MO MO - St Louis, BlkFem 8-11, 54UFMO, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83
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KaylaraOwl
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You have the details of those cases? If you have their names, maybe there will be birth announcements or obituaries that can be checked.
Moonwalker9
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Mors_Et_Vita,
Good find! I tried to look for murder cases across the county, like a namus database but there's no national webside for that. You have to look at state by state, sometimes county by county. Only a few states have decent websites about unsolved murders.
I also theorized that JD's Mother was either murdered shorly before JD was found or that she died from another cause and JD was given to a person close to the family before JD was murdered.
Since JD most likely came from a caring home and was well nourished prior to her death and forensic evidence showed she spent most of the life outside of St Louis I'm not sure her mother was murdered in St Louis, she could've been murdered almost anywhere in the county (south, or midwest) a few weeks prior to JD's murder. I have checked for this on namus and found 1 interesting case that could've been her mother. This may be far fetched, since it happened in Califiornia. But her age is right and she died at almost the same time JD was found. JD could have been abducted while the mother was on drugs and when she realized she was gone she went crazy which eventually caused her death. This woman is still unidentified though.
The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)
Good find! I tried to look for murder cases across the county, like a namus database but there's no national webside for that. You have to look at state by state, sometimes county by county. Only a few states have decent websites about unsolved murders.
I also theorized that JD's Mother was either murdered shorly before JD was found or that she died from another cause and JD was given to a person close to the family before JD was murdered.
Since JD most likely came from a caring home and was well nourished prior to her death and forensic evidence showed she spent most of the life outside of St Louis I'm not sure her mother was murdered in St Louis, she could've been murdered almost anywhere in the county (south, or midwest) a few weeks prior to JD's murder. I have checked for this on namus and found 1 interesting case that could've been her mother. This may be far fetched, since it happened in Califiornia. But her age is right and she died at almost the same time JD was found. JD could have been abducted while the mother was on drugs and when she realized she was gone she went crazy which eventually caused her death. This woman is still unidentified though.
The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)
Bit of hope
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Hi and welcome @Mors_Et_Vita. Thank you for your research and screenshots. I would like to know the details of the 27 years old, killed by knife or cutting instrument (modus operandi stands out to me in relation to this case). And I wondered if this murder was solved. In your screenshot with solved cases there is also a 27 year old female killed by knife or cutting instrument. Is this the same case? Is it possible this was the mother of this Jane Doe. She would have been between 16-18 when given birth. Because of the lack of details I can't answer this question myself. Thank you upfront.
Mors_Et_Vita
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Hi @Bit of hope, unfortunately I have not been able to find the name of this woman. But I can try Googling the details and see if any obituaries line up.
Mors_Et_Vita
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That's so crazy...it says "The decedent was found floating in a pool at an apartment complex. Earlier she had been seen outside the complex acting bizarre and yelling". It is weird that this woman was only 5'1'' and JD was much taller. However, it could definitely be a possibility. Anyone want to get in contact with Namus and report this possible connection?
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Mors_Et_Vita
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Wow...I just found something.
"At about 4:00AM on December 18, 1984, 10-year-old Alfred Foote was discovered missing from the home where he was visiting his grandmother and uncle in northwest St. Louis. At 8:30AM, officers followed a trail of blood from the home to a vacant house at 5640 Kennedy Avenue, where they found Alfred’s body partially concealed in a plastic bag underneath a concrete stairwell behind the building. He was lying directly on top of his severed head.
Alfred’s uncle, 28-year-old Michael Foote, was immediately arrested for his murder. He quickly became a suspect in Jane Doe’s case due to the similarities to Alfred’s murder; both around the same age, had been decapitated, and their bodies were dumped on vacant properties less than two miles apart. However, after questioning Michael, they were unable to establish any link between the two slayings."
Very weird. The two murders are almost identical.
"At about 4:00AM on December 18, 1984, 10-year-old Alfred Foote was discovered missing from the home where he was visiting his grandmother and uncle in northwest St. Louis. At 8:30AM, officers followed a trail of blood from the home to a vacant house at 5640 Kennedy Avenue, where they found Alfred’s body partially concealed in a plastic bag underneath a concrete stairwell behind the building. He was lying directly on top of his severed head.
Alfred’s uncle, 28-year-old Michael Foote, was immediately arrested for his murder. He quickly became a suspect in Jane Doe’s case due to the similarities to Alfred’s murder; both around the same age, had been decapitated, and their bodies were dumped on vacant properties less than two miles apart. However, after questioning Michael, they were unable to establish any link between the two slayings."
Very weird. The two murders are almost identical.
STATE v. FOOTE | 791 S.W.2d 879 (1990) | w2d87911598 | Leagle.com
Clipping from St. Louis Post-Dispatch - Newspapers.com
''Killing From page one ,I,,,J,M..-I..1l .IN,. Michael Foote Charged with murder desegregation program. "He was a very good boy," Mrs. Foote said late Tuesday, wiping away tears as she stood at the door of her apartment in the city's North Side several miles from where her son's body was found. "That's all I can say." Authorities say Michael Foote has no criminal record. Homicide detectives said they had found physical evidence linking him to the crime. They said he had given conflicting statements to police about the killing. Police say they do not know the motive for the murder. Capt. Robert Richters, commander of the homicide division, said that Alfred's father had told authorities that Michael Foote needed treatment for mental problems. "The dead child's father told us that he thought his brother was emotionally disturbed and wanted him to get treatment some years ago," Richters said. The murder was the second involving decapitation in St. Louis in less than two years. The body of a girl about 9 or 10 years old was found Feb. 28, 1983, in a vacant building at 5635 Clemens Avenue less than two miles from where Alfred's body was found. Despite an intensive investigation that lasted for several months, detectives never solved the "Jane Doe" killing. The girl's head has not been recovered; she has not been identified. Detective Sgt. Herb Riley said police would "most definitely" SCALE "K o ii mil. . floral Brldge Decapitated I Boy Found M Last I Vs,-touisAve. Hereh gKennertyAve. S Zrf" Highland Ave. Oelmar Blvd. -A J FOREST ;y-rs g PARK "13 I'-..- I v. j n :, "S . as '' t " m . 5 J 4 , f st; v Post-Dispatch graphic by Tony Lazorko question Michael Foote about the killing of the young girl. "Right now, though, we have nothing connecting him to the earlier decapitation case," Riley said. Police gave this account of the boy's killing: Alfred Foote and his younger brother "visited the home of their uncle and grandmother, Ophelia Foote, late Monday afternoon. That evening, the boys' father took the grandmother to a hospital after she became ill, possibly suffering a mild stroke. She was still in the hospital late Tuesday. Alfred Foote Sr. returned to his brother's house shortly after 4 a.m. Tuesday to pick up his sons. The 7-year-old was unharmed, police said, but young Alfred was missing. The uncle said the boy had run away. Suspecting that something had happened to his oldest son, Alfred Foote Sr. and his brother began quarreling. After a neighbor called police, Officer Paul Rea of the Union Boulevard District went to the house. He saw blood on Michael Foote's clothing and noted that Foote appeared to be drunk. Members of the Police Department's canine corps, juvenile division and Union Boulevard District conducted an intensive search of vacant buildings and lots in the area. Detectives Thomas Kranz, Theodore Ehrlich and Willie Thompson found the body in the stairwell of the vacant building on Kennerly. After a preliminary examination of the corpse, Dr. Michael Graham of the medical examiner's office said the boy's head had been severed after he was dead. The boy was killed as a result of several blows to head possibly with a heavy stick. A large butcher knife has been seized as evidence, police said. Homicide detectives say the boy was killed in the house on Highland possibly In the basement and his body and head were carried down the alley to the vacant house. Neighbors said the dilapidated frame house had been vacant for at least two years. Its windows and doors are boarded shut with red plywood; the once-white exterior walls are splotched and peeling, revealing dark wood underneath. The front lawn, overgrown with weeds, is strewn with trash crushed beer cans, broken glass and empty propane canisters. Small crowds of neighorhood residents gathered around the vacant house Tuesday morning as homicide detectives examined the scene. The body was taken away about 1 1 a.m. "If I have tears in my eyes, I just can't help it," said one onlooker, Ophelia Rodgers, 47. "I can't even think right. I knew that boy since he was a baby he was a nice little boy. Why would anybody do something like that?" Mrs. Rodgers, who lives nearby, said young Alfred had often visited his grandmother at her house on Highland. The front lawn of that house was strewn with roof shingles and wood Tuesday morning; neighbors said workmen were installing a new roof there. At the Mason Ridge School, 715 South Mason Road in Creve Coeur, Alfred was one of 33 students from St. Louis who were bused to the school. George Ramsey, principal of Mason Ridge, said Tuesday that Alfred had begun attending the school last year. Before that, the boy had gone to Eliot Elementary School, 4242 Grove Avenue in St. Louis. "Alfred had a very outgoing, pleasing personality he was a really likable young boy," Ramsey said. "I don't think there was a person here who was ever uncomfortable with Alfred. He was well-liked by his classmates and the staff." When Alfred failed to show up for classes Tuesday morning, school officials called his home to find out if he was ill. One of Alfred's aunts told Ramsey that the boy had been killed. Ramsey said he had called together the room mothers at the school to inform them of the killing. He also arranged for a psychologist to go to the school Tuesday afternoon to meet with the staff and a group of parents''
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carbuff
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I think you might be onto something there. That poor boy and his family.
carbuff
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Well, lookee what I found! Michael Foote's appeal of his murder conviction, which includes a detailed summary of the crime and events around it:
STATE v. FOOTE | 791 S.W.2d 879 (1990) | w2d87911598 | Leagle.com
Mainly it confirms there are a lot of similarities with our girl's case.
Obituary of the man who was head of the homicide unity for both crimes: Bob Richters dies; once led St. Louis police homicide unit
Nothing specific but it gives some background information about the city at the time.
And I see we had mentioned it before: MO - St Louis, BlkFem Child 54UFMO, 8-11, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83
MO - St Louis, BlkFem Child 54UFMO, 8-11, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83
It appears that St. Louis police did investigate the possible connection and didn't come up with anything, but I feel like there's something here.
STATE v. FOOTE | 791 S.W.2d 879 (1990) | w2d87911598 | Leagle.com
Mainly it confirms there are a lot of similarities with our girl's case.
Obituary of the man who was head of the homicide unity for both crimes: Bob Richters dies; once led St. Louis police homicide unit
Nothing specific but it gives some background information about the city at the time.
And I see we had mentioned it before: MO - St Louis, BlkFem Child 54UFMO, 8-11, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83
MO - St Louis, BlkFem Child 54UFMO, 8-11, in abandoned bldg, Feb'83
It appears that St. Louis police did investigate the possible connection and didn't come up with anything, but I feel like there's something here.
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chemicalpixie
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Hi,
Just checking in to see if anyone has any knowledge of the sweater beyond what I have been able to find — I know the tags were cut out, and that it was lost in the mail going to a psychic in Florida (the logic behind that choice I will never understand) but was anything ever published that discussed the kind of fabric it was made of or anything like that? I was thinking if one could find out what kind of sweater it was (brand, etc) that might help narrow down where it was bought and when. While it's a bit of a long shot to imagine that would work given the time that has passed since the crime was committed, I figured it couldn't hurt — after all, the killer likely cut the tags out of the sweater for a reason, right?
Just checking in to see if anyone has any knowledge of the sweater beyond what I have been able to find — I know the tags were cut out, and that it was lost in the mail going to a psychic in Florida (the logic behind that choice I will never understand) but was anything ever published that discussed the kind of fabric it was made of or anything like that? I was thinking if one could find out what kind of sweater it was (brand, etc) that might help narrow down where it was bought and when. While it's a bit of a long shot to imagine that would work given the time that has passed since the crime was committed, I figured it couldn't hurt — after all, the killer likely cut the tags out of the sweater for a reason, right?
AlwaysCoffee
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I think this is an excellent idea, so I did some vintage yellow sweater sleuthing to see what comes up.
Here's one from the '70s, so who knows if it could be a hand-me-down? Tag says "norm MEAGERS." Appears to be a men's sweater, but I still find that valuable because who says the sweater belonged to the girl at all?
70s Yellow V-Neck Wool Sweater - Ragstock
This one seems to be the most promising to me. Christian Dior, 1980s. It appears to have a logo on the chest, but that could also be a stain. If our Doe is not wearing this exact sweater, it could be a knock off? Though, I know it's a bit of a stretch to knock off a plain yellow sweater. The auction site is no longer active, so these links are to photos only.
https://shop.r10s.jp/auc-grab/cabinet/yrc-1504a/o-apd14y15n16ze9cb.jpg
https://shop.r10s.jp/auc-grab/cabinet/yrc-1504a/o-apd14y15n16xe9ce.jpg
This one is Dragon brand from Sears, 1980s, sold as Men's. It has some unique sleeve cuffs, but I still wanted to include it because it's difficult to get a good look of the cuffs in the evidence photos of the sweater.
Mens Vintage 80's Sears Dragon Yellow V-neck Pullover Sweater Size Large • $17.99
Moonwalker9
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Do we know if any agency is working on her case? It would ve amazing if they could solve this one through DNA. Its time this happens.
chemicalpixie
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We had the same idea! I also did some digging and I don't think the sweater was hers, or at the very least it wasn't made for little girls. I looked at catalogs from the era, and like there were NO sweaters made for children that had such a severe v neck & only 2 that were v necks at all for kids, both of which were on tween models & therefore a little bit older than our girl. Additionally, both of the v neck sweaters for kids had patterns on them, whereas hers was plain yellow. If you look at the far left sweater in this image from a 1981 Sears catalog (it was their fall/winter catalog I believe), it came in yellow & looks very similar to the sweater found on our girl. It seems to me that the sweater she was found in is completely different from the styles of children's sweaters in that era, but it does seem to fit perfectly within the styles of men's sweaters from the era. Because of that, it seems unlikely it was hers — I think it's likely it belonged to the person who killed her. It does seem to have been a mass-produced sweater, and forty some odd years out from the crime it seems a bit hard to track it down, especially when we can't narrow the exact brand down given as the sweater is gone, but the fact that it might have been a men's sweater at all seems as though it could be useful in some capacity.
I'm also interested in the nail polish — I've seen several people say it was unlikely a mother would let their child wear red nail polish that young (something I tend to agree with, my mother didn't let me wear dark colors until I was a bit older), leading them to suspect human trafficking, but the consensus of the color of the nail polish isn't quite clear — several sites say she had two different shades of red, and others say she had red and purple nail polish. Does anyone have an understanding of the colors they actually were? Because the red and purple combination, I think, really strikes me as a bit strange. Those aren't colors paired together often, and it strikes me as something that a child of that age would have chosen herself, which, again, seems odd when one considers the idea that a mother wouldn't let a child wear red polish at that age, or that possibly that whoever gave her the colors was color-blind? People with red-green colorblindness often have issues distinguishing reds & violets as well. If it was two shades of red, it's still a bit odd, but slightly less so than the red/purple colors.
Melt71
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I don't know... I have LOTS of cousins (my dad was one of 10 kids) most of them in the same age group as this little girl in 1983 (I was 12 and older than the rest). We all played with different coloured polishes, it was fun and girly and totally innocent. As the eldest cousin I was generally the one doing the painting of those wriggly little kid fingers. They weren't professional manicures but then I've not seen anything to indicate this UID had professional-style nail paint either. Yes, it could be a sign of something nefarious OR it could have just been child's play.
chemicalpixie
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True! It definitely strikes me as a bit odd, but I grew up far away from my extended family and am only one of three female cousins on my fathers' side. I'm also the eldest of my siblings, and I know that things tend to get a bit more relaxed with subsequent children, so my experience is far from universal. I'm still interested in if there was a consensus on the colors of the polish, though, given that information varies from site to site. It's not much to go on, but there's not much to go on at all here & I think muddying what little information we do have isn't exactly helpful.
TmmEye
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As a former resident of this area, this definitely probably took place in the major part of the city. That area was considering the “ghetto” back then and still is. This area of the city is still dangerous to be in, which doesn’t surprise me why the girl’s body was there. Crime is a major problem in the city, it has one of the largest murder rates in the US...
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Without looking it up, IIRC the child's body was found in a long-abandoned building that was scheduled for demolition in an urban renewal project. The area now is a neighborhood of low-density housing, duplexes I think.
IIRC, the pre-demolition fencing was included in some of the newspaper pictures?
Not sure if this was a residential or industrial area when her remains were located, but the building was abandoned & the area considered blighted.
Disclaimers: I may have confused this with another case
I get a lot of exercise jumping to conclusions
JMHO YMMV LRR
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