ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 12

[tokyorose]

I Was just thinking about K She was leaving or already had left and came back for a visit and bid a farewell to all her friends and start Her life As An Adult, I think she was the Target, Someone IE unstable Had a secret crush, maybe was spurned By Her And Couldn’t accept Her moving on and beginning Her life In another city or state, And maybe took this opportunity since She came for the weekend Of course it would’ve had to be someone who knew she was coming for a visit to plan this out… JMO

My working theory as well.

 

[wary]

In addition to the dog - something else that bothers me about the time shortly before the crime occured- Are all the frantic phone calls k and M made before 3 am- makes me wonder - was something suspicious going on outside/ inside the residence? What triggered that flurry of calls? also IF something suspicious was going on- why did they reach out to the xbf rather than LE?

K’s sister said that K was notorious for making repeated calls when she didn’t get an answer—often about trivial things.

 

[NuttMegg]

I would say this will very very much affect them....and I would also think they have answered all of LE''s questions and have helped as far as they can

but WE, the public, do not have the right to know the ins and outs of what these girls were doing that night if they choose not to put that information 'out there'. Does 'civic duty' in the U.S extend to this lack of privacy some are calling for? There appears to be an ever present hunger for all the details in cases like these

They owe the general public nothing. I wish they'd come up with a different term than survivors. I'd say just leave them alone, they have cooperated with LE. They have enough to deal with without reaching out to media or youtube to begin another cycle of salacious/speculative chatter.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

It's very strange that the dog didn't alert the residents of the house that a stranger had entered the house at night. I would think that even a very friendly dog would sense that something was terribly wrong. I've read that in the Oregon stabbings, there was also a dog in the house and he was left unharmed - has anybody read that as well? I haven't read any details about the Washington State stabbing. It's really chilling how many similarities there are between all three incidents - IMO, this definitely points to a serial killer living somewhere in the Northwest and makes it less likely that he was a local from Moscow, Idaho.

I don't understand the insistence that a dog would alert the residents. Not all dogs have that temperament. My dog only barks when we leave him home alone and that's literally the ONLY time he barks. If a stranger came in, even if at night, he would just go up to him, and sniff him and jump up with his front paws on the person requesting to be pet.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Even then, we know lots of people were in this house so random DNA means very little. If we get DNA on the chest of a victim, hurray!

And if they get DNA from the chest of a victim that links to another of the 13th murder, hurrayer!

Even if they couldn't ID the person, they'd know they were dealing with someone with specific behaviors.

Reverse search warrants are routinely ruled unconstitutional. I’ll look for Idaho cases in a bit; here’s Wiki for now. Geo-fence warrant - Wikipedia

I haven't done any real case law research in ID, but a brief search showed nothing. I also checked and Idaho is not a state with enhanced privacy laws, so potentially, maybe this will help LE, though I doubt it would do them much good, unless the killer is dumb as a rock and time-traveled from 1985.

Privacy Protections in State Constitutions

I am replying to a poster who stated there could be a connection between a murder committed exactly 14 monthe prior to this horrific ID murder...
Sorry that it may not be found in my reply...
New WS set-up has me a little confused...

The dates also align with some university calendars (break, end of session, holiday).

interesting.. this makes 4 other cases now with the main facts in common being-

• appears to have occurred on the 13th
• happened around 3am
• all unsolved stabbings
• something new I just thought of: all have highways going through town. I’m not from the areas, so not sure if they are trucker routes?

These would not be heavily traveled roads similar to the I-5 corridor, for example, but trucks are going to go in and out to deliver because there's just a whole lot of nothing around.

The UI president emphasizes that the murders took place off campus, just about every time he speaks. One reason is to try to assure parents, students and alumni that the campus itself is safe, i.e. it didn't happen in the residence halls. Another reason is likely on the advice of the University's general counsel, for legal reasons. JMO.

Well, saying it and having it interpreted as such in a civil law case are two different things. just sayin'. But yes, I bet you're right that counsel is advising that.

I've never seen a police log. I do note the discrepancy of the updated report on the Moscow, Idaho website which now reads:
" On the morning of the incident, officers located a dog at the residence. The dog was unharmed and turned over to Animal Services and then released to a responsible party."

I just don't understand turning the dog over to Animal Services if you know where the dog lived and who owns the dog (the ex-boyfriend.) If you don't know the owner and he doesn't have a collar, that's one thing. Or a disgruntled neighbor sending the dog away to try and instill responsible dog ownership principles is understandable (rude.)

But for the police to confiscate the dog from his home and turn him over to Animal Services.... why?

Just a guess, but dogs are considered 'property' in Idaho, and so it's likely they had to take the property and turn it over to the legal owner.

https://legislature.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/statutesrules/idstat/Title25/T25CH35.pdf

 

[AngTxGal]

I'm just curious what type of civic duty requires 2 young ladies to turn into public figures. IMO

Agree
My guess is people are speaking of the two survivors.
There is no ‘civic duty’ that requires or even obligates them to speak to the public regarding anything at all concerning this event or any other aspect of their lives.
It essentially is none of our business. Further- if I was a parent of a 20 yr old who had been in such a traumatic event I would advise not to do so
I trust my kids in the world as they are good people, I do not trust the world with my kids!
JMO

 

[sds71]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1596204642358087681

 

[Trouble1321075]

MOO

They have a civic duty to speak to LE. (I’m confident that they did, otherwise, I doubt that LE would have said that they were cleared.) They also have a constitutional right to not speak to LE, but, as I said, I really doubt that they used it.

Do they have a ‘civic duty’ to talk to the news media? Absolutely not! No duty at all. In fact, they may have a strong civic duty to NOT speak to them, if LE has advised them not to.

MOO

I generally agree with everything your saying. I do think that their lives have become a public interest. If they can share something that save people they have a moral obligation to share that information. Jmo.

It's a big statement to come from me because as you rightly point out they are legally obligated to share anything with anyone. I typically advocate that people should not cooperate with law enforcement because they may be inadvertently putting themselves into legal jeapordy. Moral obligations are different than legal ones.

 

[Megnut]

MOO

If this were an episode of Criminal Minds, the unsub wouldn't be the guy drooling over dancers at the strip club but the regular who sits in the back, nursing beers and getting off on his internal dialogue. Hating on the women for doing what they're doing. Manipulating men, as he sees it.

I think THIS unsub is a W A T C H E R.

Injustice collector.

IMO he watches the interplay of coeds at the bar. Watches guys hit on girls, watches girls flirt back, reject.... and decides which women he hates most. He's collecting what he perceives to be injustices toward other men.

I think we need to back up. That night K and M went out to a local club, stopped for food, went home.

Not atypical college behavior.

Good chance they'd done it before. I think that might be when, unknown to them, their path crossed this guy's path.

And I think he saw them on the night of and he watched and watched and his sense of injustice in his skewed brain only raged.

I think he witnessed what he deemed was an unforgivable slight, not directed at him, at another male. Avenger.

Went home, got a weapon, and headed out, dressed to kill.

We don't know that the night of these wicked slayings was the first time he showed up there. A week before, months before..... but maybe he couldn't gain entry and retreated, roommates altogether unaware.

This night, IMO, he let himself in after quiet settled across the house... maneuvered to the third floor, executing his targets, perhaps one more than the other.

I suspect E and X heard something and were positioned to investigate, possibly even flipping their light on. Horrors.

I believe E and X had defensive wounds because they had a moment to process, more than K and M did. They had TIME to IMO raise their hands to attempt to ward of blows.

Tragically I believe one of the four witnessed a murder before being murdered herself. Nightmare of nightmares.

In the morning IMO all was quiet. Too quiet. Deathly quiet.

I think the slider was open. There may have been footprints or a drop of blood, enough for the surviving roommates to race out of there, returning only with friends, probably from the frat house... and I think one of them tried to peer through the window, unable to see X who was IMO on the floor near the window and spying only a portion of E, not moving. The 911 call escalating.

I wonder if any of the four wore fit bits. Story told.

Find the night club. Look for the watcher.

That's my theory.

JMO

My heart is broken for the families, all those reeling from this terrible loss of life, youth, hope, future...

 

[tokyorose]

In addition to the dog - something else that bothers me about the time shortly before the crime occured- Are all the frantic phone calls k and M made before 3 am- makes me wonder - was something suspicious going on outside/ inside the residence? What triggered that flurry of calls? also IF something suspicious was going on- why did they reach out to the xbf rather than LE?

LE stated in a press conference that calls were unrelated.

 

[archisleuth]

My theory about the general focus on K being ’targeted’ goes like this: once LE used the term, and very little else was known, it was understandable that many would look for which of the 4 had your typical ‘mystery story’ motive possibility. AHA! We have a recent breakup, calls to the Ex, and a victim only visiting before leaving for good! Kaylee at first seemed to provide the easiest ‘explanation’ for ‘targeting.’

But now the Ex has been essentially ruled out. So the spurned ex boyfriend motive isn’t working. Now there are many other variants of motives. So many!!!! I just pray that LE has much more substantial evidence to work with!

Personally, I’m intrigued by the killer’s movements: he went upstairs, but not downstairs. To me, that says at least one person upstairs was a target. If Ethan alone was the target, no need to go up there. But if the two girls who worked st the restaurant were targets, yes, he would have reason to go upstairs. Just one possibility.

But I still hold my orginal theory, that someone stopped by, all 4 had a brief nasty run-in with him. And drunk and furious, he came back.

I think you have a good point. Given no forced entry, I wonder if the person knocked on the slider and was let in because it was someone they knew.

I also don’t feel certain that EX has been totally ruled out. On the MPD website it says “Who is not believed to be involved?” That language leaves some wiggle room.

 

[UKUS]

Cell Phone Pinging Cell Towers: How Often and When? - Tech With Tech

Here’s how often and when a cell phone pings the cell towers: The number of pings primarily depends on phone usage. A phone will ping when it gets close to a new tower, when you change the connection status and when it needs to establish a connection (such as for a phone call). If left ... <a...

techwithtech.com

''TABLE OF CONTENTS
1 When Does a Cell Phone Ping a Cell Tower? (3 Scenarios)
1.1 #1 When You Move
1.2 #2 Force Ping
1.3 #3 Airplane Mode
2 When Does a Cell Phone Connect to a Cell Tower? (2 Things)
2.1 #1 Cell Phone Channels
2.2 #2 When You Use the Phone
3 How Does Pinging From Your Cell Phone to a Cell Tower Work? (4 Things)
3.1 #1 The Cell Tower Network
3.2 #2 EM Radiation
3.3 #3 Switching
3.4 #4 Understanding Range''

WiFi Towers – What They Are and How They Work – Complete Guide

I've covered a lot of topics related to WiFi on this site, but one thing that I haven't covered is WiFi towers. In this article, we're going to talk about

emfacademy.com

''WiFi towers, sometimes called WiFi antennas, are like really large WiFi routers. They provide wireless internet access to homes and businesses where traditional wired internet connections, such as cable, DSL, or fiber, are not available. These WiFi towers, just like your home router, work using the 2.4 GHz and 5GHz radio frequencies to pass data between the tower, and a WiFi router in the home.''

So, instead of the router in your home being connected to a phone line to receive its internet, and then passing that internet to the other devices in your home, your router would instead wirelessly receive an internet connection from the nearest WiFi tower.''

How Do WiFi Towers Work?​

WiFi towers typically work in series or pairs, meaning that there typically isn’t just a single tower that is passing internet to all the homes around it, like how we think of cell towers. Instead, there will typically be one WiFi tower that is receiving a wired internet connection to the internet, and then that WiFi tower passes the internet wirelessly to another WiFi tower.

Unlike WiFi routers and cell towers, WiFi towers cannot typically transmit data in a full circle, they are instead tuned to directionally pass data to another specific tower. These WiFi towers need to be in direct view of one another, as they are not made to pass data through obstructions''.

excellent information @dotr thank you!

 

[DrvonMizzle]

LE stated in a press conference that calls were unrelated.

Okay good to know - I missed that!

 

[hockeymom]

Victim’s father says Moscow police believe only one of four students killed was ‘target’

So what would lead them to believe this? One more brutally attacted? Something left behind by perp? Something taken from victim?

 

[sds71]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1596209774739484672

https://twitter.com/x/status/1596209778799579136

https://twitter.com/x/status/1596209783140667393

 

[Zinn]

There have been no reports that they left texts or voice mails.

KG’s parents relayed some of the content of her “final messages” when asked about those calls in a televised Fox interview. Basically asking ex-bf to respond to her and to come over, but including the explanation “we have a dog together” which sounds more like a desire to connect emotionally rather than a request for emergency protection.

The parents did not indicate whether these were phone or text messages, though in my opinion, it sounded to me like the father had heard a message as he emphasized some of the phrasing in an emotive way.

It’s also not clear whether they read/heard these messages personally or whether the information was relayed by LE or the recipient of the messages. If only relayed/paraphrased by the recipient, the degree of accuracy could be all over the map, from perfectly accurate to compete fiction.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

I 100% agree- I’m personally down to this theory with a small chance it’s the serial killer theory that I shared a few pages back (trucker/contractor that felt the same way or felt turned down by the girls when encountering them at their restaurant job or at the bar that night) all IMO.

This is probably OT...
But a question I have to ask...

Is there a profile of females who target males who are in the same demographics as these girls?

Flip side: young, college, attractive, male students...
are attacked by females that find themselves by perception... not being attractive enough to the males they desire...
And therefore... stalk/obsess/harm innocent males whom they have such hatred for?

I imagine there are cases such as these...
Just seems like there is a higher percentage of males committing these types of crimes...

Just putting this out there...

 

[Mofranjo]

@layer has a really good point about Kaylee. I feel like the spotlight was on her from the jump with this case, even before her family became so vocal. I wonder why that is. It could be media bias that is way off topic for this site or it could be that she is the one who was targeted. Side note that she often seemed front and center in the roommate group. JMO

I've never seen a police log. I do note the discrepancy of the updated report on the Moscow, Idaho website which now reads:
" On the morning of the incident, officers located a dog at the residence. The dog was unharmed and turned over to Animal Services and then released to a responsible party."

I just don't understand turning the dog over to Animal Services if you know where the dog lived and who owns the dog (the ex-boyfriend.) If you don't know the owner and he doesn't have a collar, that's one thing. Or a disgruntled neighbor sending the dog away to try and instill responsible dog ownership principles is understandable (rude.)

But for the police to confiscate the dog from his home and turn him over to Animal Services.... why?

I guess they didn’t know whose dog it was I think her ex boyfriend has dog now I read

 

[Dutch77]

K’s sister said that K was notorious for making repeated calls when she didn’t get an answer—often about trivial things.

The calls were spread out over a 30 minute period so sure seems like innocent drunk dialing.

 

[Simply Southern]

MOO....

Yes and no. They have a right to not be harassed but they also have a civic duty. This crime does not only affect them. It has impacted the entire community and really much of the nation. They may not want to be public figures but by circumstance they are. Like it or not.

The survivors are victims. IMHO the roommates are traumatized, scared they could be the next target. I would protect my child anyway possible to keep them safe and media free. Their only civic duty was met, when they spoke with police.

These roommates owe the public nothing, mho. We own them the right to protection, medical care, privacy and prayers.


MOO...