AK AK - Steve Keel, 61, missing from hunting trip, from TN - Aug 27, 2022

[Gardenista]

Dover searchers heading home

Search For Steve | Facebook

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[RickshawFan]

Dover searchers heading home

Search For Steve | Facebook

www.facebook.com

They have a volunteer who will search solo? To look for someone who got lost solo in that very place? This doesn't sound like a great plan....

 

[moonriverfarm]

So he just left a caribou carcass out in the open? Or his backpack out in the open? Wouldn't a bear smell it and come for it? And if the area is this flat and the view unobscured, seems his hunting partner would be able to find him with binoculars.

 

[Speculaytor]

We know this because he was going to retrieve the pack that had the caribou meat in it. They had both filled their tags and were done hunting.

Were there any footprints, any trail of him at all?

 

[RickshawFan]

Were there any footprints, any trail of him at all?

I guess we would have heard if there were.

 

[shefner]

Does it make sense that two outdoorsmen would separate in order for one to go off alone for a quarter mile? Since I'm not an outdoors expert, I can't be sure. But it would seem logical that the two would make plans to take on that task together.

 

[JustMyself]

Does it make sense that two outdoorsmen would separate in order for one to go off alone for a quarter mile? Since I'm not an outdoors expert, I can't be sure. But it would seem logical that the two would make plans to take on that task together.

None of it makes sense to me - I don't want a time out so I am keeping my opinions to myself as much as I can. But yes I agree with you.

 

[annpats]

the area is this flat and the view unobscured, seems his hunting partner would be able to find him with binoculars.

Exactly what I was thinking too. Flat and no trees. Nothing to obscure any view.
SAR helicopters have been over that area and can't see anything either.

So it does make me lean towards the quicksand theory.....but then both men previously walked all over that area and didn't come across any.

I also don't understand why if there was an emergency he couldn't shout to his buddy. He was less than a mile away. The sound would have carried right over the flat unobstructed distance.

Am also wondering why both men didn't return to get the caribou meat in the backpack together.

And take a compass reading?

Hmmmmm. I honestly think if he was going to be found, they would have found him by now.

MOO.

 

[Speculaytor]

Does it make sense that two outdoorsmen would separate in order for one to go off alone for a quarter mile? Since I'm not an outdoors expert, I can't be sure. But it would seem logical that the two would make plans to take on that task together.

I was thinking the same thing. And if there were no footprints or anything else to indicate he did go off on his own, I am confused and befuddled?

 

[annpats]

Does it make sense that two outdoorsmen would separate in order for one to go off alone for a quarter mile? Since I'm not an outdoors expert, I can't be sure. But it would seem logical that the two would make plans to take on that task together.

Exactly. Steve struggled with bringing the backpack of caribou in the first place, that's why it was left there, and marked, to fetch later.

So what's to say he wouldn't struggle with it a 2nd time?

His friend should really have gone with him, although I'm sure his friend probably wanted to, but maybe Steve insisted he'd be OK..... after all, it was less half a mile in an area with no trees, and they were experienced survivalists. He would've been able to see Steve during daylight.

They had no problem with the terrain before, nor did they find any quicksand areas.

And his body has not been seen by SAR helicopter, which sounds odd, but he was probably wearing camouflage clothing, so that makes sense why.

I really don't know what to make of it all really.

 

[RickshawFan]

Does it make sense that two outdoorsmen would separate in order for one to go off alone for a quarter mile? Since I'm not an outdoors expert, I can't be sure. But it would seem logical that the two would make plans to take on that task together.

Per ^^^^ the actual distance was over 1/2 mile.
The area is so hazardous, locals don’t like to go there except when it’s frozen.
Per ^^^^^ the meat and the pack had been plopped in the open because SK was physically unable to get it to camp the day before. I would guess he was REALLY incapacitated to be willing to plonk his prize out in the open. And then, to only mark it with a walking stick?
Experienced outdoors people hang together. Cardinal rule. And there doesn’t seem to have been a compelling reason for them to split up.
In this case, too, an essential piece of equipment was the satellite communicator. They only had one.

There was a catastrophe earlier this month—in a less formidable location—where 2 hikers split up. After a days’ long search, one was finally found: deceased. The other was okay.

Mystery surrounds death of hiker who vanished trying to get water for girlfriend

A HIKER who vanished after he went searching for water for his girlfriend in the California mountains has turned up dead. A days-long search for Tim Sgrignoli, 29, ended on Thursday after authoriti…

www.the-sun.com

 

[LauraAnne]

Per ^^^^ the actual distance was over 1/2 mile.
The area is so hazardous, locals don’t like to go there except when it’s frozen.
Per ^^^^^ the meat and the pack had been plopped in the open because SK was physically unable to get it to camp the day before. I would guess he was REALLY incapacitated to be willing to plonk his prize out in the open. And then, to only mark it with a walking stick?
Experienced outdoors people hang together. Cardinal rule. And there doesn’t seem to have been a compelling reason for them to split up.
In this case, too, an essential piece of equipment was the satellite communicator. They only had one.

There was a catastrophe earlier this month—in a less formidable location—where 2 hikers split up. After a days’ long search, one was finally found: deceased. The other was okay.

Mystery surrounds death of hiker who vanished trying to get water for girlfriend

A HIKER who vanished after he went searching for water for his girlfriend in the California mountains has turned up dead. A days-long search for Tim Sgrignoli, 29, ended on Thursday after authoriti…

www.the-sun.com

I'm not sure about that. This is more along the lines of a group of people who are doing "pack in" camping, where they park at a location and pack all their equipment in, a mile or half a mile or whatever. One member of the party will often go back to the parking area to retrieve something out of the vehicle, with no problems. His intention, apparently, was to go back to where he dropped the pack and retrieve it. On the face of that, I'm not sure it would be typical for both to go. I'm still a little unclear on details. Could he not actually SEE the base camp from where the backpack was?

 

[RickshawFan]

Exactly. Steve struggled with bringing the backpack of caribou in the first place, that's why it was left there, and marked, to fetch later.

So what's to say he wouldn't struggle with it a 2nd time?

His friend should really have gone with him, although I'm sure his friend probably wanted to, but maybe Steve insisted he'd be OK..... after all, it was less half a mile in an area with no trees, and they were experienced survivalists. He would've been able to see Steve during daylight.

They had no problem with the terrain before, nor did they find any quicksand areas.

And his body has not been seen by SAR helicopter, which sounds odd, but he was probably wearing camouflage clothing, so that makes sense why.

I really don't know what to make of it all really.

I agree with most everything, except a couple of points:
—these were not “experienced survivalists”; they may have gone hunting many times in TN, but experienced folks would much more completely have assessed and mitigated risk.
—SK could not be seen from the camp where he set out, even in broad daylight. That point is demonstrated simply by the inability to find him with aerial search, though the terrain looks like it’s a blank. Plus, locals appreciate how hard it is to find people. And yes, he was evidently in camo. Since he was done hunting, he and his buddy might easily have put on fluorescent orange vests if they were committed to their outfits: a very simple precaution.
An important visibility factor: the area is prone to fog.

If I look at backcountry cases where injured/lost folks are described as “experienced”, generally that’s by friends and family. It often means something like, “they’ve gone backcountry hiking/hunting/skiing/snowmobiling a bunch of times.” But this isn’t a measure of experience: it’s the luck of the draw. Most of the time, nothing will go wrong… But when your luck quotient is spent, and you haven’t assessed your real risks and prepared for them….Often, what we see missing are basics, outdoor skills 101, and not anything that would take years to learn.

 

[RickshawFan]

I always like to write a side note in WS cases like this one about how to enhance your outdoor safety.
My #1A method is to assemble your “10 essentials” and take them.
My #1B method is to go out with old-timers. Right now, there are people flocking to the outdoors, and getting lucky. Sometimes, athleticism is confused with “experience”, sometimes a bunch of hikes, sometimes a bunch of expensive gear, sometimes a plan, even if it’s detached from reality, sometimes an expensive smartphone…
But IMO the very best source is to go out with a group of old-timers (often this is free) and listen. They will tell stories about their near-catastrophes, what kinds of items can make a huge difference in an emergency (the vaseline on cotton balls is a good example), and what CAN go wrong that you never imagined. This is how you learn how quickly heat exhaustion or hypothermia can take over, what landscapes to avoid because of the potential for slides or avalanches and what these even look like when you’re out there, simple protocols like re-grouping at trail junctions and fixing a turnaround time…

Free or low cost day trips? Try:
Green Mountain Club
Appalachian Mountain Club
Local mountaineering clubs
Black Girls Hike
Outdoor Afro
Latino Outdoors
Sierra Club, especially local chapters
MeetUps
Wilderness First Aid, e.g. at REI (lowish cost, and you can advance your skill in winter when you can’t go out)
Map and compass workshop
Local recreation groups
Ranger-led hikes at national parks (see how some now are even requiring lugged boots for these hikes? CLUE! Evidently, lugged boots are risk mitigation….)

 

[Jade]

The permafrost down a couple of feet stops snow melt absorption into the soil making many ponds and wet, soggy areas on the surface.

The mud bogs aren’t like the stereotypical jungle quicksand where rain is absorbed into the water table infinitely. With the permafrost down a couple of feet one wouldn’t sink all the way in like in horror movies apparently.

I agree that in such a landscape that a deceased person, face down, in camo clothes would just look like the rest of the land… The hunter that said he ran across his friend said the area has rolling hills.



Here is picture of him from the day before on the public face book page. The caption says he looks healthy and happy but not knowing him he looks tired and uncomfortable like his pack is too heavy or not situated to keep him from awkwardly bending forward under the weight.

Search For Steve | Well the weather has cleared and the team is out | Facebook


Since he was gun hunting the camp was probably 5 miles at least from the vehicle?

>>In this Land of the Midnight Sun, the sun never dips below the horizon for 67 days each summer.

Hunting is a way of life in Alaska, and, in season, bow hunting is allowed along the Dalton Highway. Firearm hunting, however, is not permitted within 5 miles on either side of the road.>>

The long (long) road to a famous dead end

Alaska Daylight Hours Calculator

Unbearable swarms of black flies, mosquitoes and gnats are apparently why many sleep in a vehicle.


I didn’t see where they were experienced survivalists. It was mentioned they are experienced outdoors men.



All imo

 

[RickshawFan]

The permafrost down a couple of feet stops snow melt absorption into the soil making many ponds and wet, soggy areas on the surface.

The mud bogs aren’t like the stereotypical jungle quicksand where rain is absorbed into the water table infinitely. With the permafrost down a couple of feet one wouldn’t sink all the way in like in horror movies apparently.

I agree that in such a landscape that a deceased person, face down, in camo clothes would just look like the rest of the land… The hunter that said he ran across his friend said the area has rolling hills.



Here is picture of him from the day before on the public face book page. The caption says he looks healthy and happy but not knowing him he looks tired and uncomfortable like his pack is too heavy or not situated to keep him from awkwardly bending forward under the weight.

Search For Steve | Well the weather has cleared and the team is out | Facebook


Since he was gun hunting the camp was probably 5 miles at least from the vehicle?

>>In this Land of the Midnight Sun, the sun never dips below the horizon for 67 days each summer.

Hunting is a way of life in Alaska, and, in season, bow hunting is allowed along the Dalton Highway. Firearm hunting, however, is not permitted within 5 miles on either side of the road.>>

The long (long) road to a famous dead end

Alaska Daylight Hours Calculator

Unbearable swarms of black flies, mosquitoes and gnats are apparently why many sleep in a vehicle.


I didn’t see where they were experienced survivalists. It was mentioned they are experienced outdoors men.



All imo

I'm thinking the long daylight hours might lead you to confuse east and west.

 

[RickshawFan]

Here is picture of him from the day before on the public face book page. The caption says he looks healthy and happy but not knowing him he looks tired and uncomfortable like his pack is too heavy or not situated to keep him from awkwardly bending forward under the weight.

Snipped for focus....

This was my read of the photo as well. I'm assuming one would be tired after a long day schlepping that thing around, but I, too, didn't read this as "happy go lucky".
I think you're on to something about weight distribution; so much weight is far from the torso. SK doesn't seem to be a big man. That weight far from the torso, would be much more of a burden than if it was close to the torso. To compensate, you have to lean forward. You also get jerked with every step; this increases fatigue.
Also, if that was the pole that was left to mark the dump spot of the kill, the kill was never going to be found unless you had perfect GPS co-ordinates. IMO. Look how it blends into the landscape?

I'm imagining SK couldn't find his prize the next day and panicked..... and then hypothermia set in.

*****
You can try this at home: pack your pack different ways and see how the feel of "weight" is often a matter of perception of exactly the same stuff.
AND if you're messing about with your pack, look closely at the buckle on the sternum strap. Does it have an integrated emergency whistle?

 

[RickshawFan]

Oh dear, from the Search for Steve FB site, quoting Nick Beres at local SAR, significant t's weren't crossed and i's dotted, and there was misunderstanding of the resources available. We kinda guessed about this here, but several details jumped out at me that I hadn't seen before and wouldn't know unless I planned a trip there:

—think of SAR as a local resource, for tax-paying residents. LE K-9's are for drug sniffing, not SAR.
—air assets can't legally be flown more than a certain number of hours before maintenance; this would imply you can't be sending out a steady stream of helicopters to help you out (BTW, the lost site was 1 1/2 hours from the helicopter home base).
—SAR coverage area is larger than the state of Minnesota.
****visitors to the backcountry generally check in with SAR/LE BEFORE their trip
****you have to have a permit from BLM and USFWS....interesting that they point to this
****even natives carry PLB's

 

[RickshawFan]

The above note from local SAR had me investigating the BLM permits required for recreation/hunting on the North Slope. This is it in 2018. Note, all permits are for GUIDED trips and are very specific about location, numbers, etc.

https://www.blm.gov/sites/blm.gov/files/uploads/GetInvolved_NearYou_Alaska_NPR-A_SAP_Permitted_Projects_NPR-A.pdf

BLM also evidently has Visitor Centers on Dalton Highway where you can check in. A run down of the Dalton Hwy resources is here:

Road Trip: Dalton Highway, Alaska -- National Geographic

Get stop-by-stop directions for a driving tour of Alaska's Dalton Highway from National Geographic's Ultimate Road Trips. A mostly gravel road does not do justice to the vastly dramatic scenery that lies along its winding path.

www.nationalgeographic.com

 

[annpats]

SK could not be seen from the camp where he set out, even in broad daylight.

Why is that? The land is relatively flat, there are no trees....he was half a mile away. Why wouldn't he be seen?

Hope.someone can help us understand.