Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #103

[Lilibet]

Right but in that same argument why is it any of your (not YOU- general you) business what someone’s reasons are for not getting it. I don’t think people are out to be unvaxxed and ruin everyone’s lives by giving everyone Covid. I haven’t vaxxed my kids because I’m still unsure if that’s what I’m comfortable with. I had a bad reaction to the vaccine as did my husband so we aren’t boosting and that made me pause in giving it to my kids. I just need time and there are many other people in my exact position. I’m just saying. It’s not always black and white.

No, I agree that it’s’ not always black and white regarding the vaccine and sometimes masking. But the question we are responding to is regarding those who “flaunted every protocol from the beginning,” not people who may have valid reasons. The people flouting the protocol are “treating with contemptuous disregard” or “engaging in scornful behavior” regarding these scientific standards of healthful behavior during a pandemic. These people are loud and proud of their attitude of “nobody’s going to tell me what to do.”

In your comment you referred to parents sending their kid to school sick, which is definitely flouting rules. I would think it would definitely be your business if they deliberately did something that could get your kid and the whole class sick. Would you “respect” their decision as you claimed in the comment I quoted?

Flout (sorry, but it’s not “flaunt” ) means:
Definition of flout
(Entry 1 of 2)

: to treat with contemptuous disregard : SCORN
flouting the rules

: to indulge in scornful behavior
Definition of FLOUT

Although due to usage, “flaunt” is sometimes viewed as acceptable, but it doesn’t mean the same as “flout.”
The Grammarphobia Blog: Flaunting and flouting

This thread often reminds me of the Twilight Zone episode where one family has a bomb shelter in their basement. I know many of you have had conflicts with friends and family over Covid. Do you think that when (if) this ends, those relationships will be restored, or will there be lingering animosity? Will you be able to go back to normal with people who flaunted every protocol from the beginning?

BBM

ETA: Corrected spelling of Flout

 

[beatrixpotter]

they said they kind of underestimated the risk of travelling- YA Think????

I absolutely do not even believe people like this anymore. Most of the people I see do whatever the hell they want with NO regard for a pandemic. Then when they get sick they act like they just didn't understand the situation. Baloney. They all think they've researched the issue. No one 2 years into this thing is unaware that this is contagious and you get it from other people.

I have seen people over and over online look into vacations and trips with the very specific goal in mind of avoiding having to do anything to prevent contracting or spreading a contagious illness. This is more about people embarrassed getting caught sick or killing people, "Oops! I didn't realize!" Yes, you did. You knew. You were taking the risk and just hoping to come out unscathed because you probably have so far.

 

[Turkeytrot]

This thread often reminds me of the Twilight Zone episode where one family has a bomb shelter in their basement. I know many of you have had conflicts with friends and family over Covid. Do you think that when (if) this ends, those relationships will be restored, or will there be lingering animosity? Will you be able to go back to normal with people who flaunted every protocol from the beginning?

So we haven't necessarily had conflict with anyone over Covid. We've had family members who were disappointed about not being able to visit or us not coming to see them for the holidays. No real animosity - they were just disappointed but also understood and respected our choice.

I also don't really know anyone personally who has completely disregarded protocols. I do know a handful that won't get vaccinated but I respect their decision to make that choice for themselves. I hope they won't regret that decision (as a couple of them are high risk) but it's not my choice to make.

 

[Turkeytrot]

Double post

 

[Jsizzle]

No, I agree that it’s’ not always black and white regarding the vaccine and sometimes masking. But the question we are responding to is regarding those who “flauted every protocol from the beginning,” not people who may have valid reasons. The people flauting the protocol are “treating with contemptuous disregard” or “engaging in scornful behavior” regarding these scientific standards of healthful behavior during a pandemic. These people are loud and proud of their attitude of “nobody’s going to tell me what to do.”

In your comment you referred to parents sending their kid to school sick, which is definitely flauting rules. I would think it would definitely be your business if they deliberately did something that could get your kid and the whole class sick. Would you “respect” their decision as you claimed in the comment I quoted?

Flaut (sorry, but it’s not “flaunt” ) means:
Definition of flout
(Entry 1 of 2)

: to treat with contemptuous disregard : SCORN
flouting the rules

: to indulge in scornful behavior
Definition of FLOUT

Although due to usage, “flaunt” is sometimes viewed as acceptable, but it doesn’t mean the same as “flaut.”
The Grammarphobia Blog: Flaunting and flouting

BBM

I never said parents send their kid to school sick. I actually stated the opposite. Unless that was misinterpreted. I said we have an honor system and so far so good! Parents keep their sick kids home and we haven’t had any Covid outbreaks or anything of that nature. Now if someone did knowingly send their kid to school sick and people found out about it then there would be a storm lol

eta- and no I wouldn’t respect that decision. That’s not what I said. I said I respect decisions whether or not they vax or not or choose to isolate or not (in life in general- not when sick. Obv you need to isolate when sick)

 

[Jsizzle]

So we haven't necessarily had conflict with anyone over Covid. We've had family members who were disappointed about not being able to visit or us not coming to see them for the holidays. No real animosity - they were just disappointed but also understood and respected our choice.

I also don't really know anyone personally who has completely disregarded protocols. I do know a handful that won't get vaccinated but I respect their decision to make that choice for themselves. I hope they won't regret that decision (as a couple of them are high risk) but it's not my choice to make.

My unvaxxed high risk MIL is so lonely right now that she was all but begging to come over today and “sit outside from afar”. My husband had to politely tell her no that we were not out of the woods yet. She’s almost 80. Lives alone. It’s sad but it’s in her best interest. Her response “I’m going to die from loneliness before Covid gets me”. It’s tough making these decisions

 

[beatrixpotter]

My MIL isn’t vaxxed. She has an autoimmune disease that if she gets a vaccine it will rear it’s ugly and painful head. She said she’d rather take her chances with Covid. I’ve seen what her autoimmune has done to her in the past and I’m pretty sure she was on the brink of suicide. So I try not to judge others and why they make the decisions they make. Everyone has their reasoning and it’s not for me to judge. To think these “unvaxxed” people are out to get you is preposterous IMO.

I'm not aware of any autoimmune disease that preclude getting a covid vaccine. I know people who have an autoimmune disease and who believe it precludes them because they in general don't trust pharmaceutical companies, the CDC etc.

<modsnip: no link> I have seen people literally trashing their career because they are terrified of the vaccine in large part because of the enormous scare mongering campaign.

I am in some health groups on FB and you literally can not admit you were vaccinated and had no serious side effects without people jumping down your throat and saying, "Yet!" "That you know of!". It's like a religious belief the vaccines are scary and going to cause horrible damage and it's invariably based not on science but speculation and nonsense.

Also I don't believe unvaxxed people are out to get me. I believe they simply do not care if they do get me. All the ones I know will do NOTHING to protect anyone else that inconveniences them in the slightest. They simply do not believe they are in anyway responsible for the health and well being of others around them. It is someone else's responsibility to only protect themselves and avoid catching covid. And if that means others have to stay home and can't ever participate in the slightest indoor group activity again so be it. They usually believe those people are just over reacting and "scared" for no real reason.

 

[MimosaMornings]

My unvaxxed high risk MIL is so lonely right now that she was all but begging to come over today and “sit outside from afar”. My husband had to politely tell her no that we were not out of the woods yet. She’s almost 80. Lives alone. It’s sad but it’s in her best interest. Her response “I’m going to die from loneliness before Covid gets me”. It’s tough making these decisions

I’m so sorry to hear about your MIL, it is so tough when they pull at your heartstrings like that!

 

[Mo Thuairim]

So far my vaccinated friends and colleagues have all had very mild symptoms when they have caught Covid. Right now, though, a close friend is very ill with it. It reminds me of the wild type as she felt briefly better and was hopeful yesterday before going down like a ton of bricks again today. She also had a bad bout of Covid in early 2020. Her daughter is also very sick but the big concern is her elderly mother, who has been brought to hospital with low oxygen. They had all done everything they could to shield her from Covid, working from home etc. Given the timing I'm assuming these infections are Omicron as it is massively dominant now but these symptoms within one multi-generational family are far from mild. They're all vaccinated and boosted except for the granddaughter, who is double vaccinated. It's a good reminder that no strain can ever be definitively described as mild. It depends how lucky you are.

 

[Turkeytrot]

My unvaxxed high risk MIL is so lonely right now that she was all but begging to come over today and “sit outside from afar”. My husband had to politely tell her no that we were not out of the woods yet. She’s almost 80. Lives alone. It’s sad but it’s in her best interest. Her response “I’m going to die from loneliness before Covid gets me”. It’s tough making these decisions

Ugh

 

[Jsizzle]

I'm not aware of any autoimmune disease that preclude getting a covid vaccine. I know know people who have autoimmune disease who believe it precludes them because they in general don't trust pharmaceutical companies, the CDC etc.

<modsnip: no link> I have seen people literally trashing their career because they are terrified of the vaccine in large part because of the enormous scare mongering campaign.

I am in some health groups on FB and you literally can not admit you were vaccinated and had no serious side effects without people jumping down your throat and saying, "Yet!" "That you know of!". It's like a religious belief the vaccines are scary and going to cause horrible damage and it's invariably based not on science but speculation and nonsense.

Also I don't believe unvaxxed people are out to get me. I believe they simply do not care if they do get me. All the ones I know will do NOTHING to protect anyone else that inconveniences them in the slightest. They simply do not believe they are in anyway responsible for the health and well being of others around them. It is someone else's responsibility to only protect themselves and avoid catching covid. And if that means other have to stay home and can't ever participate in the slightest indoor group activity again so be it. They usually believe those people are just over reacting and "scared" for no real reason.

It’s not just a Covid vaccine. It’s any vaccine. And her doctors have advised her not to get it. So say what you will or downplay her autoimmune but she was almost suicidal before her autoimmune cleared up. We’d rather not go there again.

 

[Jsizzle]

I’m so sorry to hear about your MIL, it is so tough when they pull at your heartstrings like that!

It’s so awful . She hosts every Christmas. She loves having us all together. It’s like the one day a year she gets us all to herself. And we just couldn’t .

 

[Jsizzle]

Ugh

Yeah. It sucks

 

[mickey2942]

This thread often reminds me of the Twilight Zone episode where one family has a bomb shelter in their basement. I know many of you have had conflicts with friends and family over Covid. Do you think that when (if) this ends, those relationships will be restored, or will there be lingering animosity? Will you be able to go back to normal with people who flaunted every protocol from the beginning?

Covid has created more issues at work INMO. People who feel like they are entitled to stay home for two plus years because they have small children who cannot be vaccinated.

I finally said I was done, since I have no children I have gone to work every day, and I was ready to quit. So, the company has made everyone come back to work, most of them, kicking and screaming the entire way. And many of them blame me.

There is a lot of bad blood at work. My company is not the only one with this problem. Most people want to work from home. Great. Work from home. But if you need to be in the office for some reason, don't make every excuse under the sun. Don't expect the same pay as people who do go into the office.

I have even made my boss come in. I was done doing everything for everyone. I called in sick, on purpose for three days...the entire place was in an uproar...people said they had no daycare, transportation, whatever. Someone had to be there. It sent home a huge notice.

 

[Lilibet]

I never said parents send their kid to school sick. I actually stated the opposite. Unless that was misinterpreted. I said we have an honor system and so far so good! Parents keep their sick kids home and we haven’t had any Covid outbreaks or anything of that nature. Now if someone did knowingly send their kid to school sick and people found out about it then there would be a **** storm lol

eta- and no I wouldn’t respect that decision. That’s not what I said. I said I respect decisions whether or not they vax or not or choose to isolate or not (in life in general- not when sick. Obv you need to isolate when sick)

I’m glad respecting decisions doesn’t include parents sending kids to school sick. Thank you for your ETA clarifying what decisions you respect.

 

[beatrixpotter]

It reminds me of this past year while pregnant and very high risk. 44 yo with hypertension, diabetes and low oxygen levels that caused alarms to ring every time I was in the hospital because it was too low. Developing preeclampsia etc. And a woman from my church messaged me to ask if I was still afraid of getting covid. And then to reassure me it was just a mild flu and I didn't need to be worried.

*eyeroll* Thanks for letting me know that YOU aren't worried about me or my health or my unborn child's. That's what that really boils down to.

Said woman is terrified of the covid vaccine herself though. And then her daughter's teacher DIED of covid and she's the same age as her!! She was devastated at her death. BUT not enough to get vaccinated or wear a mask indoors for anyone else. She's watched others die but is still too emotionally invested in being scared of vaccines and not worrying about catching or spreading covid.

I think this sums up where we are for me. Covid has absolutely ruined relationships for me in the past 2 years. You can't tell me that you don't care about my health or others and then expect me to feel the same about you. All "you" have done is told me I can't trust you and that "you" care more about yourself. The relationship can't be the same for me after that.

"I respect your decision to be vaccinated and wear a mask. But the rest of us want to crowd around in you church without wearing masks while you hold your infant daughter who can't wear a mask. It's ok if you make different choices than we do. But we will not make choices to help ensure your safety or your children's. God bless you!"

 

[beatrixpotter]

It wasn’t a friend or family member! Yikes!
Neighbor. Home Health care. Person my cousin didn’t even know but was at a birthday party.

My cousin requires 24/7 healthcare. He's helpless. His nurse of over a decade came to work covid positive and did not inform the family!

 

[Lilibet]

My unvaxxed high risk MIL is so lonely right now that she was all but begging to come over today and “sit outside from afar”. My husband had to politely tell her no that we were not out of the woods yet. She’s almost 80. Lives alone. It’s sad but it’s in her best interest. Her response “I’m going to die from loneliness before Covid gets me”. It’s tough making these decisions

I feel for your MIL, but you’re doing the right thing. I have elderly friends who have mastered Zoom which helps them feel less isolated. But that might not be possible for your MIL.

 

[Jsizzle]

Covid has created more issues at work INMO. People who feel like they are entitled to stay home for two plus years because they have small children who cannot be vaccinated.

I finally said I was done, since I have no children I have gone to work every day, and I was ready to quit. So, the company has made everyone come back to work, most of them, kicking and screaming the entire way. And many of them blame me.

There is a lot of bad blood at work. My company is not the only one with this problem. Most people want to work from home. Great. Work from home. But if you need to be in the office for some reason, don't make every excuse under the sun. Don't expect the same pay as people who do go into the office.

I have even made my boss come in. I was done doing everything for everyone. I called in sick, on purpose for three days...the entire place was in an uproar...people said they had no daycare, transportation, whatever. Someone had to be there. It sent home a huge notice.

Yes! My best friend doesn’t have kids by choice and she’s sooooo over this with people calling out because of their kids. It’s gotten way worse and finally her boss has to put his foot down. She was having to pick up the slack everytime because “you don’t have kids”. She had to cut a vacation short because of this and it was a well deserved vacation with her boyfriend. Super frustrating.

 

[Jsizzle]

I feel for your MIL, but you’re doing the right thing. I have elderly friends who have mastered Zoom which helps them feel less isolated. But that might not be possible for your MIL.

Oh she’s all up on his technology haha. But she’s a touchy feely person. Just wants and needs physical affection. But she did FaceTime my kids earlier and we all chatted. <modsnip: screenshot of text message>