Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #51

[GiGi4277]

Does anyone remember which of the three townhouses have NOT been rented back out? It was discussed a few threads back. MOO.

Melani's has not been relisted.

 

[GiGi4277]

Legal question:

I think I remember years ago reading that the state can agree to pay a private attorney as a public defender in certain cases, in a situation where the money is gone but the state doesn't want the defendant to have to start over. Does anyone know if this is correct or am i misremembering? TIA!

 

[Emi]

[URL='https://twitter.com/jlumfox10']Justin Lum [URL='https://twitter.com/jlumfox10']@jlumfox10 [/URL][/URL]12m

It’s official. Notice of hearing filed. Chad Daybell appears in front of Judge Boyce on 8/21 in District Court to face charges of concealment, destruction & alteration of evidence. Also two counts of conspiracy to do those crimes. No murder charges have been filed. #fox10phoenix





Justin Lum @jlumfox10
Steven Boyce was a Bonneville Co. Magistrate Judge before Gov. Brad Little appointed him to be district judge in 7th Judicial District Court in May 2019.

 

[Diddian]

I can say that over here in Tomball TX, that one crime would have been thoroughly investigated. And most any other city in America. I've never seen such incompetent officer work in my life. Expert response would have saved many more lives and helped the families. All in my opinion.

I don't know what level of investigation was continuing on the shooting of CV; however, I do wonder if quite a bit more was going on behind the scenes than we are privy to.

Investigators were clear that they did not believe the statements they were being told by Lori, Alex, and Tylee and that they thought the parties (particularly Lori) were behaving in a curious manner given what they'd just been party to. Perhaps when investigators began looking into Lori's and Alex's past, they started uncovering much of the history that preceded CV's shooting that we have all seen more recently:

• the attack against Joe Ryan,
• the long and contentious custody battle that preceded and followed that attack,
• Lori's detailed claims against her second husband,
• the sexual abuse reports that the childrens' therapists and guardian ad litem found suspicious,
• CV's calls to police about being locked out and Lori's threats against him and those documents he had to support his claims,
• documentation indicating the relationship with Chad - whose own wife later died under suspicious circumstances and following years of Chad predicting it, etc.)

So, every time they turned over a rock and found something slithering beneath it, another rock was just beyond it, so they turned over that, and so on. So, they start wondering if they are dealing with a "black widow," who marries, kills for profit, and moves on. Only, it's not just a black widow; she has fellow conspirators. And still more suspicious events continued to happen:

• the reported celebratory pool party the afternoon of CV's shooting,
• the lies Lori told the staff at JJ's school in Chandler about how CV died and how much JJ knew,
• the lies to Colby and CV's two sons about how CV had died and Lori's refusal to participate in phone or personal contact to answer questions from CV's two sons about CV's death,
• the text to Kay Woodcock, blasting her for receiving the life insurance proceeds,
• the Sept 1 (approx.) move to Rexburg near where Chad lived,
• the attempts to conceal that move (a PO box for mail, renting things under the Ryan name, each occupying different rental units than the one they have a formal rental agreement on),
• Melani's leaving her own marriage in such an odd way and with such little regard for her kids,
• the shooting of BB,
• the quickie marriages of AxC and MBP,
• the association of all involved with a couple of groups that operated subscription internet forums as well as sponsored group meets, speakers, conferences,
• and so on.

So, perhaps LE WAS investigating CV's shooting, but the investigation hadn't ripened into charges because, even while CV was dead and time was passing beyond that event, the "conspiracy" crimes ( more murders and attempted murders, more concealment and hindering of prosecution, raising life insurance limits not long before murders and attempted murders) of those involved in that shooting were continuing to happen and LE was continuing to investigate those as well as to determine whether they were aware of all the players and the roles each played.

I'm pleased to learn that charges will be forthcoming and I hope that the frustratingly long investigation produces the evidence that will secure convictions and worthy sentences for all involved and the parts they played.

 

[Kimmer]

Who is AL?

AL is what the family called Alex Cox

 

[Monger]

Legal question:

I think I remember years ago reading that the state can agree to pay a private attorney as a public defender in certain cases, in a situation where the money is gone but the state doesn't want the defendant to have to start over. Does anyone know if this is correct or am i misremembering? TIA!

It's not exactly the same thing, but I do remember Nurmi quitting as a public defender and going into private practice to try and get off the Jodi Arias case. He was forced to stay on so she wouldn't have to start over and I think he was compensated additional funds to try and make him "whole". It's been a long time, but I remember something about that. Someone else may recall better.

 

[mommacass]

I don't know what level of investigation was continuing on the shooting of CV; however, I do wonder if quite a bit more was going on behind the scenes than we are privy to.

Investigators were clear that they did not believe the statements they were being told by Lori, Alex, and Tylee and that they thought the parties (particularly Lori) were behaving in a curious manner given what they'd just been party to. Perhaps when investigators began looking into Lori's and Alex's past, they started uncovering much of the history that preceded CV's shooting that we have all seen more recently:

• the attack against Joe Ryan,
• the long and contentious custody battle that preceded and followed that attack,
• Lori's detailed claims against her second husband,
• the sexual abuse reports that the childrens' therapists and guardian ad litem found suspicious,
• CV's calls to police about being locked out and Lori's threats against him and those documents he had to support his claims,
• documentation indicating the relationship with Chad - whose own wife later died under suspicious circumstances and following years of Chad predicting it, etc.)

So, every time they turned over a rock and found something slithering beneath it, another rock was just beyond it, so they turned over that, and so on. So, they start wondering if they are dealing with a "black widow," who marries, kills for profit, and moves on. Only, it's not just a black widow; she has fellow conspirators. And still more suspicious events continued to happen:

• the reported celebratory pool party the afternoon of CV's shooting,
• the lies Lori told the staff at JJ's school in Chandler about how CV died and how much JJ knew,
• the lies to both Colby and CV's two sons about how CV had died and Lori's refusal to participate in phone or personal contact to answer questions from CV's two sons about CV's death,
• the text to Kay Woodcock, blasting her for receiving the life insurance proceeds,
• the Sept 1 (approx.) move to Rexburg near where Chad lived,
• the attempts to conceal that move (a PO box for mail, renting things under the Ryan name, each occupying different rental units than the one they have a formal rental agreement on),
• Melani's leaving her own marriage in such an odd way and with such little regard for her kids,
• the shooting of BB,
• the quickie marriages of AxC and MBP,
• and so on.

So, perhaps LE WAS investigating CV's shooting, but the investigation hadn't ripened into charges because, even while CV was dead and time was passing beyond that event, the "conspiracy" crimes ( more murders and attempted murders, more concealment and hindering of prosecution, raising life insurance limits not long before murders and attempted murders) of those involved in that shooting were continuing to happen and LE was continuing to investigate those as well as to determine whether they were aware of all the players and the roles each played.

I'm pleased to learn that charges will be forthcoming and I hope that the frustratingly long investigation produces the evidence that will secure convictions and worthy sentences for all involved and the parts they played.

Great post and thoughts. Thank you.

 

[Ohmeohmy]

Family Court Case Information - Case History
Brandon Boudreaux
Melani Boudreaux

Case Documents
Filing Date Description Docket Date Filing Party
8/7/2020 023 - ME: Order Entered By Court 8/7/2020
8/4/2020 COT - Petition For Contempt - Other 8/4/2020
NOTE: PETITION FOR ENFORCEMENT AND CONTEMPT RE: DECREE/PD 89 REC 27892027

**Just watching... If something is ever filed in the Charles Vallow case in AZ or the Brandon Boudreaux drive by shooting in AZ ..Melanie will be included. Wondering how Ian is feeling about this rushed marriage now.

 

[vislaw]

Doesn't discovery give the defense enough of a look? And has discovery already begun, or not till later?

Discovery in criminal cases is much different than in civil litigation. The prosecution is much more in control of when material will be released in criminal cases as opposed to civil cases where discovery occurs on the initiative of both parties. It is very common for defense counsel to complain that the prosecution is delaying production of evidence or identifying witnesses. Obviously, a defense attorney wants as much information as quickly as possible and a preliminary hearing is valuable to the defense for that reason. If counsel knows of a specific document he or she can request that it be produced and most prosecutors will comply -- eventually. In some instances counsel will ask the judge to force disclosure if the prosecutor seems to be delaying the production. In my experience prosecutors today bend over backwards to turn everything over well before trial commences. Nevertheless, they don't have to reveal their strategy and merely have to turn over the information. My defense lawyer friends tell me they often feel as though the prosecutor dumps volumes of materials without it being suitably organized or identified and there have been times in court when I've seen defense counsel claim they weren't given a piece of evidence only for the prosecutor to counter that it was produced and the defense overlooked it or didn't recognize its significance.

 

[vislaw]

Great post, thanks.

It also brings to mind something I meant to say the other day about the potential upcoming charges in Arizona.

Would the SA prosecutors purposefully want to indict through a grand jury which is secret to ALL, or purposefully do it in open court with a prelim.

Wondering minds will have to wait to see if/when.

Again, thanks for the detailed and thoughtful post.

Yes indeed, the prosecution often chooses to indict through a grand jury -- especially for major crimes such as murder. Witnesses can be called and interrogated without having to involve the defense and it gives the prosecutor a sort of "dry run" to observe how witnesses do on the stand. The defense will eventually get the grand jury transcripts, of course, but not until much later after the case is formally brought.

 

[MadTing]

Who is AL?

Melanie called alex cox AL for short.

 

[DI_Isokawa]

I'm pleased to learn that charges will be forthcoming and I hope that the frustratingly long investigation produces the evidence that will secure convictions and worthy sentences for all involved and the parts they played.

Quote snipped for focus.

I'm not hopeful at all of a conviction. Even a minimally qualified defense attorney would be capable of putting the Chandler PD on trial and ripping them to shreds for their behavior at the crime scene. And then follow up with the inevitable retired FBI agent who goes through LE's behavior, item by item and action by action, and enumerates their errors. Remember, the crime scene was majorly contaminated by the police themselves.

A prosecution argument of "Yes, we did everything wrong the first time around but this time we got it right." is a tough sell. I would not be surprised to learn of significant pushback against indictment by the Chandler PD owing to the embarrassment factor.

The only hope I see is ironclad electronic evidence, like a message from Lori to Alex congratulating him on his marksmanship. Without that, I don't see this as a slam dunk at all.

MOO.

 

[pizzaman12]

Quote snipped for focus.

I'm not hopeful at all of a conviction. Even a minimally qualified defense attorney would be capable of putting the Chandler PD on trial and ripping them to shreds for their behavior at the crime scene. And then follow up with the inevitable retired FBI agent who goes through LE's behavior, item by item and action by action, and enumerates their errors. Remember, the crime scene was majorly contaminated by the police themselves.

A prosecution argument of "Yes, we did everything wrong the first time around but this time we got it right." is a tough sell. I would not be surprised to learn of significant pushback against indictment by the Chandler PD owing to the embarrassment factor.

The only hope I see is ironclad electronic evidence, like a message from Lori to Alex congratulating him on his marksmanship. Without that, I don't see this as a slam dunk at all.

MOO.

That is with the assumption that there isn't digital evidence driving this which could potentially make how the the police department handled the crime scene irrelevant

 

[MadTing]

One thing I hadn't connected until this morning, but which is now definitely bugging me:

Dec 8 - LV & MG have a phone conversation in which LV learns that AxC has been saying more than he ought to about what's happened to JJ.

Dec 12 - (FOUR days later) AxC is found dead.

Somebody in the live chat from the live stream pointed this and was the first time i connected it also, its EXTREMELY interesting and suspicious.

 

[Diddian]

Discovery in criminal cases is much different than in civil litigation. The prosecution is much more in control of when material will be released in criminal cases as opposed to civil cases where discovery occurs on the initiative of both parties. It is very common for defense counsel to complain that the prosecution is delaying production of evidence or identifying witnesses. Obviously, a defense attorney wants as much information as quickly as possible and a preliminary hearing is valuable to the defense for that reason. If counsel knows of a specific document he or she can request that it be produced and most prosecutors will comply -- eventually. In some instances counsel will ask the judge to force disclosure if the prosecutor seems to be delaying the production. In my experience prosecutors today bend over backwards to turn everything over well before trial commences. Nevertheless, they don't have to reveal their strategy and merely have to turn over the information. My defense lawyer friends tell me they often feel as though the prosecutor dumps volumes of materials without it being suitably organized or identified and there have been times in court when I've seen defense counsel claim they weren't given a piece of evidence only for the prosecutor to counter that it was produced and the defense overlooked it or didn't recognize its significance.

I wonder if I might ask a question for @vislaw or for other attorneys posting or reading here:

When does a case go beyond "conspiracy" (involving a few or several parties) and become a potential "RICO" case?

It seems that this case (and those still under investigation) may involve not just specific individuals, but also POSSIBLY some of the organizations those individuals were associated with, occasionally sponsored by (as author-speakers-podcasters) and collected monies from.

The crimes were committed in multiple states, involved multiple crimes (murders; attempted murders; attempted kidnapping; potentially murder of witnesses and co-conspirators; concealment, alteration, and/or destruction of evidence; hindering prosecution; fleeing prosecution, lying to police, etc.), definitely involved multiple individuals, but possibly may have also involved organizations and/or families whose leaders provided cover by repeating to their membership and/or to the public the false claims the specific individuals were using to conceal their crime or by removing potential evidence previously made widely available on the internet (this is presuming that evidence was not handed over to LE when it was removed from public access).

When JM introduced LV in the podcast in which JM, LV, and MG participated, he introduced her by saying some of the audience may not know her, but that "those in the know" know her, implying an organization of sorts behind the scenes that they are both members of. When LV responded to MG in the phone conversation MG recorded on Dec 8, she pointed out that MG will be held accountable for "what she knows," seeming to imply some special knowledge associated with their roles in what I presume is the same organization. In one of the short video spots I viewed of a conference or large meeting which featured Chad as speaker, he said something to the effect of, "and now I'm going to tell you all something that you can take back to your wards and tell those who are mocking you for your participation here," (paraphrasing as I don't remember precise words, but Chad's seemed a hostile and supreme tone toward the ordinary folks and leaders in his audience members' home wards who may be doubters of the "preppers" or "end-times" groups).

Perhaps there is no point in going to the RICO laws when the laws relating to conspiracy are adequate to capture all the individuals specifically aware they were participating in crimes, but would the RICO laws provide LE any investigative tools they don't currently have available to them?

 

[MadTing]

The phone called MG recorded of lori and chad has changed some things for me, I am now 100% convinced that lori truly believed in all of this crazy zombie stuff, She was so passionate and was quoting her scriptures etc she sounded utterly convinced in her beliefs to me. I am however still not convinced that chad truly believes all that stuff, i get strong julie rowe snake oil vibes from chad

 

[Synergizer Bunny]

Who is AL?

Alex.

 

[Grixote]

It seems incredibly weird that there’s so much blame for MG here and almost no blame for the AZ cops.

 

[TheLoadedGoat]

Could Lori Vallow Daybell be working on a plea deal?

Article with opinion as to whether LV could be working a plea deal. IMO doubtful unless they don't have enough solid evidence against her.

I strongly believe a plea deal is on the table. First of all, when the Casey Anthony case started, the world was shocked a mother would not report her toddler missing after a month. We are over that shock. Just speaking of Lori, she claimed they were fine knowing full well they were dead. Then the heinous way they were found leads us to all kinds of horrible conclusions of their last moments. I believe if there was ever a chance for the death penalty, this is it. The only woman on Idaho's death row is a woman who killed her husband and kids by setting their house on fire for insurance money. As horrible as that was, it was not up close and personal. She did not tape them up, burn them, dismember them or whatever may be discussed as a possibility at trial even if not true. Could the actual act of death be at someone else's hands? Sure. But nobody wants to let a mother off for letting that happen. Even after the fact instead of regret, second thoughts, or even remorse, she's in Hawaii with her new husband, not a care in the world. If, in an alternate universe Lori had nothing to do with the death of her kids, she sure has not shown that she is grieving for them. None of the Cox family has chimed in that they talk to Lori daily and she is beside herself with grief. Closing arguments should include this question, "If the death penalty was not for Lori Daybell, who is it for?" JMO

 

[Colorado303]

Thank you SleuthD-o-doubleg for the link to another excellent EIN article.

I apologize in advance for the long rant. All JMO

Please don't get me wrong, as I support our men and women in blue. But I had to bite my tongue after reading in this current (Aug 6, 2020) news article that the Chandler PD are (now) planning to "eventually file charges against LV in connection to the 2019 homicide of her (LVD's) former husband." They key word there is: "eventually".

I was also not surprised to read in the article (even though it's now been over a year since July 2019) that the Chandler PD is "still going through active search warrants and supoenas". The key word there is: "still"

Or that Chandler Police now indicate that a "conspiracy to commit murder" charge is possible". The key word there is: "possible"

After all, back then, who would've been suspicious of a woman who, while being interviewed immediately after the traumatic shooting death of her "then" (not "former") husband, and explaining why there was really nothing she could say that would assuage her neighbors who might've been upset by the shooting - as they had not really gotten to know them yet, having just moved in, brightly quipped: "I'm like, Hi neighbors. Sorry."

Neither was I surprised to read that Chandler PD "still has a ways to go in their investigation", or that a Chandler PD detective had recently told EIN: "This case is a marathon, not a sprint". Roger that. The key phrases there are: "still has a ways to go" and "this case is a marathon".

Maybe the "marathon, not a sprint" phrase was added to the Chandler PD media relations handbook near the end of 2019 when it appears to have first dawned on CPD that LV might actually have LIED to them about what happened that day! No way! And what if all those warnings by CV prior to his death stating: "if I am ever found murdered, Lori and Alex did it" were actually TRUE? What if the shooting hadn't been self defense after all, Mr Hand?

I'm sorry to be so sarcastic, but I think it's warranted. Several CPD investigators on officer cams appeared completely enarmored with (gaga over, really), LV. It was like they had a high school crush on her. They believed every word she said - even her most improbable statements - and apparentjy they refused to even consider the possibility that CV just might have been murdered by a vengeful, evil, lying, (but smiling), cheating, sociopath wife and her all-too-eager-to-please, fake-bump-on-the-head, pit bull of a brother. CV even fore-TOLD them. His lawyer told them. His ex told them. His sister told them. Others could've told them if they'd only been asked. Look at the communication. Come. On.

IMO they should make training videos out of those officer cam tapes: "keep your head, don't let THIS happen!"

Sometimes a race just seems like a marathon because the race actually started six months before you ever heard the gun.

I think that the national news stories about the missing children in Rexburg, the attempted shooting of BB in Gilbert, TD's death (and the later exhumation), the disappearance of LVD and CD, the mysterious marriages, the trips to HI, the new suspicions about JR's death, the charges filed against LVD and CD in Idaho, and the many other incidents and red flags by December finally helped shake the marathon runners from the spell cast upon them by the wicked witch. Before then, I think they were sleeping in poppies.

IMO, no matter whether charges are eventually filed in Chandler or not, there will never be justice for CV and his family. Sadly, I think that time has passed.

Jmo

It’s no secret I think Chandler PD’s “investigation” was deplorable and had they done their job at the time of CV’s death JJ, Tylee and possibly Tammy would all be alive today.

I’m glad to hear they now plan to recommend prosecution but remember they originally recommended there be no prosecution. That tells me our suspicions that key evidence was ignored (gunpowder tests on LV, bullet trajectory analyses, blood spatter, etc) were founded. I hope there are enough pieces of evidence available at this late date to lead to a guilty verdict. If I were the prosecutor assigned to this case I would be absolutely livid at the evidence that should be available but isn’t.