TX - Uvalde; Robb Elementary, 19 children and 3 adults killed, shooter dead, 24 MAY 2022 #3

[Wise Old Owl]

Report: Uvalde leaders sought to highlight police efforts in Robb Elementary shooting response

The New York Times reported that Uvalde leaders wanted DPS Director Steven McCraw to present an account of the shooting that praised officers.

www.kvue.com

This is just disgusting. It has become so glaringly obvious that these "big fish in a small pond" are so hell bent on CYA that they will stop at nothing - nothing including outright lying even though there is evidence to disprove what they are trying to cover up. Just makes me sick. How can people be like that?


JMHO

 

[Dotta]

This is just disgusting. It has become so glaringly obvious that these "big fish in a small pond" are so hell bent on CYA that they will stop at nothing - nothing including outright lying even though there is evidence to disprove what they are trying to cover up. Just makes me sick. How can people be like that?


JMHO

They behave as if they are living in another epoch - times long gone by.

I mean - nowadays nothing can be hidden - with cctv, people filming everything with their phones, instant messages on SM, etc.
Besides, people now are very aware of their rights, and not so easily intimidated.

 

[TGIRecovered]

There is a saying that I've heard from someone I know well, who is in law enforcement. " If it's not in the report, it didn't happen." I'm sure this saying originated from training intended to teach officers to be thorough in their written reports. Unfortunately, the person I knew misused this concept by believing that If he said something didn't happen, it didn't happen. The truth became ambiguous, according to what he decided to say. MOO

Leaders such as police chiefs and other higher-ranking officers choose the culture of their department by modeling the behavior they expect from their officers. I don't think the Uvalde ISD chief expected to have to account truthfully for his disastrous choices. MOO

 

[Wise Old Owl]

They behave as if they are living in another epoch - times long gone by.

I mean - nowadays nothing can be hidden - with cctv, people filming everything with their phones, instant messages on SM, etc.
Besides, people now are very aware of their rights, and not so easily intimidated.

Yes! And what about the rights of those innocent children? What about the parents' rights? The right to the truth - as painful as that must be?

There were choices made that day - and with choices - come consequences. Nobody today wants to be held accountable for their "bad" choices. Everybody has an excuse for what they did or did not do. And because they have an excuse - they are not accountable for that choice. But that's not how it works.



JMHO

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

Absolutely, they did (and do) active shooter drills even with very young kids.

Not to show my age or anything but I graduated in 2005 and we never had any type of drills for that

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

There is a saying that I've heard from someone I know well, who is in law enforcement. " If it's not in the report, it didn't happen." I'm sure this saying originated from training intended to teach officers to be thorough in their written reports. Unfortunately, the person I knew misused this concept by believing that If he said something didn't happen, it didn't happen. The truth became ambiguous, according to what he decided to say. MOO

Leaders such as police chiefs and other higher-ranking officers choose the culture of their department by modeling the behavior they expect from their officers. I don't think the Uvalde ISD chief expected to have to account truthfully for his disastrous choices. MOO

Well it’s a little tough to get away with stuff simply because it’s not written in a report. There’s body cam on the officers, cameras everywhere, recordings of every radio transmission that are saved for a very long time.. depending on the agency.. all the calls coming and going into the dispatch center are also recorded and saved. I don’t know if the chief thought anything about future repercussions only because I think this little section of Texas was completely unprepared for a situation like this and I’m sure he thought he was doing a good or decent job.. poor communication written all over it.. and all the manpower he had on standby were just waiting for orders from the person in charge and the person who should’ve been in charge claims he didn’t even know he was in charge. Totally unprepared.

 

[Dotta]

Not to show my age or anything but I graduated in 2005 and we never had any type of drills for that

I have never had it either, but I live in Europe.

I wonder about hiding under the desks.

Isn't it better if the kids escape through the windows on the ground floor?

The windows in my school are big and situated low, so I'd rather run outside than stay like a sitting duck waiting for a maniac to shoot me.

Just asking as a complete novice in this matter.

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

I have never had it either, but I live in Europe.

I wonder about hiding under the desks.

Isn't it better if the kids escape through the windows on the ground floor?

The windows in my school are big and situated low, so I'd rather run outside than stay like a sitting duck waiting for a maniac to shoot me.

Just asking as a complete novice in this matter.

I’m not really sure what the SOP for an active shooter would be in this school district but I’d assume the teachers would want to lock the door first and get the students away from any windows. And idk if they encourage kids to exit (if there is an exit door) unless they know for certain that there’s no threat outside. The teachers prob didn’t even know how many actors (shooters) were involved. And yeah, I suppose they’d probably get under desks. I think if I was a teacher, I’d also try to barricade the door or something just in case they were still able to breach the door, whether it was locked or not. This country needs to have some upgrades in ref to their preparations and drills for these situations. Idk the answers to this but obviously the drills they’re doing don’t always work. Especially when the gunmen comes in fully loaded with an AR and god knows what else. You know it’s bad in America when you occasionally wonder to yourself as a parent if this could happen to where your children go to school.. or if they’re better off home schooled. Where I live, we have one of the largest outdoor music festivals every summer and it’s basically a completely open festival and i always think in the back of my head how this could be so bad if someone chose to do something like that here. I especially started thinking that way after what happened in Las Vegas.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I have never had it either, but I live in Europe.
I wonder about hiding under the desks.
Isn't it better if the kids escape through the windows on the ground floor?
The windows in my school are big and situated low, so I'd rather run outside than stay like a sitting duck.
Just asking as a complete novice in this matter

No - there is no hiding under desks.

Active shooter drills have evolved over the years. It usually depends on the district - with smaller rural districts not really doing them at all. At first - we were instructed to get kids into storage closets (if your room had one) - but that went out the window with Sandy Hook (AL shot up the storage closets with the kids in them!). We were told to keep a piece of construction paper taped to the back of our doors - then when the code was called - we moved it to cover that small narrow window - (shooters have taken to looking into rooms first to see if anyone is in there). Then we were told to try to barricade the door with desks and tables - but that was short lived - first responders can't get in and no one can easily get out. The latest was "someone in power" (whether it was the fire marshal or SWAT guys or whoever - I never found out who made these decisions) but they would go into each room - usually over the summer and place small pieces of masking tape in a corner of the room. This "place" was usually somewhere in the room that if someone was able to "look in that window" that they wouldn't be able to see anyone in the room. Which made no sense to me - but what did I know? They were called "safe corners" and we were told to get all the kids in that area and have them sit down.

The last school I taught at - I was on the second floor. The entire side of the building was 4 classrooms. Every room (all 4) were connected at the back wall by a door on each side (to the adjoining room) with a jack and jill bathroom in between. So - you could come into any of the 4 rooms and get to all the others. Those connecting doors DID NOT LOCK (but we kept them closed - obviously while we were teaching). In that school ( and this distressed me greatly - and I got chastised and "poo-poo'd" about trying to talk about it) was that for our active shooter drill - we were instructed to get the kids into one of the bathrooms next to our room. The bathrooms were big enough (barely) for the kids to fit and then the teacher next door and I would stand outside the bathroom doors - now remember the adjoining doors DID NOT LOCK! Talk about shooting fish in a barrel!!!!! It scared me - it really did. But that was what we were told to do.

I always had contingency plans of my own - if, heaven forbid - the "real thing" happened - about how to get the kids out. Thank the Good Lord I never had to use them!!!!

I don't think anyone has a real clue on how to "practice" for an active shooter. Each one is different and each school is set-up different. But its the world we live in now.

There is so much more I could add to this with "active shooter" training - drills - meetings - etc. that I have attended over the years. Some good - most of them are just "band-aids" trying to minimize the damage.



JMHO

 

[Dotta]

No - there is no hiding under desks.

Active shooter drills have evolved over the years. It usually depends on the district - with smaller rural districts not really doing them at all. At first - we were instructed to get kids into storage closets (if your room had one) - but that went out the window with Sandy Hook (AL shot up the storage closets with the kids in them!). We were told to keep a piece of construction paper taped to the back of our doors - then when the code was called - we moved it to cover that small narrow window - (shooters have taken to looking into rooms first to see if anyone is in there). Then we were told to try to barricade the door with desks and tables - but that was short lived - first responders can't get in and no one can easily get out. The latest was "someone in power" (whether it was the fire marshal or SWAT guys or whoever - I never found out who made these decisions) but they would go into each room - usually over the summer and place small pieces of masking tape in a corner of the room. This "place" was usually somewhere in the room that if someone was able to "look in that window" that they wouldn't be able to see anyone in the room. Which made no sense to me - but what did I know? They were called "safe corners" and we were told to get all the kids in that area and have them sit down.

The last school I taught at - I was on the second floor. The entire side of the building was 4 classrooms. Every room (all 4) were connected at the back wall by a door on each side (to the adjoining room) with a jack and jill bathroom in between. So - you could come into any of the 4 rooms and get to all the others. Those connecting doors DID NOT LOCK (but we kept them closed - obviously while we were teaching). In that school ( and this distressed me greatly - and I got chastised and "poo-poo'd" about trying to talk about it) was that for our active shooter drill - we were instructed to get the kids into one of the bathrooms next to our room. The bathrooms were big enough (barely) for the kids to fit and then the teacher next door and I would stand outside the bathroom doors - now remember the adjoining doors DID NOT LOCK! Talk about shooting fish in a barrel!!!!! It scared me - it really did. But that was what we were told to do.

I always had contingency plans of my own - if, heaven forbid - the "real thing" happened - about how to get the kids out. Thank the Good Lord I never had to use them!!!!

I don't think anyone has a real clue on how to "practice" for an active shooter. Each one is different and each school is set-up different. But its the world we live in now.

There is so much more I could add to this with "active shooter" training - drills - meetings - etc. that I have attended over the years. Some good - most of them are just "band-aids" trying to minimize the damage.



JMHO

How interesting!!!
Thank you for sharing.

 

[ilovewings]

This is just disgusting. It has become so glaringly obvious that these "big fish in a small pond" are so hell bent on CYA that they will stop at nothing - nothing including outright lying even though there is evidence to disprove what they are trying to cover up. Just makes me sick. How can people be like that?


j

X

This is just disgusting. It has become so glaringly obvious that these "big fish in a small pond" are so hell bent on CYA that they will stop at nothing - nothing including outright lying even though there is evidence to disprove what they are trying to cover up. Just makes me sick. How can people be like that?


JMHO

The fact they would actually put such a request in writing is stunning- how absolutely dense and uncaring can they be? It is incomprehensible. I am glad the truth has come to light to show what cowards they were--

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

I don't think anyone has a real clue on how to "practice" for an active shooter. Each one is different and each school is set-up different. But its the world we live in now.

The other issue is what if the shooter also knows what the school’s most recently up to date plans/drills are for an active shooter situation..? Some of it is common sense bcuz there’s only so much teachers can have their students do and only so many places for the students to hide. The number of mass shootings in this country is repulsive and there has to be some sort of solution to keep people safe whether it’s thru tweaking some laws or dumping a lot of money into keeping people safe somehow.. idk.. also, according to what everyone’s saying about the shooter, there were red flags everywhere that this kid shouldn’t have been able to have an AR and whatever else he had. I also read somewhere that he made comments and said some questionable things leading up to the incident. I guess no one took him seriously? This whole thing is tragic and a failure from the very top to the very bottom. Those kids were probably wondering why nobody was coming to save them and I can’t even imagine if they heard LE in the hallways and outside the school- all while they were terrified & waiting inside the classrooms for LE to come save them.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

And that is the problem. These shootings have gone on long enough (and the shooters are always between 17-18 & 21-22) so they have been "students" at one time or another and participated in the drills - so they know what the school is going to do. I keep saying this - THEY ARE LEARNING!!! Most of these shootings take place at the school they attended. This one - Uvalde - he went to the room he was in when he attended there in the 4th grade!!! So, they know even better.

And, what really bothers me - and this was so apparent in the trainings I attended - are the teachers. A lot of them would not be able to handle themselves if placed in that horrible situation. I'm not knocking the teachers - well.......most of them. They didn't sign up for this. They were trained to teach - not defend - especially against an AR-15!!!! But some of the attitudes and opinions I saw in these trainings were so far off the mark that, as a parent, I certainly would not want my child in that teacher's room.


JMHO

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

And, what really bothers me - and this was so apparent in the trainings I attended - are the teachers. A lot of them would not be able to handle themselves if placed in that horrible situation. I'm not knocking the teachers - well.......most of them. They didn't sign up for this. They were trained to teach - not defend - especially against an AR-15!!!! But some of the attitudes and opinions I saw in these trainings were so far off the mark that, as a parent, I certainly would not want my child in that teacher's room.

I’m very curious if you could elaborate a little bit in ref to the teachers attitudes/opinions during the drills.

I agree that teachers didn’t sign up to defend against these weapons. And honestly, most people do not handle high stress situations well. And I think that’s why it’s so important to have drills more often and more training for the teachers so that their training can just kick in during a situation like that. I think no matter how small the jurisdiction and schools are, they have to have the same amount of preparedness as other larger areas where people would assume this stuff would take place, bcuz realistically it can happen anywhere.

 

[Dotta]

And, what really bothers me - and this was so apparent in the trainings I attended - are the teachers. A lot of them would not be able to handle themselves if placed in that horrible situation. I'm not knocking the teachers - well.......most of them. They didn't sign up for this. They were trained to teach - not defend - especially against an AR-15!!!! But some of the attitudes and opinions I saw in these trainings were so far off the mark that, as a parent, I certainly would not want my child in that teacher's room.


JMHO

Absolutely!
One has to have nerves of steel to keep one's wits about in such crisis.
I can't imagine myself in this situation

I once read about so called "panic rooms" in houses, used during robberies, etc.

They are bullet proof and the people stay safe there until LE come.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I’m very curious if you could elaborate a little bit in ref to the teachers attitudes/opinions during the drills.

I agree that teachers didn’t sign up to defend against these weapons. And honestly, most people do not handle high stress situations well. And I think that’s why it’s so important to have drills more often and more training for the teachers so that their training can just kick in during a situation like that. I think no matter how small the jurisdiction and schools are, they have to have the same amount of preparedness as other larger areas where people would assume this stuff would take place, bcuz realistically it can happen anywhere.

Ok - but this is gonna be long.

Yes, there is one particular training that really "stuck" with me. It was in either 2014 or 2015. It was held on a teacher planning day - so no students in the school.

The school had hired a private consulting firm to conduct it. It was 3 or 4 (I think there were 4) guys and these guys were x-FBI and had been actively involved in the incident at Waco, Texas.

We were all brought together in the cafeteria. The guys were up on the stage - introducing themselves, giving a little history, etc. Once I heard they were x-FBI - my radar went up and I was paying attention to EVERYTHING. While they were talking - one guy left. He went out the side door of the cafeteria, down the hall and out of sight. I noticed that and kept looking that way. About 5 minutes or so later - guys were still talking - this guy came back around that corner - gun in hand and FIRED ABOUT 4 -5 shots in the air!!!!! (blanks of course). Well, chaos ensued. Most of people just screamed. Me? lol - I hit the floor and immediately started crawling to the outside door opposite of where the shots were coming from. While they were yelling for everyone to calm down and sit back down - one of the guys came over to me (I had almost gotten all the way to the door), he tapped me on the back and brought me up on stage. Now, I had already taken several self-defense classes on my own in previous years. He used me as an example and even had me defend myself against an attack. (I think they all knew that I knew what I was doing).

Next, they took us out in the hallway. They told us a shooter was going to come around the corner and we were to "flee". Well, the hallway they put us in was my hallway. In fact, it was right in front of my room. I backed up and had my back against my classroom door. There were 2 teachers in front of me and they were shook & talking to each other. I told them - stick with me - I'll get you out. So, the shooter comes around the corner - everyone is grabbing at each others hands - me? I reach around - unlock my classroom door - grabbed the 2 teachers - pulled them into my room. This particular room had an outside door!!!!!! And, of course, we went through my room and out the door. We were out - we were safe.

We kinda stood around and wondered what we should do next - since we were safe. I took them down a ways and went back into the school through another door - which was where the main group had collected. A lot of those teachers were "youngsters" fresh out of college and some were shook - some were laughing and joking.

The hallway we were in was a hallway to the gym. We - as a group - went into the gym. The "guys" had set up a type of obstacle course (because when you are being shot at - you always run in a ZIG ZAG pattern). They had each of us run the obstacles which stopped at the back of the stage (the stage connected the gym to the cafeteria).


I'll finish in next post - sorry its long but you asked

 

[Inspectah_deck9]

Ok - but this is gonna be long.

Yes, there is one particular training that really "stuck" with me. It was in either 2014 or 2015. It was held on a teacher planning day - so no students in the school.

The school had hired a private consulting firm to conduct it. It was 3 or 4 (I think there were 4) guys and these guys were x-FBI and had been actively involved in the incident at Waco, Texas.

We were all brought together in the cafeteria. The guys were up on the stage - introducing themselves, giving a little history, etc. Once I heard they were x-FBI - my radar went up and I was paying attention to EVERYTHING. While they were talking - one guy left. He went out the side door of the cafeteria, down the hall and out of sight. I noticed that and kept looking that way. About 5 minutes or so later - guys were still talking - this guy came back around that corner - gun in hand and FIRED ABOUT 4 -5 shots in the air!!!!! (blanks of course). Well, chaos ensued. Most of people just screamed. Me? lol - I hit the floor and immediately started crawling to the outside door opposite of where the shots were coming from. While they were yelling for everyone to calm down and sit back down - one of the guys came over to me (I had almost gotten all the way to the door), he tapped me on the back and brought me up on stage. Now, I had already taken several self-defense classes on my own in previous years. He used me as an example and even had me defend myself against an attack. (I think they all knew that I knew what I was doing).

Next, they took us out in the hallway. They told us a shooter was going to come around the corner and we were to "flee". Well, the hallway they put us in was my hallway. In fact, it was right in front of my room. I backed up and had my back against my classroom door. There were 2 teachers in front of me and they were shook & talking to each other. I told them - stick with me - I'll get you out. So, the shooter comes around the corner - everyone is grabbing at each others hands - me? I reach around - unlock my classroom door - grabbed the 2 teachers - pulled them into my room. This particular room had an outside door!!!!!! And, of course, we went through my room and out the door. We were out - we were safe.

We kinda stood around and wondered what we should do next - since we were safe. I took them down a ways and went back into the school through another door - which was where the main group had collected. A lot of those teachers were "youngsters" fresh out of college and some were shook - some were laughing and joking.

The hallway we were in was a hallway to the gym. We - as a group - went into the gym. The "guys" had set up a type of obstacle course (because when you are being shot at - you always run in a ZIG ZAG pattern). They had each of us run the obstacles which stopped at the back of the stage (the stage connected the gym to the cafeteria).


I'll finish in next post - sorry its long but you asked

I’ll be waiting for the next part lol

 

[Wise Old Owl]

After everyone had run the obstacles - we collected as a group. The guys started talking about how we all reacted and we were just trying to "save ourselves" and what would you do if you have 15-20 little kids that you have to save as well? By then, most of the teachers were in a state of confusion? shock? - not sure. Anyway, the guy asked for hands of the kindergarten teachers (youngest of students). He then asked them this -

"What do you do if you have all your students and lil Johnny latches on to a table or chair or post and refuses to move? All the other kids are listening to you and moving toward the door or exit or wherever you point but lil Johnny won't budge. What do you do?"

Well, most of them had these blank looks on their faces. Some said "go talk to Johnny - try to get him to let go". Guy then says - "you hear the shooter - he's coming into the room shooting - and you are going to TALK to lil Johnny?"

Nobody knew what to say. So another one of the guys steps up - he tells everyone - "you leave lil Johnny and take the rest out".

Well, needless to say - that drew a very vicious response. But, their reasoning was - if you stay and try to talk to lil Johnny - you will all be dead! Yes, of course, its a horrible horrible choice but it is a live or die choice and not just for you - for the rest of those kids waiting to get out.

That discussion went on for a while. Most of them came around to the realization that while it was a life-changing choice - you had to do it - to save the rest of them. The 4 kindergarten teachers would not budge. They kept saying that they would "die" with the kids and lil Johnny! Finally, all but one of the K teachers came around - they didn't like it - but they realized what was at stake.

I will never, ever forget that "training" session. I will never, ever forget that young kindergarten teacher. And I pray every night that she is never put in that situation - for her sake and the rest of her students. But, in an active shooter situation - you will have to make choices and some of those choices are going to be HARD!!! But if that choice depends on whether you and your students live or die?

And that is what American teachers are faced with each day when they go to work, open their classrooms, welcome their students and hope and pray that they have a normal day.................................


Enough said?




JMHO

 

[Dotta]

After everyone had run the obstacles - we collected as a group. The guys started talking about how we all reacted and we were just trying to "save ourselves" and what would you do if you have 15-20 little kids that you have to save as well? By then, most of the teachers were in a state of confusion? shock? - not sure. Anyway, the guy asked for hands of the kindergarten teachers (youngest of students). He then asked them this -

"What do you do if you have all your students and lil Johnny latches on to a table or chair or post and refuses to move? All the other kids are listening to you and moving toward the door or exit or wherever you point but lil Johnny won't budge. What do you do?"

Well, most of them had these blank looks on their faces. Some said "go talk to Johnny - try to get him to let go". Guy then says - "you hear the shooter - he's coming into the room shooting - and you are going to TALK to lil Johnny?"

Nobody knew what to say. So another one of the guys steps up - he tells everyone - "you leave lil Johnny and take the rest out".

Well, needless to say - that drew a very vicious response. But, their reasoning was - if you stay and try to talk to lil Johnny - you will all be dead! Yes, of course, its a horrible horrible choice but it is a live or die choice and not just for you - for the rest of those kids waiting to get out.

That discussion went on for a while. Most of them came around to the realization that while it was a life-changing choice - you had to do it - to save the rest of them. The 4 kindergarten teachers would not budge. They kept saying that they would "die" with the kids and lil Johnny! Finally, all but one of the K teachers came around - they didn't like it - but they realized what was at stake.

I will never, ever forget that "training" session. I will never, ever forget that young kindergarten teacher. And I pray every night that she is never put in that situation - for her sake and the rest of her students. But, in an active shooter situation - you will have to make choices and some of those choices are going to be HARD!!! But if that choice depends on whether you and your students live or die?

And that is what American teachers are faced with each day when they go to work, open their classrooms, welcome their students and hope and pray that they have a normal day.................................


Enough said?




JMHO

You have a knack for writing!
You should write handbooks/guides for teachers

 

[Leve]

No - there is no hiding under desks.

Active shooter drills have evolved over the years. It usually depends on the district - with smaller rural districts not really doing them at all. At first - we were instructed to get kids into storage closets (if your room had one) - but that went out the window with Sandy Hook (AL shot up the storage closets with the kids in them!). We were told to keep a piece of construction paper taped to the back of our doors - then when the code was called - we moved it to cover that small narrow window - (shooters have taken to looking into rooms first to see if anyone is in there). Then we were told to try to barricade the door with desks and tables - but that was short lived - first responders can't get in and no one can easily get out. The latest was "someone in power" (whether it was the fire marshal or SWAT guys or whoever - I never found out who made these decisions) but they would go into each room - usually over the summer and place small pieces of masking tape in a corner of the room. This "place" was usually somewhere in the room that if someone was able to "look in that window" that they wouldn't be able to see anyone in the room. Which made no sense to me - but what did I know? They were called "safe corners" and we were told to get all the kids in that area and have them sit down.

The last school I taught at - I was on the second floor. The entire side of the building was 4 classrooms. Every room (all 4) were connected at the back wall by a door on each side (to the adjoining room) with a jack and jill bathroom in between. So - you could come into any of the 4 rooms and get to all the others. Those connecting doors DID NOT LOCK (but we kept them closed - obviously while we were teaching). In that school ( and this distressed me greatly - and I got chastised and "poo-poo'd" about trying to talk about it) was that for our active shooter drill - we were instructed to get the kids into one of the bathrooms next to our room. The bathrooms were big enough (barely) for the kids to fit and then the teacher next door and I would stand outside the bathroom doors - now remember the adjoining doors DID NOT LOCK! Talk about shooting fish in a barrel!!!!! It scared me - it really did. But that was what we were told to do.

I always had contingency plans of my own - if, heaven forbid - the "real thing" happened - about how to get the kids out. Thank the Good Lord I never had to use them!!!!

I don't think anyone has a real clue on how to "practice" for an active shooter. Each one is different and each school is set-up different. But its the world we live in now.

There is so much more I could add to this with "active shooter" training - drills - meetings - etc. that I have attended over the years. Some good - most of them are just "band-aids" trying to minimize the damage.



JMHO

"Safe Corners" is because of Parkland. He couldn't enter the rooms, they were locked, but fired through the glass in the door. Bullets wouldn't hit the safe corner and so nobody in them were injured.