CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #63

[Best of What's Around]

Evidence of what? I think the defense destroyed KK's credibility on cross-examination. There has been no forensic evidence to support KK's claim the murder took place at the condo, that the murder weapon was a ball bat and that that the tooth was a human tooth and that it belonged to KB. That's the burden that the DA has to meet. I'm not even sure when the fire took place. The testimony from the ranch hands was vague about the specific date. For all I know, since they testified they placed the wood pallets in the rusted trough prior to Thanksgiving, PF may have started it the night of Thanksgiving or the day after.

That fire was in the works prior to Thanksgiving and KB was still very much alive. Ritchie testified the rusted horse trough was moved and the wooden palates placed inside of it before Thanksgiving. To me, it doesn't prove the purpose was to burn a body that wasn't dead yet.

There has been testimony that the DA provided KK with "bullet points" prior to her testimony. She also has embellished details she hadn't shared with LE previously. This woman is obsessed, delusional and there is no evidence at all that she has told the truth about anything at all.

Stiegerwald had Kenney admit she lied to the FBI the first time and noted again that she claimed she wanted to be caught. She testified that when agents came to her house, she said she would cooperate but said she did not tell them about any of the clues.

He again noted that the first time she talked to law enforcement was after she received the plea agreement and a letter and bullet points outlining what she needed to talk about, which she confirmed.

Stiegerwald then began to question her about things she testified about Wednesday and Thursday which he claimed was the first time she had discussed such matters.

She said that the story about Frazee fantasizing about having a son around with her was the first time she had told that story. She also said that she first told the story about giving Frazee a stuffed animal for Kaylee in court Wednesday and said she never told either story to law enforcement.

Stiegerwald asked if when she said that Frazee “wasn’t as excited as she hoped” about their unborn child, if she meant that Frazee was implying she should have an abortion, to which she responded she did not.
Kenney said she has told the truth for the past year, to which Stiegerwald ended his cross-examination:“For the past 10 hours, you’re telling the truth. And it just so happens to be what you needed to say to stay out of prison."

JMO

Frazee trial: Defense asks why Kenney didn't alert authorities

How do you think the murder happened and by whom? Or do you think it is possible KB is still alive?

If you believe KK murdered KB, where was KB from the time her cell phone went with PB until KK drove into town approximately 36 hours later?

And if PF didn’t murder her, wow is that not a coincidence that he is never concerned, never looks for her, refuses to let her mother see the baby, takes notes as to his whereabouts on the day she went missing for himself, and exclaims to his close friend that he found the perfect way to murder her - “no body, no crime” - prior to her disappearance? Not to mention he refuses to assist LE in any way...

 

[SandyQLS]

Evidence of what? I think the defense destroyed KK's credibility on cross-examination. There has been no forensic evidence to support KK's claim the murder took place at the condo, that the murder weapon was a ball bat and that that the tooth was a human tooth and that it belonged to KB. That's the burden that the DA has to meet. I'm not even sure when the fire took place. The testimony from the ranch hands was vague about the specific date. For all I know, since they testified they placed the wood pallets in the rusted trough prior to Thanksgiving, PF may have started it the night of Thanksgiving or the day after.

That fire was in the works prior to Thanksgiving and KB was still very much alive. Ritchie testified the rusted horse trough was moved and the wooden palates placed inside of it before Thanksgiving. To me, it doesn't prove the purpose was to burn a body that wasn't dead yet.

There has been testimony that the DA provided KK with "bullet points" prior to her testimony. She also has embellished details she hadn't shared with LE previously. This woman is obsessed, delusional and there is no evidence at all that she has told the truth about anything at all.

Stiegerwald had Kenney admit she lied to the FBI the first time and noted again that she claimed she wanted to be caught. She testified that when agents came to her house, she said she would cooperate but said she did not tell them about any of the clues.

He again noted that the first time she talked to law enforcement was after she received the plea agreement and a letter and bullet points outlining what she needed to talk about, which she confirmed.

Stiegerwald then began to question her about things she testified about Wednesday and Thursday which he claimed was the first time she had discussed such matters.

She said that the story about Frazee fantasizing about having a son around with her was the first time she had told that story. She also said that she first told the story about giving Frazee a stuffed animal for Kaylee in court Wednesday and said she never told either story to law enforcement.

Stiegerwald asked if when she said that Frazee “wasn’t as excited as she hoped” about their unborn child, if she meant that Frazee was implying she should have an abortion, to which she responded she did not.
Kenney said she has told the truth for the past year, to which Stiegerwald ended his cross-examination:“For the past 10 hours, you’re telling the truth. And it just so happens to be what you needed to say to stay out of prison."

JMO

Frazee trial: Defense asks why Kenney didn't alert authorities

I smell a bunny boiling in a pot.

 

[Artis]

The ranch hands said it would be possible for SF to have seen the area where the fire was, if she was standing where KK said she was.

They were not present during the fire.

MG, I could have sworn that one of those guys said he saw the fire and saw Ma come out on the deck and watch.

 

[MassGuy]

Evidence of what? I think the defense destroyed KK's credibility on cross-examination. There has been no forensic evidence to support KK's claim the murder took place at the condo, that the murder weapon was a ball bat and that that the tooth was a human tooth and that it belonged to KB. That's the burden that the DA has to meet. I'm not even sure when the fire took place. The testimony from the ranch hands was vague about the specific date. For all I know, since they testified they placed the wood pallets in the rusted trough prior to Thanksgiving, PF may have started it the night of Thanksgiving or the day after.

That fire was in the works prior to Thanksgiving and KB was still very much alive. Ritchie testified the rusted horse trough was moved and the wooden palates placed inside of it before Thanksgiving. To me, it doesn't prove the purpose was to burn a body that wasn't dead yet.

There has been testimony that the DA provided KK with "bullet points" prior to her testimony. She also has embellished details she hadn't shared with LE previously. This woman is obsessed, delusional and there is no evidence at all that she has told the truth about anything at all.

Stiegerwald had Kenney admit she lied to the FBI the first time and noted again that she claimed she wanted to be caught. She testified that when agents came to her house, she said she would cooperate but said she did not tell them about any of the clues.

He again noted that the first time she talked to law enforcement was after she received the plea agreement and a letter and bullet points outlining what she needed to talk about, which she confirmed.

Stiegerwald then began to question her about things she testified about Wednesday and Thursday which he claimed was the first time she had discussed such matters.

She said that the story about Frazee fantasizing about having a son around with her was the first time she had told that story. She also said that she first told the story about giving Frazee a stuffed animal for Kaylee in court Wednesday and said she never told either story to law enforcement.

Stiegerwald asked if when she said that Frazee “wasn’t as excited as she hoped” about their unborn child, if she meant that Frazee was implying she should have an abortion, to which she responded she did not.
Kenney said she has told the truth for the past year, to which Stiegerwald ended his cross-examination:“For the past 10 hours, you’re telling the truth. And it just so happens to be what you needed to say to stay out of prison."

JMO

Frazee trial: Defense asks why Kenney didn't alert authorities

He’s literally caught on camera picking up gas for the fire, on the night in question.

Law enforcement executed a search warrant on the house, and were unable to locate the location of the fire. After KK cooperated, she directed to them where the fire took place.

Wouldn’t you know, they found burned plastic in the shape of a trough, the presence of an accelerant, and a human tooth, right where KK said it would be.

You’re right, the fire was in the works before Thanksgiving. That’s called “premeditation.” Which fits perfectly with his statement to his friend:

Moore recalled an April 2018 conversation about #KelseyBerreth:
"I figured out a way to kill her," #PatrickFrazee said.

"And I went don't even talk about **** like that," Moore replied.
"He went, 'No body, no crime.'"
"I said 'Patrick, get that out of your head.'"

@csgazette

Jakob Rodgers on Twitter

 

[gitana1]

The JD case situation you reference happened in Civil Court and the situation as I understand it is that it is different from invoking the 5th in Criminal Court.

The Fifth Amendment does not provide a blanket right to refuse to answer questions [in civil court]. It is up to the judge to determine whether the privilege is properly invoked and that means that some investigative questioning must be allowed. So, what is going on now in the JD Main Civil Case is that the Judge has to intervene and determine whether “the witness has reasonable cause to apprehend danger of criminal liability,” and only then may the Fifth Amendment be invoked by the mistress as I understand it.

The mistress in the case invoked the 5th on all deposition questions (after previously agreeing to only invoke on a question by question basis) and it was this blanket invocation that I believe caused issues for the Plaintiff and why the Judge is now involved. The reason cited for the blanket invocation of the 5th by the Mistress was risk of incrimination in other criminal matters with no specifics given. So, now the Judge has to review all the deposition questions and make a determination as to which questions can be answered based on additional information from the Mistresses Atty and provided to the Judge (and not the Plaintiff to whom he submitted a [REDACTED] version of his document).

Perhaps @gitana1 can assist on how invoking the 5th in Criminal Court might play out here as I thought that once a witness invokes the 5th on the stand in a Criminal Court that there is to be no further questioning and I also think there is a difference between Civil and Criminal courts in terms of adverse inference of the witness (yes to adverse inference in Civil Court/Family Court and no to advise inference in Criminal Court)?

MOO

A witness invoking is treated the same in criminal and civil court. They can’t refuse to answer all questions. Just those that might incriminate them.

Sometimes this is dealt with in motions. We saw it play out that way with SF at the prelim. Her testimony wasn’t deemed crucial to the hearing and she was allowed to not testify, IIRC do she didn’t have to invoke, although the court was advised that she would if she took the stand.

But I don’t know if her possible testimony was the subject of a motion in limine.

The prohibition against holding it against a defendant when they plead the fifth doesn’t apply to a witness. In either criminal or civil. Because they’re not the one on trial.

 

[MassGuy]

MG, I could have sworn that one of those guys said he saw the fire and saw Ma come out on the deck and watch.

There was one horribly written article that made it sound that way, but every other article I have read made it clear that they were recounting what PF told them.

Sam Kraemer said the same thing as the rest.

 

[Steelslady]

Since it's the 11th EST...Happy Veterans Day @MassGuy and any other past or present military members on here. May God bless you for courageously putting your life on the line to protect our country and freedom. Thank you for your selflessness, your sacrifice, and your service. You define the word hero.

I second this- thank you, @MassGuy and all veterans, for all that you have done to keep our country safe, for protecting our precious freedoms. We are allowed so many privileges in our country, because of all of you.

I'd also like to wish my father a Happy Veteran's Day up in heaven- former Chief Petty Officer in the Navy, USS EBERLE, World War II. You'll always be a hero in my heart.

 

[Artis]

Here’s a pretty solid recap of the ranch hands’ testimony.

Former ranch hands testify in Frazee murder trial

Ritchie said after Thanksgiving he saw the pallets burned and saw Frazee near the fire. He said Frazee burned a few shed deer antlers, and the fire got about 13 feet high. He did not know if he smelled any accelerants.

That would be THE fire, wouldn't it?

Nothing there about Ma so I maybe be mixed or another reporter tweeted it. In fact, I think they used the word "patio" in reference to Ma coming out on the deck.

 

[MyBelle]

^^sbm

When Investigators took KK to the franch to tour the location of the fire, one of the Investigators body cam recorded KK saying that she saw SF come out to the deck when the bonfire flames were towering.

KK also stated that she saw the ranch hands doing chores (moving the trough) at the franch the evening of the fire. Between SF2 and KK --they identified the ranch hands and LE interviewed them on 12/31/19.

(SF2 saw the ranch hands with PF when they went to scrap yard to dispose of the trough).

I don't recall any report or testimony that the ranch hands saw SF on the deck. MOO

BBM. I think the hands testified they moved the trough and loaded the wood pallets the week of Thanksgiving, prior to the fire. KK wasn't there at that point. At least one of them testified PF told them SF came onto the deck concerned about the height of the flames.

Since Thanksgiving is on a Thursday and KK was there on a Saturday, KK lied if she said she saw them do it. I doubt the men work at night. In fact, LE claimed she pointed out where the wood for the fire came from. That wood had already been moved before she arrived.

Ritchie said during the week of Thanksgiving, Frazee asked Dygert and Ritchie to move a rusted out horse trough — meaning it had multiple holes from rust in the bottom — to a different, but nearby, location on the property.

They were also asked to put wooden pallets in the trough, Ritchie said. He said he doesn’t remember Frazee telling him why.

Sometime after Thanksgiving, Ritchie showed up for work and noticed that the pallets had been burned. He said he didn’t think anything of this and that “it was just another day at work.”

Frazee trial: Defense asks why Kenney didn't alert authorities

 

[MassGuy]

Ritchie said after Thanksgiving he saw the pallets burned and saw Frazee near the fire. He said Frazee burned a few shed deer antlers, and the fire got about 13 feet high. He did not know if he smelled any accelerants.

That would be THE fire, wouldn't it?

Nothing there about Ma so I maybe be mixed or another reporter tweeted it. In fact, I think they used the word "patio" in reference to Ma coming out on the deck.

Ha! This is the horribly written one I was referencing. Bad idea to link it on my part.

If after the word fire, you add “pit,” it makes more sense. At no point during their testimony did either ranch hand say they were there on the night of the fire.

 

[Artis]

Here’s a pretty solid recap of the ranch hands’ testimony.

Former ranch hands testify in Frazee murder trial

Found my error concerning Ma, MG:

Lee testified that Sheila Frazee — Patrick Frazee’s mother — had been on the property’s patio during the fire. The two ranch hands said the patio was visible from where they had moved the trough.

Why Krystal Lee didn’t call law enforcement, waited to tell the truth about Kelsey Berreth

I got Lee and the ranch hands mixed up because they were mentioned in the same paragraph. My bad.

 

[Artis]

Ha! This is the horribly written one I was referencing. Bad idea to link it on my part.

If after the word fire, you add “pit,” it makes more sense. At no point during their testimony did either ranch hand say they were there on the night of the fire.

But he even states how high the flames were. Are sure he wasn't there and this report isn't correct? How would he know high it was?

 

[MassGuy]

But he even states how high the flames were. Are sure he wasn't there and this report isn't correct? How would he know high it was?

For that report to be correct, every other article, Tweet, and news report would have to be wrong.

PF told him how high the flames were, which also corroborated that part of KK’s story.

 

[GoJacks]

There has been testimony that the DA provided KK with "bullet points" prior to her testimony. She also has embellished details she hadn't shared with LE previously. This woman is obsessed, delusional and there is no evidence at all that she has told the truth about anything at all.

BBM

 

[afitzy]

Evidence of what? I think the defense destroyed KK's credibility on cross-examination. There has been no forensic evidence to support KK's claim the murder took place at the condo, that the murder weapon was a ball bat and that that the tooth was a human tooth and that it belonged to KB. That's the burden that the DA has to meet. I'm not even sure when the fire took place. The testimony from the ranch hands was vague about the specific date. For all I know, since they testified they placed the wood pallets in the rusted trough prior to Thanksgiving, PF may have started it the night of Thanksgiving or the day after.

That fire was in the works prior to Thanksgiving and KB was still very much alive. Ritchie testified the rusted horse trough was moved and the wooden palates placed inside of it before Thanksgiving. To me, it doesn't prove the purpose was to burn a body that wasn't dead yet.

There has been testimony that the DA provided KK with "bullet points" prior to her testimony. She also has embellished details she hadn't shared with LE previously. This woman is obsessed, delusional and there is no evidence at all that she has told the truth about anything at all.

Stiegerwald had Kenney admit she lied to the FBI the first time and noted again that she claimed she wanted to be caught. She testified that when agents came to her house, she said she would cooperate but said she did not tell them about any of the clues.

He again noted that the first time she talked to law enforcement was after she received the plea agreement and a letter and bullet points outlining what she needed to talk about, which she confirmed.

Stiegerwald then began to question her about things she testified about Wednesday and Thursday which he claimed was the first time she had discussed such matters.

She said that the story about Frazee fantasizing about having a son around with her was the first time she had told that story. She also said that she first told the story about giving Frazee a stuffed animal for Kaylee in court Wednesday and said she never told either story to law enforcement.

Stiegerwald asked if when she said that Frazee “wasn’t as excited as she hoped” about their unborn child, if she meant that Frazee was implying she should have an abortion, to which she responded she did not.
Kenney said she has told the truth for the past year, to which Stiegerwald ended his cross-examination:“For the past 10 hours, you’re telling the truth. And it just so happens to be what you needed to say to stay out of prison."

JMO

Frazee trial: Defense asks why Kenney didn't alert authorities

Court has been ongoing now for a week and testimony has been heard from a number of witnesses including KK that refute any number of the statements you have made in your OP. Many more witnesses have yet to be called and no doubt there will be much further discussion about the tooth that you referenced in your post. My recollection was that back in June that the Court approved DNA test of the "Possible Tooth Fragment" by the CBI subject to supervision by the Defense.

Testing of 'possible tooth fragment' in Kelsey Berreth case


MOO

 

[MyBelle]

The JD case situation you reference happened in Civil Court and the situation as I understand it is that it is different from invoking the 5th in Criminal Court.

The Fifth Amendment does not provide a blanket right to refuse to answer questions [in civil court]. It is up to the judge to determine whether the privilege is properly invoked and that means that some investigative questioning must be allowed. So, what is going on now in the JD Main Civil Case is that the Judge has to intervene and determine whether “the witness has reasonable cause to apprehend danger of criminal liability,” and only then may the Fifth Amendment be invoked by the mistress as I understand it.

The mistress in the case invoked the 5th on all deposition questions (after previously agreeing to only invoke on a question by question basis) and it was this blanket invocation that I believe caused issues for the Plaintiff and why the Judge is now involved. The reason cited for the blanket invocation of the 5th by the Mistress was risk of incrimination in other criminal matters with no specifics given. So, now the Judge has to review all the deposition questions and make a determination as to which questions can be answered based on additional information from the Mistresses Atty and provided to the Judge (and not the Plaintiff to whom he submitted a [REDACTED] version of his document).

Perhaps @gitana1 can assist on how invoking the 5th in Criminal Court might play out here as I thought that once a witness invokes the 5th on the stand in a Criminal Court that there is to be no further questioning and I also think there is a difference between Civil and Criminal courts in terms of adverse inference of the witness (yes to adverse inference in Civil Court/Family Court and no to advise inference in Criminal Court)?

MOO

Thanks for all your help with keeping the facts straight in the Dulos case. I've always thought the 5th had to be invoked for every question. Look forward to an attorney weighing in.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

I smell a bunny boiling in a pot.

If you’re talking about PF, I agree.

Spoiler

This is not going well for him

 

[Sillybilly]

Popping in at random.

We appreciate that some of our members may attend court and convey what they believe to have transpired according to their understanding. WS does not require them to be verified, and it is up to members to decide whether or not to rely on the information provided.

 

[iQuill]

I smell a bunny boiling in a pot.

Ha ha ha ha ha ... post of the day. Thanks for the giggle.

 

[afitzy]

Thanks for all your help with keeping the facts straight in the Dulos case. I've always thought the 5th had to be invoked for every question. Look forward to an attorney weighing in.

JMO

You are welcome to come over and join the conversation at any time! Not much going on at the moment though unfortunately.
MOO