, both formally and informally.

Just playing the odds, it’s likely that someone in his circle has spoken with law enforcement, if he himself has not.

"it's likely someone in his circle has spoken with law enforcement."
Shazam!
See my earlier comment today about the ploy to get the 'driver'
of the car to come forward because the new sketch LE put out
is really the driver- who has more intimate knowledge of crime
or perp.
Locals took the bait and turned in tips to ID this driver (new BG
sketch) who has now talked to LE.
Thus LE is no longer looking for the car or driver.
their trap worked.
moo

 

[Boxer]

I can't read back 100 threads to find the original reference, but the poster that I replied to mentioned it in response to another poster. I'm not sure of the exact statement so paraphrasing. At one point LE stated that there is also just regular girl talk and a mention of BG on the audio. There may well be additional stuff as well, so I may have worded it poorly. MOO

The police statement was worded in a way that did not exclude more crime recording.
Mostly the girls talking seems to me
to mean they were videoing things and themselves things along their walk. Really too sad to even think about.

 

[MistyWaters]

There is specific information that can be gleamed by investigators even from personal devices, much of that information is encrypted but they do have capabilities to uncover specific details related to such devices even over public wifi.

Additionally Said pubic posts would be available to investigators as well as the public as a whole. We have heard of no such posts and I don't believe they ever existed. I have no doubt this information would have made its way to news media very early on if ever existed via locals pointing it out to reporters etc.

As far as a private message that someone may have seen bc of looking at another individuals device, Well I'm sure any of those individuals would have been questioned extensively early on if such pm ever existed.

with all that said anything is possible at this point, maybe Investigators overlooked something or someone.

I just think its more likely than not that information never even existed

JMO

I don’t ever recall the media reporting that Libby had a Facebook acct, yet according to LE she did. I posted the link a couple days ago but I’ll look for it again.