CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death hiking area, Aug 2021 #3

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FWIW, I looked further into the lightening crouch, and found this NOAA information. The U.S. National Weather Services stopped recommending the crouch in 2008 - it is interesting to read why. It is more about prevention now. The National Weather Service (NWS) stopped recommending the crouch in 2008.
This relates to a direct lightening strike from above as opposed to the ground level strike as differentiated in the attachment of @MaryG12 ‘s post . I don’t know wether it matters or not or if the advice is the same for a direct hit from above or from the ground? I just noticed that the article only alluded to a strike from above
 
Thank you for sharing those temps and for your argument @SpideySense. I’ve thought similarly about the summer in their area and how they must have hiked on other hot days. But we just can’t underestimate the strenuousness of the Savage-Lundy trail here.

I mapped the route up Savage-Lundy using MapMyRun which I’ve always found excellent for its elevation and grade info. The average grade for the climb up Savage-Lundy is 12%. It’s 1,170 feet in just over 1.6 miles to the approximate spot where they were found (give or take a half mile). Bear in mind that the first 0.3 or 0.4 of that is relatively flat, so we’re talking basically a single mile in which they’re climbing almost 1000 feet.

I’ve done ultramarathons in the Marin Headlands, Vermont and other mountainous regions, and 1,170 feet over 1.6 miles is very intense. A climb of 350 feet per mile was considered tough by me in a shorter race, and 800 feet per mile plenty tough in a 50-miler. Add on top of that heat, humidity, exposure and smoke in the air, and, well, heatstroke is seeming more and more likely to me. JMO.

ETA: At the link to the map above, you can see the trail starts to level out a bit in the area they were found. To my mind, I can imagine this is where they started to slow down to gather themselves, having tackled the hardest part of the trail. But here is where the heat could have really started to catch up to them. I’m thinking only of my own experiences racing, where adrenaline gets me up a steep hill, but once I’m flat or going downhill again, I suddenly feel the pain of what I’ve just done, and I feel it most acutely in my elevated heart rate.
 
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Okay, as a newbie I’m going to make a bold move and go out on a limb here. Feel free to throw tomatoes my way :)

It was not the heat, folks. Heatstroke didn’t kill them, full stop. Which means there was no long, horrible suffering, no babies or dogs in agony, no dramatic trailside decisions. You can continue to imagine all kinds of awful things about this poor family’s last hours if you wish, but there’s absolutely no reason or evidence to support those imaginings.

Let’s quickly set aside LE’s apparent lack of focus on heatstroke. Some of you have rightly pointed out how much of a nonissue it seems to be to them, and how irresponsible it is that they are not being more vocal. That should tell you something. LE is in the business of protecting people. When two people died recently a few days apart in Death Valley, LE was calling “suspected heatstroke” shortly after the bodies were recovered and long before autopsy. They’re not doing that here. For good reasons.

Here’s why. You cannot conclude that because it was, say, 105 degrees, the heat killed these people, or even made them uncomfortable. That’s a basic misunderstanding of how our bodies physically change and acclimate to our temperature surroundings. Hot weather is relative, and what feels insufferable to you may feel mild to someone else. Ever wonder how a tourist from Chicago can succumb to heatstroke in less than an hour hiking in Death Valley in 115 degree heat, while the rangers who live there can perform SAR for hours on end in long pants? It’s because the rangers’ bodies are acclimated.

Here’s a good description of the heat acclimating process: Heat Index - Acclimatizing Workers | Occupational Safety and Health Administration

From the above OSHA article:
“ Workers become gradually acclimatized when exposed to hot conditions for several weeks. Physical changes in blood vessels and in sweating occur to dissipate heat more effectively.”

and

“Humans are, to a large extent, capable of adjusting to the heat. Much of this adjustment to heat, under normal circumstances, usually takes about 5 to 7 days, during which time the body will undergo a series of changes that will make continued exposure to heat more endurable.”

This family lived there, and by all accounts spent a lot of time outdoors hiking in the weather. All of them, even the baby, were acclimated. Acclimating doesn’t mean you get used to feeling hot and uncomfortable- it means your body has made physical changes so that you DON’T feel hot and uncomfortable, you can stay cool more efficiently, and you are at not at high risk for heat injury or heatstroke.

Now, if they were like some residents of the California Foothills who spend most of the summer months inside in air-conditioning, that might alter my opinion. But that doesn’t sound like them.

Someone here a few threads back used the temperature readings at El Portal, CA as a good comparison of the conditions in the trail area, and that’s fair. So, here are the daily highs recorded at that station for the entire month before August 15:

7/15 - 99.1
7/16 - 99.3
7/17 - 103.5
7/18 - 103.6
7/19 - 99
7/20 - 102.6
7/21 - 103.3
7/22 - 104.5
7/23 - 102.9
7/24 - 104.9
7/25 - 104.5
7/26 - 99.7
7/27 - 102.7
7/28 - 104.2
7/29 - 105.1
7/30 - 105.1
7/31 - 100.4
8/1 - 103.1
8/2 - 104.0
8/3 - 108.1
8/4 - 107.4
8/5 - 100.0
8/6 - 100.0
8/7 - 100.6
8/8 - 100.8
8/9 - 101.7
8/10 - 102.9
8/11 - 106.0
8/12 - 106.0
8/13 - 105.1
8/14 - 106.3
8/15 - 107.1

Source: Personal Weather Station Dashboard | Weather Underground

The corresponding temperatures at the Jerseydale Station were a few degrees lower, but still high 90s to low 100s.

So, Jon, Ellen, and Miju were like the Death Valley rangers, while most of us would be like the Chicago tourist. Physically, the three of them were different than us. They would feel cooler and be able to keep a normal core temperature for much longer than we would.

Now… throw in the facts that 1) at least 1/3 of their hiking route had them walking consistently alongside a river that had access points along the way, 2) that section of the river was upstream from the algal mats found at Hites Cove, 3) they had at least some water that we know of, and perhaps things like food and empty water bladders we haven’t heard about, and 4) they were all found together on trail.

Can ANYONE find a case of multiple outdoor heatstroke deaths (couples, hikers, etc) where the bodies were found within 200 yards of each other? I can’t.

Okay, commence the tomato throwing, lol.

They were inside in air con at least 5 days of the week, he worked remotely and she went to school remotely. That is different than becoming acclimated. Look at the Olympics in Japan and how young, extremely fit people, who had gone early to attempt to acclimate, were impacted.

Heat was not discussed for a while by LE re: Kreycik either. Those threads are quite informative.

The temps were 109, no way were people only outside for part of weekend days acclimated to that, esp given the full sun exposure and heat radiating up from the canyon. A baby and a dog simply cannot acclimate to that, they cannot discharge heat effectively with fur and particularly in a nylon backpack. There may have been other factors but heat HAS to be one in that situation. It is not seen often because of how unusual it was for anyone to take a 12 month old out in such an environment. No one came upon them for 48 hours because locals of all ages and fitness levels do not hike that trail in August. CA does issue warnings re: heat dangers and dogs on trails.
 
I hope that the toxicology results will finally give us all the answers we've been looking/waiting for. I would think that the dog's tox would be back much sooner than the humans but that the human results would be needed to verify the conclusions. Worse case scenario is that things remain a mystery.
 
FWIW, I looked further into the lightening crouch, and found this NOAA information. The U.S. National Weather Services stopped recommending the crouch in 2008 - it is interesting to read why. It is more about prevention now. The National Weather Service (NWS) stopped recommending the crouch in 2008.
This relates to a direct lightening strike from above as opposed to the ground level strike as differentiated in the attachment of @MaryG12 ‘s post . I don’t know wether it matters or not or if the advice is the same for a direct hit from above or from the ground? I just noticed that the article only alluded to a strike from above
Has anyone pointed out how Stranger Things this situation is?
sorry but I don’t understand what you mean- can you expand at all please?
 
I hope that the toxicology results will finally give us all the answers we've been looking/waiting for. I would think that the dog's tox would be back much sooner than the humans but that the human results would be needed to verify the conclusions. Worse case scenario is that things remain a mystery.

Given that the bodies were out in the sun and heat that may be a big factor. Hopefully anything that may pose a danger to the public can be identified or ruled out. Very sad, this poor family weighs on my mind particularly heavily on the weekends. I so wish they were here to plan more adventures.
 
Just another interesting anecdote about how specific positioning can give clues to cause of death…

When I was a young girl back in the 70’s and 80’s, our family backpacked every summer in the High Sierras (Desolation Wilderness). I remember hearing a detailed story about a solo backpacker who was found around there, dead, laying on his back with his backpack underneath him. But the weird part was, his backpack wasn’t attached to him, it wasn’t strapped around his shoulders. It was more like he’d put it down and was found resting on it.

Just based on his positioning, it was concluded he was most likely killed by lightning. Because way back then, the recommendation for backcountry lightning safety was that you remove your pack and tuck your body into a ball on top of it, holding your knees against your chest. The idea was that the pack might insulate you from the ground and prevent current running through you.

In that poor man’s case, it didn’t work.
 
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Delirium occurs with heat exhaustion and heatstroke. Victims start to behave irrationally because their brain is shutting down. They are typically found someplace they were not expected to be.
 
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Just another interesting anecdote about how specific positioning can give clues to cause of death…

When I was a young girl back in the 70’s and 80’s, our family backpacked every summer in the High Sierras (Desolation Wilderness). I remember hearing a detailed story about a solo backpacker who was found around there, dead, laying on his back with his backpack underneath him. But the weird part was, his backpack wasn’t attached to him, it wasn’t strapped around his shoulders. It was more like he’d put it down and was found resting on it.

Just based on his positioning, it was concluded he was most likely killed by lightning. Because way back then, the recommendation for backcountry lightning safety was that you remove your pack and tuck your body into a ball on top of it, holding your knees against your chest. The idea was that the pack might insulate you from the ground and prevent current running through you.

In that poor man’s case, it didn’t work.
Lightning strike that hit both the adults and killed them during a bone dry, hot California summer? I have always associated lightning with rain or at least high humidity.
 
Delirium occurs with heat exhaustion and heatstroke. Victims start to behave irrationally because their brain is shutting down. They are typically found someplace they were not expected to be.

This point is what makes your lightning argument most convincing to me. But there are two factors that I think might have helped them remain somewhat lucid by heatstroke victim standards: 1) their relatively young ages and 2) their sense of obligation to their helpless daughter and dog.

And lest we forget we have no idea what time they perished. If they stopped to rest once or multiple times on the climb, that would have bought them time, but nothing else. Whether they hiked up slowly or tried to book it, the result would be more or less the same on their bodies, because the temperature was climbing. MOO.
 
Delirium occurs with heat exhaustion and heatstroke. Victims start to behave irrationally because their brain is shutting down. They are typically found someplace they were not expected to be.
HMM...with all respect, you asked for another instance and this seems to be pretty close. Not identical, but you have multiple cases on the same hike, with one being saved so the entire family succumbed. Yes, they were found farther apart by additional 500yds. As far as the Gerrish case ...there really wasn't any other place they could wonder off to. It was a narrow steep trail and they were pretty much confined to it. Also it's difficult to predict what one will do and how they may react once heat stroke commences MOO.
 
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Thank you for sharing those temps and for your argument @SpideySense. I’ve thought similarly about the summer in their area and how they must have hiked on other hot days. But we just can’t underestimate the strenuousness of the Savage-Lundy trail here.

I mapped the route up Savage-Lundy using MapMyRun which I’ve always found excellent for its elevation and grade info. The average grade for the climb up Savage-Lundy is 12%. It’s 1,170 feet in just over 1.6 miles to the approximate spot where they were found (give or take a half mile). Bear in mind that the first 0.3 or 0.4 of that is relatively flat, so we’re talking basically a single mile in which they’re climbing almost 1000 feet.

I’ve done ultramarathons in the Marin Headlands, Vermont and other mountainous regions, and 1,170 feet over 1.6 miles is very intense. A climb of 350 feet per mile was considered tough by me in a shorter race, and 800 feet per mile plenty tough in a 50-miler. Add on top of that heat, humidity, exposure and smoke in the air, and, well, heatstroke is seeming more and more likely to me. JMO.

ETA: At the link to the map above, you can see the trail starts to level out a bit in the area they were found. To my mind, I can imagine this is where they started to slow down to gather themselves, having tackled the hardest part of the trail. But here is where the heat could have really started to catch up to them. I’m thinking only of my own experiences racing, where adrenaline gets me up a steep hill, but once I’m flat or going downhill again, I suddenly feel the pain of what I’ve just done, and I feel it most acutely in my elevated heart rate.
Thank you, @eptichka83, for that insight. Your experience is much greater than mine. And I realize I’ve been coming off as flip or dismissive of that particular trail. No doubt, it is a brutal slog, even for experienced hikers in great shape.

I guess my idea of their day factors that in. I’m assuming (because there’s no reason not to) that they researched the trail and knew the last leg was incredibly rough. But I’m also suggesting that knowing how bad the climb would be, their plan for the 4 or 5 hours immediately preceding it would be to rest and soak and play in the river, even doze in wet clothes in the shade, and to start the journey back well-rested in the late afternoon, only after the switchbacks had time to cool down in the shade provided once the sun passed over that peak.

Given your experience, how likely do you think it would be they would struggle if the assumption was they were starting relatively fresh and well-rested, wet from the river, and the trail had been shaded for some time?

Of course, the decision to start up in the late afternoon, if that’s what they did, set them up for encountering thunderstorms.
 
Thank you, @eptichka83, for that insight. Your experience is much greater than mine. And I realize I’ve been coming off as flip or dismissive of that particular trail. No doubt, it is a brutal slog, even for experienced hikers in great shape.

I guess my idea of their day factors that in. I’m assuming (because there’s no reason not to) that they researched the trail and knew the last leg was incredibly rough. But I’m also suggesting that knowing how bad the climb would be, their plan for the 4 or 5 hours immediately preceding it would be to rest and soak and play in the river, even doze in wet clothes in the shade, and to start the journey back well-rested in the late afternoon, only after the switchbacks had time to cool down in the shade provided once the sun passed over that peak.

Given your experience, how likely do you think it would be they would struggle if the assumption was they were starting relatively fresh and well-rested, wet from the river, and the trail had been shaded for some time?

Of course, the decision to start up in the late afternoon, if that’s what they did, set them up for encountering thunderstorms.
BBM

Which thunderstorms?
 
Lightning strike that hit both the adults and killed them during a bone dry, hot California summer? I have always associated lightning with rain or at least high humidity.
There were recorded lightning strikes within 25 miles of their location that day. I posted a few pages back and attached those strikes’ mapped locations. The problem is that the website I found says it doesn’t pick up all strikes. So, it could be that there were also strikes right around the family that weren’t detected.
 
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Given your experience, how likely do you think it would be they would struggle if the assumption was they were starting relatively fresh and well-rested, wet from the river, and the trail had been shaded for some time?

Of course, the decision to start up in the late afternoon, if that’s what they did, set them up for encountering thunderstorms.

There was almost no shade on this trail due to 2018 fire damage. I haven’t been able to find accurate aerial images and Google’s images are dated 2017-2021, but I would say shade was minimal and the trail was exposed to the south.

I also have to quibble with the 4-5-hour timeframe, only as a mom of an infant myself. I can’t see most parents of a one-year-old being on a trail with a baby for that long, unless conditions forced them to stay down there. They have to nap, snack and drink breastmilk or formula. Each of those things would have to happen at least once in five hours. That’s a lot of work on a hot day. I don’t see them being that ambitious, timeframe-wise. I put their return at around 11am. MOO.
 
Lightning strike that hit both the adults and killed them during a bone dry, hot California summer? I have always associated lightning with rain or at least high humidity.
I lived and hiked in Southern California. I would occasionally see lightning strikes when the sky was blue and not a single cloud in the sky. It's a strange and scary thing, but defiantly a thing. Moo.
 
There were recorded lightning strikes within 25 miles of their location that day. I posted a few pages back and attached those strikes’ mapped locations. The problem is that the website I found says it doesn’t pick up all strikes. So, it could be that there were also strikes right around the family that weren’t detected.
California has many microclimates. 25 miles of their location could have been completely different weather that day. Could have been humid or even thunderstorms in the other location with lightning.
 
This point is what makes your lightning argument most convincing to me. But there are two factors that I think might have helped them remain somewhat lucid by heatstroke victim standards: 1) their relatively young ages and 2) their sense of obligation to their helpless daughter and dog.

And lest we forget we have no idea what time they perished. If they stopped to rest once or multiple times on the climb, that would have bought them time, but nothing else. Whether they hiked up slowly or tried to book it, the result would be more or less the same on their bodies, because the temperature was climbing. MOO.

Heat stroke is different from heat exhaustion, heat stroke is about core temp. No rest period still out in high temps would help it. No sense of obligation changes the impact of a brain overheating and organs shutting down.

How heat can make your body melt down from the inside out (theconversation.com)
 
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