Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #70

[Kiri]

But if they release their identities I feel this case could potentially be solved. Hiding their identity hasn’t helped the case that’s for sure. Imo

Surely if they are no longer foster parents of A. a missing, presumed deceased child and B. a child who is now not in their care (permanently?!? - not sure on the current legal status here so all possibly MOO), then there is no longer the call/justification of hiding the FPs to 'protect the identity' of the 'other child'?!? As they are surely now 'ex Foster parents'?? What a case! I feel so sad for the other child, L has gone through 2 sets of 'parents' in her childhood it may appear! Protect L yes, but ex foster parents?!? Hmmm. Did the 'protecting' of identities actually help or hinder this case??? I wonder what precedent it may set for other 'looked after' children and their carers in future cases. Bad enough a child goes missing, but all the added secrecy, procedure etc seems to just have added more layers to an already complex case.

 

[deugirtni]

She has been referred to as Nicole. I don't know if that is her real name or yet another Tyrrell case pseudonym.

Interesting question as to her perhaps being the FM's sister. I don't know if Nicole appeared on TV before or after the trip by the FM to collect her sister from the airport.

I also don't recall her being described as other than 'a close friend'. If she is unrelated, then is she a Kendall local, or was she called to come up to Kendall?

Good point (re the time of arrival of 'Nicole', vs FM's sister). It seems the family friend Nicole and John were already speaking to media the day following W's disappearance, on Saturday, September 13th. I had understood through years of following, that FM's sister did not arrive until two days later, on Sunday, September 14th.. at 5pm ish (confirmed again upthread by @SLouTh from CO's book). This article was 'published' at 10:42pm the evening of September 13th, and indicates Nicole spoke to media that afternoon.

Just speculation on my part, but it seems very quickly put together to me, that these friends arrived so soon, and presumably to stay for however many days (not sure? does anyone know?). Able to drop everything, clear their schedules, presumably travel from Sydney, and be ready to front the media on the FP's behalves within say 30+/- hours after W's disappearance. For me, it feels like the PR campaign started VERY early.
----
THE family of three-year-old William Tyrell, who vanished from the front yard of his grandparents’ home on Friday morning, say they are desperate to have him found safe and well.

LIA HARRIS and NEIL KEENE IN KENDALLIN KENDALL

5 min read
September 13, 2014 - 10:42PM (just to confirm, this is NSW time)
The Sunday Telegraph

“He is a much-loved, cherished little boy,” a close family friend speaking on behalf of the parents said this afternoon.

“The family are desperate to have him home, so if anyone out there has seen this little boy, knows anything about William — where he is — we just urge you please to contact the police.”

The family friend, who wanted to be known only as Nicole, said William’s relatives had been moved by the enormous show of community support during the search.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/search-for-missing-william-tyrell-3-in-kendall-on-nsw-midnorth-coast-intensifies-as-community-refuses-to-lose-hope/news-story/2dc137f5d793ed4c8e52f37c11a3e51

 

[JBowie]

Good point (re the time of arrival of 'Nicole', vs FM's sister). It seems the family friend Nicole and John were already speaking to media the day following W's disappearance, on Saturday, September 13th. I had understood through years of following, that FM's sister did not arrive until two days later, on Sunday, September 14th.. at 5pm ish (confirmed again upthread by @SLouTh from CO's book). This article was 'published' at 10:42pm the evening of September 13th, and indicates Nicole spoke to media that afternoon.

Just speculation on my part, but it seems very quickly put together to me, that these friends arrived so soon, and presumably to stay for however many days (not sure? does anyone know?). Able to drop everything, clear their schedules, presumably travel from Sydney, and be ready to front the media on the FP's behalves within say 30+/- hours after W's disappearance. For me, it feels like the PR campaign started VERY early.

Thanks for clarifying the timings and names.

It occurs to me that if they are Kendall locals, then they may be friends (or in laws) of the FM's brothers who, I gather from what the FM says, raised their own kids in the Kendall area.

Alternatively, maybe they are friends or relatives of the FF and traveled up by request.

All musing and speculation on my part.

 

[Mauig’ma]

Thanks for clarifying the timings and names.

It occurs to me that if they are Kendall locals, then they may be friends (or in laws) of the FM's brothers who, I gather from what the FM says, raised their own kids in the Kendall area.

Alternatively, maybe they are friends or relatives of the FF and traveled up by request.

All musing and speculation on my part.

This is a question for the people that attended the inquest. ie: DrSleuth or others. Can you please clarify when the trip to pick up the sister was. I’m not sure about a lot of things. But I can’t shake the feeling that I’m remembering it Was the same night as William went missing. I could very well be wrong. But if we could find the link or source that knows for sure that’d clear up a lot of talk right now. Tyia Much appreciated. Moo

 

[MissMarpleAU]

100% agree with you. Earlier in this thread I asked whether anyone knows whether this hand injury FFC seemed to have sustained contemporaneously with William's disappearance was discussed at the inquest, but have yet to receive an answer. Was FFC questioned about this? I'd also like to know if this hand injury was photographed and examined by NSW Police at the time. I know of a couple of cases where a perpetrator has been convicted of murder and was found to have hand injuries at the time their victim disappeared. (Presumably sustained during the attack of the victim or in disposal of the body.) I assume it is good police practice to examine and photograph the people who were last to see a person before they disappeared (eg the Netflix doco on Shannan Watts showed Chris having his hands photographed when she disappeared). I'm wondering whether FFC's hand injury was thoroughly assessed at the time William disappeared or in the days following or whether perhaps this was missed due to the fact that initially it was thought he had just wandered off and the focus was on the search?

The only thing I like about these latest news article is this

'Then (the foster mother) had him throwing the dice, and he was THROWING the dice and she had to teach him that you don’t, just let it roll out of your hand.

Bless you little William. THROWING those dice because you were only 3. 3 years old, and that’s how some kids roll

Yes I have to agree that’s not an activity i’d offer to a 3yo, choking hazard aswell at that age

 

[Mauig’ma]

Yes I have to agree that’s not an activity i’d offer to a 3yo, choking hazard aswell at that age

All great questions that someone from the inquest could easily verify. Please someone who was there would you mind clearing this up? I don’t want to speak for others but I especially (We) would all appreciate knowing whether it was discussed. Moo Please let us know one way or another. It’ll help with going back and forth trying to figure it out. Thanks inquest members. Moo

 

[Mauig’ma]

I have a question for the people living in Australia. I try to go on as many searches as I can. I’ve been retired since 40 and now that I’m 51 I have more time. I’m going to be an empty nester this summer. And I’m wanting to take a trip there. I’ve always wanted to go but with Covid it never happened. I’ve been to other countries but Australia is on the top of my bucket list. When I do go this fall will it be ok to search on my own? I wouldn’t go on private property as I know that’s illegal. I also realize I wouldn’t probably find anything of value. But just to be there where it all happened I feel I would feel connected to William. And I feel I need to do my part by searching especially when I have all the time and money to be able to. Williams case has struck a cord with me like no other case has. So if one of you locals could advise me on what would be the best way for me to be of value I would greatly appreciated it. Tyia

 

[deugirtni]

regarding time to hide william, the only visual of proof of life and location that day is the photo, which may or may not be valid, the event may have happened the night before after the cctv footage at mcdonalds, giving hours to find a hiding place, fgm may have been given a story and little script to read if questioned, her walk through video was odd, and her not being questioned more was put down to the fact of her being unwell wasnt it? she seemed very well in the video

I have pondered the same. There was no visual verification of W after his prominent display on FD's shoulders captured on McD's CCTV (other than by members of the foster family). Five photos of W all taken quickly in a row of nothing particularly special, was the proof of life at Benaroon Drive the morning of his disappearance - up until it came into question during the inquest, and that issue for me, is still outstanding, until the coroner releases the findings of the investigation she ordered into that matter, which was publicly known after MSM published it.

For me, it didn't make sense that this seemingly intelligent couple would run the risk of obliterating their entire family at the side of the highway (not sure if it was a ramp or just the regular highway), in darkness, to pull over, presumably take the kids out of the vehicle, remove their pants, put on their pullups (even though – they were 3.25 and 4.5 yrs old - it wasn't like they were now going to drift off to sleep for an 8 hour drive or something). They had JUST visited inside a McDonalds with perfectly good bathroom facilities - surely they could have lasted another couple of hours before another bathroom break?

They picked up the kids from daycare at around 4pm-ish.. the kids were immediately put into the vehicle to start their 4-4.5(?) hour journey... three hours later (est), the fosters are expecting the kids to go to sleep? I could see them going to sleep if they'd commenced their journey at 7pm or 8pm or 9pm, but at 4ish, and being reportedly excited to be going on a trip and to visit with their FGM, and after having been confined in a vehicle already for 2-3 hours - would they be ready for sleep? And this pull-over on the roadway in the dark was so important, why? Leather seats (I’m presuming their Land Rover Discovery had leather) can clean up well, imo.

Is it possible it was prearranged to meet another party at the side of that roadside in the dark, where there were presumably no cameras, to ‘move him on’ to someone? Nobody knew what these people looked like, nor what vehicle they drove (in fact not until the inquest some 4 years later), nor did the public know where they stopped along the way exactly, so very unlikely that someone would report such a potential sighting so far away from FGM's house, imo. This, to me, is one example of how the secrecy surrounding the fosters has greatly hindered this case.

 

[deugirtni]

I've never understood the focus on the shoes. As you say, if he wasn't wearing them, she could have just said so. My theory is that she initially lied about that in her story without thinking of the consequences and then had to keep up lie to try to avoid suspicion. But instead, she ended up arousing suspicion because of this very issue. Liars aren't usually very clever unless they are a hardened, calculated psychopath, which I don't think FFC is - most people eventually get tripped up as their stories get more convoluted and fanciful as they try to justify the original lie and continue to obfuscate the truth. Happens with my kids as they try to weasel their way out of trouble LOL!!!

But nobody had asked her yet about the shoes prior to the 000 call, and then even when she was asked during the 10:56am(?) call, she didn't answer that question.. so she was free to say either way. So if she realized he hadn’t been wearing shoes, she simply could’ve said, ‘no shoes’. I'm sure she did not take her drive *after* police arrived, otherwise I’m sure police would have been suspicious of that. She had already taken her drive before the 000 call was made. Imo.

Neither here nor there in regard to the shoes, but my theory is that she took the drive after FD arrived home, but before the 000 call... AMS stated the two had parted at some point after AMS had been informed of the disappearance, and then that they met back up again, at which point FM said the thing about 'must've bumped his head', and was going to call police now. We know FD had already arrived back at the house before AMS was informed about W’s disappearance, as she testified she could hear FD calling for W at the time. Imo.

 

[Couldbe]

All great questions that someone from the inquest could easily verify. Please someone who was there would you mind clearing this up? I don’t want to speak for others but I especially (We) would all appreciate knowing whether it was discussed. Moo Please let us know one way or another. It’ll help with going back and forth trying to figure it out. Thanks inquest members. Moo

JMO Much theorizing here revolves around the trip to the Airport by FFC. Could someone who attended the Inquest please post details on which day FFC drove (and if possible with whom in the vehicle) ....... to Port Macquarie Airport to pick up a member of her family? Thanking you in anticipation ....

 

[seekingjustice**]

JMO Much theorizing here revolves around the trip to the Airport by FFC. Could someone who attended the Inquest please post details on which day FFC drove (and if possible with whom in the vehicle) ....... to Port Macquarie Airport to pick up a member of her family? Thanking you in anticipation ....

I didn't attend the Inquest but I believe the trip to the airport was at 5pm on Sunday the 14th (as per Caroline Overington's book Missing William Tyrrell).
Chapter 4 Pg. 56

 

[Mauig’ma]

I didn't attend the Inquest but I believe the trip to the airport was at 5pm on Sunday the 14th (as per Caroline Overington's book Missing William Tyrrell).
Chapter 4 Pg. 56

I read her book and yes it says Sunday the 14th. But I just got done sorting through 2 hours of notes I took from the very beginning and throughout his case up until now. My notes say it was the evening he disappeared. I noted that I thought that was odd considering he had just disappeared that morning. I also noted that no one from le rode along with. I marked it as the first red flag I had noticed on the day he disappeared. Along with BS fixing the wash machine. Now don’t take this as fact. But I am very anal & have ocd with things and if I’m wrong I’ll be the first to admit it. But I don’t think I am. For now I’ll say imo. Until someone from the inquest can PLEASE verify. I’m not sure why we’re having such a problem having someone do that for us. Spring is a busy time of year I guess. Moo. Tyia

 

[SouthAussie]

I read her book and yes it says Sunday the 14th. But I just got done sorting through 2 hours of notes I took from the very beginning and throughout his case up until now. My notes say it was the evening he disappeared. I noted that I thought that was odd considering he had just disappeared that morning. I also noted that no one from le rode along with. I marked it as the first red flag I had noticed on the day he disappeared. Along with BS fixing the wash machine. Now don’t take this as fact. But I am very anal & have ocd with things and if I’m wrong I’ll be the first to admit it. But I don’t think I am. For now I’ll say imo. Until someone from the inquest can PLEASE verify. I’m not sure why we’re having such a problem having someone do that for us. Spring is a busy time of year I guess. Moo. Tyia

If others want to see what has been said by drsleuth about the inquest, they could do a search on "inquest" with "drsleuth" inserted where it says "By:" in the search box.

Re: you visiting Australia and Kendall. drsleuth said they drove all around that Kendall area, and said it is good to get an idea of how far apart those Benaroon Drive properties are, how they are set back from the road (so any residents who were home could easily have not seen someone hanging around or walking on the street).

imo

 

[Couldbe]

If others want to see what has been said by drsleuth about the inquest, they could do a search on "inquest" with "drsleuth" inserted where it says "By:" in the search box.

Re: you visiting Australia and Kendall. drsleuth said they drove all around that Kendall area, and said it is good to get an idea of how far apart those Benaroon Drive properties are, how they are set back from the road (so any residents who were home could easily have not seen someone hanging around or walking on the street).

imo

Thank you SouthAussie
What day do you believe that the drive to the Airport occurred?

 

[Mauig’ma]

If others want to see what has been said by drsleuth about the inquest, they could do a search on "inquest" with "drsleuth" inserted where it says "By:" in the search box.

Re: you visiting Australia and Kendall. drsleuth said they drove all around that Kendall area, and said it is good to get an idea of how far apart those Benaroon Drive properties are, how they are set back from the road (so any residents who were home could easily have not seen someone hanging around or walking on the street).

imo

Thank you. So if the houses are set back too far from the road to see much I wonder how ffc could see 2 cars parked there that no one else happened to see. Imo. Btw Thanks for your input. I appreciate it.

 

[SouthAussie]

Thank you SouthAussie
What day do you believe that the drive to the Airport occurred?

The Daily Telegraph says Saturday.
CO says Sunday.
They are both pretty good sources.

The news about William's disappearance went out very quickly. NSWPOL posted a media announcement that afternoon (Friday). Our thread here was started that day, due to the urgent news publications on the Friday.

It makes sense that friends and relatives would have started arriving to help as soon as they could over the weekend.

 

[SouthAussie]

Thank you. So if the houses are set back too far from the road to see much I wonder how ffc could see 2 cars parked there that no one else happened to see. Imo. Btw Thanks for your input. I appreciate it.

This Google shot is taken from where the two cars were parked. I can see windows, and when I zoom in I can see they are sliding glass doors. Which is where FM said she saw the cars from.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.com

 

[Doesitmakesense]

With the airport pick up, I'm still trying to get my head around why they would do that. Just me personally, if my child was missing I just don't think I would be going off to do any task that wasn't centred around me finding my child. Why couldn't the family member hire a car or get a taxi. Why did the FFC have to pick them up.

 

[SouthAussie]

With the airport pick up, I'm still trying to get my head around why they would do that. Just me personally, if my child was missing I just don't think I would be going off to do any task that wasn't centred around me finding my child. Why couldn't the family member hire a car or get a taxi. Why did the FFC have to pick them up.

Perhaps Supt Fehon or DI Rupp suggested they all went. The police would likely have used opportunities like this to go through the property more intensely.
Like when the police took them to the beach for an afternoon.

FD stayed back, either to search, and/or to wait for William, and/or to be present while the police did a further search of the house. imo
.

 

[KateM]

there’s a video in this news article link that shows police officer reporting to press with Nicole and a man behind him.

Much blinking going on from the man.

Search for William Tyrell continues | PHOTOS

SUNDAY 4pm: A FULL-SCALE search is continuing for three-year-old William Tyrell in bushland on the NSW Mid-North Coast.

www.centralwesterndaily.com.au

Yes and the woman refers to William in the past tense.