Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #14

[sandbar]

Modern terminology in news articles is replacing "committed suicide" with "died by suicide", because suicide is not a crime, so no crime has been "committed".

Hmmm, I always thought the shift in terminology was to be more specific, to indicate death, kinda like concussions are referred to as brain injuries. And I think I thought that because I thought suicides are a crime in Canada. Ya, they are, right?

 

[mtnstream]

Yes that roadside check and those 2 manning it say they searched the vehicle. Those 2 would have been the last 2 guys that KM and BS would have been in contact with before burning the Rav4. How were 2 guns in the vehicle missed in the search? I guess if the guns were pistols they could have been hidden on their person. Hmmm

When they said searched, maybe they opened the back hatch, looked at contents quickly, looked in the windows, etc, but didn't look under seats, in spare tire compartment, etc.

 

[FactFinder3000]

I honestly think the security officers didn't want to find any guns. If you had less defensive equipment than a crossing guard on you, would you want to get in a debate with a stranger that had guns?

The aboriginal communities are going to have to have more security funding than two guys wearing safety vests if they are really going to keep drugs and guns out.

I think these checkpoints may be more about determining the sobriety of the driver. They would more be looking into the vehicle for open alcohol or empty containers.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

So the BIG question that this autopsy report raises is, if they were dead for "several days" before they were found, how did the RCMP not find their clothing or personal items on the shore near where the RCMP should have suspected them to be all along?

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

So many people, as seen right here, still seem unable to accept that 2 guys with 2 guns killed 3 people.
My question is: why can't they accept reality, rationality and evidence?

Because if you try to apply Occam's Razor in the case, it certainly does not lead to the mainstream narrative!

 

[LoisLane]

Why couldn't someone from BS's family own a gun? I mean, let's say a late husband had one, and it was locked away never used, rarely checked on -- a rifle, maybe, of some value. And then it was missing after a call about a truck on fire, and the keys to the gun cabinet were missing, too.

And women hunt, too.

It could also be a key to a door. Guns secured in a room. That’s a big family home. It could have its own storage room for multiple firearms. Someone could have been a collector not just a hunter. I know a couple people who have this setup and one of them doesn’t hunt at all. I also know someone who uses a safe lock-up so combination code.

I think it would be the easiest and simplest explanation. KISS.

Maybe all they needed to stock up on was the ammo.

 

[Gina20]

Where is our dark web expert?

Are guns sold on the dark web in Canada?

 

[Rottiluvr]

So the BIG question that this autopsy report raises is, if they were dead for "several days" before they were found, how did the RCMP not find their clothing or personal items on the shore near where the RCMP should have suspected them to be all along?

I find that strange as well.

 

[aphoto]

I think these checkpoints may be more about determining the sobriety of the driver. They would more be looking into the vehicle for open alcohol or empty containers.

The checkpoints don’t search a majority of cars. Most of the time they just glance in the windows.

 

[10ofRods]

my point isn't to say anything abut the family. my point is if the guns came from the kam home then that would mean the guys left home with the guns. if they left home with the guns that would remove all of any little doubt that they planned something before they left home. be hard for someone to stage a death using guns from kam home so any doubts of a third party killing them would be removed for me also if they came from the family home.

The short period of time between them leaving and their first murders makes me think they had the guns with them. And obviously, they took them in the RAV4 through the tribal alcohol checkpoint. Along with ammo.

The burning-of-things makes more sense to me, now. They were making sure they had no backward escape route, no way back home, which was their intent all along. What's odd of course is that there is no particular message attached to their actions (as compared to most of the mass shooters in their age group). But that doesn't mean that a community, somewhere, doesn't know why they did this (in the ideological sense).

Above all, they had to be of a strongly joint suicidal mindset. A friend of mine had a father who wanted to do a joint suicide with his mother. They told no one. The mother apparently agreed to it (it ended up a murder-suicide; the father was the murderer, they were older; he was an admiral in the Navy...) Usually, joint suicides are murder-suicides. But...this was more Butch Cassidy/Sundance Kid joint crime/joint death.

With 3 completely innocent people serving as the only "signal" given by KM/BS as to their rage and rampage. "We are going to kill people until we kill ourselves!" The RCMP ended up in the parental role of attempting to round them up and make them stop the behavior. "We are going to eff with your worldview - the world is NOT safe, the world SUCKS, let us show you how much!"

Canada as a relatively gun free place? Nope, not any more (at least, not in the public mind, right now). RCMP must surely be concerned as well.

I bet they took the guns from Kam's family home, in which case the McLeod's are in a world of legal hurt. But if they stole them elsewhere (on the road? from neighbors?) then...unless the people they stole them from are dead, those people should have reported the guns missing.

It's going to remain a legendary case for some time to come.

 

[Thinkzerz]

So many people, as seen right here, still seem unable to accept that 2 guys with 2 guns killed 3 people.
My question is: why can't they accept reality, rationality and evidence?

Most likely because there doesn’t seem a good reason for killing 3 people and then to hide in a bush to off yourself. Not to mention burning to vehicles in the process. All seems strange.

 

[sandbar]

That was sarcasm, dear. I know many of you believe there was someone else involved and have all kinds of theories about these killings.

Case in point: people are now surprised that 2 guns were found next to 2 dead men wanted for murdering 3 people.

Some sleuthers thought they had ditched their gun(s), others considered that the killers were using bb guns or airguns to commit murders.

From the beginning, it was written in the sky that these 2 would not surrender alive.
The reason there has not been a shootout is because they were not discovered before.
I guess they reached a point where they could not go on anymore and mutually agreed to put an end to it.

I hold my position that the airsoft was used as a signature and not necessarily the CoD. They guy who waited with C&L said L had a little wound on hip, or mid section area. It's my opinion that it's possible that the airsoft was used to disfigure CD and possibly LD.

 

[JuneBug67]

Aside from wild speculation, why would a botanist carry a gun to do his research?

Uncooperative plants.

 

[Gina20]

Sure guns are relatively common with hunters and in redneck communities in Canada. But they’re definitely not so common in urban centres. IMO it’s very unlikely Professor LD would have been carrying a gun. Also, I don’t know many folks who take a gun with them on a camping trip, unless it’s also a hunting trip. I imagine that LD, like most experienced campers, practiced basic bear safety.

He does seem like more of a MEC bear spray kind of person.

 

[Trooper]

That was sarcasm, dear. I know many of you believe there was someone else involved and have all kinds of theories about these killings.

Case in point: people are now surprised that 2 guns were found next to 2 dead men wanted for murdering 3 people.

Some sleuthers thought they had ditched their gun(s), others considered that the killers were using bb guns or airguns to commit murders.

From the beginning, it was written in the sky that these 2 would not surrender alive.
The reason there has not been a shootout is because they were not discovered before.
I guess they reached a point where they could not go on anymore and mutually agreed to put an end to it.

Perfect. It has surprised me every time the matter of a third person, invisible, so cunning as to not even need fuel, or even a vehicle, really, but transports himself across country by.. by … transmogrification, and then, well, you get my drift. This venture had all the hallmarks of an existential lay down misère, it was only a matter of time before Kam and Bry played their trump card, and it's game over.

It is still a probability that one did the both killings, that is, one last murder, and another non consensual death in the backwoods. Then there is the probability of overwhelming boredom, killing being a dead end process to the killers as well as their victims, and all this running and scrabbling and hiding and hunger and cold and hot and insects, and living like a Neanderthal with a weak 21st century culture that requires plumbing..

Nothing in their pathetic death changes my view that Kam was the leader, the instigator. I figured he saw Bry as a sort of controllable agent, one he could direct and drive to their goal, what ever that was, and I pick him for the main shooter, too. It's the quiet ones, you see. Bry liked being led, though, it set him free to blow himself up, as it were.

Good job by the RCMP , under extreme conditions and in the critical scrutiny of people both within and without Canada. Not a foot wrong, at any stage of the process.

 

[SiciC]

When they said searched, maybe they opened the back hatch, looked at contents quickly, looked in the windows, etc, but didn't look under seats, in spare tire compartment, etc.

Yeah it sounds like the search wasn't too thorough. I wonder very much what would have transpired if the safety officers had found the guns. I think it seems quite dangerous to have unarmed officers searching peoples vehicles at night, with the potential to find anything.

 

[1987]

I hold my position that the airsoft was used as a signature. They guy who waited with C&L said L had a little wound on hip, or mid section area. It's my opinion that it's possible that the airsoft was used to disfigure CD and possibly LD.

do you understand how small a .22 bullet is?

 

[Optics]

Makes me wonder if, initially, they were heading out to play a real life version of the game. However, after the killings of Lucas and Chynna, they had huge regrets so they stayed out of sight for a few days trying to decide what to do. They realized there was no going back and they were pretty well screwed, so they took advantage of Len and his RAV4 and high tailed it out of there. While driving all that time through BC to Manitoba they made a pack to each other. Just my thoughts.

That is exactly what I've thought from the onset and stuck by, I've never had a doubt in my mind they planned this and executed it.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

Good job by the RCMP , under extreme conditions and in the critical scrutiny of people both within and without Canada. Not a foot wrong, at any stage of the process.

Yeah well, I think that can be questionable given now the RCMP have admitted their personal effect and clothing were lying on the shore, for "several days" near where they should have been expected to be, and only found them because of a civilian tip! Not sure if that qualifies for "great work".

 

[10ofRods]

Maybe Kam had a license?

Then...would he not have acquired the guns legally, in which case RCMP would have known which guns he had. That brings us full circle to the discussion about whether there should have been more info/warnings. I personally think RCMP would have said "believed to be armed and dangerous" or equivalent if they knew Kam had legally purchased guns.

Maybe not. I'm just guessing.