Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #106

[Krwiley60]

Quite a few reasons, really. For one, they were found on his property. He was also not only untruthful as to his whereabouts, but he wasn't meant to be driving at all. LE usually starts with those closest to the case and then fan outwards. Although he wasn't family, he was "close" in that it was his property. It was natural to examine his movements. In the course of investigating, they found things that weren't adding up. He was a POI in the beginning, but that doesn't mean that LE thought he was BG. Perhaps they thought he knew more than he did.

I think the fiasco with RL, as well as LE stating that they'd made several arrests that had no connection to the case while investigating various people, is one of the things that could be making someone hesitant to come forward. What if the person who does know something (if said someone exists at all) has something to hide? By coming forward, they could be risking arrest themselves, even if their crime has nothing to do with the murders. IMO, LE should've downplayed the various arrests they'd made. If someone broke the law then they clearly should've been punished for it, but I don't think it did LE any favors to announce that.

Someone that has information on these murders but also risks arrest for a crime they committed, could always ask for immunity in exchange for information.

 

[Gracie55]

Good thought. Was it open on the 13th Feb? Are they open 24/7/365?

Don't know about hours. I live in a rural area and there are some around here pretty loosely guarded. I imagine you could get in any time. Many probably have cameras nowadays too. But it's a thought. I've heard of people even living in them, and all sorts stuff found in them but I can't speak for Delphi.

 

[tresir2012]

That doesn't really track with "hiding in plain sight" and "he may be in this room" though, as if it's someone who's been involved to some degree in either the community or the case.

Hiding in plain sight could also mean a known or prior reformed criminal couldn't it? Or somebody beyond reproach normally like LE. Could also be someone high up but involved in pay offs from the underworld or anything like that. Also, as has been mentioned, a paedophile or wife beater, it really covers a lot of situations. I think this is also why the FBI got involved - they have some sting operations going on to try to catch those attempting to contact underage children. AJMO.

 

[tresir2012]

Someone that has information on these murders but also risks arrest for a crime they committed, could always ask for immunity in exchange for information.

If they stay alive to take advantage of the immunity and the reward. LE seem pretty sure someone knows, so I wonder how they are so sure?

 

[IQuestion]

They initially thought the girls may have had an accident so looking downstream of the bridge would be logical- e.g fell off bridge into stream and float downstream.

TRESIR...Ya know, that's the odd part about this case...nothing is logical, except two little girls being cut-off at the end of a bridge. And, one of them, knowing the situation was suddenly very, very wrong (Libby) using her phone to take a picture of the approaching threat.
Notice I wrote downstream with emphasis on stream. The water moves so slowly, is so narrow, and so shallow (covering less than a 20 ft width) whereas the bridge is an expanse of over 830 linear feet....so doing a little math....a 2.5% chance of falling in any part of the stream. Actually it is a creek, in a "double S" configuration that makes the water flow so slow, it is ideal for deer and thusly hunters.
TRES, just because I threw out a numbers and definitions about water ways...I may be just as far off from correct as anyone else.
*****Would anybody mind if I just relay an icky feeling....did they pick something up as they walked? That voice, "Guys, give it back"... could be monosyllabic order or request for an item. No need to use a lot of words....this is the end of the trail. Dhaaang, he is one cold bosterd.

 

[tresir2012]

"This leads me to think he may have actually still been there (at the crime scene) as DG was arriving and heard people starting to look for the girls."

I believe this to be true as well!!

You know, with the empty properties (at end of bridge and RL's) he could have just laid low and phoned a friend or joined the search. He probably knew there was noone in, as we discussed previously. Do we think he had a cell phone?

 

[rosesfromangels]

Teacher, Coach, Tour guide, Actor ?
JMO

I keep thinking radio. Could even be a voice you hear for a local ad spot.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[rosesfromangels]

Person who is hired to do commercials for local businesses because they have a radio "voice". Most likely hired through a talent agency based in a large city like Indianapolis.

Aha! I just posted that thought too!
Maybe we are on to something

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[NameUser]

TRESIR...Ya know, that's the odd part about this case...nothing is logical, except two little girls being cut-off at the end of a bridge. And, one of them, knowing the situation was suddenly very, very wrong (Libby) using her phone to take a picture of the approaching threat.
Notice I wrote downstream with emphasis on stream. The water moves so slowly, is so narrow, and so shallow (covering less than a 20 ft width) whereas the bridge is an expanse of over 830 linear feet....so doing a little math....a 2.5% chance of falling in any part of the stream. Actually it is a creek, in a "double S" configuration that makes the water flow so slow, it is ideal for deer and thusly hunters.
TRES, just because I threw out a numbers and definitions about water ways...I may be just as far off from correct as anyone else.
*****Would anybody mind if I just relay an icky feeling....did they pick something up as they walked? That voice, "Guys, give it back"... could be monosyllabic order or request for an item. No need to use a lot of words....this is the end of the trail. Dhaaang, he is one cold bosterd.

I thought the water looked like it was moving pretty well when the search teams where in it (see helicopter footage) IIRC they were at points in water that was up to there mid thigh. in the lease it would be plausible in their mind that an accident could have happened that took them away from the bridge.

Also as a parent that night I am sure they were trying to keep their hopes as high as they could and not expecting what eventually would be found.

MOO

Let the right tip be today!

 

[FinePrint]

I do in fact see a camera on the front of the building. From the location of the camera on the front of the building to the road (W300N) is 100 feet. I have no experience with these types of camera's so I do not know what the distance or radius of coverage is.

In my thinking there are only a few reasons why this camera would not have captured the suspects image, either vehicle or him walking:

1-The camera is not strong enough to capture 100 feet out to the road.
2-The suspect arrived and departed east of the location of the storage units, closer to the drop off point (maybe parked at the cemetery)
3- The suspect arrived and departed from the west and was parked at the CPS building and moved along the pathways or trails and not on the road
4- The camera was not working
5- The suspect parked at the drop off point, same place the girls were dropped off.

 

[tresir2012]

TRESIR...Ya know, that's the odd part about this case...nothing is logical, except two little girls being cut-off at the end of a bridge. And, one of them, knowing the situation was suddenly very, very wrong (Libby) using her phone to take a picture of the approaching threat.
Notice I wrote downstream with emphasis on stream. The water moves so slowly, is so narrow, and so shallow (covering less than a 20 ft width) whereas the bridge is an expanse of over 830 linear feet....so doing a little math....a 2.5% chance of falling in any part of the stream. Actually it is a creek, in a "double S" configuration that makes the water flow so slow, it is ideal for deer and thusly hunters.
TRES, just because I threw out a numbers and definitions about water ways...I may be just as far off from correct as anyone else.
*****Would anybody mind if I just relay an icky feeling....did they pick something up as they walked? That voice, "Guys, give it back"... could be monosyllabic order or request for an item. No need to use a lot of words....this is the end of the trail. Dhaaang, he is one cold bosterd.

The water was high and quite fast flowing due to snow melt and run off. The heli video the following day shows the searchers in quite deep water holding hands going across- water up to their waists. Only at the sand bar is it shallow. So it was best to check the water first. It was more like 100 feet wide IMO. The heli video is in the media thread early on but you've probably seen it. Just look how quickly that poor little boy got swept away in June and a boat load of school kids had to be saved recently too. It really is dangerous in places. MOO though.

 

[Julia966]

The only thing I can think of that has made them turn right back to the "frat boy" sketch is the murder arrest of a young man who had worked and had a girlfriend accomplice in Delphi . MOO
(ETA wrong example quoted originally.)
I cannot think of any other reason TBH.

Might the sketches be of two different people who were seen in the vicinity that day? Has LE actually said, never mind the first one, he doesn't exist or he's morphed into the second one, or have they simply added this new face into the mix?

*Sorry, I'm not as up to speed on this case as others *

 

[bradfordsleuth]

This is truly perplexing to me as well. I’ve twisted my brain into circles trying to come up with a plausible explanation as to why BG (now identified as relatively younger than original implied) would not have factored in cell phones.

Factored in 1) that they would have one in the first place (that could record, dial 911 etc), and/or 2) that he needed to dispose of Libby’s cell after the murders.

The only plausible explanation IMO, is that it required too much focus to control the girls in the first place to worry about the phone, AND that he had to scaddaddle out of there in a huge hurry. This leads me to think he may have actually still been there (at the crime scene) as DG was arriving and heard people starting to look for the girls.

All MOO.

Maybe the perp. thought that cell phone had been well destroyed when it was left behind with the girls (he could have crushed it with hard object like a large rock) and he didn't count on 'cloud' data being available or realize that he had been recorded by Libby?

Just thinking out loud and JMO

 

[goldie finch]

I keep thinking radio. Could even be a voice you hear for a local ad spot.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Disc jockey?

 

[SeattleStew]

If you look close and zoom in to pic you can see something orange laying on the ground. That is why the small piece of crime scene tape is there. I've blown it up but cannot see what it is, can anyone else? This looks like the car at the top is parked on the private road that goes under the bridge so I think this is the hill that they went down IMO. Were there other pics?because it is very hard to identify as the Delphi crime scene - it could be any crime scene. The link doesn't tell us anything specific.

Above bolded by me.

Bangert: Spotlight on Delphi trail after girls killed

This is taken right from The Lafayette Journal & Courier website. The article was written on Feb 15 2017. The article is called Bangert: Spotlight on Delphi Trail Since Girls Killed. Bangert is the author. There is a slide show of 30 photographs and the one I posted with crime scene tape is #14.

edited by me because I found the article with the picture.

 

[TL4S]

I do in fact see a camera on the front of the building. From the location of the camera on the front of the building to the road (W300N) is 100 feet. I have no experience with these types of camera's so I do not know what the distance or radius of coverage is.

In my thinking there are only a few reasons why this camera would not have captured the suspects image, either vehicle or him walking:

1-The camera is not strong enough to capture 100 feet out to the road.
2-The suspect arrived and departed east of the location of the storage units, closer to the drop off point (maybe parked at the cemetery)
3- The suspect arrived and departed from the west and was parked at the CPS building and moved along the pathways or trails and not on the road
4- The camera was not working
5- The suspect parked at the drop off point, same place the girls were dropped off.

Yeah, I'd be willing to bet LE collected their footage right away.

 

[Trocroc9]

Might the sketches be of two different people who were seen in the vicinity that day? Has LE actually said, never mind the first one, he doesn't exist or he's morphed into the second one, or have they simply added this new face into the mix?

*Sorry, I'm not as up to speed on this case as others *

Could it possibly be a father and son duo and that is why they said it could be a combination of the two sketches and only called the first sketch secondary and did not altogether eliminate it.

"The sketch isn’t a photograph. A sketch is a sketch and that’s really important for everybody to understand," Carter said. "I believe that the individual when we catch him, it will be a combination of those two.”

The sketches may be different people eyewitnesses reported seeing at the park. This would explain the age difference in sketches as the father and son could have been together at one point and then separated.

ISP: We're 'one tip away' from solving Delphi murders

 

[gregjrichards]

@oksooner we can’t discuss family members being polygraphed or not in any case here at Websleuths as they are considered to be victims. I don’t want the thread shut down.

 

[gregjrichards]

Deleted by me iPad was playing up and post duplicated.

 

[oksooner]

@oksooner we can’t discuss family members being polygraphed or not in any case here at Websleuths as they are considered to be victims. I don’t want the thread shut down.

My apologies, no harm intended I promise