MA MA - Holly Piirainen, 10, Sturbridge, 5 Aug 1993

[Kell1]

I go back and forth on a possible relation between the Holly and Molly's cases.

I tend to lean toward them not being related, though until theres someone in custody or more information is released in both cases, we cannot rule it out

I wont name names, but know in both cases, there have been several interesting suspects, 2 of which died, ones DNA was supposedly located "near" Holly's body, but no futher information has ever come forward from it

I beleive in 2014 a rapist/Child Molestor who lived near the Comins pond where Molly was abducted and killed, was arrested and was discovered to know the area well where her body was discovered .

He also coincidentally happened to live near where Holly was abducted, during that time frame, he also passed away, and somewhat matched the composite in the Bish case.

Hopefully there will be closure in these cases,

 

[jaejae]

Interesting but I feel the Connecticut River Valley Killer who was a Serial Killer should also be looked at and a possible connection to other child murders including that of Molly Bish. Just another avenue. Thanks.

Here is a link to a page where there is a report about a yet unidentified individual who may be a suspect in a string of child murders and abductions in New England prior to this case and the Molly Bish case. Until he is identified and it is known what happened to him and when he stopped he has to me be a suspect in this case and other cases such as the Molly Bish case:

Connecticut Cases

 

[jaejae]

Here is a link to a page where there is a report about a yet unidentified individual who may be a suspect in a string of child murders and abductions in New England prior to this case and the Molly Bish case. Until he is identified and it is known what happened to him and when he stopped he has to me be a suspect in this case and other cases such as the Molly Bish case:

Connecticut Cases

The suspect is linked to the disappearance of Patricia Luce and this might lead to the possibility of a serial killer attacking children in New England over some considerable length of time. He was described as being about twenty five years of age and a white male with an Afro Style hairstyle. As far as I know this is the only composite sketch of him and there is not that much information him but unless I have dreamt it I though he was described as being about five feet eight tall. Anyway if Holly's nasty case is not a crime of opportunity then this man might be a suspect because he has yet to be identified and therefore we do not know if and when he stopped committing these types of crimes. Of course in a way Molly Bish connected her case to Holly's through her letter of sympathy. However there may or may not be a connection and it is best to keep an open mind:

https://www.tribpub.com/gdpr/courant.com/

 

[Kell1]

The problem with trying to link cases, without direct evidence is that in theory you can probably link any case, to any serial killer at the time .

Im not saying they cant be part of a series, or that anyone is incorrect in doing so , but it just becomes wide ranging speculation if you try to

Work from the crime in question out

You could have 10 cases, all similar in appearance, yet it turns out every one of them are the work of 10 different people .

Its good to look broad range, but you can get into t habit of saying "its possible", what you want is "this type of individual is most likely"

 

[jaejae]

The problem with trying to link cases, without direct evidence is that in theory you can probably link any case, to any serial killer at the time .

Im not saying they cant be part of a series, or that anyone is incorrect in doing so , but it just becomes wide ranging speculation if you try to

Work from the crime in question out

You could have 10 cases, all similar in appearance, yet it turns out every one of them are the work of 10 different people .

Its good to look broad range, but you can get into t habit of saying "its possible", what you want is "this type of individual is most likely"

Thanks for the post. In these cases I am sorry I have to beg to differ with you. I think focusing on one suspect is limited vision and may prevent cases being solved. There are Serial Killers out there and they do travel and have done so in the United States before. I have a serial killer suspect that you have to be able to 'think out of the box to understand' and once you know his scale you understand his MO and crimes vary widely perhaps the most widely of all killers. Other killers do have a variation in MO. You may be right but my opinion is focusing on one suspect for each case is not the answer in many of these New England cases. This is my opinion and I could name who I believe the Connecticut River Killer was and the man who is likely the one that the composite sketch was man of years. It is about opinions but I do not think having a rigid MO helps. Cheers.

 

[Kell1]

Thanks for the post. In these cases I am sorry I have to beg to differ with you. I think focusing on one suspect is limited vision and may prevent cases being solved. There are Serial Killers out there and they do travel and have done so in the United States before. I have a serial killer suspect that you have to be able to 'think out of the box to understand' and once you know his scale you understand his MO and crimes vary widely perhaps the most widely of all killers. Other killers do have a variation in MO. You may be right but my opinion is focusing on one suspect for each case is not the answer in many of these New England cases. This is my opinion and I could name who I believe the Connecticut River Killer was and the man who is likely the one that the composite sketch was man of years. It is about opinions but I do not think having a rigid MO helps. Cheers.

I didnt say anything about focusing on one suspect, i said focus on one case and work outward.

Let evidence lead you, to other crime, dont surmise because a particular killer killed a victim in a certain way that a similar killing must be the work of that individual.

Thats how cases are linked, its done through evidence , there are cases, that are most likely linked to other killers, but we cant prove it due to lack of evidence .

For the record MO is a crime scene dynamic , it changes it almost has to as they get better at what they do or they almost get caught etc...

In cases where an offender abducts and murders a child for sexual purposes, they tend ot to change that much through their criminal history, its actually strange that it doesn't.

What you need to look for to link cases, (barring physical evidence) is the WHY. What purpose did the victim serve to the offender, now this can be broad ranging .

the "why" in behavioral terms is whats called "personation" , repeated personation over seperate cases, is what the FBI referrs to as "signature" IE the psychological reason behind why they do what they do .

Im not saying your theories are wrong, but its a common practice to see a horrible crime and automatically look to unsolved serial killings to try to make it fit what you think it may be .

If you are going to link it to that explain the why you think it is , otherwise its just a random assignment ,

 

[jaejae]

I didnt say anything about focusing on one suspect, i said focus on one case and work outward.

Let evidence lead you, to other crime, dont surmise because a particular killer killed a victim in a certain way that a similar killing must be the work of that individual.

Thats how cases are linked, its done through evidence , there are cases, that are most likely linked to other killers, but we cant prove it due to lack of evidence .

For the record MO is a crime scene dynamic , it changes it almost has to as they get better at what they do or they almost get caught etc...

In cases where an offender abducts and murders a child for sexual purposes, they tend ot to change that much through their criminal history, its actually strange that it doesn't.

What you need to look for to link cases, (barring physical evidence) is the WHY. What purpose did the victim serve to the offender, now this can be broad ranging .

the "why" in behavioral terms is whats called "personation" , repeated personation over seperate cases, is what the FBI referrs to as "signature" IE the psychological reason behind why they do what they do .

Im not saying your theories are wrong, but its a common practice to see a horrible crime and automatically look to unsolved serial killings to try to make it fit what you think it may be .

If you are going to link it to that explain the why you think it is , otherwise its just a random assignment ,

Much of what you say is valid the point I am making though is there are Serial Killers who travel large distances and have a wide variety of victims and differences in MO. You have to do it but Criminal Profiling is not a precise science and you have to keep an open mind and although I am sure everyone has acted in good faith the FBI sometimes get it wrong and in my opinion the JonBenet Ramsey case is a good example of this. Other times they get it right and I am sure that you have many times in the past and I have not worked on any cases as a LE Professional. With regards to evidence I have researched this case and others for a long time focusing on one suspect who I have mentioned on other threads about Virginian crimes but will not mention again here as he is just a suspect and you may be right it may be someone else who is more local to the area. Thanks nice to speak to an LE Professional

 

[Kell1]

Much of what you say is valid the point I am making though is there are Serial Killers who travel large distances and have a wide variety of victims and differences in MO. You have to do it but Criminal Profiling is not a precise science and you have to keep an open mind and although I am sure everyone has acted in good faith the FBI sometimes get it wrong and in my opinion the JonBenet Ramsey case is a good example of this. Other times they get it right and I am sure that you have many times in the past and I have not worked on any cases as a LE Professional. With regards to evidence I have researched this case and others for a long time focusing on one suspect who I have mentioned on other threads about Virginian crimes but will not mention again here as he is just a suspect and you may be right it may be someone else who is more local to the area. Thanks nice to speak to an LE Professional

Pleasures all mine

One thing to consider , is there are absolutely transient killers, some 500 unsolved murders are suspected to attributed to them by the FBI Most are thought to be long haul truckers.

But think about it, if that is true, were pretty sure its not 1 trucker that responsible for all those murders , but if we simply assigned it to the similarities we technically could.

Thats all Im saying , not that youre wrong in your approach, hell the old way we do insnt getting us anywhere in some of these crimes, so why not ?

Im just saying some people get locked on a suspect, then from there they project outward what else that suspect may be capable of instead of looking at a crime, and inferring who the individual responsible for that crime may be .

Profilers work backward, and sure they get things wrong, human behavior is not a one size fits all, and what we have to go on is statistics

But look at the why in each case, even eerily similar crimes, often have different perpetrators.

 

[somequestions]

I think people often try to fit information into discussion of sketches/suspects. The reason is most of what everyone writes is opinion. I think it is very difficult not to let opinions sway your reasoning.

I do not think the cases of Holly Piirainen and Molly Bish are connected. But that is just an opinion. There is nothing factual that I can point to in order to come to a solid conclusion. I can make an argument. I think I read that Holly Piirainen's body was found above ground. I think Molly Bish's body was buried under ground on the side of a hill(although no one has ever stated as fact).

But maybe this killer was evolving and left Holly Piirainen's body in the woods above ground because he was younger and did not care. And then 7 years later in the Molly Bish case, he has evolved and decided that burying a body is better to create that time gap that could help get rid of possible evidence. This is if I can even link them to the same crime based on a loose assumption about my opinion of body dumping.

Locational evidence is the same story. Holly Piirainen appears to be an opportunistic crime. How could anyone know she was going to see puppies?! So you can be fairly confident in that opinion, if nothing else. But does this mean her killer has to be a local? No. I think the killer is a local, but the killer could have been traveling on some trip and found himself on the road where Holly was walking and that is all it took. Looking at the case from the perspective of examining all the possibilities and you quickly start to realize why relying on factual evidence is so important.

Every unsolved case is left with only all the possibilities.

So try to put yourself in the shoes of a detective coming upon the Holly Piirainen kidnapping scene on August 5, 1993. What would you have done differently than they have done over the past 26 years? Solving a case is about finding the one possibility that can be supported by the factual evidence.

 

[dotr]

 

[Kell1]

Holly’s case follows more along the lines of what we would classify as a “stereotypical” abduction homicide

Ill refrain from speaking on Molly's case, in depth on this thread

 

[jaejae]

Holly’s case follows more along the lines of what we would classify as a “stereotypical” abduction homicide

Ill refrain from speaking on Molly's case, in depth on this thread

As I say I think too rigid profiles out of a training manual are not necessarily the answer in all of these cases and you have to keep an open mind and think sometimes out of the box to get the answers.

 

[Kell1]

As I say I think too rigid profiles out of a training manual are not necessarily the answer in all of these cases and you have to keep an open mind and think sometimes out of the box to get the answers.

Training manual , plus thousands of studies by those with much more tenure in the profession than you or I , add on top of that years of experience actually doing it , I think reading true crime books is great I think sleuthing out "new ideas" is great , but doesn't replace experience.

So I wouldn't down anyone's "opinion" because you don't agree with their methodology

 

[somequestions]

My methodology to try to solve this crime would be to try and narrow down where the killer lives. This is incredibly difficult, but here is my guess.

Absent the idea that the killer lives on Allen Road or offshoot road or in that general area where she was taken, there are some things to consider. The killer was probably headed somewhere that day at that time no matter what. Holly Piirainen was most likely an opportunistic crime. Allen Road might have been a connecting road/shortcut to where ever the killer was going that day. The presence of US 20 factors into where this idea of a connecting road and where Five Bridges Road is in Brimfield, MA. It is the main east/west road. Also considering the fact that there are other parallel roads to Allan Road that seem to be easier to drive and quicker in distance to destination, I am left with the following theory.

The killer most likely lives somewhere between the intersection of Allen Road and New Boston Road and the intersection of New Boston Road and US 20. If he likes fast food the McDonalds is nearby and if he goes to the nearest gas station it would be the Citgo/Sam's Foods on US 20.

But then you have to consider the killer could have been driving through the area or visiting the lake/pond area where Holly Piirainen was taken. Then the theory means nothing.

Cases like this put true crime in perspective. 26 years is a long time for any case to go unsolved.

 

[rob525]

I would be very curious to know where Joe Pelland was during this time. He was a suspect in the murder of Michelle Norris five years earlier ( though I don't believe he became a suspect until much later). The cases seem quite similar at first glance and were only about 50 miles apart. I just have a hard time believing that a guy sick enough to do something like this once and get away with it just stops. Maybe it happens but somehow I doubt it (also considering he pled guilty to charges related to abusing his daughter I believe.)

 

[jaejae]

Here is a recent Podcast about this case:

 

[somequestions]

I wanted to correct my earlier post regarding where the killer in Holly Piirainen's case most likely lives. I think I am wrong about a major detail. The Dark Minds program gave me the impression that Holly Piirainen was walking along Allen Road to the intersection of South Shore Drive where there was a house that had some puppies. This made me think the grandparent's cottage was located on Allen Road. I think this is the wrong scenario.

The correct scenario I think is that the grandparent's cottage where she was staying was located on South Shore Drive and she was walking towards the intersection with Allen Road. This is where she was kidnapped and they only found one shoe. This is important because it means that if she was kidnapped by someone who was presumably driving down Allen Road, it greatly decreases the amount of time they would have had to notice her walking. There still is the possibility that maybe the kidnapper passed by South Shore Drive and looked to the right or left depending on their direction of travel and saw her walking. Then they stopped, backed up the car, and kidnapped her.

If I finally have the scenario of Holly Piirainen's kidnapping correct, it puts the case in a totally different perspective for me. It makes it that much more surprising the case was not solved. I would have thought the kidnapper in this case either lives, works, or was visiting from some place on South Shore Drive. Still, because the kidnapping happened at or very close to the intersection of Allen Road, you cannot eliminate the possibility that it was someone driving down Allen Road.

I only realized this when after listening to the podcast episode that Holly and her brother went walking to the end of the road. And obviously Holly Piirainen was not kidnapped from either "end" of Allen Road. So hopefully I am correct now about how the Holly Piirainen case played out that day, August 5, 1993.

 

[somequestions]

I wanted to update my geographic profile of this case after correcting how events happened on August 5, 1993.

In my opinion, I would guess there is a 90% chance the killer lives, works, or was visiting on South Shore Drive. The other 10% is the anybody who happened to be driving by on Allen Road. The profile seems too simple now because law enforcement would have looked at people who lived very close to the abduction site. But you never know...

 

[somequestions]

I thought I would re-cap the few significant clues in this case:

1. Crime happened on Thursday August 5, 1993 sometime during the day. I do not know the exact time. Criminal was either off work, does not work during the day, or did not have a job.

2. Holly Piirainen's body was found on October 23, 1993 by hunters somewhere off of Five Bridges Road in Brimfield, MA. I have not read exactly where the body was found, but there is a parking area/park along the road called Five Bridges. Sometimes these nature areas have logs for visitors to write their name in.

3. On the episode of Dark Minds, Holly's father said that when investigators called him in October that they found the other shoe. This might be significant in that it could mean when Holly was abducted the person was leaving the area instead of entering it to go home. This is a guess.

4. Holly's brother said he heard a loud bang before walking back home. Maybe someone lighting off fireworks?

5. The supposed route from South Shore Drive in Sturbridge to where Holly Piirainen's body was found in Brimfield, MA off Five Bridges road includes a stretch of US 20 with some gas stations. I personally think at some point a gas station attendant at either one of those stations probably would have talked to Holly Piirainen's killer.

I always try to think back if there was anything that could have been done on that day that might have helped solve this case. I only came up with one idea that would have to have been thought of immediately by police/family when Holly was reported abducted. That idea would be to write down the license plate numbers or take pictures of all the cars in driveways along South Shore Drive immediately after the abduction. Then wait for 5 or 6 hours and do it again. Would that have produced a lead? I don't know. Even I probably would not have come up with that idea on the actual day.

If police did everything they could do to investigate the immediate area, then I really do not know what more could have been done in this case besides wait and hope for the right tip to come in. A killer could have been randomly driving down Allen Road and kidnapped Holly at the intersection with South Shore Drive. Nothing is for certain.

Cases like this show how important it is to make sure things are done immediately because a lot of things can change in 26 years. I decided to include what I thought was the best overview video of Holly Piirainen's case below.

 

[somequestions]

I did not realize this, but there is actually an eyewitness in this case who observed Holly Piirainen shortly before her abduction walking around the area at the end of South Shore Drive and Allen Road. I think it is the neighbor who had the puppies. While pointing with his finger, he said, "I never saw her go any further than that spot down there." So police do have a good idea how far she walked down the road.

There also looks to be something that looks like a communal mailbox for the residents to pick up their mail in the same area. So maybe someone was leaving or entering, stopped to get their mail, and abducted Holly Piirainen after she was spotted by the neighbor walking. The video is below.