GUILTY UK - Louise Smith, 16, Havant, Hampshire, 8 May 2020 *Arrest*

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I wonder if the defence are going to claim he accidentally killed her in a scuffle (maybe bloodlessly by smothering or similar*) and then some random maniac just happened by and found her and did all the gruesome stuff. Bit of a big coincidence that this maniac was in the same area at the same time, and also doesn’t explain the dna on the stick - the stick has to have been handled by SM to have CJ’s dna transference on it. I really can’t understand how they can be claiming it is manslaughter with the extent of her injuries and desecration.

* I do think it’s possible the killing & the gory stuff were at 2 separate times, but I believe the same party/parties were responsible for both.
 
Last edited:
elliefant said:
I wonder if the defence are going to claim he accidentally killed her in a scuffle (maybe bloodlessly by smothering or similar) and then some random maniac just happened by and found her and did all the gruesome stuff. Bit of a big coincidence that this maniac was in the same area at the same time, and also doesn’t explain the dna on the stick - the stick has to have been handled by SM to have CJ’s dna transference on it. I really can’t understand how they can be claiming it is manslaughter with the extent of her injuries and desecration.
Click to expand...

And presumably said maniac left no DNA of their own!
 
Am not putting this in spoiler as I am not being too specific - but if there was plenty of blood, which the PM indicates, then he must have removed at least his top and trousers prior to the attack - or done a very good clean up job before visiting his mother and sister.
 
Snipped from testimony above

Myself and Shane, with others, would regularly go and camp in Havant Thicket, near the banger racing track and the Bomb Holes.


Any of our locals able to highlight the location of these areas on a map ?

Am wondering if Louise body was found in one of these locations ? And, if it was, then I am also wondering why it was not the first area to be searched, considering that they already had SM as prime suspect.
 
Alyce said:
Snipped from testimony above

Myself and Shane, with others, would regularly go and camp in Havant Thicket, near the banger racing track and the Bomb Holes.


Any of our locals able to highlight the location of these areas on a map ?

Am wondering if Louise body was found in one of these locations ? And, if it was, then I am also wondering why it was not the first area to be searched, considering that they already had SM as prime suspect.
Click to expand...

Maybe here or here? :


Dropped pin

Near Rowlands Castle

Google Maps


Dropped pin

Near Havant

Google Maps

The latter of which is very close to where he emerged from the Thicket
 
I'm starting to think SM was instructed to get rid of L by CJ. None of it is adding up. I think maybe the night before when L was drunk there was some kind of sexual assault and perhaps CJ found out and ordered SM to "deal with it" I would imagine that a young pretty girl in the home was too tempting for SM and CJ felt she was losing her control over him. With regards to the stick, either it was done to hide evidence of rape/ pregnancy or it was done in anger and contempt towards L. If was to hide evidence, I don't know if SM would think to hide evidence if he does indeed have disabilities/low intelligence as mentioned. The injuries are pretty horrific and I find it hard to believe there is so little blood evidence on SM. I wonder if he just killed L and left her there. Then later on when he told CJ she instructed him to go back and burn the body. Did the police check CCTV along that route in the days after to see if he went back and burned the body later? Like what Ian Huntley did to holly & jessica?
 
I think he definitely went back and burnt her body later. I also agree, it likely was Cj's suggestion. According to testimony, he was out * searching * for Louise from 4pm to 8pm and then again from 8pm to 2am. That's a long time if he was just walking the local streets, so I think this is when he went back to the Thicket. And, I know we are told Cj never goes out, but it would not surprise me if she accompanied him
 
14:27DAVID POWELL
Forensic scientist giving evidence
Prosecutor James Newton-Price QC has called Martin Crooks, a forensic scientist, to the witness box to give evidence.

One of his specialities is investigating fire damage.

14:30DAVID POWELL
Entered cordon in thicket
MC tells how he drove down a track on May 21 at Havant Thicket at about 8.10pm on May 21 to carry out his investigations.

He reached a police's outer cordon and was escorted to the scene of the body.

Live updates on Louise Smith murder case from day 6 of trial
 
Alyce said:
I think he definitely went back and burnt her body later. I also agree, it likely was Cj's suggestion. According to testimony, he was out * searching * for Louise from 4pm to 8pm and then again from 8pm to 2am. That's a long time if he was just walking the local streets, so I think this is when he went back to the Thicket. And, I know we are told Cj never goes out, but it would not surprise me if she accompanied him
Click to expand...

I completely agree, this is a definite possibility.

But unless he confesses or they have video of her leaving the apartment how would they able to prove it?
 
14:33DAVID POWELL
Sticks arranged as if for a "bonfire"
He found sticks arranged as if for a "bonfire".

Martin Crooks tells the prosecutor: "One possibility was that the sticks were originally stacked on top of the body for a bonfire in order to aid the combustion process."

Live updates on Louise Smith murder case from day 6 of trial
 
Alyce said:
I think he definitely went back and burnt her body later. I also agree, it likely was Cj's suggestion. According to testimony, he was out * searching * for Louise from 4pm to 8pm and then again from 8pm to 2am. That's a long time if he was just walking the local streets, so I think this is when he went back to the Thicket. And, I know we are told Cj never goes out, but it would not surprise me if she accompanied him
Click to expand...

I'm going to suggest something I'd not thought of before. What if CJ provided SM with the stick? And that's how her DNA is on it? Do they know for definite the stick came from the thicket? It is entirely possible that CJ got the stick from their back garden? Or somewhere closer to home?

Also, I'm not judging people on benefits or disabilities, but I do know someone who has "agoraphobia" and she went on holiday to Africa last year and does leave her house from time to time. She makes out to GP she is agoraphobic to be able to say she is unable to work and claim disability benefit. Could this be a possibility with CJ?
 
14:43DAVID POWELL
Probable that an "accelerant" was used to start fire - scientist
MC says it's "probable" that an accelerant was used to start the fire although he found none at the scene. That may be to be expected given that the body may have been there almost two weeks before it was discovered, he said.

Live updates on Louise Smith murder case from day 6 of trial
 
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