Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #108

[PezCandy]

This is another similar comment by Carter, only days following the murders.

Feb 22/17
“To Abby and Libby, it is my hope and prayer they are now experiencing God's promise of eternal peace," Carter said as he left the podium at the news conference.”
Life changes in Delphi as hunt for killer continues

I’ve been pondering, is Carter perhaps religious or the girls family? It’s not that unusual to speak like that if it’s something you are doing to respectfully talk and help a grieving family or comfort a small town that’s shaken up.
All just opinions and amateur speculations

 

[PaulaDC]

Hey HOTDOG We all (me for sure) get things deleted, even if we didn't intend any harm. I just found out I got a post deleted because I included another poster quote that was deemed TOS/deleted. We all get caught in the net of "mass deletes" from time to time. The MODS are great, and they have guidelines for a reason...can you imagine the "free-for-all" if we didn't have them? (Insert icon of a bunch of sleuths throwing snowballs at each other, Lol.)

I admit, I'm the culprit of the original post which I also got messages it would be deleted but is still up. I also saw another more detailed post after mine explaining to watch it.Not sure if someone changed their minds or decided to allow after starting to delete.I apologize.

 

[crazychris]

This is another similar comment by Carter, only days following the murders.

Feb 22/17
“To Abby and Libby, it is my hope and prayer they are now experiencing God's promise of eternal peace," Carter said as he left the podium at the news conference.”
Life changes in Delphi as hunt for killer continues

Carter is obviously religious.I don't really think LE should bring religion in to it at all.

 

[Handsome Sailor]

We need a Mark Fuhrman type to walk right into that detective bureau, pivot on the balls of his feet, and start kicking over chairs, pound on desks with 2-fisted outrage. Light a figurative fire under some of the detectives, make it hot...until this thing is done.

 

[BNA]

We need a Mark Fuhrman type to walk right into that detective bureau, pivot on the balls of his feet, and start kicking over chairs, pound on desks with 2-fisted outrage. Light a figurative fire under some of the detectives, make it hot...until this thing is done.

I think LE needs additional help getting the word out....unless they have this all but wrapped up. I am thinking this case may need some additional, wider publicity. And, maybe the Supt. should bring his superior in to give everybody a pep talk and then a PC. OTOH, maybe his superior does not want to get involved, etc, which would be a real shame, but perhaps understandable. I am not sure if the press has been knocking on the superior's door. If not, I don't know why not. If in Pennsylvania, the superior sure would be hearing from the press. The Supt. would be getting all the publicity he desired. JMO.

 

[tresir2012]

Sorry, I haven't found any specific witness names or times of what they saw in MSM, if you have a info where to look I would appreciate it.
I am lost on Gray Hughes. Derrick's path is the one I am familiar with, but only FSG is mentioned.
FSG only heard/saw? a couple --and the time he was at the bridge? He met up wih DG at 3:15.
MOO Walk from Bridge back to Mears parking area about 6 minutes.

I am thinking of FSG and CE the two you mentioned as the only ones we have heard mentioned. Assuming FSG went across the bridge and back would maybe add another 10 minutes to his timeframe so we can estimate him on the bridge between about 3.00 till 3.09 so would have missed BG by about 1/2 hour or so. MOO.

 

[tresir2012]

Yes, I believed the idea that there was either a vehicle or another person in the photo of Abby has been pretty much debunked.

I don't see a vehicle either but I think there is a possibility he had a vehicle at that end of the bridge. MOO

 

[Jax49]

I think LE needs additional help getting the word out....unless they have this all but wrapped up. I am thinking this case may need some additional, wider publicity. And, maybe the Supt. should bring his superior in to give everybody a pep talk and then a PC. OTOH, maybe his superior does not want to get involved, etc, which would be a real shame, but perhaps understandable. I am not sure if the press has been knocking on the superior's door. If not, I don't know why not. If in Pennsylvania, the superior sure would be hearing from the press. The Supt. would be getting all the publicity he desired. JMO.

Does Carter report to someone other than the Governor?

"The Indiana State Police is currently led by Superintendent Douglas G. Carter, whose position is appointed by the governor."

 

[tresir2012]

I think, the killer is someone, who is proud to do the crime all by himself and in a wink and to escape police in every state, he did a felony (maybe, we don't know). Nevertheless he could have had a good friend, who helped him cleaning up the scene in Delphi and covering his tracks. IF he had some help (someone, who knew the area/terrain), he could have brought back the girls from another crime scene to RL's property.
..... My laptop is overheating ..... a moment please.
ETA:
I think, where ever he is, he comes around verrry quick, acc. to Carter. His special method might be, that he puts his victims always to another second/third crime scene: in IA 25 miles from the place of abduction (near the bank of a bending creek), in IN 500 ft from the place of abduction and even bringing the girls back (ie from a shed/shack) to a previous crime scene (near the bank of a bending creek). Whether bicycles (IA) or Libby's cell phone (IN), he doesn't pick things up, which would betray traces of the first crime scene. Just like Carter said, it's all about "power and control". He knows, what he is doing after the crime and he is playing around with the police. The victims should have been found, but certainly after several months only (decomposition). Maybe, he thought, RL's place was searched already and the property owner would find the victims one day, months later.
I think, BG is very proud of his craftiness avoiding the impression, he might be a killer or even a SK.
All IMO and MOO. Of course!!, I don't know and police didn't confirm, IA and IN cases have a connection.
I can't help: the sweet girls from IA are always on my mind in connection with the sweet girls from Delphi/IN.
What I don't know, is: why murder, why Abby, why Libby, why a little innocent girl at all.
Why violence, why "staging" (IF). Question mark over question mark.

I agree and I think it wrong to discount that he moved them or took them elsewhere. He got around quickly. The reenactments are wrong. There is a VOI. We have to fill in the blanks, which with the limited info is difficult. I don't discount anyone's ideas or opinions. Obviously some of us will be wrong but we are allowed to speculate. It is not discounted in my mind that they could have been taken elsewhere or driven around to the cemetery. MOO.

 

[Jax49]

If people want to believe that the park is full of horseback riders and ATVs then I guess they can.

I am starting to wonder why I even post about the park anymore. I thought that since I have nearly 40 years' worth of experiences there I might be able to shed some light on its geography and why people visit. I thought this would be helpful since most posters have never been there. Instead, it just feels like people want to argue about it. I am getting anxiety just checking my notifications anymore.

After years on WS, I can attest we'll argue about most anything. Probably even the color of the sky. I just wanted to say your input is much appreciated. Thanks.

 

[tresir2012]

Exclusive: Abby's grandpa talks about losing her

This is an article about Abby and her Grandpa. It's a very sad article but also a good insight into her life, especially as there are a lot of new WS members who may not have seen it.

 

[tresir2012]

From JudgeJudi, post #211.
GH interview with Mike and Becky Patty Part 2

As I was walking out of the house, Cody came in. He had just gotten off of work and he asked me what I was doing so I told him what was going on. So Cody got in the car with me and we decided there’s two different ways that those girls could have walked home had they decided to walk home. So we drove both routes to see if maybe they decided to walk home. Maybe something happened to her phone. The only thing we could figure at that time is maybe they had fallen down a hill. Maybe they were hurt. Maybe – because she always has her phone in her hand most of the time and maybe the phone dropped or something. That’s what we were expecting, that they were down a ravine somewhere and couldn’t get out. And then by the time we got there, there were other vehicles there, several of them, to the point that I had to park across the road. I pulled into the ditch across the road because there were so many vehicles. Some of those were ours – there were several – at this point in time there were several people there that was not family. So we started looking for the girls.

Thanks againJudgeJudi!

I copy and pasted this from another poster in thread 104 who had done the same as it details BP's account of the beginning of the search. I wonder if someone also checked the route at the south end of the bridge to Abbey's house also around that time. Has anyone ever seen that mentioned?

ETA she states they checked both routes home so she could actually mean the route to Libby's house and the route to Abby's house, which makes sense. Initially I thought she meant both routes home to Libby's house only.

 

[tresir2012]

Been lurking a LONG time ... following this case since Day Two ... it has a hold on me like no other and I WANT JUSTICE! So glad you all are here. I will be here for the duration too. Thing is, I have three sets of POI's. (Two perps working in tandem, another two working in tandem, and a lone wolf.) Always fitting the evidence to my suspicions to see what matches up. So frustrating we do not have more info. I too wonder if the recent SM activity (i.e. the debunking video) is designed to draw someone out, to lure someone in to post something "telling" online, or to bring about a reaction (perhaps not online) that will in some way cause a stir. IDK. I just want to look up here one day to see the words "ARREST". I feel that day is coming soon. Let's hope so!

Welcome Torch. I think the debunking video is helping to keep the crime in the news and as you say, may bring about a reaction as well as tips. I am always surprised when the crime is not known, even by people in the state of Indiana itself.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Summaries of two YouTube interviews with RL:

15 Feb – 2 days after the bodies were discovered

RL, aged 77, expresses his disbelief at what has happened. He lives on the country road near the trail that leads to the MHB. He said, “The area that they were in is very hard to get to. I mean you can’t get there unless you walk there. I mean somebody had to be walking with them or something”.

Another man, MS, expresses the same thoughts. Interestingly, he appears to be aged about 70 and is wearing a plaid shirt, but this may well be very common attire.

Link

Feb. 16 – Search is continuing

Police are doing a very methodical investigation looking for clues. RL says what’s happened is mind-boggling. His son grew up playing here.

The crime scene tape doesn’t appear to go to the water’s edge and is tied to a tree some feet from the creek.

An unidentified older man who lives near the crime scene says, “You couldn’t carry someone up and down these hills. It’s hard to walk by yourself”.

Link

 

[JudgeJudi]

A little bit of good news for the families.

The Abby and Libby Memorial Park online fundraiser has reached its $50,000 goal more than a month ahead of time. The Indiana Housing and Community Development Authority will match that amount. The fundraiser now has about $54,000. The money will go toward building the $1 million park off State Road 25.

The 20 acres will feature three baseball fields, two playgrounds and picnic shelters with benches. It will all be surrounded by a walking path.

Abby and Libby park in Delphi meets fundraising goal

 

[BNA]

Welcome Torch. I think the debunking video is helping to keep the crime in the news and as you say, may bring about a reaction as well as tips. I am always surprised when the crime is not known, even by people in the state of Indiana itself.

Do you have evidence that the debunking video was mentioned/discussed in the news media anywhere?

 

[Jax49]

Do you have evidence that the debunking video was mentioned/discussed in the news media anywhere?

'Rumors suck and they hurt people': Sister of Delphi murder victim addresses internet speculation

 

[ab01]

I am thinking of FSG and CE the two you mentioned as the only ones we have heard mentioned. Assuming FSG went across the bridge and back would maybe add another 10 minutes to his timeframe so we can estimate him on the bridge between about 3.00 till 3.09 so would have missed BG by about 1/2 hour or so. MOO.

How do we know fsg crossed the bridge? Most people I’m told only walk up to the bridge and turn around. I’m sure he could see people under the bridge from the trail without actually being on the bridge

Jmo

 

[CSIDreamer]

Not exactly prime trail walking time either then? I appreciate all opinions especially locals, but reserve the right to add my own. Mtn was just talking about the trails. I was not talking about the trails but adding my own thoughts about private land in the area. The girls were abducted and murdered on private land right? Riding horses on a warm February day on private land would be very likely. (Hunting on horseback with hounds is a winter pastime for example.)
MOO

Hunting on horseback with hounds is not a winter pastime in Indiana.

 

[ab01]

Hunting on horseback with hounds is not a winter pastime in Indiana.

Yah I’m an avid hunter and I’ve never seen anyone do it either.

Sounds extremely dangerous to me