Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Tammy Daybell, 49, Sept & Oct 2019 *Arrests* #60

[Boxer]

I've also read somewhere recently that with manipulative patients like her and Jodi Arias, they tend to assign female staff to them so that they aren't as likely to fall prey to sexual wiles.

Agree.
MOO I worry most about staff being susceptible to intoxicating end of times visions and religiosity.

 

[mickey2942]

I've also read somewhere recently that with manipulative patients like her and Jodi Arias, they tend to assign female staff to them so that they aren't as likely to fall prey to sexual wiles.

Actually, female staff are just as easy to fall for their manipulation. These are skilled psychopaths. I know this, because I was manipulated by one, early in my career. They start by pretending to be "helpful", nice, positive, complimentary, and friendly. Really nice, when most court ordered "clients" are rude, and openly nasty to staff.

Step two: once they have been working at being the "teachers pet", they ask for something very minor, such as an extra 5 minutes on a phone call, which seems to be almost nothing. But, there, they got you to "bend" a rule for them.

Step Three: this is when they start to "test" and "push"...what can they get away with now?

It is almost methodical, and once you have been a victim of a manipulative "client", you see it immediately after that.

It happens, usually to new, young staff, especially naive ones.

 

[GoofyJen]

Based upon the court filing today by MM, he stated he had 2 hrs to go visit LVD while he was in Rexburg & St. Anthony today. The only Idaho State Psychiatric hospital located within a 5 hr driving distance is located in Blackfoot. There is one closer to Boise, but MM drove that day & could not have seen her while there. She must be in Blackfoot.

The court filing was made last Tuesday recounting the events of last Monday. LVD wasn't transferred to the mental health facility until last Thursday and is still there according to Vinelink.

 

[SleuthD-o-doubleg]

The court filing was made last Tuesday recounting the events of last Monday. LVD wasn't transferred to the mental health facility until last Thursday and is still there according to Vinelink.

Do you have any ideas to why MM would spend all day at the women’s detention center today? Is it possible LVD is back? Is he possibly working on getting the women’s detention center to get him access at whatever facility she is at (if that’s the case)?

All jmo moo imo

 

[MsJosie]

Do you have any ideas to why MM would spend all day at the women’s detention center today? Is it possible LVD is back? Is he possibly working on getting the women’s detention center to get him access at whatever facility she is at (if that’s the case)?

All jmo moo imo

I think you had a Bingo!

 

[wenwe4]

The court filing was made last Tuesday recounting the events of last Monday. LVD wasn't transferred to the mental health facility until last Thursday and is still there according to Vinelink.

Thank you for this as I did not put the timeline of events together and assumed it was after she was moved.

 

[Colorado303]

From the article

"EastIdahoNews.com filed a public record request asking Boyce to unseal the order to seal, which was granted Friday. The motion to compel and 169 attached pages are still sealed and, at this time, EastIdahoNews.com is not publishing the information to protect the integrity of the case."

Curious when those 169 pages will be released if Boyce granted the request on Friday

Probably not until the trial, if even then. Since the pages were attached to Mean’s motion (requesting discovery?) I think it might be the discovery MM already received from the DA regarding the original charges. To illustrate to the court what he has and hasn’t received.

Since the court hasn’t been breaking land speed records posting documents to the site (and because none our super-sleuths stumbled on the same info before it was sealed) I doubt the material was ever publicly available. I’m wondering if Means himself provided the info to Nate Eaton, possibly w/the hope it would be published and the case tarnished as a result.

 

[Colorado303]

Sorry to be a turd responding to my own post, but this right here is enough for an appeal based on ineffective assistance of counsel. And THAT is something I hope the state addresses.

Prior’s approach addressing discovery timing w/the prosecutors in court last week was cooperative, above board and utterly professional. MM is not only making Prior look good in general, he’s provably endearing Prior to the judges and DA by comparison. Heck, he’s even making me think favorably of Prior and I loathe Chad and hope he fries.

For John Prior, Mark Means is the gift that keeps on giving.

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

Sorry to be a turd responding to my own post, but this right here is enough for an appeal based on ineffective assistance of counsel. And THAT is something I hope the state addresses.

Yes it's too much now, he's shown he doesn't understand how to work in the criminal courts, is vexatious, and I would say the repeated nature of it is becoming harrassment (IMO), and I think they need to preserve fairness for LVD and protect against future appeals by getting him off the case now. He STILL doesn't understand that Tammy's autopsy is not discoverable in the charges against LVD and CD for conspiracy to hide the children's bodies. If they wait until later the new guys are going to have to start over and there will probably be a year's delay at least in getting up to speed with the size of the evidence files.

 

[JolietJake]

If waiting a year and starting all over with LV is neccessary to get MM off the case, I'm all for it. We waited this long and LV's so-called incompetent thing will drag it on anyway, so why not? Besides, if MM sticks around he will continue to play games since that's his MO. I'm not sure who is more incompetent, LV or MM.

 

[GoofyJen]

Do you have any ideas to why MM would spend all day at the women’s detention center today? Is it possible LVD is back? Is he possibly working on getting the women’s detention center to get him access at whatever facility she is at (if that’s the case)?

All jmo moo imo

I think anything is possible with him. I can't begin to imagine what he was doing there all day for weeks at a time when we know that she was there. Based on the lockdown at the facilities and his narrative of last Monday, I could easily see him having trouble accessing LVD and going to the jail to complain/make demands of them. I have a harder time believing that she was able to go through the restoration process over a weekend.
MOO

 

[GoofyJen]

Prior’s approach addressing discovery timing w/the prosecutors in court last week was cooperative, above board and utterly professional. MM is not only making Prior look good in general, he’s provably endearing Prior to the judges and DA by comparison. Heck, he’s even making me think favorably of Prior and I loathe Chad and hope he fries.

For John Prior, Mark Means is the gift that keeps on giving.

JMO

I said the same thing to my hubby. It pained me to say that for just a few minutes, I actually liked Prior.
Moo

 

[kshultz06082]

I said the same thing to my hubby. It pained me to say that for just a few minutes, I actually liked Prior.
Moo

I felt the same... made me question my own sanity. Jmo

 

[CSIDreamer]

I felt the same... made me question my own sanity. Jmo

Lol!

 

[SleuthD-o-doubleg]

I think anything is possible with him. I can't begin to imagine what he was doing there all day for weeks at a time when we know that she was there. Based on the lockdown at the facilities and his narrative of last Monday, I could easily see him having trouble accessing LVD and going to the jail to complain/make demands of them. I have a harder time believing that she was able to go through the restoration process over a weekend.
MOO

Is it possible the facility she was at did an intake and found her competent and sent her back?

All jmo moo imo, only speculating at this point.

 

[MsJosie]

Is it possible the facility she was at did an intake and found her competent and sent her back?

All jmo moo imo, only speculating at this point.

i wonder if she admitted to faking the mental illness and because of that she was sent back to prison.

do you remember the case where the guy/inmate did that. He acted out all through his court hearing. I think it was singing in the court room. When the Judge told him he was going to a mental hospital, the guy/inmate told his lawyer he wanted to plead guilty and admit he was faking and acting. That no way he was going back to a mental hospital!

I wonder if this is what LV did…she realized she would have many restrictions for some time, testing, etc. and decided being in a more restrictive controlled setting then a jail, not getting to see her lawyer for some time, no visitors or calls, she did not want to go through with faking and be in a mental hospital. Just some of my own thoughts and JMOO.

 

[dcfi224]

Is it possible the facility she was at did an intake and found her competent and sent her back?

All jmo moo imo, only speculating at this point.

Bringing forward my post from a previous thread:
—————————————
There is a difference between “capacity” and “competency” and they are often used interchangeably, when they are in fact different (guilty myself).

• Competency (sometimes called legal capacity)
  • A judicial determination of legal status
  • Made by a JUDGE, not a physician
  • Denotes a person’s legal ability or inability
  • Multiple areas of competency may be addressed in legal settings, such as competency to:
    • Stand trial
    • Be executed
    • Be a parent
    • Make a will
    • Sign a contract
    • Make health care decisions
  • Judges make final decisions about competency, sometimes after input from psychiatrists and psychologists, or other physicians.
    • Court opinions about competency should generally be left to psychiatrists with specific training in forensic psychiatry, except for competency to make health care decisions.

• Capacity (sometimes called clinical competency)
  • Assessed by a PHYSICIAN, not a judge
  • A clinical opinion regarding a patient’s decisional abilities to make health care decisions
  • Assessment based primarily on the patient’s capacity to understand an informed consent discussion
  • Elements of informed consent
    • Knowing
      • What the procedure is
      • Risks
      • Benefits
      • Alternatives
    • Voluntary
    • Competent

————————————————
Given this difference, IF she were to already be back at the jail, perhaps the psychiatric facility deemed she had capacity (and maybe she declined services?? JMO) and therefore it is back in a judges hands to rule on the competency issue??

I sat through a few hearings for patients at a psychiatric facility I worked at a while back. These were for people who had been involuntarily committed to the facility for extended periods of time (like 60 or 90 day periods, not just the 72hr holds). The patient had the opportunity to argue why they felt they should be released and then usually the primary member of the treatment team would argue why the patient should stay or if they agreed they didn’t need to be there. The vast majority sided with the Psychiatrist.

 

[SleuthD-o-doubleg]

Bringing forward my post from a previous thread:
—————————————
There is a difference between “capacity” and “competency” and they are often used interchangeably, when they are in fact different (guilty myself).

• Competency (sometimes called legal capacity)
  • A judicial determination of legal status
  • Made by a JUDGE, not a physician
  • Denotes a person’s legal ability or inability
  • Multiple areas of competency may be addressed in legal settings, such as competency to:
    • Stand trial
    • Be executed
    • Be a parent
    • Make a will
    • Sign a contract
    • Make health care decisions
  • Judges make final decisions about competency, sometimes after input from psychiatrists and psychologists, or other physicians.
    • Court opinions about competency should generally be left to psychiatrists with specific training in forensic psychiatry, except for competency to make health care decisions.

• Capacity (sometimes called clinical competency)
  • Assessed by a PHYSICIAN, not a judge
  • A clinical opinion regarding a patient’s decisional abilities to make health care decisions
  • Assessment based primarily on the patient’s capacity to understand an informed consent discussion
  • Elements of informed consent
    • Knowing
      • What the procedure is
      • Risks
      • Benefits
      • Alternatives
    • Voluntary
    • Competent

————————————————
Given this difference, IF she were to already be back at the jail, perhaps the psychiatric facility deemed she had capacity (and maybe she declined services?? JMO) and therefore it is back in a judges hands to rule on the competency issue??

I sat through a few hearings for patients at a psychiatric facility I worked at a while back. These were for people who had been involuntarily committed to the facility for extended periods of time (like 60 or 90 day periods, not just the 72hr holds). The patient had the opportunity to argue why they felt they should be released and then usually the primary member of the treatment team would argue why the patient should stay or if they agreed they didn’t need to be there. The vast majority sided with the Psychiatrist.

Thank you!

 

[GoofyJen]

Is it possible the facility she was at did an intake and found her competent and sent her back?

All jmo moo imo, only speculating at this point.

If I was a gambling lady, I'd say no. The court ordered the initial evaluation on 3/8 and didn't issue a commitment order until 6/8. She then wasn't transferred until 6/24. I highly doubt that an intake assessment, progress report to the court, finding by the director of the facility that she is competent reported to the court, a decision by the judge to return her to jail, arrangements for transfer, and the transfer itself all happened in less than two business days.

JMO

 

[SleuthD-o-doubleg]

If I was a gambling lady, I'd say no. The court ordered the initial evaluation on 3/8 and didn't issue a commitment order until 6/8. She then wasn't transferred until 6/24. I highly doubt that an intake assessment, progress report to the court, finding by the director of the facility that she is competent reported to the court, a decision by the judge to return her to jail, arrangements for transfer, and the transfer itself all happened in less than two business days.

JMO

Thank you! We’ll see what happens Thursday.