Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #10

[KR72]

ETA: Hmmm.... harsh words or harsh reality?

This reporter has been on location/boots on the ground reporting from day one.

Not aware of Chief Constant citing in the evening hours the fugitives captured -- maybe this was on social media? I recall he referred people to FB.

And finally-- there was no truth to RCMP deployed with "non-working radios." Officer could not reach his radio and fired into the ground.

https://www.9news.com.au/world/lucas-fowler-murder-hunt-
for-fugitives-kam-mcleod-bryer-schmegelsky-questions-linger-sighting-news-canada/8c183e5e-d8cc-4b21-adfb-badf93dc6f11

AUS 8/2/19

[...]

When I travelled to York Landing the following day while police were still on the ground searching, I spoke to another Bear Clan Patrol volunteer, Danielle McMaster. This was our interview:

AD: How certain was your other volunteer that this was the two suspects?
DANIELLE: We're not too certain at all, we've just seen two individuals from the back.
AD: And one was wearing a camouflage shirt?
DANIELLE: Yes
AD: How do you guys feel about the sighting?
DANIELLE: We're pretty excited. We're hoping it's them and we can catch them.

[...]

The narrative sounds slightly different from one account to another. When I was trying to ascertain the exact location of the sighting from the volunteers and the community's Chief Leroy Constant, I heard it described as at the garbage dump, near the garbage dump, rummaging through the garbage dump and between the garbage dump and water treatment plant. Mixed messages can of course happen via Chinese whispers when it comes to witness accounts, but it is worth noting.

Other things don't feel right. When I asked Danielle how she felt about her fellow volunteer possibly spotting these two, she said she felt 'pretty excited'. That is an odd response from someone who believes two suspected triple murderers are in the vicinity. Rattled? Yes. Shocked? Yes. Surprised? Yes. Hopeful of a breakthrough? Absolutely.
Excited?

The other thing that doesn't smell right is the way the reported sighting was handled by the community's Chief, Leroy Constant. In the evening hours after the sighting was called in, Constant declared that the two fugitives had been captured. That spread inaccurate information like wildfire across social media, even prompting some Australian media to start reporting the incorrect information. It was incorrect, police had not captured McLeod and Schmegelsky. bbm

The Bear Clan Patrol volunteers have a uniform with an emblem and their name on it. Currently, their group has over 375 members who work on a volunteering basis. They describe themselves as "a community-based solution to crime prevention, providing a sense of safety, solidarity and belonging to both its members and to the communities they serve".

From the outside looking in, they appear to be a vigilante group taking social issues into their own hands. When I interviewed Bear Clan Patrol volunteer Wade Taylor, he tells me, "We are there to help the community in Winnipeg in rough areas, we help people who are in trouble and we also stop people who are being aggressive."

The group has somewhat of a political motivation. On their ******** page [***], they explain why they were established.

"Our community recognizes that Indigenous people once had their own territory, language and culture - vibrant and cohesive social, economic and political systems held together by a spiritual worldview and a sacred responsibility to Mother Earth and all of creation ... With consciousness comes awareness, with awareness comes ownership of personal circumstances, and with collaboration comes change. It is within the context of this approach that the Bear Clan Patrol has been mobilized."

And yet despite all the resources thrown into searching York Landing immediately after the tip off, nothing was found. One police officer told me their sniffer dog was on the ground so quickly that afternoon, there is no way the pair wouldn't have been sniffed out if they were indeed in that forest they reportedly ran into. Not only that, they deployed air resources with infrared capabilities to look over the area and saw nothing. It just doesn't make sense. These two suspects can't just disappear into thin air.

As for locals who reported hearing gunshots, I later found out there were only two gunshots fired. They were from a tactical officer's firearm who fired into the ground. He had become separated from his team and he couldn't reach for his radio, so it was his way of communicating to his peers where he was in the bush. bbm

The end result of this promising tip-off was a total letdown. Manitoba police confirmed they can't corroborate the tip, and so they pulled their resources out and went back to the drawing board in Gillam. And now, they're sadly starting to phase out resources from Gillam itself.

There are several explanations for the false alarm in York Landing and I'm not going to spell them out. Whatever happened, every hour counts on the clock when a nationwide manhunt of this importance is underway.

And given it turned out to be nothing, Kam Mcleod and Bryer Schmegelsky are now another 12 hours ahead of the police. If they're alive, that is.

The Bear Clan are hardly vigilantes.

 

[tcfpne]

On the paperwork dated July 24 that charges them with second degree murder of the man near Dease Lake the victim is listed as John Doe. Would they list him as John Doe if they knew who he was but hadn’t managed to inform the family?

I always assumed that they were charged with murder because the RCMP discovered something at the crime scene that connected the 2 to the car or the body?
Or there was some detail I missed.

Anyway, they shouldn't have listed him as John Doe if the RCMP knew who the victim was, regardless of informing family.

 

[Jonesk9]

I've been wondering if they're going to head back to the island before winter sets in over the rest of Canada. They may have a bug out shelter built that's already stocked and ready for them. Heck they could be back on Vancouver Island already.

 

[CanadianMade]

Bryer did chose to hit the like button on Facebook for the Young Communists group.

How do you know this? Were you friends with him on Facebook or is this something you have taken from the media and are running with it yourself?

 

[CanadianMade]

Plus it's not even particularly relevant, as LE hasn't said anything about the murders being influenced by any sort of fringe ideology. The evidence indicates that their motive for committing the murders was about the same as it is for most teen spree killers. My guess is the admiration for two opposite fringe ideologies had more to do with the fighting and survival tactics historically used by those particular groups and the hate/killings caused by members of those groups, rather than the ideas of the groups. I know people mock people who implicate violent video games, but their obsession with a violent survivalist video game also seems to indicate their general interests.

What evidence?

 

[Kiantra]

MOO ...
While I do think there was some planning behind their adventure, I do think the murders were also opportunistic. If they were indeed training to be survivalists for the past two years as AS has stated, then they likely have been saving for this for quite some time and may have more money and resources than some have speculated. Earlier a member mentioned prepaid credit cards and that makes absolute perfect sense.

 

[musicaljoke]

With what survival equipment/supplies they allegedly had, I'd say very slim. I really have to wonder what would have been going through their minds to go into that environment completely unprepared. If they've spent time in the bush as kids, as has been suggested, they should know better. I really have to wonder if they didn't get away by small boat out into the Hudson Bay.

It's not possible for two guys to navigate Hudson Bay in a small boat, so it would be highly unlikely that they would get very far with a plan to escape via Hudson Bay. It's icy cold, there is no fuel, rowing is really out of the question, and it's big water. Finer sailors have lost their lives in Hudson Bay, including the formidable explorer, Henry Hudson.

Here is Environment Canada's Ice Chart for Southern Hudson Bay for today, Aug 1st.

https://ice-glaces.ec.gc.ca/prods/WIS30CT/20190801180000_WIS30CT_0010698188.pdf

Ice Products - Result - Product Search - Canadian Ice Service

 

[scrappinkat]

I find this super interesting. He went missing the day before the RAV4 burned + he's 18 years old. I tried to look up his facebook, but the name is so common + I'm not good at that. I wonder if he was a gamer with them possibly? He may have just taken off, but I think it's worth exploring IMO.

This is a small town, here are the stats: Thompson (Manitoba, Canada) - Population Statistics, Charts, Map, Location, Weather and Web Information

He doesn’t seem to be a gamer (judging by his Facebook page) and he’s originally from Thunder Bay Ontario.

 

[CanadianMade]

That is my point! I'm tired of constantly seeing they were driven by Nazi sympathies through these threads when NOTHING has been substantiated in that regard, any more than being motivated by any other ideology including Communism. Stick to the facts, not rumours or hearsay spread by posters here or major media sources. I think people need to realize that major media outlets are not immune to spreading hearsay and rumours.

I completely agree with you on this, however I just want to say that we don't have ANY factual information as to who they were at all. We only have what we have been told by media or by hearsay so even the communism aspect is a rumor.

 

[tcfpne]

There is no evidence. Maybe they aren't spree killers, maybe they are.
RCMP hasn't charged them in the deaths of LF and CD because either there is no hurry (as discussed before) or because
there are differences between crime scenes that mean that someone else could've killed the couple.

People label them as spree killers, but the fact is, they are wanted for 1 murder, and 1 murder only. The spree idea doesn't seem to fit

 

[Jen-Knee]

I don't think they ever left the area where they torched the Rav. If they had stolen a vehicle or someone unintentionally helped them to leave the area, I think LE would have heard about it by now. Or there would have been confirmed sightings elsewhere. There's just way too much media (and social media) coverage. Their faces are everywhere. My guess is they went into the bush with the belief they could survive out there, and are probably dead by now.

 

[CanadianMade]

Didn't you find it strange that BS threatened the 1 girl and said he'd cut off her head? Who says that to a young girl? Did he ever threaten any guys? Maybe BS is an Incel? In 1 of the news report a co-worker of the mother said BS's mother was scared of him? I wonder why? Was she threatened too? JMO

What I find strange is that she jumped on the chance to be on the news.

 

[CanadianMade]

How old was he when he said that, because young boys say a lot of stupid things to young girls lol

Exactly.
7th grade.

 

[scrappinkat]

How do you know this? Were you friends with him on Facebook or is this something you have taken from the media and are running with it yourself?

Not friends with him but his Facebook page was public before it was unavailable.

 

[Kubirai]

Maybe what they were up was just trying to run away from home.

If they knocked on your door, would you report them to police?

 

[Kiantra]

I've been wondering if they're going to head back to the island before winter sets in over the rest of Canada. They may have a bug out shelter built that's already stocked and ready for them. Heck they could be back on Vancouver Island already.

That’s a very dismal thought.

 

[Deleted member 248860]

ETA: Hmmm.... harsh words or harsh reality?

This reporter has been on location/boots on the ground reporting from day one.

Not aware of Chief Constant citing in the evening hours the fugitives captured -- maybe this was on social media? I recall he referred people to FB.

And finally-- there was no truth to RCMP deployed with "non-working radios." Officer could not reach his radio and fired into the ground.

https://www.9news.com.au/world/lucas-fowler-murder-hunt-
for-fugitives-kam-mcleod-bryer-schmegelsky-questions-linger-sighting-news-canada/8c183e5e-d8cc-4b21-adfb-badf93dc6f11

AUS 8/2/19

[...]

When I travelled to York Landing the following day while police were still on the ground searching, I spoke to another Bear Clan Patrol volunteer, Danielle McMaster. This was our interview:

AD: How certain was your other volunteer that this was the two suspects?
DANIELLE: We're not too certain at all, we've just seen two individuals from the back.
AD: And one was wearing a camouflage shirt?
DANIELLE: Yes
AD: How do you guys feel about the sighting?
DANIELLE: We're pretty excited. We're hoping it's them and we can catch them.

[...]

The narrative sounds slightly different from one account to another. When I was trying to ascertain the exact location of the sighting from the volunteers and the community's Chief Leroy Constant, I heard it described as at the garbage dump, near the garbage dump, rummaging through the garbage dump and between the garbage dump and water treatment plant. Mixed messages can of course happen via Chinese whispers when it comes to witness accounts, but it is worth noting.

Other things don't feel right. When I asked Danielle how she felt about her fellow volunteer possibly spotting these two, she said she felt 'pretty excited'. That is an odd response from someone who believes two suspected triple murderers are in the vicinity. Rattled? Yes. Shocked? Yes. Surprised? Yes. Hopeful of a breakthrough? Absolutely.
Excited?

The other thing that doesn't smell right is the way the reported sighting was handled by the community's Chief, Leroy Constant. In the evening hours after the sighting was called in, Constant declared that the two fugitives had been captured. That spread inaccurate information like wildfire across social media, even prompting some Australian media to start reporting the incorrect information. It was incorrect, police had not captured McLeod and Schmegelsky. bbm

The Bear Clan Patrol volunteers have a uniform with an emblem and their name on it. Currently, their group has over 375 members who work on a volunteering basis. They describe themselves as "a community-based solution to crime prevention, providing a sense of safety, solidarity and belonging to both its members and to the communities they serve".

From the outside looking in, they appear to be a vigilante group taking social issues into their own hands. When I interviewed Bear Clan Patrol volunteer Wade Taylor, he tells me, "We are there to help the community in Winnipeg in rough areas, we help people who are in trouble and we also stop people who are being aggressive."

The group has somewhat of a political motivation. On their ******** page [***], they explain why they were established.

"Our community recognizes that Indigenous people once had their own territory, language and culture - vibrant and cohesive social, economic and political systems held together by a spiritual worldview and a sacred responsibility to Mother Earth and all of creation ... With consciousness comes awareness, with awareness comes ownership of personal circumstances, and with collaboration comes change. It is within the context of this approach that the Bear Clan Patrol has been mobilized."

And yet despite all the resources thrown into searching York Landing immediately after the tip off, nothing was found. One police officer told me their sniffer dog was on the ground so quickly that afternoon, there is no way the pair wouldn't have been sniffed out if they were indeed in that forest they reportedly ran into. Not only that, they deployed air resources with infrared capabilities to look over the area and saw nothing. It just doesn't make sense. These two suspects can't just disappear into thin air.

As for locals who reported hearing gunshots, I later found out there were only two gunshots fired. They were from a tactical officer's firearm who fired into the ground. He had become separated from his team and he couldn't reach for his radio, so it was his way of communicating to his peers where he was in the bush. bbm

The end result of this promising tip-off was a total letdown. Manitoba police confirmed they can't corroborate the tip, and so they pulled their resources out and went back to the drawing board in Gillam. And now, they're sadly starting to phase out resources from Gillam itself.

There are several explanations for the false alarm in York Landing and I'm not going to spell them out. Whatever happened, every hour counts on the clock when a nationwide manhunt of this importance is underway.

And given it turned out to be nothing, Kam Mcleod and Bryer Schmegelsky are now another 12 hours ahead of the police. If they're alive, that is.

A few days ago, I wrote a long post about the Split Lake and York Landing events, and the junk appearing in the Daily Mail, as a follow up to repeated posts in which I said that the Split Lake people are not police officers, let alone RCMP, and that the Bear Clan is just a neighbourhood watch group, with no training and no experience in the north, whose “sighting” should not be taken at face value, in part because it made no sense on its face. There was a lot of kickback on these posts, which is why I finally wrote the long one.

I also talked about what I called the “dynamics”, something this journalist is also talking about when he says “There are several explanations for the false alarm in York Landing and I'm not going to spell them out.” In my long post, I come closer to spelling them out, but like him I also left some things unsaid. Read my post slowly, and what happened may become crystal clear.

In my view, there are far too many people in this world who are in a hurry to believe anybody but the professionals who are actually carrying out an investigation, and are all the happier if they can implicitly criticize those professionals in the process.

Go back a few days and you’ll find posts from people who were at pains to point out that the Bear Clan was not invited into these communities by the RCMP. In other words, the Bear Clan, not the RCMP, was “solving” the crime. The Australian journalist suggests, astutely in my view, that they not only didn’t solve the crime, but may have occasioned a significant waste of time and resources.

Also, there were posts saying that the RCMP were both incompetent and unprofessional because they didn’t have working radios, and as a consequence had to resort to firing their guns to communicate. As this Australian journalist says, that is rubbish.

Everything this journalist is saying makes complete sense to me*, as someone who, while I may now live in New York, knows Manitoba, and its politics, like the back of my hand.

Cheers

* My one substantive disagreement with him is his casual use of the word vigilante, which is just wrong and mischaracterizes neighbourhood watch operations.

 

[CanadianMade]

There is no evidence. Maybe they aren't spree killers, maybe they are.
RCMP hasn't charged them in the deaths of LF and CD because either there is no hurry (as discussed before) or because
there are differences between crime scenes that mean that someone else could've killed the couple.

People label them as spree killers, but the fact is, they are wanted for 1 murder, and 1 murder only. The spree idea doesn't seem to fit

Agreed.
Spree killers would have bodies lined up along the way. This does not seem to be the case at all.

 

[Carpetchick]

it is definitely not common up here

ETA: I thought you were referring to Nazi wear but now see you meant camoflauge - still not common but I do see it and it does stand out to me

My kids are close to the ages of these guys and wouldn’t be caught dead wearing Camouflage clothing. It’s not common.

 

[Jen-Knee]

I've been wondering if they're going to head back to the island before winter sets in over the rest of Canada. They may have a bug out shelter built that's already stocked and ready for them. Heck they could be back on Vancouver Island already.

It's unlikely. They'd be too easily spotted on the ferry, and Port Alberni is a small town. They would have been noticed.