OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#48

[OhioBlues]

IIRC, I think she said it was on Loy's Run.

I need to make a road trip!

 

[Howcanppldosuch]

For some reason I thought of night vision goggles. These come in a huge price range ($30 to $4,000), and I wonder if the W4 tried to be thrifty and NOT destroy them after the murders, assuming they would not get caught. The good ones look cumbersome, some mount to a helmet. Jmo

My experience/opinion is that night vision goggles take practice to get use too. Hard to buy and use well the first few times. Moving with speed and stealth is hard if your not used to them

 

[Johnny B Bad]

My experience/opinion is that night vision goggles take practice to get use too. Hard to buy and use well the first few times. Moving with speed and stealth is hard if your not used to them

I don’t think they used night vision goggles because for one thing Kenny knew who killed him, I think he let a woman into his camper, Big Chris had just laid down when his window was shot with a slingshot to keep Frankie from hearing any gun shots, Billy was the one that went into Big Chris home and attacked him, and Jake and George 4 killed Frankie and Hannah at the same time, but someone held the 6 month old baby while they shot FR and HG, could have been AW, and Jake let the hate and pay back come out on little Hannah Gillie, I think BW got hurt at CR, they waited on GR to walk thru the door to shoot him, when he walked in they put the gun to his head and killed him afterwards drug his body into the bedroom and put him with Big Chris, it took all of the Wagners to get into Dana house, JMO, Angela or Jake knock on her door, Dana open the door thinking SW was sick and after she saw the guns she ran they killed her with rage, little Chris was hidden behind his bed when he was killed and HR was in her bed, so it took at least 3 Wagners to pull the hit off at Dana house, it took 2 Wagners at Big Chris and 3 Wagners at Frankie to keep all the kids from getting hurt, JMO

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I don’t think they used night vision goggles because for one thing Kenny knew who killed him, I think he let a woman into his camper, Big Chris had just laid down when his window was shot with a slingshot to keep Frankie from hearing any gun shots, Billy was the one that went into Big Chris home and attacked him, and Jake and George 4 killed Frankie and Hannah at the same time, but someone held the 6 month old baby while they shot FR and HG, could have been AW, and Jake let the hate and pay back come out on little Hannah Gillie, I think BW got hurt at CR, they waited on GR to walk thru the door to shoot him, when he walked in they put the gun to his head and killed him afterwards drug his body into the bedroom and put him with Big Chris, it took all of the Wagners to get into Dana house, JMO, Angela or Jake knock on her door, Dana open the door thinking SW was sick and after she saw the guns she ran they killed her with rage, little Chris was hidden behind his bed when he was killed and HR was in her bed, so it took at least 3 Wagners to pull the hit off at Dana house, it took 2 Wagners at Big Chris and 3 Wagners at Frankie to keep all the kids from getting hurt, JMO

Dewine stated all involved in the murders were arrested and there were no further suspects at large upon the arrest of the four defendants. So, if you believe Kenneth let a woman in his camper, do you mean that your thoughts are that Kenneth let Angela into his camper? She is the only female charged with murder. Why would Kenneth Rhoden let Angela Wagner into his camper, in the early morning hours? If I’m misunderstanding, I apologize and hope you can clarify.

Also, how are the four defendants charged with burglary at every crime scene if they were let into any of the homes by the victims? The state has the obligation to provide the burden of proof for each allegation/charge. That leads me to believe the state confidently believes they will be able to prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that the four defendants, conspiring together, unlawfully entered each crime scene in the middle of the night (burglary) with the intent to commit a felony (capital murder x8). JMHO, the defendants got in the homes somehow, but it wasn’t by being invited in by any of the victims.

ETA- I’m not being snarky or condescending in any way. Sometimes the tone is lost with typing so I just wanted to clarify. My mind truly wants to understand the possibility of your theory and what I’m possibly overlooking.

 

[Fletcher73]

Agree, why wouldn't they have just dumped this stuff off a remote bridge into the middle of one of the nearby big rivers. ... Seems they were adept at the stalking, breaking in and killing, not so much in getting rid of evidence. ... ETA2: ... the assumption was the killers would have dumped all their evidence (guns, clothing, etc) immediately after the murders, before the bodies were discovered and suspects identified to track and follow. Wags didn't think to do this, apparently.

My first thought, when the evidence was collected on October 31, 2018, was that the silencer was kept by the perp because he/she was either proud of creating it, or proud of the job done with it, so had saved it as a souvenir; moo.
IMO I had assumed it had been disposed of just prior to it's discovery, but of course, we don't know that at all, so JMO.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Dewine stated all involved in the murders were arrested and there were no further suspects at large upon the arrest of the four defendants. So, if you believe Kenneth let a woman in his camper, do you mean that your thoughts are that Kenneth let Angela into his camper? She is the only female charged with murder. Why would Kenneth Rhoden let Angela Wagner into his camper, in the early morning hours? If I’m misunderstanding, I apologize and hope you can clarify.

Also, how are the four defendants charged with burglary at every crime scene if they were let into any of the homes by the victims? The state has the obligation to provide the burden of proof for each allegation/charge. That leads me to believe the state confidently believes they will be able to prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that the four defendants, conspiring together, unlawfully entered each crime scene in the middle of the night (burglary) with the intent to commit a felony (capital murder x8). JMHO, the defendants got in the homes somehow, but it wasn’t by being invited in by any of the victims.

I did mean the person that I think killed Kenny was AW because he was so relaxed that he had set back down on the bed and brownie his dog did not care who was in the camper, if you think, just a couple weeks prior to the murders the Wagners men had altercation with the Rhodens so do you think Kenny would open the door up for one of the Wagners men, (also remember the women fan club at Billy last pre-trial) plus AW and Billy weren’t staying together he had a room at his mother and she had her dads house

 

[OhioBlues]

DBM

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I did mean the person that I think killed Kenny was AW because he was so relaxed that he had set back down on the bed and brownie his dog did not care who was in the camper, if you think, just a couple weeks prior to the murders the Wagners men had altercation with the Rhodens so do you think Kenny would open the door up for one of the Wagners men, (also remember the women fan club at Billy last pre-trial) plus AW and Billy weren’t staying together he had a room at his mother and she had her dads house

Personally, I don’t believe Kenneth opened the door for just anyone and I don’t believe he would’ve willingly let any Wagner in his home. The Oxygen article stated Angela and Hanna May had bad blood since Hanna May left Jake for Charlie. I can’t see Kenneth allowing a woman in his home that didn’t get along with his teenage niece, let alone the same woman who’s husband was allegedly involved in a fight with Kenneth’s brother two weeks prior. That same woman was the mother of Hanna’s ex who was trying to allegedly force Hanna May to sign over custody. By all accounts I’ve seen, Kenneth was loyal to his family and letting Angela Wagner in his camper would’ve been disloyal on several levels.

Why Jake Wagner And Hanna Rhoden's Relationship Could Be Key To The Pike County Murders

IIRC, Angela did not obtain her father’s home until April-ish 2018. Angela’s father, “Pug”, died in November 2017, while the four Wagners were still residing in Alaska. . At the time of the murders on 4/22/16, Angela was by all accounts living at Peterson road. Defiance Farms fb was very active before and after the murders with Angela’s posts reflecting she was at that residence. Just wanted to clarify that the S Webster home doesn’t seem to come into play until nearly 2 years after the murders and doesn’t appear to have any bearing as to why Kenneth would willingly let Angela in his camper. JMHO. Billy and Angela May have separated at some point, but I dont believe that’s ever been confirmed by a legitimate source, has it?

Fredericka did state Billy had a room at her house, but to be fair my elderly grandmother still calls one of the bedrooms in her home “so and so’s room” when referring to that particular room, even though her adult daughter hasn’t resided in that room for decades. It’s very possible and highly likely Billy was staying at Fredericka’s at some point, but I don’t believe we know that as fact. All JMO.

 

[Cool Cats]

For some reason I thought of night vision goggles. These come in a huge price range ($30 to $4,000), and I wonder if the W4 tried to be thrifty and NOT destroy them after the murders, assuming they would not get caught. The good ones look cumbersome, some mount to a helmet
. Jmo

Well after 3 years there's a new one. Night vision equipment! Did you ever watch The Silence Of The Lambs? The end of the movie where Jody Foster is hunting down the killer shows the killer using night vision goggles in his house and they really work well. So yeah, those crazy bastards might have used them.

 

[ColMustard]

There's the question of the blue car in KR's driveway (towed by LE on day one), he may have thought he was opening the door for GR, or maybe actually did open it for GR. Gun with suppressor is thrust in his face, on the pretense of robbery, KR backs up to the bed, pulls out the money as the killer readies for the shot, and is shot once. Nobody hears the suppressed shot.

A used night vision monocular can be bought as low as $30, they're handheld and will work at considerable distance, 100yds or so. Search, night owl optics.

If I recall, it was a full moon that night? Much easier to navigate with the moonlight, even one night before/after the full moon. The Moon has seemed even brighter the past several years.

So the night vision maybe wouldn't be needed to travel, but a quick scan would show if anyone else is moving about. Warm bodies will glow white, and the tiniest point of light would be like a small Sun.

 

[ColMustard]

Johnny B, I like your theory on the UHR scenario, but I'm not sure about KR letting AW into his home. Of course a gun in the face changes things quickly. Almost anyone might comply, if only to buy time.

 

[Cool Cats]

There's the question of the blue car in KR's driveway (towed by LE on day one), he may have thought he was opening the door for GR, or maybe actually did open it for GR. Gun with suppressor is thrust in his face, on the pretense of robbery, KR backs up to the bed, pulls out the money as the killer readies for the shot, and is shot once. Nobody hears the suppressed shot.

A used night vision monocular can be bought as low as $30, they're handheld and will work at considerable distance, 100yds or so. Search, night owl optics.

If I recall, it was a full moon that night? Much easier to navigate with the moonlight, even one night before/after the full moon. The Moon has seemed even brighter the past several years.

So the night vision maybe wouldn't be needed to travel, but a quick scan would show if anyone else is moving about. Warm bodies will glow white, and the tiniest point of light would be like a small Sun.

Yes it was a full moon that night but there still could have been cloud cover. The night vision equipment would be for inside the houses where they can't just walk in and turn on all the lights. Lighting is a big factor in the houses so now I am inclined to think along the lines of night vision goggles being used.

I always just assumed flashlights, but night goggles are more sophisticated, and even though the Wagners are as dumb as posts, LE did say there was sophistication involved, some planning from the movie "something about saints"?

I just don't think Kenny opened the door, he was in bed. Had he opened the door, he would have been shot on the spot and been found out of bed.

He used a padlock when away so I think his door didn't even lock from the inside. The Wagner's would know this.

 

[Cool Cats]

I did mean the person that I think killed Kenny was AW because he was so relaxed that he had set back down on the bed and brownie his dog did not care who was in the camper, if you think, just a couple weeks prior to the murders the Wagners men had altercation with the Rhodens so do you think Kenny would open the door up for one of the Wagners men, (also remember the women fan club at Billy last pre-trial) plus AW and Billy weren’t staying together he had a room at his mother and she had her dads house

There were 2 young kids. Angie was home with the kids. The Wagner men wouldn't want Angie there. Would you want your mom there? I'm sure Angie was home to help with at least some type of alibi.
Can you imagine what would happen to the babysitter that night? Questioned to no end. They wouldn't want that to happen. Just My thoughts, I respect your opinion.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Kendra Rhoden only wants her father's personal items. And, his Ford Ranger. And, a stack of old family pictures she gave him of the two of them so he could make copies

They wasn’t a Ford Ranger sittings in Kenneth driveway

Johnny B, I like your theory on the UHR scenario, but I'm not sure about KR letting AW into his home. Of course a gun in the face changes things quickly. Almost anyone might comply, if only to buy time.

I can’t see Kenneth letting anyone else of the Wagners in his home other than AW, he would see all other as a threat and his gun would be in his hand, the dog is the key to the investigation, the dogs need brought to the courtroom and see what happens around the Wagners.

 

[Merrygirl]

This article has some info on how they eventually purchased the farm

Fredericka Wagner: A look at her property and assets



BBM

I wonder if the business contacts were from Cincinnati?

I deal with reading business registrations in my line of work. The “agent’ is the one who wishes to start the business and who pays the $ for the shares to begin operation. The “incorporator(s)” is the business law firm who did the paperwork to set up the business as a legal entity. IMO, GW jr started the FWF with $500 and the law firm Tepe, Harrell, & Behymer of Cincinnati did the legal paperwork to set it up as a business. There were never shareholders. GWjr was the original owner.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Sorry about ford ranger information I didn’t get to delete it

 

[Merrygirl]

There were 2 young kids. Angie was home with the kids. The Wagner men wouldn't want Angie there. Would you want your mom there? I'm sure Angie was home to help with at least some type of alibi.
Can you imagine what would happen to the babysitter that night? Questioned to no end. They wouldn't want that to happen. Just My thoughts, I respect your opinion.

I have a different theory. I believe AW WAS there because Little BR’s interview with the child psychologist appears as part of AW’s discovery. My theory is BR identified a female who consoled him while the others did the dirty deed. If she was at FR’s trailer then it’s possible she could have been at KR’s camper. I believe the kids were home in bed with RN babysitting.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Dewine stated all involved in the murders were arrested and there were no further suspects at large upon the arrest of the four defendants. So, if you believe Kenneth let a woman in his camper, do you mean that your thoughts are that Kenneth let Angela into his camper? She is the only female charged with murder. Why would Kenneth Rhoden let Angela Wagner into his camper, in the early morning hours? If I’m misunderstanding, I apologize and hope you can clarify.

Also, how are the four defendants charged with burglary at every crime scene if they were let into any of the homes by the victims? The state has the obligation to provide the burden of proof for each allegation/charge. That leads me to believe the state confidently believes they will be able to prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that the four defendants, conspiring together, unlawfully entered each crime scene in the middle of the night (burglary) with the intent to commit a felony (capital murder x8). JMHO, the defendants got in the homes somehow, but it wasn’t by being invited in by any of the victims.

ETA- I’m not being snarky or condescending in any way. Sometimes the tone is lost with typing so I just wanted to clarify. My mind truly wants to understand the possibility of your theory and what I’m possibly overlooking.

I think they had a key to Frankie's home and possibly Chris's. BJM knew where the spare key was so why would Jake not know when he admitted that he lived with Dana in Chris and Frankie's trailers while dating Hannah. He may even have known where Kenny kept a spare key but by some accounts Kenny never locked his door when he was home. Looking at the design of a fifth wheel camper the bed is located in the upper section right by the door, so they may have opened the door and while one of them distracted Brownie the other shot Kenny. I think everything at Kenny's happened in seconds before he could get awake good and because of the dog they only had time to shoot him once. In other words I think they got very lucky at Kenny's. Then again Brownie knew Jake and may have only barked once then stopped when she saw who it was.

I think Dana was awake and Jake knocked on her door. When she opened it they rushed her then killed Junior and Hannah.

All JMO

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Does anyone know about an inmate handcuff to another police officer arm during the search of Peterson Road of the Wagners house they sold May 15 2017?

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Dana was the only one that had the gun put under her chin and shot, the killers made sure she was awake and looking at them when they killed her JMO