NJ NJ - Dulce Mariá Alavez, 5, abducted @ Bridgeton City Park, Cumberland Co, 16 Sep 2019 #7

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MJPeony said:
Thanks for posting that.

Well, watching and listening to that was like walking through wet cement, but it does give me a better idea of the environment and geography than what I’d previously seen. And I’m now (MOO) more convinced than ever that whoever took Dulce knew Noema was in the car out of sight, so therefore must have either followed them there or had been watching them in visits past and saw a pattern. They didn’t risk it- they knew there was no chance of being seen and had cover of the little hill. And since they’d only just been there a few minutes, I think the perp was well prepared. JMO.
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Agree - hate to sound ungrateful but it’s much easier to watch with the sound off
 
Suglo said:
She’s probably translating the word she uses in Spanish literally to English. I don’t know what that word would be in Mexico. Survey does show up as a synonym of investigation in Spanish. Not that it would make much more sense in that sentence. I would love to hear her say this in Spanish so I could translate what she meant by survey.
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I would think she means the police are "canvassing"... no? Going back to the people along the route/witnesses/store owner etc. who did come forward, and asking them if they've remembered anything new?
 
283 said:
I’m not a fan of the spokesperson but she posted this video tour of the park which provides goods perspective - in case anyone is interested ?
She shows perspective from where mom was parked as well as from the opposite side where the storage sheds are located and the roads leading thru.

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Thank you for this. It makes me think that whatever happened, happened fast. There's a good chance Dulce is still in the park or the very least near by.
 
After that video, I’m having an even harder time visualizing how this “perfect storm” happened. Yes I agree that seeing a live walkthrough helped tremendously with picturing that day. But whoever supposedly abducted Dulce had to have known (whether by following Noema’s car from the little store or by studying a routine that couldn’t have been an active routine for more than a few days as school had recently started back up) that tiny little hill covered an exact area of the playground so Noema couldn’t see. That person huddled behind buildings and waited until Dulce and her brother reached that exact part of the play area and then gestured frantically to join him/darted over and grabbed her? While he was hiding behind the buildings, he also must have factored in the parking spot Noema was parked in right? A little to the left would change the view. Then he led Dulce to his van and hurriedly wobble-drove out on those deeply pitted roads we just saw in the video. This was either the absolute most amazingly timed abduction ever or maybe Dulce wandered off and is in the park still. I just don’t see the timing coming together this way by a random perp looking to take a child.
 
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WildOrchid said:
After that video, I’m having an even harder time visualizing how this “perfect storm” happened. Yes I agree that seeing a live walkthrough helped tremendously with picturing that day. But whoever supposedly abducted Dulce had to have known (whether by following Noema’s car from the little store or by studying a routine that couldn’t have been an active routine for more than a few days as school had recently started back up) that tiny little hill covered an exact area of the playground so Noema couldn’t see. That person huddled behind buildings and waited until Dulce and her brother reached that exact part of the play area and then gestured frantically to join him/darted over and grabbed her? While he was hiding behind the buildings, he also must have factored in the parking spot Noema was parked in right? A little to the left would change the view. Then he led Dulce to his van and hurriedly wobble-drove out on those deeply pitted roads we just saw in the video. This was either the absolute most amazingly timed abduction ever or maybe Dulce wandered off and is in the park still. I just don’t see the timing coming together this way by a random perp looking to take a child.
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I agree. With the playground being under construction it is not shocking there were no other children there playing at the time.
Would a creep stand by and wait at a vacant park under construction - knowing children likely wouldn’t be there playing? Unless this happened to be the most opportune perfect storm of a creep being there at the very time the kids were there unattended odds are this was a targeted event.
Also, there was a local posting a few threads back saying there was an abandoned van found in the neighborhood that could have been used as a handoff to another vehicle.

I repost the link of the playground at time of disappearance.
It doesn’t seem like much of the equipment is able to be played on with the exception of the swing set. Is it me or does it just seem to be one elevated baby swing- I don’t think either of the kids could have gotten into that especially with ice cream/popsicles- and that is the area out of view from the car? I screenshot the video and try to post still shot of the swing but it’s too large to post.
Here's what we know about the Dulce Maria Alavez case
 
Something just doesn’t add up here with watching the video and then picturing how an abduction by a random perp could have happened. So let’s think. Picture yourself driving into the park that day as Noema. The kids get out alone, you remain in the car to scratch a ticket or do homework. Today you didn’t bring the family dog. You or your little sister notice you can’t see the kids playing after 10 minutes. You now jump out of the car as yourself (not moving slowly as a pregnant woman and not 19 and not understanding the danger) to investigate. You obviously run (not walk) towards the playground. You see your son but not your daughter. What’s your gut reaction and what do you do in slow mo? You immediately dial 911? You tell everyone else to call 911? You run towards the woods to see if she’s there? You look around for water bodies? You scan the parking lot for her/others? What are you thinking about where Dulce is? Let’s think outside of the red van box as a caregiver on site at that moment.
 
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My daughter is 9, and I wouldn't have (and don't) let her go to the park where I can't see her.

However, in this scenario, I would look for her. I would call her name, and look into the woods. I'd call 911 when I was sure she wasn't in the immediate area.
 
I do not allow my kids out of sight either. I do however think that WSers are more likely to come up with a plausible scenario for what happened to Dulce and where she may be found than it is likely that a random abduction happened during a tiny time frame, behind a tiny hill, on a day when the dog didn’t come to the park, while the mom wasn’t in view, on an unpaved pitted road that inhibits driving, at a playground that was under construction. I think she either wandered or this was not random. With the video, it’s now easier to imagine ourselves there that day and try to imagine what our own reaction would be and where Dulce might be.
 
WildOrchid said:
I do not allow my kids out of sight either. I do however think that WSers are more likely to come up with a plausible scenario for what happened to Dulce and where she may be found than it is likely that a random abduction happened during a tiny time frame, behind a tiny hill, on a day when the dog didn’t come to the park, while the mom wasn’t in view, on an unpaved pitted road that inhibits driving, at a playground that was under construction. I think she either wandered or this was not random. With the video, it’s now easier to imagine ourselves there that day and try to imagine what our own reaction would be and where Dulce might be.
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Seeing how attentive Dulce was to Manuel in the convenience store video I can’t imagine her wandering off..
 
What if the kids walked over to the sparse playground with ice cream still in hand and realized they couldn’t climb into the swing without spilling? What if there was a ball there left behind by another child or a basketball player? The kids start half heartedly kicking it between them to avoid boredom while finishing their ice cream. The ball goes too far (across the pitted road or in another direction) and Dulce chases it. I do not speak Spanish and I’m not certain the little boy knows ASL but remember Noema had said Manuel indicated a man had gestured “come here” to Dulce and he pointed between the buildings? Do we know if the Spanish word for “man” would be the same as saying Manny? Same question about man/Manny in ASL? Is it possible Dulce kicked the imagined ball too far, chased it, turned and she is the one who gestured “come here” to Manuel to chase the ball with her as opposed to a man gesturing come here? Is there water nearby? Close enough that the kids chased a ball, Dulce went into water and Manny came back crying and pointing in that direction? I know this is a stretch but I just feel like she’s right under our noses and we are missing the obvious.
 
WildOrchid said:
What if the kids walked over to the sparse playground with ice cream still in hand and realized they couldn’t climb into the swing without spilling? What if there was a ball there left behind by another child or a basketball player? The kids start half heartedly kicking it between them to avoid boredom while finishing their ice cream. The ball goes too far (across the pitted road or in another direction) and Dulce chases it. I do not speak Spanish and I’m not certain the little boy knows ASL but remember Noema had said Manuel indicated a man had gestured “come here” to Dulce and he pointed between the buildings? Do we know if the Spanish word for “man” would be the same as saying Manny? Same question about man/Manny in ASL? Is it possible Dulce kicked the imagined ball too far, chased it, turned and she is the one who gestured “come here” to Manuel to chase the ball with her as opposed to a man gesturing come here? Is there water nearby? Close enough that the kids chased a ball, Dulce went into water and Manny came back crying and pointing in that direction? I know this is a stretch but I just feel like she’s right under our noses and we are missing the obvious.
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Maybe the "come here" gesture was Manuel telling his mom she needed to "come here" to see what had happened to Dulce? The Spanish word for "man" is hombre and it's not the same as saying "Manny". I wonder why would a person park their car behind the sheds? A city worker who has access to the locks? A construction worker working nearby? A parent waiting for their child to finish playing basketball? A jogger who regularly frequents the park whose home is nearby? Someone that knew parking there was the easiest path towards the main road?

Since Dulce's ice cup was never found, could it be because Dulce recognized him and walked toward him? Did he say hi to her outside in the parking lot of that Sunoco convenience store? Was she taken shopping somewhere the day before? It could have been an old buddy of her mom's boyfriend who paid a visit to their house once before telling her he could give her a ride home? I'm glad I watched that youtube video but I still have so many questions.

Where are you, Dulce? :(
 
WildOrchid said:
I do not allow my kids out of sight either. I do however think that WSers are more likely to come up with a plausible scenario for what happened to Dulce and where she may be found than it is likely that a random abduction happened during a tiny time frame, behind a tiny hill, on a day when the dog didn’t come to the park, while the mom wasn’t in view, on an unpaved pitted road that inhibits driving, at a playground that was under construction. I think she either wandered or this was not random. With the video, it’s now easier to imagine ourselves there that day and try to imagine what our own reaction would be and where Dulce might be.
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I believe it was random and I don't think it was planned, but rather someone was there on that nice day in September, either walking around or watching basketball or whatever. Perhaps a young guy (just a bit older than a juvenile). And the opportunity was there suddenly - a little girl on the playground unsupervised, probably he noticed that supervision was sitting in a car out of sight. This person acted on the spur of the provided moment and was able to lead Dulce off into the woods. This has always been my strongest hunch for some reason. JMO
 
zecats said:
I believe it was random and I don't think it was planned, but rather someone was there on that nice day in September, either walking around or watching basketball or whatever. Perhaps a young guy (just a bit older than a juvenile). And the opportunity was there suddenly - a little girl on the playground unsupervised, probably he noticed that supervision was sitting in a car out of sight. This person acted on the spur of the provided moment and was able to lead Dulce off into the woods. This has always been my strongest hunch for some reason. JMO
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My first thought is ‘who does that?’ Then I remember where I’m reading. God, I hate this!
 
Yesterday the FBI commented publicly for the first time on Dulce’s case

FBI Speaks on Continued Search for Dulce Maria

I wonder if there’s something to the prosecutor below comment “we encourage the public at home and abroad to remain vigilante ..“ or if I’m just reading too much into it ?

Cumberland County Prosecutor McRae-Webb on Friday said it continues to be an active investigation.

"We encourage the public at home and abroad to continue to remain vigilante and report any information that may assist us in determining the circumstances leading to Dulce's disappearance," she said
'Nobody spontaneously disappears,' FBI says 4 months after NJ girl vanished
 
PunkCake said:
creepy. interacted through a friend of a friend when we happened to be at a party. always out at this basically exclusively Hispanic bar/nightclub called Tequila, a very big spot that demographic. Always packed.

Anyway.
his car doesn’t match. LE had officially cleared him by December.


This is even more creepy to say but the lured victim was post pubescent.

Okay here’s a personal experience. A man tried to lure me when I was about 15. In broad daylight. In a parking lot. Innocently asking if I knew where Walmart was (we were honest to god in the same parking lot of it) so I pointed and he asked if I could get in and show him because he wasn’t from around here. Um. No. Big van. Odd request. I grew up watching law & order from when I was like 5. My friends finally came out of a store behind me and he was STILL TRYING TO ENGAGE WITH US AS WE KEPT WALKING.
At 15 I did not look 15, at all. So this man could have been trying to lure me just to lure a woman or as a pedo. I’ll never know but that was one of the more “I’m not scared I’m just annoyed” I would have with grown men in semi public places.

Guys have been sleazy but none of them were cool with the idea of going to jail once I was like “sir. I’m 15 can you please get out of my way now”, they stuttered away.

“Falmagul Cangri”s actual name is Steven and he was engaged.
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Thank you... for your truths, but somehow he still is on my hinky meter and I can’t explain why!
 
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