Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Tammy Daybell, 49, Sept & Oct 2019 *Arrests* #61

[TheProblemWeAllLiveWith]

Great points about MG. It’s her affect when speaking about things, and her weird circular non-logic that sets off red flags.
One question- in her first public interviews, a while ago, did she speak about knowing TD was supposed to die? That LV told her at least twice that TD would die but it didn’t happen? And she didn’t question it when she did die? That makes her part of the conspiracy, correct?
I realize this comes from statements after the fact, so everything she says has to be filtered with that in mind.
I still think she’s going to be a problem witness for the prosecution. Good thing there’s plenty of paper trails.

 

[Kemug]

The victims, particularly the children, went through so much horror at the hands of the very people who should have loved and protected them the most. Call me un-Christian, but I really hope the murderers will go through just as much, in fact more, horror, in this world and the next.

 

[indicolite22]

After reading the police summary of Alex's interview, Scott Reisch is surprised that Alex was not arrested the same day, because his actions didn't qualify as self-defense. If Scott were a DA, he would prosecute Alex for a 2nd degree murder.

 

[Colorado303]

On the other hand, I like having everything on one thread so we can view it all together. We can have considerable discussions on all the topics you mentioned. As far as latest news, that can all be found on the news and media thread from first page.

I am hoping charges are brought soon for justice in attempted murder of Brandon Boudreaux. That will really open things up and may require another thread but for now, I enjoy having it all in one location.

I do get where you are coming from though.
This case is so convoluted with so many players. I do think LE is still investigating on so many levels.

As I mentioned upthread I saw an interview on YouTube (Cannot link it) with someone from preparing the people who knew the Daybells and MG well. There are satellite groups all over the U.S. That surprised me.
The interviewee said Chad Daybell broke from the larger group to start his own thing, the grading of people from light to dark, etc. and drew people with him, especially women.

BBM

I agree! While each of these cases could generate enough discussion for separate threads they are so thoroughly entangled in many cases my head would hurt trying to determine which thread to post on. Okus in order to avoid reiterating information already posted by another member we’d often have to check multiple threads before posting. I’d much rather only have to to wrestle with a single thread. JMO

 

[DI_Isokawa]

FWIW, I don't think you can pull these cases apart by perp, victim, or timeline without losing track.

 

[Picklepuck]

MOO: So, I was thinking about when BB was shot at and the fact that there was a driver of the jeep and Alex was in the back, or I assume there was a driver. People have speculated about a number of potential people being the driver, i.e. MP, JM, etc. But what about ZP? Could she have been the driver? I have nothing to back this up with, just sharing a random thought I had this morning. Has this been speculated before or discussed at any point? I missed quite a bit of the WB thread chat over the past year or so. JMO, MOO

 

[StrangerThanFiction]

Great points about MG. It’s her affect when speaking about things, and her weird circular non-logic that sets off red flags.

RSBM. It seems to be a common thing amongst those in this case named “Melani/e”, with our without the “E”. Also MM. JMO.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Off topic- your post is beautiful prose.

Back on topic - exactly.

We can have compassion for broken people, possibly so much that we don’t feel as angry towards them as we would to others who have done the same bad actions (or inactions). We can be angry with them, possibly so much that we don’t feel as compassionate towards them compared to others who have gone through the same traumas.

Broken people are responsible for their actions, no matter what happened to them. And we are entitled to our individual cocktails of compassion and anger we feel observing them.

BBM

You're absolutely right. I went through a situation about a week ago and all I could think was "what may or may not have happened to you in some vague event has no real bearing on your passive aggressive behavior today".

 

[montegrl]

New filings in CD's murder case:

• 07/21/2021 Motion for Change of Venue
  
  
• 07/21/2021 Motion
  
  Comment
  for Grand Jury Transcript
  

 

[Tortoise]

New filings in CD's murder case:

• 07/21/2021 Motion for Change of Venue
  
  
• 07/21/2021 Motion
  
  Comment
  for Grand Jury Transcript

I thought that would have been in the discovery. How strange.

 

[887sMtreme]

Snipped for focus

I noticed she said multiple times she was going to stick the core beliefs and reading certain LDS books but immediately goes and finds a man to give her a blessing and he gave her some kind of "reading" (my word) about her situation. She still believes in the dreams and visions as she spoke in depth on her dream.

Remember that to a certain extent, all these things are core practice for LDS members. As I am not a Church member myself, I warn you that I might be off the mark here, but I think we all have to keep that in mind — especially us “outsiders” — as this case progresses. Not all that seems insane is necessarily insane, or even evil. But enough of it is that I hope all the perpetrators and their enablers are prosecuted to the full extent of the law. MOO, obviously.

 

[887sMtreme]

Wow.


Wow.

I am speechless, even though there really was not anything new about the murders of significance that I caught. It did seem to me that Melanie didn’t seem to think Alex was murdered- but I could have interpreted her tone/words wrong, and I don’t think she knows.

I feel like I learned a little more about Melanie G and what she knew and when. Not sure what that has to do with the murders - but it gives some insight into a person who drowned herself in cool-aid.

She believes herself a victim of “groups” that she wanted to have special healing powers. I didn’t read her book, but apparently she had had a very traumatic childhood. I can see her having developed the skill of disconnecting from reality. I can see her being drawn to magical healing.
I can see her being all about herself; nobody else was from the tidbits I learned of her childhood.

I don’t think there is any public knowledge that Melanie G has committed a crime. I don’t think there is any public knowledge that she has any immunity or special deals- not that she would need it if I am correct about her criminal culpability.

I can see why people are really angry with her. I could not believe my ears when she talked about Tylee and JJ. It was - in my opinion- and I am not licensed to diagnose- sociopathic. She seemed to only regret- and only slightly- Alex’s death. And perhaps that was because he validated her as she rose a bit from her fog- agreeing that Chad and Lori shouldn’t have done what they did - to Melanie!- as if she were the most important victim.

There is something really wrong with Melanie. I think if she weren’t so damaged she would not have been sucked into the “groups” that have done so much wrong to her, as if she were the biggest victim. If she were not so damaged... she wouldn’t have chosen the same friends. I don’t agree that she would have had more to offer LE- or could have saved lives. She was a kind of enabler- getting her own needs met with these groups, as she calls them.

I was appalled that she was worried that JuR would “look bad,” not worried that JuR will be horrified when bodies are found.

Arising from her fog, motivated by atypical motivators such as not wanting to “look bad,” she made some angering decisions like telling LE half of the lie she was asked to tell for Chad and Lori. But I don’t see evidence of a crime.

I get the anger at Melanie. I don’t get where people are finding her sharing guilt for the most horrific crimes, given public knowledge. I think she is just attracted to the wrong kind of “healing” and shows how damaged she is by reacting to brutal murders in a very abnormal way. I don’t think she intends to harm others meeting her own needs, but she clearly has a lot of needs, and deserves to have them met. That can be true about a person we are angry with.

MOO only.

Edited to add: I think Melanie is doing the best she can to be helpful now. She seems atypically detached from the horror, but that detachment could be what helped her survive this long. I thank her for her help.

Her own traumatic background could easily have caused her to retreat to disassociation long enough ago for it to have become automatic for her by now. What we receive as a sociopathic lack of empathy might be her way of neutralizing pain. Not that this excuses her choices in all of this.

 

[montegrl]

I thought that would have been in the discovery. How strange.

They may have had audio or video recordings of it in the discovery but if I'm remembering correctly, official transcripts need to be requested separately. I think this came up with a different hearing, maybe the PC hearing and JP requested the transcript of that also. MOO

It was the preliminary hearing: Request for Preliminary Hearing Transcript.pdf (idaho.gov)

 

[887sMtreme]

Exactly.

I’m not here to understand them, nor defend them. I want justice for those who are murdered. Regardless of how others want to justify them, I want to see justice.

Remember their names:
Tylee Ryan
JJ Vallow
Charles Vallow
Tammy Daybell

Joe Ryan-Alex Cox-Stacey Cope, maybe these can be explained. Maybe not. One thing is clear. The two persons in jail are serial killers and killers of children, which is especially heinous.

It is important for us to remember these things. Thank you.

 

[Nikynoo]

I agree with you. The only glossing over I've seen with regard to MG is her own.

And, also that bishop... he did some glossing over to AZ police.

'Ain't nothin' sexy about any of it. jmo

ETA: IIRC when MG learned of Tammy's death she thought "I wonder how they did it?" (per the Eaton interview). Thus, she knew they had done it, just not how... still she went on to lie to LE about JJ.

I'm wondering whether MG meant, how they got T to die (e.g. through prayer or other alledged 'powers' vs poision, suffocation etc)?

 

[Nikynoo]

Great points about MG. It’s her affect when speaking about things, and her weird circular non-logic that sets off red flags.
One question- in her first public interviews, a while ago, did she speak about knowing TD was supposed to die? That LV told her at least twice that TD would die but it didn’t happen? And she didn’t question it when she did die? That makes her part of the conspiracy, correct?
I realize this comes from statements after the fact, so everything she says has to be filtered with that in mind.
I still think she’s going to be a problem witness for the prosecution. Good thing there’s plenty of paper trails.

No, IMO it does not make MG part of the conspiracy. Tammys death was foreseen by Chad (and I also think JR?). I seem to recall that one of the promonitions was that Tammy would die in a car accident. Chad had talked about Tammys early death for years (before even meeting Lori), so, no, I don't think MG would be involved in or even suspicious of Tammys death.

 

[indicolite22]

I'm wondering whether MG meant, how they got T to die (e.g. through prayer or other alledged 'powers' vs poision, suffocation etc)?

Chad also predicted that Tammy would die in a car accident because she had a "mission" to carry out on the other side of the veil. Perhaps it was before she was declared a zombie. After that point she was "helped" to cross to the other side.

 

[Tortoise]

They may have had audio or video recordings of it in the discovery but if I'm remembering correctly, official transcripts need to be requested separately. I think this came up with a different hearing, maybe the PC hearing and JP requested the transcript of that also. MOO

It was the preliminary hearing: Request for Preliminary Hearing Transcript.pdf (idaho.gov)

Thank you montegrl, I just assumed grand jury proceedings wouldn't be videoed or audio recorded and that news media only do that where there is public interest, which wouldn't apply to the GJ.

 

[montegrl]

Thank you montegrl, I just assumed grand jury proceedings wouldn't be videoed or audio recorded and that news media only do that where there is public interest, which wouldn't apply to the GJ.

It is a little more nuanced than I was thinking. So here are the rules about the GJ transcript and recording:

(a) Reporting Grand Jury Proceedings. All proceedings of the grand jury, except deliberations, must be recorded, either stenographically or electronically.
(b) Record of Proceedings. The district judge or the presiding juror must designate someone to report or electronically record all of the proceedings of the grand jury, except its deliberations. That person must be sworn to correctly report all of the proceedings and not to divulge any of the information to any person except on order of the district judge. On taking the oath, the person must be permitted to attend all sessions, except deliberations, of the grand jury. On the conclusion of each matter presented to the grand jury, the court clerk must seal the record of the grand jury proceedings and the record must not be examined by any person or transcribed except on order of the district judge.
(c) Availability of Record of Grand Jury Proceedings. The district judge, by motion, must permit the following persons to listen to the record of the proceedings of the grand jury or to obtain a transcript of the proceedings in the same manner as a transcript of a preliminary hearing:
(1) a prosecuting attorney,
(2) a person charged in an indictment or the attorney for the person charged, or
(3) a person charged with perjury because of the person's testimony before the grand jury.
The district judge may place conditions on the use, dissemination or publication of the record of proceedings of the grand jury, and any violation of any condition by a party granted access to the record will constitute contempt of the order of the district judge. I.C.R. 6.2. Transcript of Grand Jury Proceedings | Supreme Court (idaho.gov)


Here is what is discoverable as it relates to the GJ:

Discovery rules:
(C) the recorded testimony of the defendant before a grand jury that relates to the offense charged. I.C.R. 16. Discovery and Inspection | Supreme Court (idaho.gov)

 

[Ruminations]

Has there been anymore thought to a forum for this case?
I feel its a travesty that each of these murders is not entitled to its own space.
Charles doesn't even appear in the title of this thread.
Alex's death too.
The weddings
The poisons
Joe ryan
Attempt on Brandon
The fringe playing enablers.
The autopsies
A family tree

so so much more we are curious about!


Ill flag a mod.

I think there would be too much duplication- too much flipping around. However, it is a good idea to start individually-focused timelines on the timelines and media area. As a reference.