UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #16

[MrsWatson]

Huh?

DBM=deleted by me

 

[Novosti]

Yep - not messing around, looks like they might fully drain it.

Do we know whetherthe 3 foot hole is somewhere on the site of the previous timber structure / silage pit that Shadwell has determined was built between 2007 and 2011 ?

Police dig up land close to where missing chef Claudia Lawrence was last seen

Update:
This morning, two officers marked off a 700-foot stretch of land near the gravel pits in Sand Hutton, a village only eight miles from Claudia's home in York.

They dug up a single three foot deep hole, while around 40 officers remained in the area searching the ground with sticks.

pond is drained too, there’s pics in the link.

 

[MrsWatson]

For newcomers, here is a link to all the WS lingo

Websleuths Lingo

 

[AerieFaerie]

Ummm, why not?

She had a complicated love life. All sorts of motives there.

The misogynistic and sensationalist way the press framed CL’s romantic life was the issue. Her relationships should of course be a significant interest, but it’s such a thorny subject in light of the press’ presentation. It biased so many minds.

Also, hello all! I lived in York back in 2009, between Heworth and the uni, and my friend lived next door to MS in late 2009-10, so CL’a case has always been close to home.

 

[GwenChristie]

Exactly. This was victim shaming at it’s finest. I have always questioned where this information come from in the first place and it’s relevance - the people involved in her murder perhaps?

I did wonder who told the police that at the time. Those sort of stories can have a negative effect on an investigation. I remember seeing a documentary, it might have been on the Yorkshire ripper, saying how there was less public sympathy for victims who were viewed as “immoral”. It would be interesting to know if it was the later suspects who had started those rumours just to muddy the waters.

 

[Sarahaddison14]

Yep - not messing around, looks like they might fully drain it.

Do we know whetherthe 3 foot hole is somewhere on the site of the previous timber structure / silage pit that Shadwell has determined was built between 2007 and 2011 ?

I honestly haven’t got a clue, there’s no images of the 3 foot hole they’ve dug in the article. To what I can see!

 

[Stormtrooper]

Newbie here. Read a lot (but not all) of the previous posts on this case. Although I don't live in York the case has always intrigued me due to the nature of the disappearance and the vicinity of her house to what must have been a busy road with a pub nearby.

Anyway, I was interested to delve back on some information regarding the last ping of her mobile when it was switched off at 12:10pm on 19th March 2009. The image below (courtesy of The Sunday Times) shows that the phone mast near York Uni had a 9 mile range which extended to Tockwith. However, it's not a 360° radius from the mast it's only 120°. Does anyone know of a more accurate map showing the 120° that the mast covered and does this include the area at the Sand Hutton gravel pits?

 

[tulip182]

Out Foxed

New bloodhounds looking at this case - what’s your thoughts on what happened to CL? Old hands sometimes can’t see the wood for the trees - I’d be interested in your take - 18th or 19th?
One of the four or are police barking up the wrong tree?

I think the night of the 18th. The last message from her phone (that we know about) seemed to be out of character and also containing wrong information. Did she send it hoping someone would realise it was wrong or did someone else send it to try and make sure nobody was overly concerned about her absence - she was tired from long shifts at work - and to buy them time to make a plan.

Also, she started a conversation by text with the friend in Cyprus and never responded to his last message. Given that she started the conversation, would she not have checked her messages and replied the next morning before leaving for work?

It’s odd that there seemed to be quite a few CCTV cameras on shops and private properties that caught her walking towards home on 18th yet nothing at all on the morning of 19th? Even if there were no cameras specifically showing the front door of her house were there any that would have picked her up getting into a car or when she got to the road if she left via the alleyway at the back? Would anyone drive to the back of the house to pick her up or was someone staying with her and parking in the NH which had no working CCTV.
If we are to believe her work colleague she spent the night of 17th with a new boyfriend. Was it just the case that the straighteners were left in her rucksack from that night and she’d leave it by the door to pick up when she left for work the next morning.

I’ve always believed she was taken out of the house via the alleyway and NH carpark and then the house was staged to look like she’d left for work. The thing I’m interested in is the way the it was left. Her mother said that she wouldn’t have worn the slippers which were left by the door and the hair dye seemed to be out of place if she’d just had her hair coloured elsewhere? Were those slippers left there because the others were with Claudia? It would make sense of her belongings such as handbag, charger etc being at home and just her rucksack and chef clothes missing along with the straighteners if she’d had them at work with her that day having stayed a boyfriends house on the 17th.

I don’t think she left for work on 19th. I think that’s when she was taken away from the house before someone went in to clean up. Easy enough to just pick up her rucksack and any other incriminating items and dispose of them. With her not being reported missing until 20th, there’d be plenty of time to dispose of her belongings somewhere completely different to where they left her.

 

[Iknowyouknow]

<modsnip>

Claudia doesn’t strike me as a shy person who didn’t know how attractive she was. What I find strange is where are the rest of her friends (apart from JK and SC)? Maybe I’ve missed them but I’ve never seen anyone else do appeals etc… and one thing I know for certain is she had a huge group of close friends in the NH.

 

[MrsWatson]

Will the search continue over the bank holiday week-end?

 

[Kaykedi]

I think the night of the 18th. The last message from her phone (that we know about) seemed to be out of character and also containing wrong information. Did she send it hoping someone would realise it was wrong or did someone else send it to try and make sure nobody was overly concerned about her absence - she was tired from long shifts at work - and to buy them time to make a plan.

Also, she started a conversation by text with the friend in Cyprus and never responded to his last message. Given that she started the conversation, would she not have checked her messages and replied the next morning before leaving for work?

It’s odd that there seemed to be quite a few CCTV cameras on shops and private properties that caught her walking towards home on 18th yet nothing at all on the morning of 19th? Even if there were no cameras specifically showing the front door of her house were there any that would have picked her up getting into a car or when she got to the road if she left via the alleyway at the back? Would anyone drive to the back of the house to pick her up or was someone staying with her and parking in the NH which had no working CCTV.
If we are to believe her work colleague she spent the night of 17th with a new boyfriend. Was it just the case that the straighteners were left in her rucksack from that night and she’d leave it by the door to pick up when she left for work the next morning.

I’ve always believed she was taken out of the house via the alleyway and NH carpark and then the house was staged to look like she’d left for work. The thing I’m interested in is the way the it was left. Her mother said that she wouldn’t have worn the slippers which were left by the door and the hair dye seemed to be out of place if she’d just had her hair coloured elsewhere? Were those slippers left there because the others were with Claudia? It would make sense of her belongings such as handbag, charger etc being at home and just her rucksack and chef clothes missing along with the straighteners if she’d had them at work with her that day having stayed a boyfriends house on the 17th.

I don’t think she left for work on 19th. I think that’s when she was taken away from the house before someone went in to clean up. Easy enough to just pick up her rucksack and any other incriminating items and dispose of them. With her not being reported missing until 20th, there’d be plenty of time to dispose of her belongings somewhere completely different to where they left her.

I think the night of the 18th. The last message from her phone (that we know about) seemed to be out of character and also containing wrong information. Did she send it hoping someone would realise it was wrong or did someone else send it to try and make sure nobody was overly concerned about her absence - she was tired from long shifts at work - and to buy them time to make a plan.

Also, she started a conversation by text with the friend in Cyprus and never responded to his last message. Given that she started the conversation, would she not have checked her messages and replied the next morning before leaving for work?

It’s odd that there seemed to be quite a few CCTV cameras on shops and private properties that caught her walking towards home on 18th yet nothing at all on the morning of 19th? Even if there were no cameras specifically showing the front door of her house were there any that would have picked her up getting into a car or when she got to the road if she left via the alleyway at the back? Would anyone drive to the back of the house to pick her up or was someone staying with her and parking in the NH which had no working CCTV.
If we are to believe her work colleague she spent the night of 17th with a new boyfriend. Was it just the case that the straighteners were left in her rucksack from that night and she’d leave it by the door to pick up when she left for work the next morning.

I’ve always believed she was taken out of the house via the alleyway and NH carpark and then the house was staged to look like she’d left for work. The thing I’m interested in is the way the it was left. Her mother said that she wouldn’t have worn the slippers which were left by the door and the hair dye seemed to be out of place if she’d just had her hair coloured elsewhere? Were those slippers left there because the others were with Claudia? It would make sense of her belongings such as handbag, charger etc being at home and just her rucksack and chef clothes missing along with the straighteners if she’d had them at work with her that day having stayed a boyfriends house on the 17th.

I don’t think she left for work on 19th. I think that’s when she was taken away from the house before someone went in to clean up. Easy enough to just pick up her rucksack and any other incriminating items and dispose of them. With her not being reported missing until 20th, there’d be plenty of time to dispose of her belongings somewhere completely different to where they left her.

What was said in Claudia's last text?

 

[Grouse]

Newbie here. Read a lot (but not all) of the previous posts on this case. Although I don't live in York the case has always intrigued me due to the nature of the disappearance and the vicinity of her house to what must have been a busy road with a pub nearby.

Anyway, I was interested to delve back on some information regarding the last ping of her mobile when it was switched off at 12:10pm on 19th March 2009. The image below (courtesy of The Sunday Times) shows that the phone mast near York Uni had a 9 mile range which extended to Tockwith. However, it's not a 360° radius from the mast it's only 120°. Does anyone know of a more accurate map showing the 120° that the mast covered and does this include the area at the Sand Hutton gravel pits?

Hi, welcome to the forum.

Not sure without a protractor to hand, but if Tockwith was being quoted as it's central to that 120° sector from the Uni (I don't know if it is) then I think Sand Hutton would probably not not be in the same sector.

 

[tulip182]

It was the one about having to do 12 long days in a row which, as far as I can tell from what I’ve read, was untrue. She also tended to end her messages with an ‘x’ and there wasn’t one.
It might not mean anything but does seem a bit odd to be giving out the wrong info to someone who should know that to be wrong.

 

[vekoma]

Im very interested in seeing the location of this camera is it visible from a Google street walk?

It isn’t.

You go straight up the bridlepath opposite Gravel Pit Farm it’s on the last tree on your right hand side just as you meet the T junction of the gravelled road. It’s a small green square box.

 

[crander]

iKnowyouknow i respectfully hold a different view.
Whether it be her parents, friends , former boyfriends ,or former work colleagues effectively everyone who knew her all say Claudia was initally shy with people and also didnt know or exploit to her advantage that she was very attractive. In fact her mother goes a lot further saying that claudia had very low self esteem and when they went shopping claudia would get many admiring looks from men but never even realised it herself.
It says something about her calm happy friendly manner that former work colleagues and boyfriends happily stayed in touch. I have seen nothing anywhere which says she was ever rude aggressive or confrontational quite the opposite by all accounts she was over often over generous
Her day to day life was similar to millions of people, she was sensible conscientious house proud worked full time including 6am shifts where her father said she would get up at 4am (self discipline trait there!) her spare time was mainly spent with friends primarily at the nags head or with her parents .
I do agree that a disproportionate amount is known about her last 2 years when living in heworth to her life before then. We know the basics of career and love life but aside from a few people she previously worked with as friends not much known or shared at all in Gone book about her life friends hobbies between ages 18-33 moving to york.
The problem is that from the investigation perspective she also had many male friends nothing wrong with that of course but locally she had male friends former work colleagues, many at nags head and in cyprus had got to know many bar owners also primarily men. I dont believe she was leading any kind of double life she was just very popular and spent a lot of time out and about in pubs and abroad.
Definitely a naivety to her but nothing nasty at all based on anything i have read
Kaykedi...i havent got the quote right now but her final text were with her male friend in cyprus about visiting him i recall was along the lines of 'trying to get a cheap hotel but finding it hard everywhere else cheap except cyprus will keep looking' general chat about her visiting thats all nothing of stress or concern as i recall at all

 

[Beckymcpherson91]

Could her straightners have been used as a murder weapon and that's why they are missing i just find it pretty strange she didn't take any money or a bank card but took her straightners with her so that to me means she was planning on going out after her shift or did she always take them to work with her. I really hope the family get the answers they deserve.

 

[Nikynoo]

Newbie here. Read a lot (but not all) of the previous posts on this case. Although I don't live in York the case has always intrigued me due to the nature of the disappearance and the vicinity of her house to what must have been a busy road with a pub nearby.

Anyway, I was interested to delve back on some information regarding the last ping of her mobile when it was switched off at 12:10pm on 19th March 2009. The image below (courtesy of The Sunday Times) shows that the phone mast near York Uni had a 9 mile range which extended to Tockwith. However, it's not a 360° radius from the mast it's only 120°. Does anyone know of a more accurate map showing the 120° that the mast covered and does this include the area at the Sand Hutton gravel pits?

Oh. I didn't realise the sector was that narrow. If you look at the pic you posted it mentions Tockwith Village, which is in the opposite direction of the gravel pits. However, I am not sure whether the ST article is accurate or is just generalising.

Here's a link showing tockwith, york uni and sand hutton - Google Maps

 

[crander]

on her personality her friends also say she was always worried about what people thought about her, and hated to see anyone upset.....to the extent she found it difficult to tell male admirers in pubs to go away - not exactly the cold man eater shamefully portrayed lazy journalism to sell papers

 

[Nikynoo]

Could her straightners have been used as a murder weapon and that's why they are missing i just find it pretty strange she didn't take any money or a bank card but took her straightners with her so that to me means she was planning on going out after her shift or did she always take them to work with her. I really hope the family get the answers they deserve.

Yes, it is a possibility that they are the murder weapon. I don't think she took them to work with her.

 

[crander]

kaykedi....i meant flight rather than hotel - apologies