Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #13

[dameagatha]

I an one of those that might not think those young men were guilty, of everything. I know how RCMP are very reluctant to divulge information, I know what it is like to wait for months to see results in a crime. I have said before; something isn't right about this at all. I am not advocating in any way on their behalf. It doesn't make sense. Two young men without a history don't leave their home to go and kill, especially people. Regardless that they played games and had interests in Nazi history it doesn't make them killers. You would then define how many young people that play video games and are somewhat isolated ?? That's crap. You have to read everything, listen again and think; does it make any sense ??

Yes, they do. See Dartmouth Murders, 2001. Two teen age boys, interested in Nietzsche, killed two married professors in their home.

2001 Dartmouth College murders - Wikipedia

 

[Moonlitnight]

Yes when I saw this it reminded me greatly of Reena Virk's death in many ways

That was one of the most heartbreaking stories ever. And her killer is free.

 

[Deleted member 248860]

Real estate is actually a different market in Port Alberni compared to the rest of the island and is considered the "most affordable" and not nearly as desirable as other cities. This is from last year but one could find similar stats for 2019:

Regionally, the benchmark price of a single-family home in the Campbell River area hit $434,900, an increase of four per cent over June 2018. In the Comox Valley, the benchmark price reached $518,200, up by three per from one year ago. Duncan reported a benchmark price of $471,400, an increase of slightly less than two per cent from June 2018. Nanaimo’s benchmark price rose by three per cent to $559,300 while the Parksville-Qualicum area saw its benchmark price increase by three per cent to $589,500. The cost of a benchmark single-family home in Port Alberni reached $318,300 in June, a nine per cent increase from one year ago.

Vancouver Island Real Estate Board - Statistics

What’s important here is new home construction as an indicator of construction jobs. See my post #2447 just above. In any event, a 9% increase in value in one year of existing housing stock is rather bullish.

 

[otto]

The RCMP's boat. It looks exactly like their boat, sitting on the road in your picture.

I don't know. I thought it was a blurred building in the distance, but maybe is part of a blurred boat parked on the road near the burned Rav4 location.

 

[NJSleuth91]

I an one of those that might not think those young men were guilty, of everything. I know how RCMP are very reluctant to divulge information, I know what it is like to wait for months to see results in a crime. I have said before; something isn't right about this at all. I am not advocating in any way on their behalf. It doesn't make sense. Two young men without a history don't leave their home to go and kill, especially people. Regardless that they played games and had interests in Nazi history it doesn't make them killers. You would then define how many young people that play video games and are somewhat isolated ?? That's crap. You have to read everything, listen again and think; does it make any sense ??

And yet it happens all the time. The Columbine shooters never killed anyone either. Until they did.

Also, we can't rule out that they didn't set out intending to kill. It's possible Lucas and Chynna's murders were an impulsive decision such as during an argument, or a robbery gone wrong. Prof Dyck's murder was likely in an attempt to try to escape, and since it was charged as second degree it's possible that it wasn't intentional either. We don't have enough information to say if this was planned or not, but there is quite a bit of evidence pointing to it not being planned.

 

[Shlock Homes]

I an one of those that might not think those young men were guilty, of everything. I know how RCMP are very reluctant to divulge information, I know what it is like to wait for months to see results in a crime. I have said before; something isn't right about this at all. I am not advocating in any way on their behalf. It doesn't make sense. Two young men without a history don't leave their home to go and kill, especially people. Regardless that they played games and had interests in Nazi history it doesn't make them killers. You would then define how many young people that play video games and are somewhat isolated ?? That's crap. You have to read everything, listen again and think; does it make any sense ??

Everything is circumstantial at this point. They want to show intent by building a case based on the person's history. But ultimately, if there was a court case, a lot of this wouldn't be admissible or have relevance. Even if one of them had a book on the Charles Manson murders, it doesn't mean they would turn to murder. And for thrill killers, they stopped in BC. You'd have expected a trail of murder extending into Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba. The m.o. for the murder of Dyck seems different from Fowler and Deese, that's why it seems like the work of different people.

 

[derbywinner]

And I'm not biting.

Not sure what the debate is. Port Alberni isn't a port. Vancouver is a port; I know because I worked at Vanterm; GCT.

 

[musicaljoke]

...Nobody seems to question the way the boat was damaged? That definitely wasn't from smashing rocks, that was caused by something heavy being dropped in the middle of the boat. I'm not even sure if that could happen in the water, if it had to have been suspended at either end on something, then the weight dropped in the middle. Anyway, if they did find the undamaged boat, it makes more sense that they floated downstream, and they abandoned the boat, climbed the cliff(?) and were found in the bush there. I don't know why they make it sound like they walked there.
The whole case just seems very odd. I'm guessing they'll hope the public interest wanes in the case, and it'll just be closed up without the proof connecting the murders to the pair being shared with the public.

The damage to the boat is nearly identical to the damage sustained our friends' aluminum boat that overturned in rapids. Their boat overturned, then tipped on its side and continued to be pushed sideways down the rapids until it became pinned against a rock. The force of the water along both sides of the boat was so strong that it nearly bent the boat in half. They were unable to dislodge it.

It's very possible that the boat found by the searchers was damaged in a similar manner. It's also possible that the boat was held against the rock by the force of the water for a period of a few days before it was released and drifted back to shore.

 

[Optics]

It's not a port; a fishing hub maybe.

It's a Port

 

[Deleted member 248860]

I'm pretty sure he did know about his Ukrainian heritage, but just rejected it in favor of calling himself Russian instead. Dylann Roof for example was just a few years older and had a cohesive racist belief system, he posted a whole manifesto about why he was enacting the mass shooting, he targeted people specifically because of their demographics, and made it very clear that he was enacting the mass shooting specifically because of race war reasons. We see none of that in this case. There has been no evidence suggesting that ideology had anything to do with it. Two people does not constitute a militia.

Yes, this seems more like Dayton than El Paso, if one wants to draw an analogy.

Of course, that doesn’t exclude flirtation with extreme ideas.

 

[Shlock Homes]

Police discovered the boat, and that led them to the personal items upstream of the rapids. The middle seat from the boat is missing, which would have compromised the structural integrity and made it more vulnerable to buckling in the middle in the rapids.

View attachment 197906

View attachment 197907

Ref: RCMP Twitter photos

It looks like the rim was also ripped out. That takes a lot of effort. KM and BS did that, or the boat was already missing that when they possibly took it?

 

[derbywinner]

Real estate is actually a different market in Port Alberni compared to the rest of the island and is considered the "most affordable" and not nearly as desirable as other cities. This is from last year but one could find similar stats for 2019:

Regionally, the benchmark price of a single-family home in the Campbell River area hit $434,900, an increase of four per cent over June 2018. In the Comox Valley, the benchmark price reached $518,200, up by three per from one year ago. Duncan reported a benchmark price of $471,400, an increase of slightly less than two per cent from June 2018. Nanaimo’s benchmark price rose by three per cent to $559,300 while the Parksville-Qualicum area saw its benchmark price increase by three per cent to $589,500. The cost of a benchmark single-family home in Port Alberni reached $318,300 in June, a nine per cent increase from one year ago.

Vancouver Island Real Estate Board - Statistics

For some Port Alberni would give people a better option then other places off the lower mainland !

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Background info. only.

For all the talk of Port Alberni's hard-luck economy, there are talks ongoing with the cruise ship industry to develop a cruise ship hub. Imagine the potential in that. Local ship pilots, who board to guide the ships down the channel, tugs, etc.

Port Alberni Transhipment Hub, PATH, is another plan to cash in on the Asian container ship market, making use of barges to bring exports to the deepwater seaport, ready for lading at PA. Ports further south are at capacity, they argue. I don't know if these plans will come to fruition.

One drawback with any fjord is the threat of tsunamis from undersea subduction earthquakes, like the 1964 Alaska earthquake. Channeling a tsunami increases its height and speed.

I've heard Port Alberni being called "the armpit" of Vancouver Island, and that was from someone born and raised there! Not sure that's an insult or a geographical reference lol... I'm in Southern Vancouver Island and yes, the big earthquake is a freaky thought even though I'm not in the high impact area.

A cruise ship hub would be great for PA, or find a niche market that utilizes the tourists passing through on their way to Tofino. I haven't been to PA for awhile, will have to check it out next time we go to Tofino which we are wanting to go soon!

 

[Zella]

Even if one of them had a book on the Charles Manson murders, it doesn't mean they would turn to murder.

I don't think anyone said they did or they inherently would if they did.

I mean, to be perfectly frank, I own a book on Manson. I would venture to say a lot of people on this forum do, seeing as it is for true crime buffs. I would sincerely hope my library would never be used against me. If it is, I'm guilty of mass murder.

That doesn't mean someone is a murderer.

Bryer and Kam had interests that a lot of people who never kill anybody do. But they--and especially Bryer--also manifested more worrying red-flag behavior. It's the combined effect of those worrying things that is being considered, not one of them in isolation.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

For some Port Alberni would give people a better option then other places off the lower mainland !

Agreed. Depending on lifestyle... I've lived both places and choose island living any day. It's a whole different vibe here. I'm glad we're separated by water from the mainland!

 

[dameagatha]

It looks like the rim was also ripped out. That takes a lot of effort. KM and BS did that, or the boat was already missing that when they possibly took it?

Kam & Bryer may not have ever used a boat. People in Gillam said there are a lot of ruined boats along the river at various times.

 

[Moonlitnight]

Not sure what the debate is. Port Alberni isn't a port. Vancouver is a port; I know because I worked at Vanterm; GCT.

While it is the most un-port-like port on the planet, it is still a port, believe it or not. Overview | Port Alberni Port Authority - Rising Tides and New Horizons

 

[otto]

It looks like the rim was also ripped out. That takes a lot of effort. KM and BS did that, or the boat was already missing that when they possibly took it?

That may have happened when the middle seat was removed. There's no information about who owned the boat, what condition it was in, and whether it was used by the suspects.

 

[Shlock Homes]

The damage to the boat is nearly identical to the damage sustained our friends' aluminum boat that overturned in rapids. Their boat overturned, then tipped on its side and continued to be pushed sideways down the rapids until it became pinned against a rock. The force of the water along both sides of the boat was so strong that it nearly bent the boat in half. They were unable to dislodge it.

It's very possible that the boat found by the searchers was damaged in a similar manner. It's also possible that the boat was held against the rock by the force of the water for a period of a few days before it was released and drifted back to shore.

Was it a large river like the Nelson River though? All the photos I've seen of the river show a fairly wide, and non-rapids river. In fact, if you didn't know it was a river, you'd think it was a lake. It's also not clear where they would have put the boat into the water, the whole area looks like it's a sloped cliff. Somehow I think the boat was meant to be tied to them, but they can't connect the dots.

 

[Shlock Homes]

That may have happened when the middle seat was removed.

Not an easy feat. And no reason why anyone would do that.