Lies point us to the truth #2

[887sMtreme]

887sMtreme,

Since PR fiber evidence is all wrapped up in the ligature and deposited in/around the paint tote; I would surmise her participation here. Also, since the RN was written in feminine style, with her pad and sharpie (put back in it’s rightful place); I would say she has left evidence here as well.

Seeings how JB was SA on a “regular basis” I lean more towards a man/boy in the family smashing her head. After all this was the whole reason for the cover up.

Both scenarios lead with me. I go back and forth. It’s fascinating, in a macabre and sorrowful way.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

You know,
Lies that shall lead us to the truth. There are so many blatant red flags in the case. If I didn’t understand the American Justice system I could not make sense of this case and the why hasn’t the R’s been held accountable. Somehow they contributed to the SA, torture, murder, abuse of their own child and/or at least covered up for someone else that did. The true bills speak of this. We must remember that they were offered a public apology and exonerated by a government official. I would understand this to also mean: that one covered for the other. Yet, we have a third player (known within the home) that Christmas night. When a crime is committed, the person leaves something behind and takes something away; it can be microscopic in size. Moving the body can contaminate things big time. So as the world turns, so are the days of our lives. The story begins …
''Our daughter arrived home zonked out. JR carries JB upstairs. His dna fibers from that Israel shirt should be on her top as that item was never changed. JB didn’t wake when (PR) removed her boots, pants, vest and dressed her by adding another ponytail (plus the green garland), BR long johns, the size 12 bloomies. So PR dna should be found on all of these items.
The story deviates per the third party. BR stated that JB was awake and walked up the spiral stairs, with PR following behind. Who knows maybe JB was already in trouble at this point? Maybe PR put a diaper on JB and the only existing pair of size 12 bloomies over it? You know the ones she said she put seven pairs into JB panty drawer. Yet the remaining (brand new) 6 pairs simply vanished.
Now let’s shift, think about the pineapple snack found on the dining room table. It apparently belonged to the third party. His fingerprints were found on it. I wonder about that fruit cocktail JB had? Where is that evidence linking? The pineapple matched down to the rind in their fridge (found in JB intestine - postmortem) so if they discovered that then FBI/BPD crime scene, should have also retrieved their trash and checked the dishwasher? There was also a fruit cocktail with this pineapple. Where does the evidence point us. JB did consume BR pineapple. BR said she was awake when they got home. We know by watching BR via the Dr. Bernard interview that he was a germaphobe and self absorbed boy so had JB taken a piece with her fingers he could have lost his cool. Logic tells us that if JB was so zonked out, she didn’t wake; but then a few minutes later she does and consumes the pineapple? I believe the timeline here is a hour and a half after consumption. Arrival home and the crime itself happened rather quickly.
But, the real question is what happened that night that led to the coverup via SA?
Was JB fed up and threatened to tell on her abuser/abusers? Was the SA a perversion of her fathers. Or, maybe corporal punishment by her mother. Or, a game gone bad at the hand of her brother/brothers? TBC …

 

[Rain on my Parade]

Here is the Bode report of on long johns:
https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...28/1481227134523/SCAN_20161102_114900559.jpeg
https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...481227229078/SCAN_20161102_114900559_001.jpeg

Looks like BR and PR and JB?

 

[proust20]

Aristocracy is not determined by wealth but by historic bloodlines. Personally, I've never seen PR as a fashionista - In NYC she visited Bloomingdale's not Bergdorf's. Her fibers were synthetic not cashmere.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

SA
Wikipedia has this to say … they mention Jonbenet

Sexualization in child beauty pageants - Wikipedia

 

[UKGuy]

Aristocracy is not determined by wealth but by historic bloodlines. Personally, I've never seen PR as a fashionista - In NYC she visited Bloomingdale's not Bergdorf's. Her fibers were synthetic not cashmere.

proust20,
What about Egyptian Pharoes? Brothers married sisters to keep the family on the throne, some think Tutenkamun died from a genetically inherited illness.

Nothing like a bloodline theme to move the swingometer. Consider the books: The Da Vinci Code, or Bloodline of the Holy Grail: The Hidden Lineage of Jesus Revealed, any of the Royal Houses of europe, all claim direct descent and blue blood.

Aristos is from greek simply denoting the best nothing more.

Many people buy into the English aristocracy by purchasing titles and estates.

Personally, I've never seen PR as a fashionista - In NYC she visited Bloomingdale's not Bergdorf's. Her fibers were synthetic not cashmere.

Sure, that's the point. The Ramsey's were new money, attempting to climb the social ladder, but lacking some of the finer airs and graces, e.g. designer clothes, etc.

.

 

[proust20]

When I see photos of the way of Patsy looked at the time of the crime, I must remind myself that it was 1996 and not 1986. Her look reminds me of Delta Burke. Jackie O? Umm...no, sorry. But I don't want to tear Patsy down for something trivial. No matter what the truth actually is, I think of her as a tragic figure in American history. She suffered both before JB's death, and, of course, afterwards. I hope that she was able to find some solace in her faith before she passed.

 

[UKGuy]

When I see photos of the way of Patsy looked at the time of the crime, I must remind myself that it was 1996 and not 1986. Her look reminds me of Delta Burke. Jackie O? Umm...no, sorry. But I don't want to tear Patsy down for something trivial. No matter what the truth actually is, I think of her as a tragic figure in American history. She suffered both before JB's death, and, of course, afterwards. I hope that she was able to find some solace in her faith before she passed.

proust20,
Yes, in a way her life story exemplifies tragedy. In a sense it was her focus on pageants that caused her carefully constructed house of cards to fall down.

It would not surprise me to learn that Patsy had serious mental health problems brought on by her cancer and deteriorating family relations?

Neither Patsy or John came across as religious in the fundamentalist sense, i.e. Patsy may have embraced it before her death, and John after JonBenet's death?

One of the JonBenet books suggested the parents attended church more as a social convention rather than a religious undertaking?

Just look at Patsy's family photos and her movies, she comes over as conservative, small c, promoting her happy family, etc. Not much religion to be seen anywhere.

Did she not turn to painting in the period leading to her passing?

.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

The Ramsey's were new money, attempting to climb the social ladder, but lacking some of the finer airs and graces, e.g. designer clothes, etc.

I have to admit UKGuy and proust20,
You both had me going with this one.
Are we really talking about “Do you peel and eat a banana or do you peel, cut with a knife and eat it with a fork?”
All joking aside, yes PR wanted to be loved and adored and she put her best foot forward (at least in her mind) to accomplish this. We need to look at where PR was born and raised (Parkersburg, West Virginia) to get a full grasp of her. There is an eye opener with Wikipedia. Research the churches in the area as well. Perhaps, simply perhaps she got a taste for the dramatic here. Who knows, but we can’t deny she had it in spades.

In a sense it was her focus on pageants that caused her carefully constructed house of cards to fall down.

UKGuy,
That focus of PR was also driven by Nedra. One only needs to look at that women to understand she was a force to be reckoned with. Speaking of which ~ wondering what the big fat cat, DP was up to? Brings me back to why PR put on airs? Did she not measure up within her own family? Seems to me that NP was pulling the reigns in this household. Along with JR of course. PR was sick, she had just been handed a death sentence. One has to come to terms with that. Now she had her hands all tightened up in JB ligature, her paint tray, the surrounding carpet, the white blanket, the duct tape … not the panty drawer. Then of course we have the true bills. There is punishable guilt found here. The PR story is tragic because of her involvement with what took place that night. I haven’t visited the Smoky mountains but know people from there. You can tell a lot about a person if you know where they are from.

Did she not turn to painting in the period leading to her passing?

Just so I can get a clearer picture what is this referring to?

 

[UKGuy]

I have to admit UKGuy and proust20,
You both had me going with this one.
Are we really talking about “Do you peel and eat a banana or do you peel, cut with a knife and eat it with a fork?”
All joking aside, yes PR wanted to be loved and adored and she put her best foot forward (at least in her mind) to accomplish this. We need to look at where PR was born and raised (Parkersburg, West Virginia) to get a full grasp of her. There is an eye opener with Wikipedia. Research the churches in the area as well. Perhaps, simply perhaps she got a taste for the dramatic here. Who knows, but we can’t deny she had it in spades.



UKGuy,
That focus of PR was also driven by Nedra. One only needs to look at that women to understand she was a force to be reckoned with. Speaking of which ~ wondering what the big fat cat, DP was up to? Brings me back to why PR put on airs? Did she not measure up within her own family? Seems to me that NP was pulling the reigns in this household. Along with JR of course. PR was sick, she had just been handed a death sentence. One has to come to terms with that. Now she had her hands all tightened up in JB ligature, her paint tray, the surrounding carpet, the white blanket, the duct tape … not the panty drawer. Then of course we have the true bills. There is punishable guilt found here. The PR story is tragic because of her involvement with what took place that night. I haven’t visited the Smoky mountains but know people from there. You can tell a lot about a person if you know where they are from.



Just so I can get a clearer picture what is this referring to?

Rain on my Parade,

That focus of PR was also driven by Nedra. One only needs to look at that women to understand she was a force to be reckoned with. Speaking of which ~ wondering what the big fat cat, DP was up to? Brings me back to why PR put on airs? Did she not measure up within her own family? Seems to me that NP was pulling the reigns in this household. Along with JR of course. PR was sick, she had just been handed a death sentence. One has to come to terms with that. Now she had her hands all tightened up in JB ligature, her paint tray, the surrounding carpet, the white blanket, the duct tape … not the panty drawer. Then of course we have the true bills. There is punishable guilt found here. The PR story is tragic because of her involvement with what took place that night. I haven’t visited the Smoky mountains but know people from there. You can tell a lot about a person if you know where they are from.

Yes, what NP never realized was that Patsy had arrived and wanted to move beyond the pageant circuit. NP would not allow this to happen, along with her two sisters, Patsy was pulled into NP's orbit.

Patsy had the money to bankroll JonBenet with extras for NP and the sisters, but really Patsy was attempting to reinvent herself as a socialite, not a pageant mum, something which exemplified success for NP.

Even DP bought into the pageant circuit he adored Shirley Temple and this ideal was passed onto JonBenet via videotapes purchased by PR or NP?

A useless, exotic fact: Andy Warhol wrote to Shirley Temple requesting an autograph which he received by return post on a Shirley Temple photograph. Presumably standard Hollywood PR stuff.

Until the day she passed Patsy's ambition was to literally paint out the tragic aspects of her life.

Just so I can get a clearer picture what is this referring to?

Beneath the public tragic JonBenet persona that came to characterise Patsy, there was a creative, artistic person trying to escape.

To this end, after JonBenet's funeral and the move to Georgia, she intensified her interest in painting.

She completed many paintings, had numerous showings, etc. I've actually seen some of her works for sale on the internet, which included her portraits of Burke and JonBenet.

Here is the tragic part: Patsy had booked a booth at the Charlevoix’s Summer Solstice Art Show where she intended to display her art work.

But her health deteriorated, and she remained in suburban Atlanta and died just hours before the show began.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

Yes, what NP never realized was that Patsy had arrived and wanted to move beyond the pageant circuit. NP would not allow this to happen, along with her two sisters, Patsy was pulled into NP's orbit.

Patsy had the money to bankroll JonBenet with extras for NP and the sisters, but really Patsy was attempting to reinvent herself as a socialite, not a pageant mum, something which exemplified success for NP.

UKGuy,
I don’t recall ever reading that PR wanted out of of the pageant circuit. What I do recall reading is that JB was 3 years old when PR was diagnosed and went through treatment. NP was the primary caregiver for both children. That PP would come down and she and NP would decorate costumes, shoes, props, etc. Obviously the grooming was done by NP. Her not so grandmotherly statement of “All kids are a little abused”; is one big red flag to me. As well as her statements to BR. This isn’t the cookie making grandma children dream of. All either child had to do was to see their friends with their respective grandparents; to see the difference. I believe they did this JB last Christmas season.

Even DP bought into the pageant circuit he adored Shirley Temple and this ideal was passed onto JonBenet via videotapes purchased by PR or NP?

Doesn’t this sound rather odd? For a grandfather to be interested in Shirley Temple. Reminds me of JR professing to sit on the floor and make jewelry with Daphne’s and JB, and BR putting together a toy. And this was all in one night, sounds like a very involved father. I guess it’s a normal thing to do and also be referred to as a big fat cat.

Until the day she passed Patsy's ambition was to literally paint out the tragic aspects of her life.

This is very beautiful. Painting allows one to escape into your own inner world. I am sure this would have brought her some solace and peace. She needed it.
Yet, I have to ask you again about the true bills. No matter who did what every person in that house that night was responsible for JB demise. Isn’t this why we are here … Justice for JB? She should RIP as well.

Here is the tragic part: Patsy had booked a booth at the Charlevoix’s Summer Solstice Art Show where she intended to display her art work.

But her health deteriorated, and she remained in suburban Atlanta and died just hours before the show began.

No more accolades for her.

 

[icedtea4me]

Aristocracy is not determined by wealth but by historic bloodlines. Personally, I've never seen PR as a fashionista - In NYC she visited Bloomingdale's not Bergdorf's. Her fibers were synthetic not cashmere.

I found a nice Talbots cashmere sweater at a thrift store just before Xmas.

And now back to your discussion.

 

[icedtea4me]

<snip>Did she not turn to painting in the period leading to her passing?

.

A few of her paintings can be seen starting at the 6:00 mark.

 

[proust20]

icedtea4me,

Style is different from Fashion, and Style is nor determined by $$$.





a

 

[proust20]

Returning to Lies Point to the Truth which began this thread, a compilation of lies, or at least some of them:

JB was sound asleep and put right to bed on Christmas night. The extra hair tie belies this.
PR only glanced at the RN before placing the 911.
JR spread out the three sheets of the RN on the floor to read it.
All 3 Rs lied about BR being asleep until BPD arrived.
BR's willful ignorance in not identifying the pineapple in a bowl that had his fingerprints on it.
JR's tall tale about breaking the basement window that has at least two versions.
JR's trip to the mailbox on the 26th which he proposed to explain his disappearance that morning.
JR seeing a van by the house which he did not report.
PR saying that Burke did not have HiTec boots.
PR not remembering why she called Dr. Beuf several times in one day.
PR relating that she tore the gift-wrapped packages in the WC.
PR not knowing where the size 12s were stored.
PR asserting that the pageants only occupied time on Sundays.
The Rs pretending that the scratches on the exterior door were fresh.
AH misleading the public that no indictments had been returned.
ML stating that the parents were exonerated, which was not in her power to grant to anyone.

No doubt there are others. Please add them.

 

[icedtea4me]

<snip>
BR's willful ignorance in not identifying the pineapple in a bowl that had his fingerprints on it.</snip>

1. Burke was shown a b/w picture.

Are you saying that everyone who sees that picture is automatically going to be able to say "It's chunks of pineapple in cream in a bowl"?

2. How do you know that his prints weren't on the bowl earlier when there was candy in it from the 23 Dec 96 party? Can you prove that he touched the bowl when the pineapple was in it?

 

[UKGuy]

UKGuy,
I don’t recall ever reading that PR wanted out of of the pageant circuit. What I do recall reading is that JB was 3 years old when PR was diagnosed and went through treatment. NP was the primary caregiver for both children. That PP would come down and she and NP would decorate costumes, shoes, props, etc. Obviously the grooming was done by NP. Her not so grandmotherly statement of “All kids are a little abused”; is one big red flag to me. As well as her statements to BR. This isn’t the cookie making grandma children dream of. All either child had to do was to see their friends with their respective grandparents; to see the difference. I believe they did this JB last Christmas season.



Doesn’t this sound rather odd? For a grandfather to be interested in Shirley Temple. Reminds me of JR professing to sit on the floor and make jewelry with Daphne’s and JB, and BR putting together a toy. And this was all in one night, sounds like a very involved father. I guess it’s a normal thing to do and also be referred to as a big fat cat.



This is very beautiful. Painting allows one to escape into your own inner world. I am sure this would have brought her some solace and peace. She needed it.
Yet, I have to ask you again about the true bills. No matter who did what every person in that house that night was responsible for JB demise. Isn’t this why we are here … Justice for JB? She should RIP as well.



No more accolades for her.

Rain on my Parade,

This is very beautiful. Painting allows one to escape into your own inner world. I am sure this would have brought her some solace and peace.

I agree, artistic endeavour can reveal the world around you or allow you to become enveloped in a world of your own construction.

A look over Patsy's painting style might let you decide whether she painted in the style of Romanticism, Impressionism or Modernism?

Yes DP's appreciation of Shirley Temple might suggest grooming or something much darker.

Once Patsy and John became successful via Access Graphics Patsy had no need for pageant kudos.

It was NP and the sisters who wanted the pageants to continue, if its true then NP's alleged remark to PR about JR making the money and we just spend it is apt and to the point.

.

 

[proust20]

icedtea4me,

If there were proof of almost anything in this case, there'd be no need for us to speculate. To be thorough, can it be proved that Burke did not partake of the contents of the bowl with the wrong sized serving spoon? Of course not. However, there was indeed a bowl of pineapple with Burke's fingerprints on it. Next to the bowl there was a glass of tea that also had his fingerprints. JB's autopsy revealed the remnants of the pineapple that matched the rind of it in the fridge. As Burke admitted that pineapple was a favorite snack of his, its appearance and its rather expected location could likely lead him to identifying it through a chain of familiar associations. Patsy said that she did not put out the pineapple. Then who did? If not BR, whoever that might have been had to be aware that this was a favorite nosh of both children. Did JB request it from her assailant who didn't leave their fingerprints while maintaining BR's intact? Or did she prepare the bowl for herself without leaving her own fingerprints on it? If JB did not sample the pineapple from this bowl, from where did she get it? In any case, this aspect is but one of the sixteen untruths that I enumerated.

Most people can learn to paint. It's just manual labor. Painting in a personal style is the ultimate goal of this Art. That results after much sustained effort, if at all. Isms are abstractions about which Patsy showed no interest judging from the contents of the house. I think that PR was interested in Art classes as a social activity. Although, in fact, painting is a solitary pursuit. Exhibiting her work could be a substitute for her pageant days during which she displayed herself. To be fair, Patsy did have a need to please others. (I do not want to be only negative about her.) A typically bizarre touch is that her art supplies were directly involved with the murder. It is too much to expect that a newbie like Patsy would be able to express her inner turmoil immediately on canvas. Hitler's paintings are bland and mediocre.

 

[Rain on my Parade]

Returning to Lies Point to the Truth which began this thread, a compilation of lies, or at least some of them:

JB was sound asleep and put right to bed on Christmas night. The extra hair tie belies this.
PR only glanced at the RN before placing the 911.
JR spread out the three sheets of the RN on the floor to read it.
All 3 Rs lied about BR being asleep until BPD arrived.
BR's willful ignorance in not identifying the pineapple in a bowl that had his fingerprints on it.
JR's tall tale about breaking the basement window that has at least two versions.
JR's trip to the mailbox on the 26th which he proposed to explain his disappearance that morning.
JR seeing a van by the house which he did not report.
PR saying that Burke did not have HiTec boots.
PR not remembering why she called Dr. Beuf several times in one day.
PR relating that she tore the gift-wrapped packages in the WC.
PR not knowing where the size 12s were stored.
PR asserting that the pageants only occupied time on Sundays.
The Rs pretending that the scratches on the exterior door were fresh.
AH misleading the public that no indictments had been returned.
ML stating that the parents were exonerated, which was not in her power to grant to anyone.

No doubt there are others. Please add them.

proust20,
Thank you for your post!

Not one family member heard anything unusual that night.
The RN was fabricated.
JR did not carry JB up to bed.
JB top was never changed.
JR knew all along where JB body was.
JR stating he had to fly to Atlanta immediately for a very important meeting he couldn’t miss.
BR didn’t get a bike that year.
BR slept through everything … especially that morning.
PR stating she didn’t harm a hair on that child’s head.
PR put all size 12 bloomies in JB underwear drawer.

 

[proust20]

Another falsehood - At first the Rs did not recognize the Maglite as their property.