Found Alive CA - Sherri Papini, 34, Redding, 2 November 2016 - #24

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What puzzles me.

If as you say there was a "Latin American Style Kidnapping", inter mediated by a "shady as hell non-governmental agent" with a "reverse reward".

Why aren't you more concerned this group will try it again? Further, why isn't the family more concerned with catching the kidnappers? Leaving it behind and moving on is not unreasonable, but doesn't offer safety or comfort when the perpetrators were never caught. Who's to say they wouldn't try to kidnap SP again? I darn sure wouldn't live in the same house with them still "out there" prowling the rural roads of California.
I personally am concerned that this sort of thing will become more common in the US as I think are the authorities which is why any information about the ransom is swept under the rug. I believe the family is terrified of brutal reprisal if they pursue further investigation. I doubt the Papinis are in a position to pay the same ransom again. Kidnappers know you can't squeeze blood from a stone. I don't think these kidnappers were "prowling" either. I think this was targeted based on Sherri's past racist behaviors.

IMO... it doesn’t matter how badly the victim wishes this story would just go away because a public safety risk exists. If this abduction and assault happened the way the victim claims it did, it’s possible these assailants will kidnap and assault someone else if they aren’t apprehended. If they successfully secured a reverse ransom, like some have theorized, the likelihood the assailants will kidnap someone else is even higher. For that reason, it’s absolutely fair for the public to question the validity of these claims because they deserve to know if there’s a danger to the community.
There is a danger to the Southern California community and many other communities. Everyone knows it and everyone knows what could be done to much more effectively reduce it than pointing fingers at pretty blonde moms and having law enforcement chasing shadows.
 
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I believe this was a Latin American style kidnapping in a modus operandi we thankfully do not often see in the United States. If I recall correctly, in the very early stages of the case a "reverse reward" or some other such term for a ransom was proactively offered. I think this was all intermediated by an informed, non-governmental agent who may or may not have been shady as hell but for one reason or another had connections to that world. I also assume that sexual abuse occurred, either as a step toward human trafficking or just as a matter of course.

What still puzzles me is why with regular frequency this thread, this case is dragged back up over and over again when it's very clear the victims very very much want to leave it behind and to move on from it. It puzzles me why people want so much to believe these victims are complicit somehow, in this case, in stark diametrical opposition to not just the normal mores of the forum but its literal written rules.

A paper could be written on this phenomenon alone.

I understand where you are coming from in that normally we would be chastised by the moderators and told that any further infarction would be met with time out , so this case really does go against the grain of general Websleuths permitted behaviour, however, this has been clarified by the owner of WS, Tricia, and the individual case and circumstances known has given rise to more questions than answers and because of what is known about the victims history coupled with the inordinate amount of details lacking any clarity whatsoever, Tricia has deemed it as a case that can be sleuthed this way. She has looked at the case on an individual basis and coupling all the aforementioned with a public safety issue, has decided that it is open to be sleuthed in this way, irrespective of what it may bring up that is either a negative portrayal of the victim or if it casts aspersions on her account. Lastly, if this has happened as described, why was her husband informing the victims children that she would be back on thanksgiving and she was ? That’s certainly something that causes eyebrows to be raised and needs answering. Plus, we have a pair/gang of kidnappers on the loose that need to be caught before more victims suffer the alleged same awful fate and that alone means it’s incumbent on everyone, not just LE, to assist in the capture of such violent aggressors and if to do so requires some difficult questions to be answered honestly by the victim, then so be it . God forbid that it happens again and the victim is unable to “ escape “ her captors and is left to a fate worse than death itself .... all MOO
 
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The obvious answer is that once the ransom had been paid the husband was informed that she would be released by Thanksgiving. It probably took some time for her to be brought back from wherever she was, possibly across the border. Wishful thinking is also not outside the realm of possibility.

<modsnip: rude and personalizing>
 
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The obvious answer is that once the ransom had been paid the husband was informed that she would be released by Thanksgiving. It probably took some time for her to be brought back from wherever she was, possibly across the border. Wishful thinking is also not outside the realm of possibility.

If your facetious quotation marks are implying that you do not believe there are women right here in the United States being trafficked, you're wrong.


Thank you for taking the time to reply so quickly and succinctly but there is no need to border on being offensive to me. I WAS NOT being facetious as you put it and I absolutely know that woman are being trafficked worldwide and besides Websleuths, I work on a voluntary basis in this field to assist in the prevention of such crimes , however i did not refer to that in my post at all, you have merely taken my post out of context and added your own words to suit your narrative. I have been in LE for many years and take your time to think about your belief that a ransom was paid either publicly or privately, if that were the case, do you not think that SP would be at a drop off point away from her captors so that they can’t be identified and not be left found wandering the highway? Surely there would be someone heading out towards a drop off point to intercept her ? But that did not happen and not only that , SP said that she escaped so if that was the case, then clearly her release was not as a result of a reward / ransom being paid and ergo KP wouldn’t have known she would be home on thanksgiving. I have been involved in many such investigations where kidnapping and ransom are involved and the end result does not look like this , even if every case is individual and doesn’t look the same. With regards and all sincerity... MOO
 
MS-13 is international, well documented in various countries. Here are some threat assessments from various LE agencies, as well as various MSM reports.

MS-13 threat has continued to grow internationally, against a climate of political correctness.

Threat Assessment from FBI 2008

"MS-13, who are mostly Salvadoran nationals or first generation Salvadoran-Americans, but also Hondurans, Guatemalans, Mexicans, and other Central and South American immigrants."

Snip

"MS-13 originated in Los Angeles, but when members migrated eastward, they began forming cliques that for the most part operated independently. These cliques, though, often maintain regular contact with members in other regions to coordinate recruitment/criminal activities and to prevent conflicts. "

MS-13 Threat Assessment

Threat Assessment From Virginia 2008

"MS-13 members favor prominent tattoos on their chest, back, and arms. Most tattoos are a form of "MS" or "MS-13” and can be in standard numerals, roman numerals or any combination of the two."

Snip

"MS-13 gang membership appeals to youth in the same way that gangs have always appealed to them: protection, material gain, and belonging. There is however some factors which are specific to the Hispanic gang experience and MS-13 in particular. As migrants move legally or illegally into American communities, they face language barriers, limited employment options, and victimization by native gangs already operating in the area.17"

"MS-13 is a true transnational gang, with documented cliques throughout Central America, the United States and Canada."

Snip

"MS-13 is estimated to have some 20,000 members in the U.S., with at least some level of presence in around 33 states.25 The domestic arm of the gang revolves around the Los Angeles and Washington, DC regions, which were and are the primary areas of Salvadoran immigrant settlement.26 The spread of MS-13 cliques across the country appears to have followed the patterns of migration as immigrant communities spread, and tend to also follow the patterns in the illegal drug market, a major moneymaking activity of gangs.

https://info.publicintelligence.net/VFCMaraSalvatrucha.pdf

"Mara inmates realized they had to join La Eme [The Mexican Mafia] to survive, and the mob was happy to add war-hardened machete wielders to its cell-block armies. The Mexican Mafia uses the number thirteen (M is the thirteenth letter of the alphabet), so as Maras joined up, they became the Mara Salvatrucha 13."

Trump says he's going to 'destroy' MS-13 — here's how the gang got its sinister name

MS-13's roots

Salvadoran immigrants fleeing the country's civil war started MS-13 decades ago in Los Angeles. Its members are also immigrants from Honduras, Guatemala, Mexico and other Central and South American countries, according to an FBI Threat Assessment of the gang.

What is MS-13? The 'transnational' street gang on the FBI's radar - CNN

“We’ve learned that through this investigation MS-13 had plans for establishing an East Coast foundation here in New York for the gang, that will never happen,” he said.

The bulk of the accused thugs, 64 defendants, were busted in the past week as part of a new indictment alleging murder conspiracy, drug trafficking, gang violence and the possession and sale of weapons, said Suffolk County District Attorney Timothy Sini.

https://nypost.com/2019/12/20/massive-ms-13-bust-officials-charge-96-members-in-gang-takedown/

US probe finds MS-13, the world’s deadliest gang has infiltrated Australia

The investigation began in May, 2017, and US authorities were surprised to discover the gang’s international reach.

“We uncovered a structured network of MS-13 operations in New Jersey, Maryland, Virginia, Texas, from within a Mississippi prison cell, and in countries around the globe including Mexico, Colombia, Korea, France, Australia, Peru, Egypt, Ecuador and Cuba,” Ms Singas said.

MS-13, the world’s deadliest gang has infiltrated Australia
 
There is a danger to the Southern California community and many other communities. Everyone knows it and everyone knows what could be done to much more effectively reduce it than pointing fingers at pretty blonde moms and having law enforcement chasing shadows.

The obvious answer is that once the ransom had been paid the husband was informed that she would be released by Thanksgiving. It probably took some time for her to be brought back from wherever she was, possibly across the border. Wishful thinking is also not outside the realm of possibility.

You're in the wrong part of the state. Redding is in far northern California, roughly 700 miles from the Mexican border. With California traffic, that would be several days of driving.

Unless you were referring to Oregon...
 
Thank you for taking the time to reply so quickly and succinctly but there is no need to border on being offensive to me. I WAS NOT being facetious as you put it and I absolutely know that woman are being trafficked worldwide and besides Websleuths, I work on a voluntary basis in this field to assist in the prevention of such crimes , however i did not refer to that in my post at all, you have merely taken my post out of context and added your own words to suit your narrative. I have been in LE for many years and take your time to think about your belief that a ransom was paid either publicly or privately, if that were the case, do you not think that SP would be at a drop off point away from her captors so that they can’t be identified and not be left found wandering the highway? Surely there would be someone heading out towards a drop off point to intercept her ? But that did not happen and not only that , SP said that she escaped so if that was the case, then clearly her release was not as a result of a reward / ransom being paid and ergo KP wouldn’t have known she would be home on thanksgiving. I have been involved in many such investigations where kidnapping and ransom are involved and the end result does not look like this , even if every case is individual and doesn’t look the same. With regards and all sincerity... MOO
I'm sure that in England there is some sort of established etiquette for the paying of ransom and the delivery of ransomed hostages. In fact, if I'm not mistaken the largest provider of K&R insurance is a British company.

The official policy of the US government on the other hand is to not negotiate with kidnappers and in many cases to respond to such situations with the use of force. This may or may not be the unwritten law in California but we actively foster the impression that if you take a US citizen there is a very real possibility that you will be killed by government agents. This does statistically seem to serve as a deterrent but it also raises the stakes in individual cases and it's understandable that the families of a kidnap victim might not want to risk being an example. It's also understandable that kidnappers might want to release a victim at as remote a location as possible, far removed from any SWAT teams. To me, it also seems quite believable that a victim be instructed to say they escaped since the payment of their ransom was intended to be secret. I'm sure that in hindsight Sherri's husband deeply regrets telling their kids she would be home and never expected that info to have come out publicly.

If you have some specific information about how ransom is usually paid in the state of California and how the return of kidnap victims there is "usually" handled I would be very interested to read it but even then, I don't think this started out as a ransom kidnapping (which usually target very wealthy families). I think that Sherri was targeted in retribution and was well along in the process of being broken down for human trafficking but someone in that economic chain managed to buy her back and she was dumped somewhere that her captors expected she would be found but not until they'd had plenty of time to be far far away which is exactly what happened.
 
Thank you for taking the time to reply so quickly and succinctly but there is no need to border on being offensive to me. I WAS NOT being facetious as you put it and I absolutely know that woman are being trafficked worldwide and besides Websleuths, I work on a voluntary basis in this field to assist in the prevention of such crimes , however i did not refer to that in my post at all, you have merely taken my post out of context and added your own words to suit your narrative. I have been in LE for many years and take your time to think about your belief that a ransom was paid either publicly or privately, if that were the case, do you not think that SP would be at a drop off point away from her captors so that they can’t be identified and not be left found wandering the highway? Surely there would be someone heading out towards a drop off point to intercept her ? But that did not happen and not only that , SP said that she escaped so if that was the case, then clearly her release was not as a result of a reward / ransom being paid and ergo KP wouldn’t have known she would be home on thanksgiving. I have been involved in many such investigations where kidnapping and ransom are involved and the end result does not look like this , even if every case is individual and doesn’t look the same. With regards and all sincerity... MOO

EXCELLENT post. Thank you for putting your experience and thoughts together here. And thank you for working in LE, a stressful job to be sure.
 
I'm sure that in England there is some sort of established etiquette for the paying of ransom and the delivery of ransomed hostages. In fact, if I'm not mistaken the largest provider of K&R insurance is a British company.

The official policy of the US government on the other hand is to not negotiate with kidnappers and in many cases to respond to such situations with the use of force. This may or may not be the unwritten law in California but we actively foster the impression that if you take a US citizen there is a very real possibility that you will be killed by government agents. This does statistically seem to serve as a deterrent but it also raises the stakes in individual cases and it's understandable that the families of a kidnap victim might not want to risk being an example. It's also understandable that kidnappers might want to release a victim at as remote a location as possible, far removed from any SWAT teams. To me, it also seems quite believable that a victim be instructed to say they escaped since the payment of their ransom was intended to be secret. I'm sure that in hindsight Sherri's husband deeply regrets telling their kids she would be home and never expected that info to have come out publicly.

If you have some specific information about how ransom is usually paid in the state of California and how the return of kidnap victims there is "usually" handled I would be very interested to read it but even then, I don't think this started out as a ransom kidnapping (which usually target very wealthy families). I think that Sherri was targeted in retribution and was well along in the process of being broken down for human trafficking but someone in that economic chain managed to buy her back and she was dumped somewhere that her captors expected she would be found but not until they'd had plenty of time to be far far away which is exactly what happened.
I have a lot of information regarding kidnapping but none of which I would be willing to share with you because it would not be professional to do so and it’s a very guarded part of police work and it’s almost secretive on a need to know basis for the protection of those who are kidnapped. British Police do not pay ransom either .
You seem very well versed in the intricacies of process and policy in the field of LE response to kidnap cases so I will turn the question around to you and ask you to share your knowledge?
In terms of other details within your post, you are entitled to your opinion and your personal perspective however, respectfully, unless you have been involved in the investigation of a live kidnapping and hostage / ransom situation wether it be trafficking or otherwise ( although it’s less likely for someone to be kidnapped in the true sense of the word for trafficking and it’s more akin to grooming as opposed to kidnapping where trafficking is involved), then I will say that some of your post is not how it works in the real world and I am not going to enter into further debate about it because it is a closely guarded and controlled way of investigating that is not for sharing, suffice to say that I have and I speak from investigative experience. Thank you for your valuable input and taking the time to discuss your personal thoughts with me on this forum . Peace ✌️ out !
 
MS-13 is international, well documented in various countries. Here are some threat assessments from various LE agencies, as well as various MSM reports.

MS-13 threat has continued to grow internationally, against a climate of political correctness.

Threat Assessment from FBI 2008

"MS-13, who are mostly Salvadoran nationals or first generation Salvadoran-Americans, but also Hondurans, Guatemalans, Mexicans, and other Central and South American immigrants."

Snip

"MS-13 originated in Los Angeles, but when members migrated eastward, they began forming cliques that for the most part operated independently. These cliques, though, often maintain regular contact with members in other regions to coordinate recruitment/criminal activities and to prevent conflicts. "

MS-13 Threat Assessment

Threat Assessment From Virginia 2008

"MS-13 members favor prominent tattoos on their chest, back, and arms. Most tattoos are a form of "MS" or "MS-13” and can be in standard numerals, roman numerals or any combination of the two."

Snip

"MS-13 gang membership appeals to youth in the same way that gangs have always appealed to them: protection, material gain, and belonging. There is however some factors which are specific to the Hispanic gang experience and MS-13 in particular. As migrants move legally or illegally into American communities, they face language barriers, limited employment options, and victimization by native gangs already operating in the area.17"

"MS-13 is a true transnational gang, with documented cliques throughout Central America, the United States and Canada."

Snip

"MS-13 is estimated to have some 20,000 members in the U.S., with at least some level of presence in around 33 states.25 The domestic arm of the gang revolves around the Los Angeles and Washington, DC regions, which were and are the primary areas of Salvadoran immigrant settlement.26 The spread of MS-13 cliques across the country appears to have followed the patterns of migration as immigrant communities spread, and tend to also follow the patterns in the illegal drug market, a major moneymaking activity of gangs.

https://info.publicintelligence.net/VFCMaraSalvatrucha.pdf

"Mara inmates realized they had to join La Eme [The Mexican Mafia] to survive, and the mob was happy to add war-hardened machete wielders to its cell-block armies. The Mexican Mafia uses the number thirteen (M is the thirteenth letter of the alphabet), so as Maras joined up, they became the Mara Salvatrucha 13."

Trump says he's going to 'destroy' MS-13 — here's how the gang got its sinister name

MS-13's roots

Salvadoran immigrants fleeing the country's civil war started MS-13 decades ago in Los Angeles. Its members are also immigrants from Honduras, Guatemala, Mexico and other Central and South American countries, according to an FBI Threat Assessment of the gang.

What is MS-13? The 'transnational' street gang on the FBI's radar - CNN

“We’ve learned that through this investigation MS-13 had plans for establishing an East Coast foundation here in New York for the gang, that will never happen,” he said.

The bulk of the accused thugs, 64 defendants, were busted in the past week as part of a new indictment alleging murder conspiracy, drug trafficking, gang violence and the possession and sale of weapons, said Suffolk County District Attorney Timothy Sini.

https://nypost.com/2019/12/20/massive-ms-13-bust-officials-charge-96-members-in-gang-takedown/

US probe finds MS-13, the world’s deadliest gang has infiltrated Australia

The investigation began in May, 2017, and US authorities were surprised to discover the gang’s international reach.

“We uncovered a structured network of MS-13 operations in New Jersey, Maryland, Virginia, Texas, from within a Mississippi prison cell, and in countries around the globe including Mexico, Colombia, Korea, France, Australia, Peru, Egypt, Ecuador and Cuba,” Ms Singas said.

MS-13, the world’s deadliest gang has infiltrated Australia
Thank you for taking the time to share this very interesting information.
 
once the ransom had been paid the husband was informed that she would be released by Thanksgiving. It probably took some time for her to be brought back from wherever she was, possibly across the border.
<modsnip: rude and personalizing>

Respectfully snipped for commentary focus and response.
This is *exactly* what I speculate occurred. I seem to be one of the few on the thread who believes this woman was brutalized and is lucky to be alive.
My continued prayers and best wishes to her and her family.

Amateur opinion and speculation
 
Based on all I've read, heard and watched, and my 40+ years following true crime cases, I do not believe the Papini's version of events surrounding her disappearance or her miraculous reappearance.
Literally, not a shred of it rings true.
Which is unfortunate, especially if the whole thing is actually true.
Somehow, the whole case comes off as a lie.

Will the general public ever really know the truth?
I highly doubt it.
But it would be nice if there was actually someone else involved in the story, and they eventually told the truth about what happened that day, and in the days following.
 
Respectfully snipped for commentary focus and response.
This is *exactly* what I speculate occurred. I seem to be one of the few on the thread who believes this woman was brutalized and is lucky to be alive.
My continued prayers and best wishes to her and her family.

Amateur opinion and speculation
I believe she was brutalized. I am doubtful she was kidnapped.
 
I have a lot of information regarding kidnapping but none of which I would be willing to share with you because it would not be professional to do so and it’s a very guarded part of police work and it’s almost secretive on a need to know basis for the protection of those who are kidnapped. British Police do not pay ransom either .
You seem very well versed in the intricacies of process and policy in the field of LE response to kidnap cases so I will turn the question around to you and ask you to share your knowledge?
In terms of other details within your post, you are entitled to your opinion and your personal perspective however, respectfully, unless you have been involved in the investigation of a live kidnapping and hostage / ransom situation wether it be trafficking or otherwise ( although it’s less likely for someone to be kidnapped in the true sense of the word for trafficking and it’s more akin to grooming as opposed to kidnapping where trafficking is involved), then I will say that some of your post is not how it works in the real world and I am not going to enter into further debate about it because it is a closely guarded and controlled way of investigating that is not for sharing, suffice to say that I have and I speak from investigative experience. Thank you for your valuable input and taking the time to discuss your personal thoughts with me on this forum . Peace ✌️ out !
I try very hard to avoid logical fallacies so even if I were posting from a verified law enforcement account I would be remiss to use it to make arguments from authority.

Fortunately, it's no secret how the FBI handles kidnappings and one need not take my word for it, rather look at any one of many well documented operations. The Patty Hearst case immediately springs to my mind, right there in California in which a foreign/prison organized criminal syndicate carried out a high profile kidnapping. In that case, over 400 armed police and federal agents ended up burning a house down around most the so-called "Symbionese Liberation Army"

More recent well publicized incident of FBI response to kidnapping are the cases of Jimmy Lee Dykes and James DiMaggio both of which ended in an FBI SWAT team infiltrating and killing the subject.

In this Papini incident, they may well have had the even more recent case of Ulises Valladares which has even more parallels and unfortunately resulted in a member of the FBI SWAT team accidentally killing the kidnapping victim.

There are many, many more well documented cases of FBI involvement in kidnappings having chaotic and it's very easy to see why perpetrators and victims alike might go to lengths to avoid participating in their standard operations.
 
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I personally am concerned that this sort of thing will become more common in the US as I think are the authorities which is why any information about the ransom is swept under the rug. I believe the family is terrified of brutal reprisal if they pursue further investigation. I doubt the Papinis are in a position to pay the same ransom again. Kidnappers know you can't squeeze blood from a stone. I don't think these kidnappers were "prowling" either. I think this was targeted based on Sherri's past racist behaviors.


There is a danger to the Southern California community and many other communities. Everyone knows it and everyone knows what could be done to much more effectively reduce it than pointing fingers at pretty blonde moms and having law enforcement chasing shadows.

redding is very far northern ca
 
I will not victim shame. This woman, rightly so, wants to avoid the spotlight, and it could be to avoid antagonizing her former captors or just to live her life. I may handle it differently if it were ME, but it's not ME. Sherri has the right to live her life. It is NOT her job to keep the public safe, but it is her job to keep herself and her children safe. Thus, avoiding media. No one could, or likely would choose to, give those injuries to themselves. Broken bones? Branding? Complete emaciation? Not to mention, I know from personal experience that our brains can block things out of self-protection. I believe this is why details are fuzzy or missing in Ms. Pappini's account. In any event, I believe she experienced horrible violations and was abducted and was fortunately released alive. Other than that, what she chooses to share or NOT share is up to her. Unfortunately in our media-hungry, "15 minutes of fame" society, the fact that she does NOT want that fame automatically equates to her story being fabricated by people who feel they have a RIGHT to KNOW what happened to her in detail. And no matter what I say or anyone else says, until they get what THEY want, in their minds Sherri will remain a liar. And that is a travesty. I hope she and her family can live out their lives as they choose and that media, press, curious onlookers will allow her to keep her privacy. I believe her. And wish her well.
 
Papini has, to date, not tried to make any money out of this, which eliminates a major motive for faking this. She has kept a low profile, so attention is not a motive. She appeared to be confused when released. No ransom demand and the family was not wealthy.

The vibe, for me, does not appear that she is faking. That is obviously an opinion to the vibe.

I'm wondering if either she crossed someone or if this was mistaken identity.
 
Papini has, to date, not tried to make any money out of this, which eliminates a major motive for faking this. She has kept a low profile, so attention is not a motive. She appeared to be confused when released. No ransom demand and the family was not wealthy.

The vibe, for me, does not appear that she is faking. That is obviously an opinion to the vibe.

I'm wondering if either she crossed someone or if this was mistaken identity.

I think she got the attention she wanted when she was allegedly kidnapped. I don't think she anticipated the national attention this would receive and most definitely didn't think people would still be questioning her story almost 4 years later.


Criticism and questions are not the attention she wants now.

As always, this is just my opinion.
 
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