UT UT- STILL MISSING 5 -Year-Old Elizabeth Shelley , Logan, 25 May 2019 (UNCLE ARRESTED) #2

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From what I’ve been reading, he was spotted around 6:30 AM on the 25th at Cafe Sabor near an abandoned train cart. Cafe Sabor is on 600 W and there is a train track that runs behind it. They have him on video without Elizabeth. The police retrieved the video footage from the worker.
 
SuzDuJour said:
If he was on probation it was probably part of the terms that he couldn’t possess a weapon. A baseball bat is arguably not a weapon, where a knife clearly would be.
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I think a baseball bat hidden on a person with no baseball activities to attend to will easily be considered a weapon by police. Depends on circumstances. imo.
 
I am hoping today is the day they find Lizzy.
I think this guy was a walking time bomb. He had a criminal record going back at least two years and we don't even know anything about his juvenile record, if one exists.
I wouldn't be surprised if he has a long history of mental health issues and substance abuse, going back to his early teens.
In any case he seems to have had a dark past, looking at his FB he seems to have had significant issues with depression.
I think that he spiraled out of control and likely acted out impulses and urges that he may have had for a long time. He doesn't seem to have any respect for his family or even human life. He is not remorseful nor does he seem to care about anything at all.
I don't think he had a psychotic break down or lost control. He knew exactly what he was doing and made attempts to cover his tracks.
I hope they find Lizzy so her body can tell the story of what he did to her. Her family deserves to know what happened and he deserves to be punished to the fullest extent. Imo
 
Trudie said:
Perhaps his crime spree wasn’t over?
Paranoia from drugs?
Maybe thought he’d take down LE?
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I was assuming the bat was for resisting arrest by either LE or anyone else who spotted him and wanted to hold him till LE got there.

I'm wondering if he was totally without a phone (having left the burner phone at his sister's house) and therefore not sure what alerts or LE action had yet been taken. He must have assumed the crime would be discovered very quickly. But it would be very strange and paranoia inducing to assume LE were looking for him but not know.
 
Tip May, 27 2019 12:59:50 CART147
Mon May 27 14:22:05 2019

A report of a knife found and possible footprint's from suspect. Items were determined to be unrelated to the incident.

BBM - Not sure if this was linked yet, but saw some discussion about a possible knife.

EBM to add link: http://web.loganutah.org/Police/media.cfm
 
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It is interesting to me that upon AW's accosting by LE, his first utterances seemed to be concern to identify that he had drugs and paraphernalia with him. If someone had just killed a child, that isn't what I'd expect him to be concerned about. Just thoughts.
 
Krix76 said:
I was bothered by the bat in his possession so much I took a little drive down to the Willow Park batting cages to look around. I was curious if he had it the whole time or if he could have picked it up along the way. We hit about 40 balls then the slow pitch machine stole $1 from us. They have metal bats of several sizes free to use and as long as the building is unlocked, a person could grab one. The metal bats are spray painted with blue on them to deter theft I suppose. The batting cages are also about 50 feet away from the train tracks.
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What kind of trains go through there & on what schedule? Do they stop?
 
katydid23 said:
About the knife. If he had used one, and then disposed it, he might not have wanted to carry another one on him, thinking it might look incriminating. He had to know he was going to get stopped sat some point?

But the bat? I don't get that. Hard to see it as self defense even because he couldn't even get to it without taking off his jacket...:confused:
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.
IMO he wasn’t thinking about the future at all. He was just functioning in the moment. Rationally, having the bat as self defense does not make sense. Maybe he was protecting himself from imaginary demons? Or, maybe it was just something he came across during his travels and decided to pick it up “just in case” he needed it. Of course, it could also be the murder weapon, that he was hanging onto for some unknown reason.

SuzDuJour said:
If he was on probation it was probably part of the terms that he couldn’t possess a weapon. A baseball bat is arguably not a weapon, where a knife clearly would be.
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. It was part of the terms of his probation. One could argue that a bat is not a weapon, but the arresting officers decided it was. Regarding him making a decision to carry a bat instead of a knife: that would involve rational thinking - I don’t think he was doing much of that.

Krix76 said:
I was bothered by the bat in his possession so much I took a little drive down to the Willow Park batting cages to look around. I was curious if he had it the whole time or if he could have picked it up along the way. We hit about 40 balls then the slow pitch machine stole $1 from us. They have metal bats of several sizes free to use and as long as the building is unlocked, a person could grab one. The metal bats are spray painted with blue on them to deter theft I suppose. The batting cages are also about 50 feet away from the train tracks.
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Thank you for local insights! He could had just picked up a bat because it was something easy for him to grab.

deugirtni said:
I think a baseball bat hidden on a person with no baseball activities to attend to will easily be considered a weapon by police. Depends on circumstances. imo.
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. It was - he’s been charged with possession of a dangerous weapon by a felon.
 
ClaireNC said:
.
IMO he wasn’t thinking about the future at all. He was just functioning in the moment. Rationally, having the bat as self defense does not make sense. Maybe he was protecting himself from imaginary demons? Or, maybe it was just something he came across during his travels and decided to pick it up “just in case” he needed it. Of course, it could also be the murder weapon, that he was hanging onto for some unknown reason.

. It was part of the terms of his probation. One could argue that a bat is not a weapon, but the arresting officers decided it was. Regarding him making a decision to carry a bat instead of a knife: that would involve rational thinking - I don’t think he was doing much of that.


Thank you for local insights! He could had just picked up a bat because it was something easy for him to grab.

. It was - he’s been charged with possession of a dangerous weapon by a felon.
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Sounds to me like he was quite dogmatic about discarding things in a somewhat scattered pattern....as if to make it harder?
 
deugirtni said:
I think a baseball bat hidden on a person with no baseball activities to attend to will easily be considered a weapon by police. Depends on circumstances. imo.
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Yes a weapon can- by legal definition in most states- be almost anything used to threaten, intimidate, fight, harm, injure, or kill another person or living creature. Intent is considered. Weapons can include guns, knives, cars, dogs, glass bottles, heavy flashlights, and... baseball bats- amongst many other things.
 
JudgeJoe said:
Yes a weapon can- by legal definition in most states- be almost anything used to threaten, intimidate, fight, harm, injure, or kill another person or living creature. Intent is considered. Weapons can include guns, knives, cars, dogs, glass bottles, heavy flashlights, and... baseball bats- amongst many other things.
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100%. If he's carrying a baseball bat and wearing a baseball uniform on the way to a game, no. If he's carrying one while on the run from the cops for abducting a little girl, ding ding ding, now it's a weapon.
 
JudgeJoe said:
Yes a weapon can- by legal definition in most states- be almost anything used to threaten, intimidate, fight, harm, injure, or kill another person or living creature. Intent is considered. Weapons can include guns, knives, cars, dogs, glass bottles, heavy flashlights, and... baseball bats- amongst many other things.
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Yes - and I think a baseball bat in a context other than a baseball game or going to/coming from a game could be considered a weapon. What other reason was he carrying it for?

jmo
 
smucklecrumble said:
I think if he was gonna kill himself ge would have done it before arrest...instead of going to get beer and cigs. Hes been deceitful and uncooperative, he clearly doesn’t care. MOO
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Maybe he just wanted to get as many beers in him before they found him.
I'm thinking the baseball bat was for self defense as opposed to being used in the crime. He probably didn't care if he was killed or not while resisting them. Either that or he was just too much of a wimp. Imo
 
SuzDuJour said:
If he was on probation it was probably part of the terms that he couldn’t possess a weapon. A baseball bat is arguably not a weapon, where a knife clearly would be.
Click to expand...

He was also on a no drink and he was drinking so the probation terms meant nothing to him, and he had a warrant showing he ignored probation terms.

Not that anything he did makes much sense so far so it could be. I am thinking it was an item of opportunity or part of a sick twisted thought in choosing to carry a bat. Or it was one of two weapons and the other, like a knife, was disposed of and he picked up the bat along the way...

Just speculation/jmo.
 
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