Found Deceased UT - MacKenzie "Kenzie" Lueck, 23, Salt Lake City, 17 June 2019 #18 *ARREST*

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About Hatch Park: AA may very well have got ML to meet him there with zero intention of murder.A first time meet for two online acquaintances (with the anonymity that online brings) whatever AA's expectations were (especially if a bit out of the "ordinary") it's possible he wanted to wanted to maintain "real life" anonymity from ML after the encounter.

If true, then he ought not to have given her his actual phone number. As I understand it, there were texts between them, using their actual phones.

It's possible, of course, that the police are using the word "text" to refer to WhatsApp or even Tinder messages, although I find that unlikely.
 
Just jumping off from your post.

While this is not my primary theory, if she and he had met before and say went to dinner, maybe even to that park and watched a ball game or had a picnic lunch during the day, maybe to a motel another time, if she had had one, two, maybe three successful meetings/dates with him, she may not have hesitated or lacked trust to meet him at the park even at that hour...

The why still remains of the reason for the park but perhaps he just said my house isn't easy to find, she had never been there and he just says meet me at that park where we had our first "date" and we'll head to my place from there or even I got us a room at a little Air BNB I know of... She does not have fear about it because they had been there before (the park and she had been out/with him previously...)

As for shutting off the phone, like most of us I am undecided there too but I can say when having high stress and being home around family during something like a death/funeral for a few days, all are grieving, others are grieving, I think most of us can relate to how exhausting that is and how ready you are or in need of a break from it... She was used to having her own life and some independence being on year 5 in Utah from what we know. She was probably yearning for a break as anyone would be.

You see a ton of relatives, friends, etc. in the course of a few short days, are on your best behavior and probably helping out as well. I can believe once she let her parents know she was safe, she felt she had done her part and just wanted to shut the world away for whatever was planned, if only through that night, go with him, do whatever was planned or nothing at all and get some sleep... She made her last text to him as or when the Lyft entered the park and my best guess is she then shut it down--as others have said, she had arrived and was with the person she intended to see--that last text/contact is what placed them both there and then they looked further at records, etc. when they had enough cause which showed him/them at his house within 7 or 8 minutes.

The problem I do have here is how fortunate for him--perhaps he talked about shutting out the world to her earlier and taking a "break" from her stressful couple of days... Or it was something she did while with him prior and it was expected or just understood... If I understand it correctly too, in some cases, the one is expected often to give their full attention to the other so no phone upon meeting to show he has your full attention...

I want to stress again this is not my first theory at all but it is perhaps about #3 on my list... My thoughts revolve more around what I think his house really was with its cameras and more.

Just thoughts/speculation and JMO.

MOO she had an exam the next day, was a dedicated student. MOO I think he was a low level college drugs supplier, a kind friend with the right test performance enhancing drugs. MOO Unexplained social connections are most often about substances. One plan she might have worked out with him is to meet him somewhere halfway to her apartment and have him drive her the rest the way home.
 
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If true, then he ought not to have given her his actual phone number. As I understand it, there were texts between them, using their actual phones.

It's possible, of course, that the police are using the word "text" to refer to WhatsApp or even Tinder messages, although I find that unlikely.
Yeah until LE clarifies otherwise, I am assuming them saying "texting" as opposed to "messaging" means a literal text message.
 
Just jumping off from your post.

While this is not my primary theory, if she and he had met before and say went to dinner, maybe even to that park and watched a ball game or had a picnic lunch during the day, maybe to a motel another time, if she had had one, two, maybe three successful meetings/dates with him, she may not have hesitated or lacked trust to meet him at the park even at that hour...

The why still remains of the reason for the park but perhaps he just said my house isn't easy to find, she had never been there and he just says meet me at that park where we had our first "date" and we'll head to my place from there or even I got us a room at a little Air BNB I know of... She does not have fear about it because they had been there before (the park and she had been out/with him previously...)

As for shutting off the phone, like most of us I am undecided there too but I can say when having high stress and being home around family during something like a death/funeral for a few days, all are grieving, others are grieving, I think most of us can relate to how exhausting that is and how ready you are or in need of a break from it... She was used to having her own life and some independence being on year 5 in Utah from what we know. She was probably yearning for a break as anyone would be.

You see a ton of relatives, friends, etc. in the course of a few short days, are on your best behavior and probably helping out as well. I can believe once she let her parents know she was safe, she felt she had done her part and just wanted to shut the world away for whatever was planned, if only through that night, go with him, do whatever was planned or nothing at all and get some sleep... She made her last text to him as or when the Lyft entered the park and my best guess is she then shut it down--as others have said, she had arrived and was with the person she intended to see--that last text/contact is what placed them both there and then they looked further at records, etc. when they had enough cause which showed him/them at his house within 7 or 8 minutes.

The problem I do have here is how fortunate for him--perhaps he talked about shutting out the world to her earlier and taking a "break" from her stressful couple of days... Or it was something she did while with him prior and it was expected or just understood... If I understand it correctly too, in some cases, the one is expected often to give their full attention to the other so no phone upon meeting to show he has your full attention...

I want to stress again this is not my first theory at all but it is perhaps about #3 on my list... My thoughts revolve more around what I think his house really was with its cameras and more.

Just thoughts/speculation and JMO.
Why was the left side of her skull smashed in with a 5 centimeter hole and set on fire bury her with hands tied behind her back with rope and zip ties because she liked him so much? Wouldn’t ya think he would be happy, ecstatic this beautiful, young, sweet, smart female wanted to be with him?why would he brutally kill her? This leads me to believe there was NO WAY she was emotionally or physically interested in that guy or I believe her girlfriends would know. Girls that age are chatty and love to talk and tell to their girl friends. There was something else going on here and I cannot put my finger on it and why she got in his car. We will know eventually. IMHO She was NOT planning on going to his house or she would have Lyft take her there. He changed plans once she got in his death machine and started his engine.
 
MOO she had an exam the next day, was a dedicated student. MOO I think he was a low level college drugs supplier, a kind friend with the right test performance enhancing drugs. Unexplained social connections are most often about substances. One plan she might have worked out with him is to meet him somewhere halfway to her apartment and have him drive her the rest the way home.
Anything is possible; however, the park is not "halfway to her apartment." It was the opposite direction of her home from the airport. Also, I'm not sure her exam was the following day. It may have been later in the week. They were on the same dating apps, so that seems more of a connection to me. Not sure you'd be texting back and forth with your drug supplier, not sure he'd want you to take a Lyft to meet him, not sure he'd offer you (and your bags) a ride home. Anything is possible...
 
MOO she had an exam the next day, was a dedicated student. MOO I think he was a low level college drugs supplier, a kind friend with the right test performance enhancing drugs. Unexplained social connections are most often about substances. One plan she might have worked out with him is to meet him somewhere halfway to her apartment and have him drive her the rest the way home.

If I recall correctly, her exam was not the next day nor did she have to be back to work. I read that here although I cannot tell you what the source was offhand. I recall also that it was how it came about she was missing, that she missed an exam a few days later.

While I get the drug, exam and park thinking, I do believe the person that said they had some type of relationship/arrangement. I am unsure why he would be worried about her if that relationship was a drug buy from someone who commonly sold to many students, etc as a low level college supplier, when it appeared he was more worried about her personal safety... I also truly don't see meeting in a park for just drugs and immediately heading for his home.

Additionally, there is no hint of drugs at all with her that we are aware of I don't think.

Jmo though.
 
Why was the left side of her skull smashed in with a 5 centimeter hole and set on fire bury her with hands tied behind her back with rope and zip ties because she liked him so much? Wouldn’t ya think he would be happy, ecstatic this beautiful, young, sweet, smart female wanted to be with him?why would he brutally kill her? This leads me to believe there was NO WAY she was emotionally or physically interested in that guy or I believe her girlfriends would know. Girls that age are chatty and love to talk and tell to their girl friends. There was something else going on here and I cannot put my finger on it and why she got in his car. We will know eventually. IMHO She was NOT planning on going to his house or she would have Lyft take her there. He changed plans once she got in his death machine and started his engine.
I agree. The house was unplanned; otherwise, she would've taken the Lyft directly there. Perhaps he was planning the rape but not the murder. Maybe he figured she wouldn't want to have sex with him, but he was planning on that - one way or the other. The murder happened because she tried to escape.
 
Why was the left side of her skull smashed in with a 5 centimeter hole and set on fire bury her with hands tied behind her back with rope and zip ties because she liked him so much? Wouldn’t ya think he would be happy, ecstatic this beautiful, young, sweet, smart female wanted to be with him?why would he brutally kill her? This leads me to believe there was NO WAY she was emotionally or physically interested in that guy or I believe her girlfriends would know. Girls that age are chatty and love to talk and tell to their girl friends. There was something else going on here and I cannot put my finger on it and why she got in his car. We will know eventually. IMHO She was NOT planning on going to his house or she would have Lyft take her there. He changed plans once she got in his death machine and started his engine.

You very well could be right and we don't know. There are various opinions and I am entitled to mine as well and I have respect for yours.

I never said she liked him so very much, I never even said she necessarily liked him at all but that if they had met previously, nothing happened where she did not leave safe and alive and head home after was perhaps a reason she had some bit of trust. I also mentioned the word date this way--"date". It could possibly be just a friendship so the word date would not apply in its usual sense.

As far as him being happy to see her, insane jealousy when a female is on a trip, we could get into talk about abusive husbands who have a cute young wife, serial killers who are married with children and appear to be sane and a good husband and all sorts of things. Why he did what he did is because he is twisted and evil and perhaps we can agree on that.

I also am under no illusion when I believe that her friends may have very well shared things with authorities that we do not know, and for obvious reasons, protecting the investigation and, in fact, I remember one hinting at that and it was at the park PC the friends held if I recall correctly.

As for her being emotionally involved with him, I also never said that nor that she even had any deep interest in him.

If she had no idea he was taking her to his home, your theory still has her going to a park willingly in a Lyft to meet him and they seem to have had each others' actual phone numbers and were in contact even prior to her landing in SLC.

Jmo though.

Edited to clarify a sentence.
 
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He wasn't "tech savvy" enough to know to cut his phone off when he met her at the park or when he took her to the canyon, so I don't believe he cut her phone off either. I think she did it voluntarily at this point.
He wasn't smart at all IMO when it came to technology, so that makes me seriously question whether he was running some sort of "business" with the cameras in his house.

A lot of people do not understand how phones track everyone. Being ignorant to that fact is no barrier to running a web-based business. Chris Spotz apparently knew enough to put his phone in airplane mode, IIRC, but forgot about google maps tracking every place he was going. One of the reasons I keep mentioning that AA was not particularly aware of his local environment is that he clearly needed his phone to get around SLC and environs.

One of the traits of an anti-social person is that they think they are smarter than they actually are.
 
A lot of people do not understand how phones track everyone. Being ignorant to that fact is no barrier to running a web-based business. Chris Spotz apparently knew enough to put his phone in airplane mode, IIRC, but forgot about google maps tracking every place he was going. One of the reasons I keep mentioning that AA was not particularly aware of his local environment is that he clearly needed his phone to get around SLC and environs.

One of the traits of an anti-social person is that they think they are smarter than they actually are.

BBM

How do we know that he needed his phone to get around SLC?
 
I agree with you I think that she knew him and was comfortable with him. I think she turned her phone off because she didn’t want anyone to know where she was. I think there is no way you get in a lyft without a full charge— most would fear that.
---

Question for all:
What makes you feel like this was premeditated outside of the park? The room? Could the room really have been his bdsm room with no ill intent behind it? Is there any scenario where this was either accidental or anger induced at the house followed by a horrible attempt at a cover up?

Well, frankly, the fact that her hands were bound behind her back with both rope and zip ties. I believe he killed her by a blow to the head (probably with a hammer) after she was tied up. I believe the evidence will show that both rope and zip tie were on her before she was burned and it is only reasonable to assume that he restrained her before killing her.

Restraining someone shows premeditation to me. There is no "accidental" killing at that point. That's what premeditation means to me. We may never know who turned off the phone...
 
Just curious. Why did nobody report ML missing until Thursday?
We don't really know, but my guess is because she'd been living in Utah for 5 years, had a job, had classes, etc. It wouldn't be unusual for parents not to have daily contact with a young adult living away from home. It didn't sound like her roommates were her friends, so they most likely didn't know when she was supposed to come home or maybe thought she'd been home and was staying with someone else. Her friends also had jobs, school and probably not daily contact with her. By Thursday, she'd missed an exam, missed work, and I believe had missed her flight back to CA for a wedding (that could've been later); also, the vague unease about not hearing from your kid for a day or two probably turned into real concern when they hadn't heard from her in 4 days, she wasn't answering her texts or calls, and it seemed as if her phone was turned off. My boys go/went to college out of state, and it wasn't unusual for me not to have contact with them for several days. If I had a question for them and texted or called them and then they didn't text/call me back for a day or two, I'd start to worry but not before that. Also, they never knew where their roommates were or when they were coming home and they often stayed over at girls' places or crashed at other guys' places. So, not knowing she was missing until Thursday doesn't seem unusual to me.
 
MOO she had an exam the next day, was a dedicated student. MOO I think he was a low level college drugs supplier, a kind friend with the right test performance enhancing drugs. Unexplained social connections are most often about substances. One plan she might have worked out with him is to meet him somewhere halfway to her apartment and have him drive her the rest the way home.

I thought her exam was the next day, but several people pointed out that it was actually on Wednesday. At the same time, I know that college students frequently seek out ritalin or similar before exams. The amount of travel she was scheduled to do over a 10 day period was a lot. Summer courses are usually short and intense.

This park was in the opposite direction (from the airport) to her house. They left so quickly (a minute or less) toward his house.
 
Why was the left side of her skull smashed in with a 5 centimeter hole and set on fire bury her with hands tied behind her back with rope and zip ties because she liked him so much? Wouldn’t ya think he would be happy, ecstatic this beautiful, young, sweet, smart female wanted to be with him?why would he brutally kill her? This leads me to believe there was NO WAY she was emotionally or physically interested in that guy or I believe her girlfriends would know. Girls that age are chatty and love to talk and tell to their girl friends. There was something else going on here and I cannot put my finger on it and why she got in his car. We will know eventually. IMHO She was NOT planning on going to his house or she would have Lyft take her there. He changed plans once she got in his death machine and started his engine.

i agree with a lot of what you are saying but i do have a genuine question (ik there are off limit topics rn so i am not trying to delve into that) but why is it so unbelievable they possibly had a few dates, hang outs or intense texting relationship?

regardless of what she thought the final destination was, she met him at an isolated park at 3am so i think its difficult to rule out the possibility of a relationship (not necessarily dating but even as friends/acquaintances). its possible they met to argue (not sure if that is one theory you are suggesting) but if they argued, that still suggests they had relationship that started on mutual ground and led to a disagreement.

if AA was able to charm her, maybe ML liked him (or who she thought he was). im not suggesting they were in a serious relationship, but even the best judge of character can be fooled during the intro stages of a relationship (romantic or otherwise); its part of being human.

if this was premeditated, maybe part of his process was gaining a certain level of comfort with ML. during this grooming/deception process they get to know each other and then the park was the first opportunity he had to act. he may even have enjoyed this build up. or maybe he is a monster who enjoys pursuing women and then eventually loses his temper. but imo, im not seeing the distinction between his violence being reserved only if they didnt have a prior relationship.
 
Why was the left side of her skull smashed in with a 5 centimeter hole and set on fire bury her with hands tied behind her back with rope and zip ties because she liked him so much? Wouldn’t ya think he would be happy, ecstatic this beautiful, young, sweet, smart female wanted to be with him?why would he brutally kill her? This leads me to believe there was NO WAY she was emotionally or physically interested in that guy or I believe her girlfriends would know. Girls that age are chatty and love to talk and tell to their girl friends. There was something else going on here and I cannot put my finger on it and why she got in his car. We will know eventually. IMHO She was NOT planning on going to his house or she would have Lyft take her there. He changed plans once she got in his death machine and started his engine.
I agree that she was not attracted to this guy - physically, mentally and emotionally. I dont think she previously dated him either or she would have seen his creepiness. IMO he lured her for some other reason.
 
Anything is possible; however, the park is not "halfway to her apartment." It was the opposite direction of her home from the airport. Also, I'm not sure her exam was the following day. It may have been later in the week. They were on the same dating apps, so that seems more of a connection to me. Not sure you'd be texting back and forth with your drug supplier, not sure he'd want you to take a Lyft to meet him, not sure he'd offer you (and your bags) a ride home. Anything is possible...

MOO it is on the way time wise.
ML apartment 25 minutes drive away
form SLC airport.
Hatch Park is 12 minutes from the Airport.
Hatch Park to ML's apartment is 25 minutes away.

Hatch Park detour would add 12 minutes on way home, if that was her plan.
 
I agree. The house was unplanned; otherwise, she would've taken the Lyft directly there. Perhaps he was planning the rape but not the murder. Maybe he figured she wouldn't want to have sex with him, but he was planning on that - one way or the other. The murder happened because she tried to escape.
I think this could be what happened and she threatened to call the cops and that ticked him off more since he had been accused before and knew he would be toast.

Are we going to hear anymore from the woman that told her story to Tricia how she was raped by AA? Tricia said she was willing to answer questions but I haven’t seen anything lately.
 
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