Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #134

[taylorss]

Some great comments here getting into stuff that’s nagged at me. I wondered what BJC as BG could’ve done with those earlobes, so thanks Rosegold68 (love your name too!)

As to the presumed differences in the crimes against the 9-yo and A&L ... based on BJC’s record (of arrests/ convictions but also just existence) he doesn’t nec appear to be so much a sex fiend as a deranged rage-aholic who jumps at the chance to assert power over others & hurt them with indifference to consequences MOO.

In this analysis, his rage-driven attack on a little neighborhood child might’ve gone the way it did because of surrounding circumstances - he had a tiny captive in his home where his sick mind imagined he’d have all the time & secrecy he could want.

If he is also the attacker of A&L, the rage motive could be the same - spotted two young ladies going about their lives indifferent to him (& 10x more loved & content than him on his best day JMO) and acted out against them in the way that his worthless mind deemed most appropriate for self expression given the circumstances. Circumstances: two vics with combined strength much greater than that of a single 9-yo; open public area, not his basement, where any yelling could be heard & bring others; hard limit on time he could spend near his victims if he didn’t want to be spotted, etc. MOO

Since Idk what was inflicted upon A&L, this all could be moot. But if indeed those girls were victims of depraved rage w/o it leading to a sex-focused attack.... that to me doesn’t create inconsistencies with what we know of BJC. All JMO / speculation

 

[Boxer]

MOO The voice and video of BG will play virtually no part in arrest or conviction.
It was to encourage tips and narrow the pool of suspects.
Now,
JBC has to have had the opportunity, and fit the crime evidence.

 

[Yemelyan]

Would it be harder to get a DNA read on a non secretor person?

The problem with a "non-secretor" is not that they aren't secreting DNA. Their cells with intact nuclei will still have DNA that can be explored (cheek epithelial cells and leukocytes in saliva, for one example, will still have all the DNA that is needed to develop a DNA profile). It's just that in non-secretors, the genes that should make the specific proteins that denote their A, B, or AB blood type are not being expressed in body fluids.

Before DNA profiling, a matching blood type between suspect and body fluids at a crime scene was considered strong evidence. If LE was stymied from figuring out the blood type of their suspect (due to non-secretor status of A and B proteins), they were lacking important evidence to prove their case.

But now that investigators look at genomic DNA to identify profiles instead of mere blood type, secretor vs. non-secretor status is no longer significant from a forensic standpoint.

All MOO.

 

[Inthedetails]

If they didn't release the manner of murder (maybe) because the perpetrator would murder someone else differently, then why did they release the sketch? (That just makes me think the sketch is incorrect)

My thinking if the sketch caught the perp, then great!

But if the sketch didn't catch the perp, LE might be able to catch him when he committed a similar crime down the road. They are banking on a perp who not only will strike again, but has particular ways of doing it. If the perp knew LE was on to his m.o. and so was the public, he might change it.

And/or, the perp might reveal details when under question (or when blabbing to someone) that only the perp and LE knows. If everyone knows the details, knowledge of them can't be used as a way to ID the perp.

Of course, that's just my opinion and I'm not LE. I am not particularly concerned that LE hasn't released the info. The details will be used against the perp in court, and the two sketches, in the end, might indeed make some sense.

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

Bolded by me....

Not necessarily. IMO offenders in sexually motivated murders sometimes do not complete the act that leaves copious DNA. For some, this is because it's the act of killing that provides sexual release, not an act of rape. Others may attempt to destroy DNA evidence or might take items of clothing, etc, away with them that bear this evidence. Physical examination for sexual assault does not always reveal conclusive results, but it doesn't mean it didn't occur.

Even in cases where authorities are sure DNA evidence should have been left behind, it can be very difficult, technically speaking, to separate the female DNA from the male DNA in samples taken from victims' bodies. There are methods of amplifying the male DNA so that the genetic profile of the offender can be isolated from the mixed sample but this is not always straightforward.

All MOO.

Bingo.

 

[crussell821]

I'm not sure where "unseasonably warm" came from. It looks like an average day, or maybe slightly warmer than average. I'm sure it is very common to have cold snaps in February. 2/13/17 was not one of those times. But "unseasonably warm?" The low was 23 around dawn, and the high was 45 around 2pm. I know the wind and sun (or lack thereof) can alter how the actual temperature feels, but 45 degrees is 45 degrees, and that was the high temp. Jacket recommended.

Sure, if you're out in the early afternoon, walking at a steady pace, your body will produce a lot of heat. It might not seem too bad walking from the parking lot into cracker barrel. But if you are outside for hours, and not being particularly active, than 45 is pretty cold.

All from 2017:
Feb 6. High 52
Feb 7. High 59
Feb 8. High 34
Feb9. High 21
Feb 10. High 46
Feb 11. High 63
Feb 12.......high 50
Feb 13. High 45
Feb 14.......high 50
Feb 15. High 37
Feb 16. High 46
Feb17 thru feb 24.......all highs in the 60's. (Now THIS is what I would call unseasonably warm)

It looks like the 13th was actually one of the cooler days in this stretch. Sure, I bet it is not uncommon for delphi to have highs in the teens, or even single digits, in February. There just seems to be a misconception (imo) that it was balmy on 2/13/17.

MOO

I lived in the Midwest at the time of these murders, in Chicago, and it was indeed an unseasonably warm day. 45 and sunny is like 85 and hot to a Midwesterner after a cold winter.
MOO

 

[Yemelyan]

If anyone could answer this.

Let me put it this way. If you were LE, would a legally obtained confession from a suspect be one of the strongest, perhaps THE strongest, pieces of evidence you'd want to go into a trial with? Because there could always be issues with the quality of any DNA (through no mistakes on LE's part), or you could have a jury that didn't understand the technical testimony from experts in fingerprints, trace evidence, etc because it wasn't THAT conclusive, but a confession is very impactful, right? And the thing that makes it impactful is that the confession contains information that nobody but the killer could know.

So if LE have a murder and they release to the public that the victim was stabbed four times with a knife, that the killer performed specific post-mortem acts, that DNA was recovered from certain places but that it actually wasn't that usable, and that the killer took jewelry from the victim as he left the scene (all just examples) then what do they have left to measure against a confession to see if it is accurate? A defense attorney will say that the confession was coerced and the killer only was able to come up these details because they had been widely reported by the press.

So to protect the integrity of an active investigation (screening for tips of actual value, interrogating persons of interest to determine any involvement) AND to preserve the integrity of evidence at a future trial (such as a confession), LE will be conservative in what facts are released.

JMO

 

[Inthedetails]

.

If the second sketch is from an eyewitness then that means they witnessed him minus a hat?

JBC has big holes in his ears and it appears he has had expanders for a while pre dating the crime with regards to old photos. I noticed normal ears are drawn and I'm not sure if I'm reading too much into that and shouldn't be. It would not be something you could miss noticing imo.

Snipped

Check out his recent mugshot. I know he has holes in his ears but I don't notice them even spending time looking at a photo close up. It's understandable, imo, that a witness who isn't in his face would also not see them.

Mugshot at the link: James Brian Chadwell: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com

The ears don't rule him out, imo.

 

[Inthedetails]

MOO The voice and video of BG will play virtually no part in arrest or conviction.
It was to encourage tips and narrow the pool of suspects.
Now,
JBC has to have had the opportunity, and fit the crime evidence.

Exactly, and that's what LE is working on now. It will take some time.

imo

 

[Inthedetails]

Some great comments here getting into stuff that’s nagged at me. I wondered what BJC as BG could’ve done with those earlobes, so thanks Rosegold68 (love your name too!)

As to the presumed differences in the crimes against the 9-yo and A&L ... based on BJC’s record (of arrests/ convictions but also just existence) he doesn’t nec appear to be so much a sex fiend as a deranged rage-aholic who jumps at the chance to assert power over others & hurt them with indifference to consequences MOO.

In this analysis, his rage-driven attack on a little neighborhood child might’ve gone the way it did because of surrounding circumstances - he had a tiny captive in his home where his sick mind imagined he’d have all the time & secrecy he could want.

If he is also the attacker of A&L, the rage motive could be the same - spotted two young ladies going about their lives indifferent to him (& 10x more loved & content than him on his best day JMO) and acted out against them in the way that his worthless mind deemed most appropriate for self expression given the circumstances. Circumstances: two vics with combined strength much greater than that of a single 9-yo; open public area, not his basement, where any yelling could be heard & bring others; hard limit on time he could spend near his victims if he didn’t want to be spotted, etc. MOO

Since Idk what was inflicted upon A&L, this all could be moot. But if indeed those girls were victims of depraved rage w/o it leading to a sex-focused attack.... that to me doesn’t create inconsistencies with what we know of BJC. All JMO / speculation

I think you are spot on.

The in-house crime vs. the outdoors crime doesn't seem inconsistent to me. In one case, he saw his victim while he was at home. In the other case, he saw his victims when he was outdoors. In a moment when he is raging for violence, any victim crossing his path is prey, whether he spotted her from a window or on a park path.

And I do think the desire for violence and physically overpowering the victim are the strongest pull. Yes, it's sexual, but the desire is the violent attack. He's not the grooming type of predator.

jmo

 

[Miigo]

I’m curious if LE are still at the home of JBC collecting evidence? Any locals know?

 

[Yemelyan]

ITA. It has been my thought from the beginning that there was no sexual assault. And I can only think of two logical reason as to why. And that would that he could not get physically aroused, which may be the reason as to why they were brutally murdered. Or because he (or she) knew them in some way that the thought of sexually assaulting the girls was repulsive to him (or her). And/or BG is a female, although the likelihood is extremely low, but not out of the question.
mOO
But I’m sure there are many other possible reasons that are unbeknownst to me.

ETA: If it was sexually motivated in some way, perhaps the reason that BG couldn’t “perform” was due to the girls ages/puberty level. But honestly I haven’t a clue. These are just some of my thoughts.
mOO

The conclusions you came to are definitely possibilities. Keep in mind, too, that you can't always apply logic (like you tried to) to the behavior of these offenders. In a lot of sexually motivated murders (especially those of children) the offender did not intend to have a "normal" sexual encounter. Paraphilia may be involved. Think of BTK. He didn't rape his victims but those were sexual assaults. MOO

 

[CrimeDawg123]

.

Snipped

Check out his recent mugshot. I know he has holes in his ears but I don't notice them even spending time looking at a photo close up. It's understandable, imo, that a witness who isn't in his face would also not see them.

Mugshot at the link: James Brian Chadwell: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com

The ears don't rule him out, imo.

I agree. Initially I thought he couldn't be the suspect because of his ear gauges but if he didn't have them in on that day, and a witness was far away, it's certainly possible the witness would not have noticed them. I think Chadwell bears a striking resemblance to the photos and the sketches.

 

[Tinks]

Liquor theft followed by a foot pursuit lands Indiana man in jail

From this we know he’s impulsive, yet thinks of consequences, likes Amaretto and stuffs things in his jacket.

 

[Tealgrove]

I’m curious if LE are still at the home of JBC collecting evidence? Any locals know?

I asked that a couple of days ago and got no answer. Sure love to know the answer to that question.

 

[Miigo]

@Tealgrove for some reason it’s not letting me reply to your post, <modsnip>

 

[Wild Rose]

I agree. Initially I thought he couldn't be the suspect because of his ear gauges but if he didn't have them in on that day, and a witness was far away, it's certainly possible the witness would not have noticed them. I think Chadwell bears a striking resemblance to the photos and the sketches.

Angelo, way back in thread #94, I think it was on pg 29, thought BG had headphones around his neck. That would cover his ears from passerbys, but also draws huge attention to his face. Remembering they said do not pay attention to his cap on the artist sketch. Hardened criminals cover the identifying characteristics like tatoos, ears.

 

[minazoe]

He's a pro. mOO

 

[GeorgiaRai]

I’m leaning towards JBC NOT being BG because his motive is obviously sexual whereas IMO Abby and Libby’s murder was not.
{snipped}

This echoed my thoughts very well, but then I had to wonder.

Reports state that JBC's last victim's clothing was on the floor beside her, so disrobing may have been part of his "process."

I'd always assume Abby was killed first, quickly and fairly easily due to her slight frame, and once Libby realized she had no way of saving Abby, she tried to leave - and was more severely injured for her efforts. In that case, it would seem the girls' deaths had no obvious sexual motive.

But if disrobing was part of BG's fantasy/routine, I wonder if Libby was the first victim - forced to remove her clothing, assaulted, bound, injured - while Abby, under threat, was helpless to stop it. BG may have planned to do the same to Abby next, but by then heard activity/searchers - or simply ran out of time -and had to leave the scene before he could carry it out.

I don't find anything odd in BG's 2nd victim (regardless of which girl it was) not running or screaming if she could see with her own eyes what BG was capable of and what her fate would be if she went against his orders.

JMO.

 

[Alethea]

Is there a press conference this afternoon? If local news reporters are mentioning something, that can be discussed. Any legitimate sources?