Found Deceased WY - Gabrielle ‘Gabby’ Petito, 22, Grand Teton National Park, 25 Aug 2021 #50

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If BL did go home for that weird storage unit expedition I expect it would’ve given him an opportunity to lay the groundwork with his parents too. “She’s going to get me in trouble / she’s abusive / she’s losing it” and whatever else. Groundwork that might have benefited him when he later returned in her van and with a story explaining why he’s home without her.
 
seastorm said:
What was that quote from her Dad about ordering Dominos to her hotel room and working with her on her website not long before she disappeared?

I wonder if she did take a break at a motel for a while while she decided what was next, then moved on to spread creek. It’s my opinion that she probably didn’t see him as a threat to her safety, just realized that their relationship was disfunctional and not serving her after she is charged with DV. MOO
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I strongly feel that Gabby did fear him at this point. If nothing else, she was terrified of being abandoned all alone with no van and no phone. He, IMHO, had done that to her and it was also to the point of giving her panic attacks. This was my take on the police body cameras. BL had found the one way to control, threaten, and punish her. JMO!
 
CharlestonGal said:
There appears to be a normalization/minimization coming from both sides of the family. CL displayed this clearly in her ABC interview when she said <paraphrased> that it was normal to fight and separate and come back together and that this is what "normal" couples do. She said that in reference to the Moab video. GP's mother minimized that video as well. It is seemingly normal to them for relationships to work that way. Rose, on the other hand, recognized that the up/down, on/off pattern in the relationship, and the controlling and/or jealous behavior of BL was toxic.

It is NOT normal for one person to grab the other's face in the way Gabby described. It is NOT normal for a couple to be hitting each other in the street. But to CL and GP's mother, the video showed nothing more than a normal spat between a young couple. It's sad, to me, that so many people think those are things all normal couples do. If that is the message Gabby was getting from the people around her, she probably normalized it as well, and stayed in that relationship much longer than she should have.

Now, does this level of "normal" relationship dysfunction typically lead to murder? Of course not. A lot of times it stays at this low level of emotional abuse and occasional physical assaults of pushing and slapping. And quite often, it escalates and becomes worse and worse over time and this kind of thing should never be minimized or normalized by anybody.
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But, it's normal to them. And in the US, we don't really get to tell other people what to consider normal - we just have laws. I guess you'd be surprised about what people say about slap fights and this kind of violence - it's very common and to many people who live it, is normal. Of course you can judge, but you won't understand them if you don't realize that their threshold for what's abnormal is different to yours.

Further, I have an entire database of crimes (mostly murders, all kinds) in which the main thing that people who are not residing with the perp will say is, "But he was so nice, we never would have thought this."

I got interested in this topic when I was 17 and the boy who lived behind us (a sweet, quiet boy who was a bit of a loner, but we girls found him sweet, not particularly cool, kind of cute, a little awkward)...got up one morning and shot both of his parents. I suppose it could just be the neighborhood, but 30 years later, a man who was everybody's friend and aged about 60, shot his brother and killed himself. That was in the house across the street from the boy. Both families were "normal."

If there's one thing I've learned from a life of academic study of crime, it's that there's always a story, and that "quiet, nice kid next door" often isn't, if you go and interview siblings (I think CL almost said something about it) or parents...

I doubt Gabby's parents knew he had taken her driver's license, or that they specifically fought over phones, or that he hated "infestations" of people in nature settings, or that he had severe insomnia or "episodes" in which he thought he might be hearing voices or hallucinating (per MSM from Gabby's friend). They may not have read that, even now. I would wager that neither parent was familiar with his social media and, like most parents, probably wouldn't have been able to interpret it without the context of his entire behavior - and seeing his natal family dynamics up close.

But his parents knew him. There's a reason he was still living at home, underemployed, dreaming and painting and drawing cartoons, reading scifi and thrillers, creating music playlists - these are not employable skills. These are occupational therapy, IMO. Gabby joined his team of helpers.

I doubt that Wayne Couzen's fellow employees had a clue about him. People with deep issues find ways to conceal them, especially with help from families. However, their "fixes" are jerry-rigged and highly subject to falling apart under stress. They know how to duck and cover, as we are seeing in this case.

I learned all that from LE. And then I learned it from law professors and psychiatrists. And in hospitals for the criminally insane. And in VA hospitals, where people were in locked wards for running amuck. Often, their comrades and commanding officers were shocked ("Never thought he was the type"). But the psychiatrists and other researchers concluded differently. The clues were there, but a person might need training to see them. And the stressors were obvious too. Even though the patients were hopeful that they could "buck up" and be part of society, they could not.

I think many, many people survive relationships like the one Gabby had with Brian (in terms of the degree of spatting and face smooshing and girl slapping) and did not kill each other. I'm not condoning slapping and pinching, of course (and I would tell my daughters to leave), but in real life, most people look the other way when young people have what they feel are "minor" issues with interpersonal boundaries. Everyone figures they'll learn. But in certain conditions involving deep-seated issues, the behaviors escalate - often suddenly, and I do believe that sometimes we can suss that out before it happens.

The question is - what is different about BL? I refuse to think it's just some random neuron misfiring (unless drugs are involved, which I do not think is true) or that there were really no signs at all - but the signs weren't apparent to young Gabby and probably were more complex than just his behavior toward Gabby. I also think Gabby saw a parent-structured version of Brian. As most people do not feel completely themselves while living with their parents, Brian had not had a chance to figure himself out, out in the big world. The structure of Brian's world had changed a few times, in the two years before this incident, and his previous coping skills (gained to help with his issues) were not sufficient to this next phase of life.

At all.
 
Sassafrass said:
Completely agree it doesn't seem it's an ineffective counsel situation. I'm coming at it from an ethical standpoint. Not merely "could I get disbarred" (or disciplined), though obviously those should be concerns, but rather "what is the ethical thing to do, given that I [he] am a member of the Bar, and not only am I bound by stated rules of professional responsibility (guardrails), but I also believe in the principles that those rules are intended to ensure - namely, fair representation and a special obligation to those who rely on me for my legal counsel"?

Internal and external ethics, if you will.

If I have a potential client come to me asking for advice involving law in which I'm completely inexperienced, and the potential consequences involve literal freedom - I'm bringing in someone equipped to advise and/or handle it.

Even smaller things: ex.: I'm not a t&e lawyer. If a friend wants me to handle their fairly routine estate planning, then sure - I'm competent, and I can read the tax code and research what I need to. But if they bring a complicated, high-dollar situation, I'll give general advice and help - up to the point that I'm not positive my advice is accurate and legally maximizing the benefit to them. And part of my advice to them on the front end is going to be 1) i may want to at least bring in someone with specific experience to review/work with me, and 2) if it gets really complex or legally dicey, I may refer them to someone else entirely.

Clients come to lawyers because they need very specific and important advice. We as attorneys have an obligation to reflect honestly on whether we are competent to provide that to then, whether or not we think we could successfully fight an ethics investigation.

SB may know what he's doing and what is need strictly legally speaking right now is well within his competency. But IF he is texting with reporters, or IF he is telling someone who might, at some point, have interests adverse to or unaligned with those of his clients, that they don't need an attorney - whoo, child.
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I'm not sure how logical it is for a NY RE attorney handling a case out of the Federal District of Wyoming. It seems an experienced criminal attorney reasonably located in or near Wyoming would be a better fit for all involved.
 
Beans said:
Yes, I wondered if this video had sparked the sudden urge to report BL missing but I think it was perhaps only published late on the night they reported him gone or early the following day. Iirc they reported him missing sometime in the evening of the 18th.
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His parents said they were worried about him--I'm thinking he had gone full-blown psychotic.
 
borndem said:
bbm
True, but what have they to offer other than his immediate surrender. That's all they've got, IMO.
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We don't know. Information about his stated plans, exactly what they discussed about GP, any support they gave him, his state of mind, his personal (mental or otherwise) history, any of his belongings that might be relevant (journals, etc.)....
 
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Sassafrass said:
Is it absolutely confirmed (by quotes/statements) that they never even tried to reach out to the Ls until 9/10?

I ask because it seems odd to me that they would have gone from 0 (at 9/1-9/9) to [call Ls/file police report] on 9/10. I'd rather have expectex parents in their situation to have filed or tried to file a report only after some days of trying and failing to connect with the Ls.

In case I'm not clear - I am not criticizing GP'S parents. Just wondering if we know that they didn't try reaching BL/the Ls sooner than 9/10. I think it would be more likely that after x days of not hearing ftkm/not being able to reach GP, their next action would have been to try BL, then the L parebts, then CL, all over the course of that week/10 days before concluding they needed to reach out to LE.
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Both parents have stated that they did not get overly concerned for nearly 2 weeks. Whether either of them tried to text or call Gabby and not get any answer, we do not know , but because of the wilderness travel GP snd BL we’re doing, it did not seem to be an issue for a while that there was no contact.
It was on Sept 10, that they came to the conclusion something was wrong and they contacted the Laundries with no answers which got them to file a missing persons report. Exactly when they reached what point in their concern, we don’t know but when BL’s parents did not get back to them, they knew something was terribly wrong.

IMO, that was when the Laundries realized something horrible happened beyond a simple break up between BL and GP. There is no evidence that they knew GP was just left , that she was dead.
 
Angels Advocate said:
When did Gabby and BL visit SLC ?
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We don't really know beyond the checkout date (24th?), the date pizza was ordered and quite possibly another I have missed. Look at the timeline on Page one of this thread for more complete take. There are a lot of fuzzy time periods.
 
WizardQuest said:
I do suppose that storage units were recently on their minds.

That's quite a thought, and a good possibility. Cheaper than an airbnb or rental.

maybe even temp/humidity controlled.

Who would look in a storage unit for a fugitive?
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He!!, I would -- I mean, it's just sitting there, glaring at them, IMO. It could have BL in it or some evidence that has not been hidden/destroyed yet. Storage bins, huts, trunks, trash cans, etc., no way the FBI ignore that if they were doing a true search for a perpetrator of for crime evidence. But that would require a warrant, wouldn't it? Would the 'rents allow a full search w/o a warrant? Not likely. JMO.
 
Bluebythec said:
I wonder if LE could just check the utility bills like water, for example. What was the usage when BL was away vs recently. So if he indeed was hidden in the house he'd be flushing the toilet, taking showers, more laundry etc and that would show up in the usage.
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Would that even be accurate though? With the parents stuck in the home now virtually 24/7, they're bound to use more water, electricity, etc than if they were living their regular daily lives
 
Barbie619 said:
There is one outstanding feature to me and it's his nose. For a 24 year old his is very large, very distinct. It hooks down at the end, but it's very prominent.

If this witness saw BL from a side view and remembered that nose, plus the elf ears those are distinct. So for him to go and look at his phone and pictures of BL and know it was him, I believe him. Also it was smart of him to call Dog and get the voice of BL, only confirming in this man's mind that he did indeed see BL out at 12:30 am just driving around.
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The voice is what has me believing. You can wear a great disguise, grow hair or shave……but changing your voice is SO much more difficult!
 
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