Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #117

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I was just searching around online for statistics about Indiana-Rapes-Murders etc. And came across this article. I found it very interesting although it isn't about Abby and Libby it says alot about "possibilities".....I'm so not accusing anyone but found the authority issue similar.
Police Sergeant Doubled as Serial Rapist

This, IMO, is one of the challenges of this case, and it is tricky, in that, nobody wants to point fingers at a model, upstanding, citizen.....HOWEVER, I firmly believe it is exactly what needs to be done to solve this case.

NOBODY wants to offend. NOBODY wants to point the finger at a man of status, or power, or wealth, or fame. It comes with great risk. Yet, I firmly believe this to be where the answer may very well be found.

The killer is believed to be from Delphi, either currently, or formerly, hiding in plain sight. The killer likely holds, or held, some type of reputable status in the community.

It is my opinion he murdered, he and likely another, to cover up another crime, to maintain his status, his normalcy, his life.....it was necessary to kill, so as to protect himself, his career, his family, his children's inheritance, his all.

He is a rat. A rat who carries on in his daily life, looking in to the eyes of his fellow community members, knowing he is a killer, yet living a life perceived as normal by others. ONLY those closest to him would be able to discern his true self, that of a killer, but they will deny it, squash the idea, shelve it, try to stamp it out, until it grows in proportion that their only relief will be to turn him in to the authorities.

MHO
 
I for my part see it, that Lyric and Libby are similar types and Lizzy and Abby are similar types (only the faces, I know). Of course, Lyric/Lizzy were children and the Delphi girls were already teenagers and there is a big difference in that.
Maybe also, the day of murder was more important to the killer than the type or age of girls. We don't know yet.
I see it, too. And Abby and Libby were just about the age that Lyric and Elizabeth would have been, had they grown up. It just seems so far-fetched, like from a movie plot. But it's intriguing.
 
But who was tracking him on that bridge? Or maybe he used a burner-type phone. He still could have used something to communicate. Or maybe he was listening to music; just using some cheap device. It does seem to me that he had earbuds.
I should have phrased that differently. I meant it would be easy for LE to see which phones pinged from a tower in the area that day and determine who owned the phone. I personally would not even take a phone with me if I planned on attacking someone [if that was his intent when he left home that day].
 
I believe the BG was definitely local and knew the area well or spent some time in that area because none of the witnesses saw him with wet clothes. Also you would have to know the water level in the area that time of year/week/Day(s) to know when and where to have the girls cross while abducting both the girls without getting wet. This means knowledge of the surroundings and conditions ahead of time and that day. Knowing where the sand bar type areas are located for him to cross with the girls (where they were found) he had to have previous knowledge beforehand to execute his plan in such a short period of time.
 
I for my part see it, that Lyric and Libby are similar types and Lizzy and Abby are similar types (only the faces, I know). Of course, Lyric/Lizzy were children and the Delphi girls were already teenagers and there is a big difference in that.
Maybe also, the day of murder was more important to the killer than the type or age of girls. We don't know yet.

I also see a similarity in appearance. Compare the photos below.
Liberty-German-and-Abigail-Williams.jpg


elizabeth-and-lyric-snapchat-killer.jpg



Another similarity between the cases is that one victim in each pair had familial drug issues and was being watched over by a grandmother. Not saying there is a drug angle here, but just that family dynamics is another connection. They disappeared from a small town, in the middle of the afternoon, on a non-school day, while out enjoying nature.

One huge difference though is that Lyric and Lizzy were transported many miles from the site of their abduction, suggesting that a vehicle was involved. Abby and Libby were found within shouting distance of their last known whereabouts. MO seems different, even if other details are eerily similar.
 
I believe the BG was definitely local and knew the area well or spent some time in that area because none of the witnesses saw him with wet clothes. Also you would have to know the water level in the area that time of year/week/Day(s) to know when and where to have the girls cross while abducting both the girls without getting wet. This means knowledge of the surroundings and conditions ahead of time and that day. Knowing where the sand bar type areas are located for him to cross with the girls (where they were found) he had to have previous knowledge beforehand to execute his plan in such a short period of time.
I've never read anything that said how the witnesses described the clothes of who they saw (one I did hear said a scarf I think), only the face sketches they helped generate, the height, weight and age. The condition of his clothes, wet or not, has never been mentioned by LE to my knowledge.
 
I see it, too. And Abby and Libby were just about the age that Lyric and Elizabeth would have been, had they grown up. It just seems so far-fetched, like from a movie plot. But it's intriguing.

I noticed that too, and think it is a worthwhile angle to investigate. All 4 of the murdered girls were in the 2001-2003 birth cohorts even though they were different ages at the time of their murders. If it is one killer responsible, could he possibly have a child in this age range--thus a connection? A man with a child that age is likely to be in the 35-50 age range (which fits with the OBG sketch). I wonder if any of the dads/uncles/older brothers of Libby/Abby's friends ever lived in Iowa?
 
The only problem with that theory is when did Liberty German and Abigail Williams cross paths with the killer in order to cause Liberty to want to videotape him with her phone? Or is it that you are saying the girls previously saw him and noticed that he was intently watching and following them all the way to the Monon High Bridge, at which point he must have stopped following since he is not in the Snapchat photo. So then he went underneath the bridge and climbed up from underneath. This seems like an almost impossible feat from what I have seen of the Monon High Bridge in videos. And what would be the reason for that? That certainly would attract attention to the bridge guy. I do not think it is very likely he was hiding underneath the bridge. But it is a possibility like so many others.

It seems that it would be quite a feat to come up from underneath the bridge(ground up) and then have to get down to a place(under the rails) where he would be able to get up through a space to appear on the tracks. (yes, I saw Greeno do it but he went through a hole on top of the rails) Seems more logical that BG either came down the rails from the north or came up from "down the hill" gave the girls the salutation "Guys" and then went down the tracks a ways and turned back at them and told them to go "down the hill". JMO
 
I believe the BG was definitely local and knew the area well or spent some time in that area because none of the witnesses saw him with wet clothes. Also you would have to know the water level in the area that time of year/week/Day(s) to know when and where to have the girls cross while abducting both the girls without getting wet. This means knowledge of the surroundings and conditions ahead of time and that day. Knowing where the sand bar type areas are located for him to cross with the girls (where they were found) he had to have previous knowledge beforehand to execute his plan in such a short period of time.
A hunter could have come earlier in the day and have the area scoped out in no time.
 
I've never read anything that said how the witnesses described the clothes of who they saw (one I did hear said a scarf I think), only the face sketches they helped generate, the height, weight and age. The condition of his clothes, wet or not, has never been mentioned by LE to my knowledge.
There's a relatively new YouTube video (Harvey C.) that was posted a few days ago, it supposedly shows all the possible "characters" involved and why and where they were during the murders. One of the pictures on there is a drawing made by a supposed witness. It is the first time I actually saw an unofficial drawing but the point is, drawn with a full white scarf. His video is not an approved source but I think that scarf if it is from a true verifyable witness would finally answer that question everyone wondered. Moo
 
A hunter could have come earlier in the day and have the area scoped out in no time.

Or any other day

As always, when a crime goes unsolved too much emphasis goes toward the result and the specifics. We know the girls crossed the bridge then were found dead across the creek. Therefore that was the plan and he executed it perfectly. He had to have local knowledge.

Meanwhile we have no clue how many times he screwed up. He might have gotten down there and realized his actual plan wouldn't work. Not with two girls. Not with two young fleeing girls. Who knows? He improvises in panic and it is totally by chance they end up in that area.

Then he flees and makes additional mistakes. He thinks he's been seen. After all, he almost ran into another car. How can that guy not remember me? He thinks he left DNA. He bolts because he expects a knock at the door. Then the video and voice freak him out even more. He starts rattling off all the names who can identify him from that look and that sound. How could they not identify me? After all...that's me. That's what I look like and that's what I sound like.

Then nothing happens. How can this be possible? Are they toying with me? Baiting me?

Finally after 2+ years and a bizarre press conference he gradually begins to realize they have nothing. I made tons of mistakes but I don't have to concede them because everyone thinks I'm the perfect criminal. Just look at these threads...they think the other side of the creek was the master plan. They actually believe I'm a local.
 
Or any other day

As always, when a crime goes unsolved too much emphasis goes toward the result and the specifics. We know the girls crossed the bridge then were found dead across the creek. Therefore that was the plan and he executed it perfectly. He had to have local knowledge.

Meanwhile we have no clue how many times he screwed up. He might have gotten down there and realized his actual plan wouldn't work. Not with two girls. Not with two young fleeing girls. Who knows? He improvises in panic and it is totally by chance they end up in that area.

Then he flees and makes additional mistakes. He thinks he's been seen. After all, he almost ran into another car. How can that guy not remember me? He thinks he left DNA. He bolts because he expects a knock at the door. Then the video and voice freak him out even more. He starts rattling off all the names who can identify him from that look and that sound. How could they not identify me? After all...that's me. That's what I look like and that's what I sound like.

Then nothing happens. How can this be possible? Are they toying with me? Baiting me?

Finally after 2+ years and a bizarre press conference he gradually begins to realize they have nothing. I made tons of mistakes but I don't have to concede them because everyone thinks I'm the perfect criminal. Just look at these threads...they think the other side of the creek was the master plan. They actually believe I'm a local.

One thing that shocked me yesterday was, how many times the police got close to the serial killers, and yet missed. For different reasons. Too many to name.
 
This, IMO, is one of the challenges of this case, and it is tricky, in that, nobody wants to point fingers at a model, upstanding, citizen.....HOWEVER, I firmly believe it is exactly what needs to be done to solve this case.

NOBODY wants to offend. NOBODY wants to point the finger at a man of status, or power, or wealth, or fame. It comes with great risk. Yet, I firmly believe this to be where the answer may very well be found.

The killer is believed to be from Delphi, either currently, or formerly, hiding in plain sight. The killer likely holds, or held, some type of reputable status in the community.

It is my opinion he murdered, he and likely another, to cover up another crime, to maintain his status, his normalcy, his life.....it was necessary to kill, so as to protect himself, his career, his family, his children's inheritance, his all.

MHO

The regular folks living there who might know him might be very scared. If he killed Libby and Abby for being privy to the secret that would be hard to prove, think of what he could do with the person who knew about the killings.

If he is the person of any status or power, I can understand the Delphians.

One has to have the courage and integrity of Libby to be unafraid.

(But boy, it is beginning to sound like Cosa Nostra in Sicily. Corrupt criminals of status and fame, powerless police, overwhelming fear of vendetta, and one law, omertà).
 
There's a relatively new YouTube video (Harvey C.) that was posted a few days ago, it supposedly shows all the possible "characters" involved and why and where they were during the murders. One of the pictures on there is a drawing made by a supposed witness. It is the first time I actually saw an unofficial drawing but the point is, drawn with a full white scarf. His video is not an approved source but I think that scarf if it is from a true verifyable witness would finally answer that question everyone wondered. Moo
Wow! Thanks for this info Paula. More people were probably around Monon High Bridge area that day than I'd ever suspected. This guy doesn't sound like a loon, actually sounds pretty level-headed...in that video anyway.
 
Or any other day

As always, when a crime goes unsolved too much emphasis goes toward the result and the specifics. We know the girls crossed the bridge then were found dead across the creek. Therefore that was the plan and he executed it perfectly. He had to have local knowledge.

Meanwhile we have no clue how many times he screwed up. He might have gotten down there and realized his actual plan wouldn't work. Not with two girls. Not with two young fleeing girls. Who knows? He improvises in panic and it is totally by chance they end up in that area.

Then he flees and makes additional mistakes. He thinks he's been seen. After all, he almost ran into another car. How can that guy not remember me? He thinks he left DNA. He bolts because he expects a knock at the door. Then the video and voice freak him out even more. He starts rattling off all the names who can identify him from that look and that sound. How could they not identify me? After all...that's me. That's what I look like and that's what I sound like.

Then nothing happens. How can this be possible? Are they toying with me? Baiting me?

Finally after 2+ years and a bizarre press conference he gradually begins to realize they have nothing. I made tons of mistakes but I don't have to concede them because everyone thinks I'm the perfect criminal. Just look at these threads...they think the other side of the creek was the master plan. They actually believe I'm a local.

It boggles the mind.

1) The precision timing and isolated location (trap) of the murders.
2) A house in the immediate vicinity with a view of the bodies’ location whose owners were out of town.
2) The apparent inadequate DNA issues, especially when Libby weighed 200 pounds, was athletic and known to put up a fight, with a killer around the same weight.
3) Supposedly a local killer but no one has claimed a $240K reward based on video and audio evidence in a town of 4000+ people, nor possible physical injures after the fact nor a gait that appears unusual with duck feet and a high step,
4) At least two eye witnesses based on two sketches with little similarity as far as age.
5) A stated video and audio killer that appears to most to be middle age, closer to mid 50’s or even older, not twenty to forty.
6) A killer that vanished into thin air with people around before and after the fact.
7) Strange series of Police press conferences, with only two officers on stage at the most recent one and a 180 change in direction.

I agree with Awsi and like a few others here smell a rat or two.

I don’t think the killer is local, but lived within an hour or so distance in the past, although may live much further away now. He or an accomplice stalked the girls prior to the murders. He or an accomplice is a policeman or related to one. He is a sociopath/ psychopath and enjoys timing/ risk challenges. This is not his first set of murders. He may have taken video or photos of the murders with a Go Pro or other camera, possibly to sell. He enjoys hurting others and is obsessed with issues of power and control, because he lacks authentic natural power. He has difficulty controlling his impulses and is prone to rage when rejected. He may have a virgin/ *advertiser censored* complex. He may have a psychic spiritual split, such as religiosity that has been skewed to justify his actions. Local people may know or suspect the killers/ killer but are afraid to get involved for some specific reason. Moo.
 
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There's a relatively new YouTube video (Harvey C.) that was posted a few days ago, it supposedly shows all the possible "characters" involved and why and where they were during the murders. One of the pictures on there is a drawing made by a supposed witness. It is the first time I actually saw an unofficial drawing but the point is, drawn with a full white scarf. His video is not an approved source but I think that scarf if it is from a true verifyable witness would finally answer that question everyone wondered. Moo
I find it very interesting, hearing of a white scarf again! But who in his right criminal mind would wear something like a white (!) scarf in combination with "daddy clothes", which otherwise are looking like the clothing of a middle-aged farmer/trucker or similar, all blue and unobtrusive (except the shoes!)? If I am "a murderer on my mission" in an area like the MHB area, then why would I dress with a white scarf: the scarf more visible widely than the rest of my person between all the bare trees? Anyway: who does own a white scarf at all? I even don't know one single female with a white scarf in her wardrobe. ;)
That "the unknown thing", which is looking out of BG's jacket, seems to be white, is disturbingly enough to me the whole time.
So, I am very curious about the scarf and the color of it and what will turn out in the end.
ETA: Have not seen the video, you mentioned, yet!
 
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2) A house in the immediate vicinity with a view of the bodies’ location whose owners were out of town.
What, if the home of the snowbirds (I think, you mean these people) was broken into during this time? What, if the owners of the home didn't call LE, when they returned and noticed some signs of burglary? Maybe, they had concerns because of the vicinity to the crime scene and the unpleasant connections, which would have brought some trouble?
It's only a thought .... MOO
There are killers, who are also practiced in B&E very well. Sometimes they started their criminal career with something like this.
Question, which would remain: How/why did the burglar/killer know, that the inhabitants were not present (IF he knew)?
 
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(But boy, it is beginning to sound like Cosa Nostra in Sicily. Corrupt criminals of status and fame, powerless police, overwhelming fear of vendetta, and one law, omertà).
Would be a thought. MOO
 
I also see a similarity in appearance. Compare the photos below.
Liberty-German-and-Abigail-Williams.jpg


elizabeth-and-lyric-snapchat-killer.jpg



Another similarity between the cases is that one victim in each pair had familial drug issues and was being watched over by a grandmother. Not saying there is a drug angle here, but just that family dynamics is another connection. They disappeared from a small town, in the middle of the afternoon, on a non-school day, while out enjoying nature.

One huge difference though is that Lyric and Lizzy were transported many miles from the site of their abduction, suggesting that a vehicle was involved. Abby and Libby were found within shouting distance of their last known whereabouts. MO seems different, even if other details are eerily similar.
Iowa: Maybe, the killer didn't plan to abduct Lyric/Lizzy and take them 25 miles away, but was by circumstances forced to do so.
Delphi: Maybe, the killer did plan to abduct Abby/Libby and take them 25 miles away, but was by circumstances hindered to do so.

Maybe, the killer is intentionally always changing the MO, as he knows very well, that would confuse LE and would make them nearly unable to connect the crimes. Imagine, he would select another state every time in addition!
MOO
 
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