Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #127

[Deleted member 102539]

BG is a walking perversion, an anomaly, a reject of nature, a freak. mOO

.... unfortunately probably with a nice, impressive look from head to toe, smart, successful (outside his evil escapades), with friends and a female partner - won't say: never, but hardly to identify as a "walking perversion, an anomaly, a reject of nature, a freak".
Probably he has a lot of acquaintances, also in higher-up places, who aren't in the least interested in this man being unmasked as a possibly killer. I don't say, they know and are covering the crime/s. Maybe, they don't know (only suspecting him now and then?) and they fGs don't want to know in their own lifetime.
I believe, that's one of the problems here with the Abby/Libby case, and the video and sketch #2 didn't help, unfortunately. IMO all together.
-.-.-
In 2019 I hoped, it would make sense and perhaps would be conducive a bit, using sketch #2 as an avatar. It seems, I could have used just another pic.

 

[news buff]

I just think the take home message is, no DNA or videos can substitute for a task group and good old detective work.

I agree that tips coming from the whole country might not be helpful, because we all like true crime and have unbridled fantasy, but unless we know something, or saw this guy walking down the street, it is all water. This is why I never submitted any tip; none of my ideas puts anyone on MHB. (And I hope most people think logically. For the same reason I never believed in leaf readings or cards or all that jazz. It is not logic.)

What is MHB please?

 

[stattlich1]

What is MHB please?

The bridge, Monon High Bridge.

 

[news buff]

The bridge, Monon High Bridge.

Thank you.

 

[Justice101]

following....

 

[Peppery]

Why would that be of interest to you?

Its not of any interest to me other than to determine what may have motivated BG. Several posts prior to mine discussed prolific SKs who were into necrophilia and questioned if BG might also fit in that category. We know there is a very tight timeline from when the girls were dropped off to the scheduled pickup time, so if he also committed this crime, it paints a very different picture of BG and his motivation to me. I hope there was no SA at any point, but I do believe that was probably his biggest or only motivator. MOO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I’ve pretty much pinged off every theory and speculation tower we’ve had at one time or another with this case. At this moment I think when we finally do get an arrest we will be shocked by the simplicity of it all; motive, preparation(if any), escape route, etc. As far as the killer himself, I think he’s more along the lines of T Bruce(I don’t think he is TB) in that he likes killing people, has been doing it off and on for years while living an outwardly appearing normal life. Anything is possible, but I think these are most likely opportunity murders.
What we really know about the murders is almost zero. I think more information would be helpful, especially since LE keeps asking for the public’s help. At the very least LE should have a press conference to clear up all the muddled things they have said in the past year and a half, most importantly clarify the two sketches once and for all.
Just my thoughts.

 

[Yemelyan]

I don’t want to google it, but can it be determined if intercourse was pre or post death? Especially if it was very close to TOD?

IMO the only answer is it depends on the circumstances.

Spermatozoa degrade at predictable rates inside and on the human body so they can distinguish in most cases a sexual encounter, say, 12 hours to a few days earlier and one that occurs perimortem. If they have internal or external swabs LE knows more than if they have seminal fluid on clothing, for example.

The examiner can look at soft tissue trauma - if it exists; it doesn't always, even for violent encounters - and make some determinations about whether activity occurred perimortem or significantly postmortem.

Sometimes if there are defensive wounds in particular patterns (on upper legs for example), if there's a preponderance of evidence that suggests the encounter was non-consensual, that steers the determination one way or another.

All of this is JMO.

 

[JenniD]

You are thinking along the same lines as I am. A social media connection of some sort with one of the hard to trace apps. This is a logical possibility to me, whether it was Libby or Abby or both posting.

Amateur opinion and speculation

There is a compilation of Liberty’s music videos on YouTube

 

[Charlot123]

Not sure if relevant, but I'm aware of other ways to communicate....

Communicate through Playstation,

How to send text or voice messages on PlayStation Network

Here's a scary title, 'Playing in the dark',

http://arizonajournal.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/10-Ruskin.pdf

I've weighed in here before, and will briefly do so again. I worked in public school with at-risk (FYI, they ALL are at-risk) middle school and high school students for 25 years. I interacted with Families, LE, Drug Task Force, Probation, Social Services, Counseling agencies, Therapists, Gang resource officers, Courts, Parents, Teachers, Elected Officials, you name it.

I guarantee two plays run parallel with one another in teenagers lives. The one they show you. And the one they don't.

Adults do Hamlet.
Kids do Othello.

Skilled Adults can penetrate Othello to some degree, but you better know what you're doing. Kids will take some brutal punishment before revealing truth, if indeed they ever do.

Not sure what A and L had going on, but my spidey sense tells me there was something. They knew something, or were involved in something. And their parents, and families had, and still have, no idea what it was.

If not, then it falls in the SK domain, IMO.

Always MOO here. Always.

You know, maybe they were not doing anything that would even horrify their parents.

I remember the situation from my kid’s life, when he and his friend, both tweens, not directionally challenged, knowing right from wrong, big, were allowed by us, moms, to walk in a local zoo. Assuming nothing would happen.

That it didn’t was our sheer luck, as I now understand.

So maybe the girls were going to meet someone, or maybe they simply wanted to make photos, or something else, it is ultimately not what the girls keep a secret, it is just what these pervs one could meet keep a secret.

Take this poor young woman in Chicago who just walked away from her mom in Midland Meadows. Maybe she was looking for a toilet, I am sorry. Who knows? Or wanted to make a private call. It is not what she wanted that matters. It is who she ran into, poor woman, and what he wanted that ultimately mattered.

I think, there were two girls, and a phone, and a drive to and fro, and a known area. Seems to be safe. Merely that person whom they met was not.

 

[Charlot123]

.... unfortunately probably with a nice, impressive look from head to toe, smart, successful (outside his evil escapades), with friends and a female partner - won't say: never, but hardly to identify as a "walking perversion, an anomaly, a reject of nature, a freak".
Probably he has a lot of acquaintances, also in higher-up places, who aren't in the least interested in this man being unmasked as a possibly killer. I don't say, they know and are covering the crime/s. Maybe, they don't know (only suspecting him now and then?) and they fGs don't want to know in their own lifetime.
I believe, that's one of the problems here with the Abby/Libby case, and the video and sketch #2 didn't help, unfortunately. IMO all together.
-.-.-
In 2019 I hoped, it would make sense and perhaps would be conducive a bit, using sketch #2 as an avatar. It seems, I could have used just another pic.

Friends fall. Or, smarter friends drop these guys like hot coals, and maybe should be the first ones to turn against them, publicly and loudly.

So maybe the fault lies with the people who are afraid to tell the truth to “friends in higher places”? Because when truth gets known, more lives eventually would collapse because of someone’s cowardice?

 

[rosesfromangels]

Friends fall. Or, smarter friends drop these guys like hot coals, and maybe should be the first ones to turn against them, publicly and loudly.

So maybe the fault lies with the people who are afraid to tell the truth to “friends in higher places”? Because when truth gets known, more lives eventually would collapse because of someone’s cowardice?

I hope whoever is following this thread, who is trying to get up the nerve to call LE is compelled to do so after reading your post. To know a vicious butcher is running free amongst other potential victims is *criminal* not to report. Report him NOW before there is another tragedy!

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[KayCherry]

Friends fall. Or, smarter friends drop these guys like hot coals, and maybe should be the first ones to turn against them, publicly and loudly.

So maybe the fault lies with the people who are afraid to tell the truth to “friends in higher places”? Because when truth gets known, more lives eventually would collapse because of someone’s cowardice?

I agree with your post. I feel someone has to recognize that peculiar walk/gait. I have a gut instinct he knew the area well, I wonder if 'any' activities happen at all are in the woods, like do people/possibly homeless/someone in tent in any area of woods at all? In NJ we have this... I also have lived in neighborhood that had a pretty lot of transient type people, renting low income in and around my neighborhood. I wonder about this...

 

[mainemom376]

I’ve pretty much pinged off every theory and speculation tower we’ve had at one time or another with this case. At this moment I think when we finally do get an arrest we will be shocked by the simplicity of it all; motive, preparation(if any), escape route, etc. As far as the killer himself, I think he’s more along the lines of T Bruce(I don’t think he is TB) in that he likes killing people, has been doing it off and on for years while living an outwardly appearing normal life. Anything is possible, but I think these are most likely opportunity murders.
What we really know about the murders is almost zero. I think more information would be helpful, especially since LE keeps asking for the public’s help. At the very least LE should have a press conference to clear up all the muddled things they have said in the past year and a half, most importantly clarify the two sketches once and for all.
Just my thoughts.

Yes, I am really surprised that they have not had another press conference. Certainly can’t hurt at this point, right? JMO

 

[Diddian]

Yes, I am really surprised that they have not had another press conference. Certainly can’t hurt at this point, right? JMO

I know I'd love to hear at least some details about why BOTH sketches were not released in Feb 2017. They were both drawn in the days following the murders based on persons seen by witnesses in the area. So, why did LE opt to prioritize one over the other at the beginning of the investigation? Why not release both and, if either of the men portrayed in those sketches was there but innocent, he might have come forward? WHY the complete turnaround to dismiss the first sketch and to focus the investigation instead on the person portrayed in the second sketch released over two years after it was drawn?

Did LE find the man portrayed in the first sketch released and he had some kind of solid alibi?

Did LE find the man portrayed in the first sketch and he was working there that day with the man portrayed in the second sketch, but it was under coercion or he had no idea the other guy was going to so far as to commit murders?

Was the man portrayed in the first sketch working with LE beginning in April 2019, when the second sketch was released?

Did the witness from whose memory the first sketch was drawn retract her claims to have seen the man portrayed in the first sketch on the trails that day? And if so, why?

ETA: To ask for the people of the community of Delphi and nearby communities to look closely at those in their families, neighborhoods, community, work or school or vendor associations and to turn in a tip about them if they sound like, walk like, have a posture like, or resemble the sketches or the shot from LG's video or the video itself without SOME reasonable explanation about why they were at one time looking for a face that looks like that portrayed in Sketch One, but now are looking for a face that looks like that portrayed in Sketch Two seems a very lot to ask. Under those circumstances, tips about more distant associations would seem more likely than tips about close associations. And perhaps if LE revealed WHY the switch, that explanation itself may point to someone. (Such as if he bullied someone else who had a compromised reputation to participate.)

 

[K.jill]

I am looking for the video loop Bg walking on the bridge. Can anyone post that or a link to a post that shows it?

 

[TheVisual]

I am looking for the video loop Bg walking on the bridge. Can anyone post that or a link to a post that shows it?

It would be on the Indiana State Police site.

 

[K.jill]

Here is a link to the ISP page That shows bg walking on the bridge.
ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation

It looks to me like he steps forward with his left foot and then his right foot comes in and he kind of touches one ankle to the other before stepping forward on the right foot.
Am I explaining that clearly?
I have seen posters speculate that he is turning to walk toward one of the girls but could it be some weird OCD thing with as walk? If so, that would be something a person who knew him would definitely recognize regardless of whatever disguise or extra clothes he could be wearing.
I wondered what was meant when they asked the public to watch his mannerisms. I didn’t see any mannerisms in the very short clip they gave us. And I have thought that anything about his walk can be explained away by the condition of the bridge. But, I watched this clip last night and noticed it looks more like a deliberate sort of clicking his ankles together before he takes a step.

 

[sunshineray]

I’ve pretty much pinged off every theory and speculation tower we’ve had at one time or another with this case. At this moment I think when we finally do get an arrest we will be shocked by the simplicity of it all; motive, preparation(if any), escape route, etc. As far as the killer himself, I think he’s more along the lines of T Bruce(I don’t think he is TB) in that he likes killing people, has been doing it off and on for years while living an outwardly appearing normal life. Anything is possible, but I think these are most likely opportunity murders.
What we really know about the murders is almost zero. I think more information would be helpful, especially since LE keeps asking for the public’s help. At the very least LE should have a press conference to clear up all the muddled things they have said in the past year and a half, most importantly clarify the two sketches once and for all.
Just my thoughts.

Snipped and BBM

I think more information would be helpful, especially since LE keeps asking for the public’s help.

Wasn't the last time that LE offically asked the public for help at the April 2019 press conference?

 

[MistyWaters]

Here is a link to the ISP page That shows bg walking on the bridge.
ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation

It looks to me like he steps forward with his left foot and then his right foot comes in and he kind of touches one ankle to the other before stepping forward on the right foot.
Am I explaining that clearly?
I have seen posters speculate that he is turning to walk toward one of the girls but could it be some weird OCD thing with as walk? If so, that would be something a person who knew him would definitely recognize regardless of whatever disguise or extra clothes he could be wearing.
I wondered what was meant when they asked the public to watch his mannerisms. I didn’t see any mannerisms in the very short clip they gave us. And I have thought that anything about his walk can be explained away by the condition of the bridge. But, I watched this clip last night and noticed it looks more like a deliberate sort of clicking his ankles together before he takes a step.

Watch the tree in the background of the video and you’ll notice he’s not actually walking per say. It’s a very brief left foot/right foot clip looped over and over again. Mannerisms refers to such things as his posture, his hands in his pockets.....all those things often recognizable of a person one knows without seeing their face.