NC NC - Asha Degree, 9, Shelby, 14 Feb 2000

[MrsWatson]

This is such a sad case. I think Asha did leave willingly, to meet someone. Is it safe to think that LE has already gone back over and re-interviewed everyone Asha was in contact with, even in a most peripheral way? Everyone associated with every sports team, friends of her cousins, her cousins, aunts, grannie, people from church? I just don't see this little girl who is described as shy and timid leaving with someone she didn't have some sort of contact with.

I wonder if the NKOTH teeshirt could have been a hand-me-down from someone Asha admired, and she wore it as a night shirt? Or it was just comfy?

Like everyone else, I just can't get over two separate drivers saw a little girl on the side of the road in the middle of night in bad weather and just kept going. WTH?? How could you see that and think that was okay?

 

[MissLaura]

This is such a sad case. I think Asha did leave willingly, to meet someone. Is it safe to think that LE has already gone back over and re-interviewed everyone Asha was in contact with, even in a most peripheral way? Everyone associated with every sports team, friends of her cousins, her cousins, aunts, grannie, people from church? I just don't see this little girl who is described as shy and timid leaving with someone she didn't have some sort of contact with.

I wonder if the NKOTH teeshirt could have been a hand-me-down from someone Asha admired, and she wore it as a night shirt? Or it was just comfy?

Like everyone else, I just can't get over two separate drivers saw a little girl on the side of the road in the middle of night in bad weather and just kept going. WTH?? How could you see that and think that was okay?

I thought the first truck driver turned around to go check, but Asha ran into the woods? I believe he reported it on his CB to tell other truck drivers to be on the look out if they were driving by there.

Didn't the 2nd driver think it was a grown woman at first? It's really hard to see at night.

Correct me if I have these details wrong, it's what I recall off the top of my head.

 

[Proud Country Gal]

I thought the first truck driver turned around to go check, but Asha ran into the woods? I believe he reported it on his CB to tell other truck drivers to be on the look out if they were driving by there.

Didn't the 2nd driver think it was a grown woman at first? It's really hard to see at night.

Correct me if I have these details wrong, it's what I recall off the top of my head.

Yes the Sundrop driver turned around more than once to check on her. The road isn't very wide, almost no usable shoulder in most places, and not a whole lot of places to turn around. I have a video of the road I will post on YT when I can get it edited. (Or I will go re-record a video of it when I can while I am up here this week.) I grew up riding and driving that road, it is a nightmare on a dark rainy night!
BTW I believe this is the size of the "Sundrop truck" It's not as large as a big rig and I believe that is why he was able to turn around to check on her.

 

[annpats]

The father's story that he went out in an awful thunderstorm, at night, during a power-cut to an unspecified store (that may not even have been open due to the power lines being out) just seems a bit.....odd.

I don't know about this case, but my head and heart tells me she may not have left willingly.

I wonder if she was acting up a bit, as young children do, and her father took her over to a relative's or friend's house to stay there out of his way for a while.
Or he took her somewhere else, and she ran away from there?

If Asha was scared of dogs, dark and thunder, no way would she have left willingly on this night.

Also, the open-sided barn that it was rumoured she may have stayed in, is almost a mile down a little road, off the main street. No lights. Did she even know where it led to? I don't think she would have even gone down there. It would have been pitch black and there were dogs on the property, which the owners said they didn't hear bark.

Asha did not leave her home willingly at all, or even by herself, IMO. The reasons and cause of her disappearance lie close to home, I think.

MOO.

 

[Angleterre]

The father's story that he went out in an awful thunderstorm, at night, during a power-cut to an unspecified store (that may not even have been open due to the power lines being out) just seems a bit.....odd.

I don't know about this case, but my head and heart tells me she may not have left willingly.

I wonder if she was acting up a bit, as young children do, and her father took her over to a relative's or friend's house to stay there out of his way for a while.
Or he took her somewhere else, and she ran away from there?

If Asha was scared of dogs, dark and thunder, no way would she have left willingly on this night.

Also, the open-sided barn that it was rumoured she may have stayed in, is almost a mile down a little road, off the main street. No lights. Did she even know where it led to? I don't think she would have even gone down there. It would have been pitch black and there were dogs on the property, which the owners said they didn't hear bark.

Asha did not leave her home willingly at all, or even by herself, IMO. The reasons and cause of her disappearance lie close to home, I think.

MOO.

I wasn’t aware of this @annpats
Can you please direct me to this information? Thank you

 

[annpats]

I wasn’t aware of this @annpats
Can you please direct me to this information? Thank you

It's mentioned in some reports, but left out in others. Apparently, Harold went out during the storm to a nearby store get a Valentine's Day present for his wife.
If you do a Google Search you'll find it. It's mentioned on some True Crime websites and also Reddit.

 

[?unknown?]

It's mentioned in some reports, but left out in others. Apparently, Harold went out during the storm to a nearby store get a Valentine's Day present for his wife.
If you do a Google Search you'll find it. It's mentioned on some True Crime websites and also Reddit.

Why is it odd for him to go to the store especially if he was buying some last minute chocolates or whatever for valentines? If there was a power cut he can’t watch TV, he can’t listen to the radio, smart phones weren’t a thing back then, there was no light for him to read a book so why not take a drive and pick his wife up a little something? He’s just come back from work and is probably already dressed and active, not yet ready to go to bed. Also, if he went to a store surely the police would have verified this with the store? He must have told the cops which store he went to and they probably confirmed and his story checked out.

 

[?unknown?]

Also how do we even know it was just constant constant storm and torrential rain the whole night long? Maybe when Harold went out the weather had subsided a bit. Same thing when Asha left the home, how do we know it was battering winds and rain at the exact moment she left? The weather may have eased up for an hour or so during the night

 

[Sherlock1842]

I think she was being groomed by an older boy in the neighborhood, definitely somebody she trusted. I believe she did leave her house willingly but that she wasn’t expecting to be out in the storm, that someone was supposed to pick her up. Maybe they didn’t show up for some reason, or maybe they did show up and she realized she was in danger and escaped? She had a stable home life and would likely have been harder to “groom”, that’s why I believe it was a family friend, maybe even someone from her church, definitely someone she AND her family trusted.

 

[dotr]

I think she was being groomed by an older boy in the neighborhood, definitely somebody she trusted. I believe she did leave her house willingly but that she wasn’t expecting to be out in the storm, that someone was supposed to pick her up. Maybe they didn’t show up for some reason, or maybe they did show up and she realized she was in danger and escaped? She had a stable home life and would likely have been harder to “groom”, that’s why I believe it was a family friend, maybe even someone from her church, definitely someone she AND her family trusted.

Agree that it was likely somebody Asha knew and trusted- maybe that person was discretely walking alongside the highway and Asha was aware of that and so was not afraid to walk "by herself''?

If indeed it was somebody known to Asha, my hope is that she is still alive somewhere.
imo, speculation.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

I agree! She had a family member that lived close by too. I imagined that she left to go there and a older family acquaintance was there at the time. She just had a sleepover over there recently. Maybe they got her to get in the car and she later escaped when he/she parked hence the road sightings? This really is a complicated case. It's the road sightings that get me.

 

[MissLaura]

Also how do we even know it was just constant constant storm and torrential rain the whole night long? Maybe when Harold went out the weather had subsided a bit. Same thing when Asha left the home, how do we know it was battering winds and rain at the exact moment she left? The weather may have eased up for an hour or so during the night

It wasn't. I forget which podcast mentioned this, it might have been The Prosecutors or Criminology, but I believe it was more of a drizzle when Asha was out on the highway. I've never heard it described as constant storm and torrential rain to begin with though.

 

[Backabeyond]

This is such a sad case. I think Asha did leave willingly, to meet someone. Is it safe to think that LE has already gone back over and re-interviewed everyone Asha was in contact with, even in a most peripheral way? Everyone associated with every sports team, friends of her cousins, her cousins, aunts, grannie, people from church? I just don't see this little girl who is described as shy and timid leaving with someone she didn't have some sort of contact with.

I wonder if the NKOTH teeshirt could have been a hand-me-down from someone Asha admired, and she wore it as a night shirt? Or it was just comfy?

Like everyone else, I just can't get over two separate drivers saw a little girl on the side of the road in the middle of night in bad weather and just kept going. WTH?? How could you see that and think that was okay?

It definitely sounds like she left willingly, but then the darkness and thunderstorm seem to negate that possibility. But who knows, maybe she was braver or more motivated than people think. As far as opportunities for contact with outsiders, it seems rather limited and as if she was almost always under supervision. Grooming a child or convincing her to run away would take some serious time. Especially if she had no real problems at home. And if someone did, it makes no sense that she would be made to walk miles in the rain and dark. I'm stuck at a very generic conclusion for the time being. She left on her own for some reason(to perform some task she felt important, go on an adventure, "run away", etc.). And a person from the situational end of the child abuser spectrum happened across her. They are the opportunistic types. They are the ones who are most likely to abuse, kidnap and murder a child that is a total stranger to them. You will often find that people like this commit "one-off" offense and/or its somehow drug/alcohol fueled. These are the people who you hear about getting arrested 30 yrs later for a rape and murder while they were methed out but have never offended on that level before or after. This is kind of where i'm at. I think the offender was driving north out of town to his early morning shift somewhere that way, or going home from a late night shift in town. possibly working or living near or past the area where her bag was found. If it wasn't work related, then I'm guessing an intoxicated(or maybe sober) person making their way home from a party or friends house. I lean towards these two because of the time. There arent too many other reasons for people to be traveling at that time. Of course I could easily be wrong in any part of my assessment.

 

[Backabeyond]

In my last comment it dawned on me to question who would be out driving so early in the morning and for what reason. To me its either someone going to a early morning shift or leaving a late night shift. Or the person was leaving a party or friends house, and at least from my own experience, likely intoxicated. I would like to hear what other likely possibilities i might be missing. I know there are countless random possibilities, but I guess I'm talking more about "normal" reasons, if that makes sense.

 

[PayrollNerd]

In my last comment it dawned on me to question who would be out driving so early in the morning and for what reason. To me its either someone going to a early morning shift or leaving a late night shift. Or the person was leaving a party or friends house, and at least from my own experience, likely intoxicated. I would like to hear what other likely possibilities i might be missing. I know there are countless random possibilities, but I guess I'm talking more about "normal" reasons, if that makes sense.

Newspaper pickup and delivery comes to mind although probably not as common as in past decades.

 

[BethAnn777]

In my last comment it dawned on me to question who would be out driving so early in the morning and for what reason. To me its either someone going to a early morning shift or leaving a late night shift. Or the person was leaving a party or friends house, and at least from my own experience, likely intoxicated. I would like to hear what other likely possibilities i might be missing. I know there are countless random possibilities, but I guess I'm talking more about "normal" reasons, if that makes sense.

I get stuck on this, if this was opportunistic, how did her stuff end up in the shed? An opportunistic abductor who also just happened to know that shed was there or stumbled upon it? If the shed wasn’t involved it would be much easier for me to consider that she was grabbed while walking down the road. Why wouldn’t her abductor have just taken her away in their vehicle or brought her into their home? Since that shed was only a mile approx. from her house, I lean towards that not being the first time she was in that shed. She may have been meeting someone there. When I was a kid my friends and I had a secret “headquarters “ in which we would meet at certain times. No cell phones so all of these things had to be planned ahead of time. I also had a secret friend, another kid, and we would meet up to kiss, etc. We were both 10 and in 5th grade when this was taking place.
I think if she had been meeting other kids there someone would have said so. Which leads me to believe she was meeting an adult man there and this wasn’t the first time. Perhaps she was being groomed and had been meeting with her abductor for weeks/months. Or, she was never on that road or in that shed to begin with. My guess would be a family member, not anyone she lived with, or a family friend, even someone in the peripheral of a friend/family member.

I know there were supposedly eye witnesses, but eye witnesses can be wrong. Flat out wrong, innocently mistaken or purposely deceitful. Think of how many times eye witnesses, sometimes multiple eye witnesses, swear up and down they saw someone who we later find out was already deceased and there was no way they saw the person. They were wrong. Or maybe the girl these eye witnesses saw was the mystery girl in that photo found in the shed, or was it later found in Asha’s backpack, I can’t recall.

 

[Eireboy]

The father's story that he went out in an awful thunderstorm, at night, during a power-cut to an unspecified store (that may not even have been open due to the power lines being out) just seems a bit.....odd.

I don't know about this case, but my head and heart tells me she may not have left willingly.

I wonder if she was acting up a bit, as young children do, and her father took her over to a relative's or friend's house to stay there out of his way for a while.
Or he took her somewhere else, and she ran away from there?

If Asha was scared of dogs, dark and thunder, no way would she have left willingly on this night.

Also, the open-sided barn that it was rumoured she may have stayed in, is almost a mile down a little road, off the main street. No lights. Did she even know where it led to? I don't think she would have even gone down there. It would have been pitch black and there were dogs on the property, which the owners said they didn't hear bark.

Asha did not leave her home willingly at all, or even by herself, IMO. The reasons and cause of her disappearance lie close to home, I think.

MOO.

I totally agree with you

 

[Gloomy Bear]

This case is so sad! I grew up hearing about it and I'm nowhere near!

It is way too coincidental that two separate drivers both spotted a girl (roughly same description) walking along the same highway. If it was only one driver, I would be a lot more skeptical. But what are the chances? I think this gives good support that Asha did leave the house that night.

I'll also say I 100% believe that the FBI has a lot more information - both new and also since the very beginning - that they've never shared with the public. I think they have a much clearer picture than we do about what transpired that night and maybe even a bit afterwards too. Some of the things they put out - like the green vehicle - almost seems like they are not genuinely asking for tips but are instead sending a message to the community that they are getting more confident and closer to the truth. I additionally think the advances in technology from the past 20 years is probably helping the investigation along.

The NKOTB shirt is so very interesting. When I read that, I immediately thought "that was before Asha's time." I'm about the same age as Asha, so I would know! This detail makes me think there is a teen/young adult involved in this somehow, whether they knew exactly what they were doing or not. I tend to lean toward the theories that say Asha was groomed, but I almost think it was like second-hand grooming. I think an adult got a teen or younger adult in Asha's circle (school or maybe church) to gain her trust. I know when I was a 9-year-old girl (which seems like 3 lifetimes ago!), I so desperately wanted to be like the cool teen girls. I admired the high school girls at my church youth group - one of them was the pastor's daughter and she would sneak me into the pastor's office to give me candy. It was a totally innocent thing, but my parents never knew that. I don't think anyone did. So I could see how a relationship could easily form.

The first thing I thought when they said the library book was found but it's not hers, they don't know who checked it out was, "Someone stole it." And re-enforces for me the probability of a school/church/teen connection. You're all right, the book is a little young for Asha...but doesn't it seem like a book that a teenager would think a 9-year-old girl would like?

I'm also not sure that night was a "planned meeting." I wonder if someone told Asha, "If you ever want to come to my house for such-and-such-reason, come any time, day or night, and I'll help you! I'll buy you things! We'll go on adventures!" Or whatever someone would say to a young girl. Maybe this was Asha's night where she felt like she needed to go, for whatever reason. And she acted on this open invitation. This makes more sense to me than planning a middle-of-the-night scenario ahead of time. The highway witnesses say she looked like she knew where she was going so I wonder if they did in fact live in the vicinity. I'm also not too sure about the shed. But I do not believe the backpack was a red herring (at least for now!). For me, when I hear it was wrapped in double trash bags and buried, I assume it is because the person was hoping if it was ever by chance found, it would simply be thought of as garbage and thrown away. Not peeped into. I wonder what made the contractor want to open unearthed trash bags. Maybe it had a distinctive shape.

And finally (phew!) I think it is interesting that the FBI are still considering her alive. I know the local police have, and of course her parents would. But do the FBI usually do this? Did the FBI also have this "still alive" assumption with other cases such as Jacob Wetterling?

Random late night (or early morning, heh) thoughts.

Where are you after all this time, Asha?

 

[justinkjones1993]

One thing I've always found interesting about that green car info....

They say it had rust on the wheel wells. That is awfully specific. Wouldn't it be rather difficult to see that in rainy weather at 3:30 or 4 AM? That indicates to me that they have a very specific individual or individuals in mind who had that vehicle in 2000. I agree with those here who have said the FBI knows a lot more than what has been publicly released.

 

[TristanP]

The father's story that he went out in an awful thunderstorm, at night, during a power-cut to an unspecified store (that may not even have been open due to the power lines being out) just seems a bit.....odd.

I don't know about this case, but my head and heart tells me she may not have left willingly.

I wonder if she was acting up a bit, as young children do, and her father took her over to a relative's or friend's house to stay there out of his way for a while.
Or he took her somewhere else, and she ran away from there?

If Asha was scared of dogs, dark and thunder, no way would she have left willingly on this night.

Also, the open-sided barn that it was rumoured she may have stayed in, is almost a mile down a little road, off the main street. No lights. Did she even know where it led to? I don't think she would have even gone down there. It would have been pitch black and there were dogs on the property, which the owners said they didn't hear bark.

Asha did not leave her home willingly at all, or even by herself, IMO. The reasons and cause of her disappearance lie close to home, I think.

MOO.

I agree. If Asha willingly left her house that night, she was running FROM something.

Her parents got ahead of the game and immediately stated she was an extremely sheltered, shy, meek little girl who never disobeyed. 99% of people believe this wholeheartedly, yet also believe she left her home in the dark, during a thunderstorm, with a packed bag.

If this was reported today…”Nine year old disappears during the night, parents last to see her when she went to bed” what would immediate thoughts be? Certainly not “Oh, my, that little child must have packed a bag and ran away into the night in a thunderstorm!”

I’m just saying.

But her parents are fiercely defended by the majority of people who follow this case, so any possibility besides her leaving voluntarily is rarely discussed and usually dismissed quickly.