Found Safe TX - SS, 8, Fort Worth, kidnapped while walking w/mother, 18 May 2019

[katydid23]

Is it possible she was in another room? Maybe he knew other people staying there and asked someone to watch her for a bit or something? MOO

When he was driving her back to the room, he may have been paranoid that someone already had figured it out. So he may have put her in the trunk and left the car a long walk away from the hotel.

Then returned to his room. After the initial knock on the door by LE, he was not as paranoid. And he was calm when they first knocked because she was not in his room. So they searched and left.

After that he felt confident enough to retrieve her from the car and take her inside? JMO

 

[jjenny]

How well did police search the room the first time? It sounds like they just looked around? I am not sure they did a thorough search from the description of it. Did they look under beds, inside closet, TV stand?

 

[jjenny]

Yep, the situation with the Forest Hill police and the motel is very odd to me. I agree with all your points. I mean, you have a guy that 'fits' description with a girl and you walk away? I think that's crazy. The FWPD had to know about this too, why weren't they there soon after? The questions just keep going on and on... Were they waiting on a warrant and watching nearby?

It's hard to tell from what little info tid-bits (often erroneous) that the local media throws out there.

Also, I'm not directly implying anyone outside the guy they arrested is involved in any way - but I'm absolutely not ruling it out either.

This guy with a rap sheet (don't know all his offenses) from out of town waltzes into the Ryan Place neighborhood and brazenly abducts a girl with her mom (yes I know it can happen, but it seems random and rare to me) in daylight and presumably takes girl to motel off major road not too far away and somehow is questioned by cops that can't find the girl or the car?

Yes, maybe the simplest explanation is he had her restrained in the car and it was parked away from motel.

PS - what's your favorite scanner?

Police don't always do a good job. In Jeffrey Dahmer's case, a 14 year old boy escaped his apartment, and police accepted Dahmer claims that the boy was an adult and returned the boy to him. The boy was subsequently killed. So I wonder how thoroughly police searched the room for the girl in this case. Did they look under the bed? Inside the closets, TV stands, etc?

 

[Simply Southern]

Yep, the situation with the Forest Hill police and the motel is very odd to me. I agree with all your points. I mean, you have a guy that 'fits' description with a girl and you walk away? I think that's crazy. The FWPD had to know about this too, why weren't they there soon after? The questions just keep going on and on... Were they waiting on a warrant and watching nearby?

It's hard to tell from what little info tid-bits (often erroneous) that the local media throws out there.

Also, I'm not directly implying anyone outside the guy they arrested is involved in any way - but I'm absolutely not ruling it out either.

This guy with a rap sheet (don't know all his offenses) from out of town waltzes into the Ryan Place neighborhood and brazenly abducts a girl with her mom (yes I know it can happen, but it seems random and rare to me) in daylight and presumably takes girl to motel off major road not too far away and somehow is questioned by cops that can't find the girl or the car?

Yes, maybe the simplest explanation is he had her restrained in the car and it was parked away from motel.

PS - what's your favorite scanner?

I agree it maybe random but rare, oh no. Just look at our threads and my guess not even 20% of the abductions, that happen daily.

From experience, some go search, some work the map from home and some provide equipment if needed and everybody's got their scanner.

Usually LE work well with locals. When the Hedrick Racing team crashed into our mountains, locals with maps, a bull dozed and a dozen ATVs and the little local cable TV station was on the mountain, cutting a road to the site before the poor old state police car made it up the gravel mountain road, 2 hours, later.. The race track sent 2 helicopters over to the site and they broke into our radios and helped guide locals. We move fast and furious, we don't have a supervisor and have no boss, and don't ask permission, nothing to stand in the way of success.

I have a uniden in family room/kitchen and a hand held battery operated. I'm so lucky my LE and FD buddies programmed the back channels. Grew up in the county and everybody had a scanner, it was the only way we knew of a fire (all volunteer) or emergency. Oh and my very super duper binoculars. I thought everybody had one, til I went away to college.

 

[PommyMommy]

When he was driving her back to the room, he may have been paranoid that someone already had figured it out. So he may have put her in the trunk and left the car a long walk away from the hotel.

Then returned to his room. After the initial knock on the door by LE, he was not as paranoid. And he was calm when they first knocked because she was not in his room. So they searched and left.

After that he felt confident enough to retrieve her from the car and take her inside? JMO

That makes the most sense to me at this point. I mean, how in the world could they have missed the car? That's hard to swallow! MOO

How well did police search the room the first time? It sounds like they just looked around? I am not sure they did a thorough search from the description of it. Did they look under beds, inside closet, TV stand?

Reportedly, they inspected the areas of the room large enough to conceal a child.
Two hours before Salem Sabatka's rescue, police spoke to suspected kidnapper and couldn't find her - CNN

 

[jjenny]

That makes the most sense to me, so far. I mean, how in the world could they have missed the car? That's hard to swallow! MOO

Reportedly, they inspected the areas of the room large enough to conceal a child.
Two hours before Salem Sabatka's rescue, police spoke to suspected kidnapper and couldn't find her - CNN

Maybe the area where the child was concealed was smaller than what police believed could conceal a child. I wouldn't count out that the girl was already in the room and police just didn't find her.

 

[Simply Southern]

Link to the hotel, they are like small apartments. You can click the, slide show.

He was,uncooperative, I don't think he allowed LE to search.

Wood Springs Suites, Forrest Hills, TX

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[MsFacetious]

Since the tipster said she saw the girl... I'm inclined to think she had been in the room at some point. However, I don't know. It IS confusing. I think what this may come down to is not having a warrant. Without a warrant they are limited.

I am not sure of the legalities when it's a hotel room. I DO know if they had heard her in a drawer, they could have opened it. Just like they were able to enter the room once they believed she WAS in it. I don't know if they could have opened it if they didn't have reason to believe she was in it.

WOODSPRING SUITES FORT WORTH FOREST HILL $80 ($̶1̶0̶6̶) - Prices & Hotel Reviews - TX - TripAdvisor

SS is small but not terribly short. Drawers would be a tight fit. As would fridge. I think everything else (desk, tub) would be open and visible Did he have a suitcase? That might be the safest bet for him, legally speaking they likely wouldn't search that.

Most hotel beds don't have space under the beds, many people simply assume none of them do. However, some will. Some also have space under there if you move a faux frame out of the way. That is my guess right now.

I'm guessing that in those several minutes he moved that frame from one side and put her under the bed. Then replaced that side. So cops would have looked and it would have appeared like nothing could fit under the bed.

She certainly could have been in a drawer too, just seems much more risky.

 

[Gumbeaux]

I think someone should be getting all the details on how this pastor 'found' the car by some 'miracle'...

My suspicious nature wondered the same.

 

[LadyL]

FORT WORTH — Two and a half hours before an 8-year-old Fort Worth girl was rescued from her suspected kidnapper, Forest Hill police had gone to the man’s motel room, questioned the suspect and even looked inside his room but did not see the child.

Hours before kidnapped girl’s rescue, Forest Hill police checked suspect’s room

OMG

 

[blue22]

2 1/2 HOURS!!! Thank goodness she is alive. That is a lifetime in a child abduction. I cannot believe this turn in the story. I hope it gets sorted and discipline gets handed down where needed.

 

[MuddyTires]

Apparently it is a federal crime if under a certain age. Interesting glad you brought this up.

Title 18, U.S.C., section 1201(g) provides special rules for offenses involving children. Where the victim is under the age of 18 years and the offender has obtained such age and is not a parent, grandparent,brother, sister, aunt, uncle, or person having legal custody, sentencing levels are increased to reflect the severity of the treatment and situation in which the child has been placed.

1034. Kidnapping—Federal Jurisdiction

I don't believe your interpretation is accurate.

18 USC 1201 identifies the following five types of kidnapping as federal kidnapping offenses:

(a) Whoever unlawfully seizes, confines, inveigles, decoys, kidnaps, abducts, or carries away and holds for ransom or reward or otherwise any person, except in the case of a minor by the parent thereof, when—

(1) the person is willfully transported in interstate or foreign commerce, regardless of whether the person was alive when transported across a State boundary, or the offender travels in interstate or foreign commerce or uses the mail or any means, facility, or instrumentality of interstate or foreign commerce in committing or in furtherance of the commission of the offense;

(2) any such act against the person is done within the special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States;

(3) any such act against the person is done within the special aircraft jurisdiction of the United States as defined in section 46501 of title 49;

(4) the person is a foreign official, an internationally protected person, or an official guest as those terms are defined in section 1116(b) of this title; or

(5) the person is among those officers and employees described in section 1114 of this title and any such act against the person is done while the person is engaged in, or on account of, the performance of official duties,

shall be punished by imprisonment for any term of years or for life and, if the death of any person results, shall be punished by death or life imprisonment.

18 USC 1201(g) does not identify an additional kidnapping offense, but rather provides for an increased sentence in certain circumstances:

(g) Special Rule for Certain Offenses Involving Children.—
(1)To whom applicable.—If—
(A) the victim of an offense under this section has not attained the age of eighteen years; and
(B) the offender—

(i) has attained such age; and
(ii) is not—
(I) a parent;
(II) a grandparent;
(III) a brother;
(IV) a sister;
(V) an aunt;
(VI) an uncle; or
(VII) an individual having legal custody of the victim;​

the sentence under this section for such offense shall include imprisonment for not less than 20 years.

The language "of an offense under this section" refers to offenses listed above in 1201(a).


By the way, 18 USC 1204 adds a sixth kind of federal kidnapping offense:

(a) Whoever removes a child from the United States, or attempts to do so, or retains a child (who has been in the United States) outside the United States with intent to obstruct the lawful exercise of parental rights shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 3 years, or both.

 

[MuddyTires]

Most likely, he is charged with kidnapping under 1201(a)(1) pursuant to the instrumentality of interstate or foreign commerce clause:

Whoever unlawfully seizes, confines, inveigles, decoys, kidnaps, abducts, or carries away and holds for ransom or reward or otherwise any person, except in the case of a minor by the parent thereof, when—
(1) the person is willfully transported in interstate or foreign commerce, regardless of whether the person was alive when transported across a State boundary, or the offender travels in interstate or foreign commerce or uses the mail or any means, facility, or instrumentality of interstate or foreign commerce in committing or in furtherance of the commission of the offense.

Not sure about kidnapping, but in other contexts, cell phones, highways, and even cars have been considered instrumentalities of interstate commerce.

EDITED - just confirmed that use of an automobile does count as use of an instrumentality of interstate commerce under the federal kidnapping statute, so his use of the car, at a minimum, makes it a federal kidnapping offense.

 

[Mind your biscuits]

Police don't always do a good job. In Jeffrey Dahmer's case, a 14 year old boy escaped his apartment, and police accepted Dahmer claims that the boy was an adult and returned the boy to him. The boy was subsequently killed. So I wonder how thoroughly police searched the room for the girl in this case. Did they look under the bed? Inside the closets, TV stands, etc?

As was pointed out to me up thread, without a warrant, LE are only allowed to do a visual, in plain sight search. No looking in closets.

 

[JaneEyre]

Is it possible she was in another room? Maybe he knew other people staying there and asked someone to watch her for a bit or something? MOO

Those motel beds sit on boxes. They always freak me out. I mean, it is possible someone could be hiding inside. Since this was extended stay, I wonder if he could have prepared that underside of the bed ahead of time to hide her in.

ETA - probably not, if all of the beds look like the one shown in the link Simply Southern posted. But I have managed to creep myself out yet again about motels.

 

[Mind your biscuits]

Those motel beds sit on boxes. They always freak me out. I mean, it is possible someone could be hiding inside. Since this was extended stay, I wonder if he could have prepared that underside of the bed ahead of time to hide her in.

ETA - probably not, if all of the beds look like the one shown in the link Simply Southern posted. But I have managed to creep myself out yet again about motels.

Well, thanks for that.Creeped out and staying in a hotel for ten days soon

 

[JaneEyre]

Well, thanks for that.Creeped out and staying in a hotel for ten days soon

Hey, you’re welcome. I do what I can.

 

[Simply Southern]

My suspicious nature wondered the same.

I can understand your concern.

We have 2 WS members, Sally Kimball who searched at request of friends of the family and posted the grid she searched, starting post #359. Also, Ladylub, shared a FB organized search and would have gone but was under the weather., post #437.


JMO, photos show this was a really nice neighborhood, community. Locals organized, when the Amber Alter did not go out. The community really stepped up to look for SS, they organized quickly (fb), searched, and communicated. And by dang it, they found her, amazing!!! JMO someone was monitoring the police scanner, (we do), maybe the folks decided to concentrate on that area, I would.

 

[flashy09]

Well, thanks for that.Creeped out and staying in a hotel for ten days soon

WS has made me an anxious mess at times! Never sure if a good thing - more aware- or if I am making myself crazy lol.

BTW I am in involved in horse racing and love your screen name!

 

[katydid23]

2 1/2 HOURS!!! Thank goodness she is alive. That is a lifetime in a child abduction. I cannot believe this turn in the story. I hope it gets sorted and discipline gets handed down where needed.

I am not sure that any discipline would be warranted. If they didn't have warrants, nor any cause for a warrant, then they didn't do anything wrong.

And the description of the perp was vague as well as the description of the vehicle. Those cops had no way of knowing if that was the suspect or if it was just some middle aged guy who looked like the general description given.