Found Deceased IN - Kyran Holland, 1, Kyannah Holland, 2, Kyle Moorman II, 5, & dad, Kyle Moorman, 27, Indianapolis, 6 Jul 2022

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In Utah you can have a temporary plate that you renew monthly while working on the car until it is fully functional.

We still do not know how my 2-3 year old son got my (automatic) suburban in to reverse; you had to put your foot on the break to put it in to gear. He was alone in the front, the siblings were buckled in the back. We were very lucky nothing worse happened.

I am not necessarily blaming the children for this, but hoping that this was an accident vs something worse. I would rather this be a terrible, terrible accident than think that the father did this on purpose.

I can honestly see him going fishing after dark without diapers. If he thought the child was going to sleep through the adventure, perhaps. I remember not changing my children through the night once they reached a certain age. Perhaps he didn't take a diaper because he planned to change them when he got home and moved them to their beds.
 
MimosaMornings said:
Perhaps he got it at a good price since it had a cracked windshield, a donut tire and no air conditioning - maybe planning on fixing things as he could afford it. It was mentioned upthread that his work schedule was erratic, it’s hard switching shifts constantly.
JMO
Click to expand...
I wonder how he was managing to get to work and around prior to buying and working on the Saab. Did he have a running car at all?
 
The more I think about, the more I think this could have been a terrible accident. It's possible whatever happened had something to do with that donut tire. I've been reading about 2009 Saab 9-3's. They are considered the entry level to a luxury vehicle. Even knowing the model, there are so many variations. As an example (I'll attach the link) there is the four door sedan 2.0 T Touring vehicle with a manual transmission and front wheel drive (FWD), things like AC, Keyless entry, leather seats are standard. Then there is the four door sedan 2.0T Comfort. It has automatic transmission, FWD, etc. Most of the specs are the same.


All in all, there are about 9 different configurations of the 9-3. They all come with a compact tire (donut) and the installed tires are rated as rear tire performance and front tire performance. I'm not sure what this means, unless tires are based on FWD vs AWD. It sounds like the donut tire location could have serious ramifications if you need traction to stop your vehicle from moving since they have very little tread, are made from a different compound than rubber (harder and more slippy), have a lighter weight rim and are significantly smaller than the regular tires. Depending on whether you have AWD, RWD or FWD, where you place the donut can impact the outcome. Where they are on the vehicle has an impact, especially on a FWD vehicle because of the weight of the engine. I read that if you have a FWD vehicle and get a front tire flat, if you're using a donut spare, the best thing to do is move a rear tire to the front and put the donut on the back wheel. There's also no such thing as a universal donut tire, so it is imperative to use the donut tire that the manufacturer provided with the vehicle.

The parking pad where I presume the vehicle went into the water is on a downgrade toward the water. When I look at the image of the vehicle on the back of the tow truck, the front tire on the driver's side looks smaller than the one on the back. It doesn't have the fancy rims, so I presume this is the donut tire. Perhaps whatever happened occurred before Kyle even got out of the car. He drove onto the parking pad, maybe misjudging how close he got to the edge and the car started rolling forward. How was he situated (east/west with the driver's side of the vehicle facing the pond or north/south with the front of the vehicle facing the pond? Depending on which way his steering wheel was placed if he was trying to reverse, when he hit the gas pedal he could have made an arc that put the front left tire over the water's edge destabilizing the weight and sending the vehicle into the water.
 
branmuffin said:
The more I think about, the more I think this could have been a terrible accident. It's possible whatever happened had something to do with that donut tire. I've been reading about 2009 Saab 9-3's. They are considered the entry level to a luxury vehicle. Even knowing the model, there are so many variations. As an example (I'll attach the link) there is the four door sedan 2.0 T Touring vehicle with a manual transmission and front wheel drive (FWD), things like AC, Keyless entry, leather seats are standard. Then there is the four door sedan 2.0T Comfort. It has automatic transmission, FWD, etc. Most of the specs are the same.


All in all, there are about 9 different configurations of the 9-3. They all come with a compact tire (donut) and the installed tires are rated as rear tire performance and front tire performance. I'm not sure what this means, unless tires are based on FWD vs AWD. It sounds like the donut tire location could have serious ramifications if you need traction to stop your vehicle from moving since they have very little tread, are made from a different compound than rubber (harder and more slippy), have a lighter weight rim and are significantly smaller than the regular tires. Depending on whether you have AWD, RWD or FWD, where you place the donut can impact the outcome. Where they are on the vehicle has an impact, especially on a FWD vehicle because of the weight of the engine. I read that if you have a FWD vehicle and get a front tire flat, if you're using a donut spare, the best thing to do is move a rear tire to the front and put the donut on the back wheel. There's also no such thing as a universal donut tire, so it is imperative to use the donut tire that the manufacturer provided with the vehicle.

The parking pad where I presume the vehicle went into the water is on a downgrade toward the water. When I look at the image of the vehicle on the back of the tow truck, the front tire on the driver's side looks smaller than the one on the back. It doesn't have the fancy rims, so I presume this is the donut tire. Perhaps whatever happened occurred before Kyle even got out of the car. He drove onto the parking pad, maybe misjudging how close he got to the edge and the car started rolling forward. How was he situated (east/west with the driver's side of the vehicle facing the pond or north/south with the front of the vehicle facing the pond? Depending on which way his steering wheel was placed if he was trying to reverse, when he hit the gas pedal he could have made an arc that put the front left tire over the water's edge destabilizing the weight and sending the vehicle into the water.
Click to expand...
This is a brilliant and compelling analysis.

The fact that apparently no fishing gear was recovered probably suggests Kyle never got situated to fish or it would've been abandoned at water's edge IMO.

Kyle may have parked above that point while texting, then made his way onto the slab where the tragic, accidental nightmare unfolded swiftly and mercilessly.

No way to stop it.

JMO
 
gitana1 said:
Yes I was basing it on that. I guess some found he’s had it since March? So not so new I guess.
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I think he's had the car since March but was working on it to get it restored for some time and had only started driving it in the month before this happened. Temp plates are only legal for a month here.

Indiana BMV source on this: Temporary Permits.
 
IceIce9 said:
In Indiana a temporary plate is only valid for 30 days, at which time it has to be replaced by a regular license plate.
Click to expand...
It is 45 days now, the Indiana law changed in 2016. I am an Indiana resident and purchased 2 used cars in 2021 from a dealer and the plate was good for 45 days.

codes.findlaw.com

Indiana Code Title 9. Motor Vehicles § 9-18.1-2-8 | FindLaw

Indiana Title 9. Motor Vehicles Section 9-18.1-2-8. Read the code on FindLaw
codes.findlaw.com codes.findlaw.com
 
Kemug said:
It all hinges on the presence or absence of fishing gear, doesn't it? :(
Click to expand...
Seems so. There was no mention of anyone finding any of his fishing gear still out by the water. So I think he was done fishing by the time the tragedy happened.

It always takes my husband and son a little while to kind of wash off their gear and pack it up, so it can be put in the car. Easy when we had our truck with us. But with a car, you kind of want to rinse it off, clean it up a bit and dry it off before putting it in the car, or your trunk gets smelly and damp.... I don't know how big his trunk was.

I imagine the gear was stashed away in his trunk by the time they ended up in the water. If so, it was probably not his kids that created the mishap. Because once he put his gear away there'd be no reason not to just get right into the car at that point.

And he has been texting a couple of girls, and had said he was in his car and couldn't get out w/out waking the kids. SO that is kind of confusing still. It seems like he was in the drivers seat when this car rolled into the lake. What a tragedy.
 
Wonder what he used for bait? Probably artificial not live. I haven’t seen mention of stopping at a bait shop.
I figured there would be one full size fishing rod/reel combo for Dad and one kids size for the oldest child.
Kids size would probably fit in the trunk.
What type of fish is in that lake?
JMO
 
I'm not sure if this was Kyle's fishing pole but officers did take one into custody on the 10th.

The children did not need a fishing pole because, I believe, they were asleep. Besides, a one yr old nor a two yr old are not able to hold a fishing pole with the line in the water at night. Who would allow tiny toddlers to get that close to the water's edge after midnight? I'm not sure the 1yo could walk yet. My 5yo had a plastic, but fairly sturdy, Snoopy fishing pole so Kyle's 5yo likely had a toy fishing pole but the child was asleep, imo.

"07/10/2022, 7:07PM
Detectives contacted the last known person to speak with Kyle Moorman on phone and that individual advised nothing seemed out of place. The person said the children were asleep in car and Kyle advised his phone was going to lose battery power. Last known contact 07/07/2022 at 12:24AM."


7/10/2022 @ 11:00am
“A detective, familiar with the area, identified a large retention pond called ‘Sloan Ditch’ located at Hunter Road as a possible search location. At 11:00 AM detectives entered a dirt path behind the Bible Church of Indiana. Detectives observed that the path had recent vehicle traffic with tire tracks in the mud and disturbed brush. Along the drive path, a blue open face fishing pole was located. Photos were taken of the fishing pole and marked with a GPS map marker. Detectives walked the entire area of the body of water and noticed that there were fresh tracks into the water on a makeshift boat ramp. The officers concluded their search at approximately 12:30PM taking the fishing pole back to the missing persons office.


Jul 13, 2022 / 07:50 PM EST / Updated: Jul 14, 2022 / 06:29 AM EST
Moorman family demands answers after bodies of missing dad, kids found in pond
 
DeDee said:
I'm not sure if this was Kyle's fishing pole but officers did take one into custody on the 10th.

The children did not need a fishing pole because, I believe, they were asleep. Besides, a one yr old nor a two yr old are not able to hold a fishing pole with the line in the water at night. Who would allow tiny toddlers to get that close to the water's edge after midnight? I'm not sure the 1yo could walk yet. My 5yo had a plastic, but fairly sturdy, Snoopy fishing pole so Kyle's 5yo likely had a toy fishing pole but the child was asleep, imo.

"07/10/2022, 7:07PM
Detectives contacted the last known person to speak with Kyle Moorman on phone and that individual advised nothing seemed out of place. The person said the children were asleep in car and Kyle advised his phone was going to lose battery power. Last known contact 07/07/2022 at 12:24AM."


7/10/2022 @ 11:00am
“A detective, familiar with the area, identified a large retention pond called ‘Sloan Ditch’ located at Hunter Road as a possible search location. At 11:00 AM detectives entered a dirt path behind the Bible Church of Indiana. Detectives observed that the path had recent vehicle traffic with tire tracks in the mud and disturbed brush. Along the drive path, a blue open face fishing pole was located. Photos were taken of the fishing pole and marked with a GPS map marker. Detectives walked the entire area of the body of water and noticed that there were fresh tracks into the water on a makeshift boat ramp. The officers concluded their search at approximately 12:30PM taking the fishing pole back to the missing persons office.


Jul 13, 2022 / 07:50 PM EST / Updated: Jul 14, 2022 / 06:29 AM EST
Moorman family demands answers after bodies of missing dad, kids found in pond
Click to expand...
Thanks for this---I hadn't seen anything about the fishing pole. But I have never heard the family say it was Kuyle's, although they did think the baby bottle might have been theirs.

Did LE never show the fishing pole to his family?

The cops saw fresh tracks into the water and still never did an urgent search and investigation?
 
DeDee said:
I'm not sure if this was Kyle's fishing pole but officers did take one into custody on the 10th.

The children did not need a fishing pole because, I believe, they were asleep. Besides, a one yr old nor a two yr old are not able to hold a fishing pole with the line in the water at night. Who would allow tiny toddlers to get that close to the water's edge after midnight? I'm not sure the 1yo could walk yet. My 5yo had a plastic, but fairly sturdy, Snoopy fishing pole so Kyle's 5yo likely had a toy fishing pole but the child was asleep, imo.

"07/10/2022, 7:07PM
Detectives contacted the last known person to speak with Kyle Moorman on phone and that individual advised nothing seemed out of place. The person said the children were asleep in car and Kyle advised his phone was going to lose battery power. Last known contact 07/07/2022 at 12:24AM."


7/10/2022 @ 11:00am
“A detective, familiar with the area, identified a large retention pond called ‘Sloan Ditch’ located at Hunter Road as a possible search location. At 11:00 AM detectives entered a dirt path behind the Bible Church of Indiana. Detectives observed that the path had recent vehicle traffic with tire tracks in the mud and disturbed brush. Along the drive path, a blue open face fishing pole was located. Photos were taken of the fishing pole and marked with a GPS map marker. Detectives walked the entire area of the body of water and noticed that there were fresh tracks into the water on a makeshift boat ramp. The officers concluded their search at approximately 12:30PM taking the fishing pole back to the missing persons office.


Jul 13, 2022 / 07:50 PM EST / Updated: Jul 14, 2022 / 06:29 AM EST
Moorman family demands answers after bodies of missing dad, kids found in pond
Click to expand...
Well that’s interesting. All the initial info said there were no tire tracks.

This “investigation” seems a bit suspect to me.

MOO
 
samaor said:
Sloan Ditch, where the tire tracks were found, is a different pond from where Kyle and the kids were found. IMO, they were found to be unrelated.
Click to expand...
Ah, Ok, that makes more sense. I couldn't imagine that they found a fishing pole and tracks into the water and they didn't investigate further and sooner.
 
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