ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 14

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diabeticrockstar said:
I believe Killer exited via the far side of the 3rd balcony. I do believe that is blood (there is no other spots with "berries" leaving marks like that....and the marks are about the width apart as two hands lowering themselves down/hanging from the balcony to quietly as possible drop down).
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It was the width of the marks that struck me also, and it seems to be that area of the roof the investigators were pointing to in this image:

1669541637751.png

(image from: Police still yet to name suspect nearly 2 weeks after University of Idaho murders)
 
wary said:
I hope so much that they have seriously useful DNA evidence.

I don’t know how LE thinks. I’m not sure they really even think in terms of clearing people—more like finding evidence that points toward someone guilty, maybe?

My guess is that they only post the list of ‘cleared’ to try to take the heat off of innocent people who’ve been hit hard by sleuther speculation. So they’re not going to bother to add anyone to the list unless they’re already in the public eye.

All this only my speculation.
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True. They will find the killer. If not, then they'll turn to public for help. In the meantime, for the public accuse a person who may not only be innocent, but is likely, seriously grieving, is not fair. Good luck to the police.
(BTW, it is incredibly easy to slip into the house if the door is opened for a minute, say, one of the girls went out to look for a dog and was standing with her back to the door, and someone was waiting for the moment. JMO.)
 
MsBetsy said:
There are trees that have berries such as the mountain ash, mulberry, or yew. Imo
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I think it is a mountain ash which does have red berries, as seen in the very upper right of this pic.

Even as I was typing this, I'm thinking it's not so important to know how the perp got in because we just know they did and it is more important to find out WHO they are, not how they got in. Then I think it MAY help figure out whether they are someone known to the victims or a random unknown lurking in the bushes, and IF that's how they entered and left the scene could be important in knowing where LE should be looking for possible security system captures.

Okay, I'm rambling and while some of you folks are just getting up, it's wayyyyyy past my bedtime here.

1669542771228.png
 
Sillybilly said:
I think it is a mountain ash which does have red berries, as seen in the very upper right of this pic.

Even as I was typing this, I'm thinking it's not so important to know how the perp got in because we just know they did and it is more important to find out WHO they are, not how they got in. Then I think it MAY help figure out whether they are someone known to the victims or a random unknown lurking in the bushes, and IF that's how they entered and left the scene could be important in knowing where LE should be looking for possible security system captures.

Okay, I'm rambling and while some of you folks are just getting up, it's wayyyyyy past my bedtime here.

View attachment 382946
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The red marks on the balcony are the same bright color as the berries. Blood would have turned dark a long time ago. If the red marks on the wood are not from berries, they are far more likely to be traces of an older paint job showing through than blood.
 
diabeticrockstar said:
My personal theory, formed after reading a collection of opinions thru threads 12&13, several unusual discrepancies in the timeline & official releases, and statements given by family members to traditional media outlets:

I believe the intended target was Xana. (Secondary Q's: Has she always had the 2nd floor BR? What was father referring to when he stated she had "recently turned her life around"?). I believe there was a triggering event that occurred earlier in the night; the timeline given by LE still does not account for several hours. First they released X & E were at party from 8p to 130a. Then they changed it to 8p to 9p five days ago. Yesterday they ammend their timeline to say that X/E arrived back home at 130 but did not say they attended the party entire time. (Additionally, this would explain the specific request for tips about the frat party. There has been rampant, thus far not founded, rumors of an incident at that party. Frat also went dark online unlike the girls' sororities). Conflicting the released info is X'S father stating he talked to her around midnight. (Partying at a frat...take 5 min to call dad at midnight?). She told her dad that her and E were "staying at home to watch a movie"--if this is true I doubt police would leave the timeline as-is.

I initially believed the killer (singular) entered home via the 2nd floor sliding door. In this scenario going to the 3rd floor would be unnecessary and undermine my hypothesis. After the photos of roof, 3rd floor balcony, tree line, etc. I believe killer entered through 3rd floor sliding door-perhaps had waited on roof as one person theorized, but most likely utilizing the relative privacy of the wooded side of house and steep incline. I believe this entrance afforded killer most private entry, perhaps thinking he could sneak in, or that possibly the room would be unattended (Kaylee had been out of town)(Also goes back to my inquiry about previous room occupant). Killer enters and makes quick strike to K, possibly K & M both (I believe they were in same bed. But this info has not been released). Killer then moves on. Perhaps to M's room, perhaps surprised that the duo are each still awake (whether because of dog issue, drunk dialing, etc).

I believe that the red liquid photographed is that of blood (as ME or coroner had confirmed in a media interview). That is location of a 2nd floor bedroom according to Floorplan. I believe this scene was the most violent. (X w/ defensive wounds)(Visual blood loss through wall to outside). I think there is a possibility that either E or X had wounds/were staged leading LE to believe it was targeted. (An ex? A Greek member?)

I believe Killer exited via the far side of the 3rd balcony. I do believe that is blood (there is no other spots with "berries" leaving marks like that....and the marks are about the width apart as two hands lowering themselves down/hanging from the balcony to quietly as possible drop down).

Sorry. That was long. All MOO. I wanted to be clear and concise so to make clear.

I also do not believe Killer knew about or cared about the first floor & it's inhabitants. The 911 call and The Dog to me are interesting, but I believe they are intangibles not of direct importance to case. I believe the police somewhat "focusing" on K/M is a public misdirect, and that the specific request for info/tips regarding the frat party and subsequent events is very telling.

Edit: PHOTO BELOW for context of theory
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Thank you for this.
Are the “berry marks” posted on the previous thread? I’m so behind and reading backwards.:)
 
Please be kind as this is my 1st time posting! But this case is keeping me awake at night and felt I had to join the discussion.
My theory is that the perp is a local, maybe interacted a few times with one of the girls. Maybe via their job or just out and about. He took a liking to them, found them on social media and became obsessed. Probably followed them around, most definitely watched the house, got an idea of the layout. Entered via the sliding doors, didn't expect the male in the house and this disturbed the sexual element being present at the scene. I think the dog didn't bark because he's just used to alot of people being around the house? I truly believe this perp will try again.
 
Porki said:
Thread 13, post #977 has the pic with obvious berries on the tree right next to the deck.

Sorry, can't get it to link.
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We don't quote post numbers because those can change over time due to Mods having to remove posts.

The following will help everyone know how to quote a post from elsewhere and then your link will not change due to moderation:

How to Quote a Post from Another Thread
 
Is everyone assuming the killer is a "he"? Jealousy and early morning phone calls to your crush/new love interest/guy your stalking can drive a girl to murder. Wait until everyone is asleep then kill whoever you despise for getting in between you and the man you want to be with. When your done change into your victim's clothes and walk out unoticed by neighbors.
 
DeViLintheDetaiL said:
Is everyone assuming the killer is a "he"? Jealousy and early morning phone calls to your crush/new love interest/guy your stalking can drive a girl to murder. Wait until everyone is asleep then kill whoever you despise for getting in between you and the man you want to be with. When your done change into your victim's clothes and walk out unoticed by neighbors.
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I was thinking about it, but then came across an article I linked at the very beginning of this thread. Someone in GB decided to measure the forces developing during knife attacks. They appeared huge, but one of the differences in the study was that women tended to not overuse such forces. (Not because they are weaker, i wonder if it is behavioral). Men typically use a lot of force during knife attacks. Of course, there are exceptions, and one could reason that a woman is not exhausting herself during such attacks and could potentially kill more people. Only the police knows how it looked, what the impact was. If the only person the killer had to fight with was X, it could be a woman. If E were awake and put up some fight, I'd say, it would take a man. But we don't know the details.
 
Comment on DNA results: the murderer does not have to be in the national DNA database to be identified by crime scene DNA. LE, FBI, investigators most likely collected a DNA sample from all those interviewed. Imagine someone they interviewed declining to submit to a simple buccal swab for DNA, right away that would throw a red flag. Comment regarding the 911 call "unresponsive person": yes some language usage is standard by dispatch. The caller may or may not have used the description "unresponsive". Standardized language is commonly used in many industries, organizations and public service sectors. This language prompts a more efficient response to requests. Example being a police call for unresponsive will trigger responding officers to prepare a narcan kit, contact EMS, and wear PPE, (personal protective equipment). PPE such as mask, and gloves to aid in protection from potentially hazardous biologic material. Dispatch may or may not have asked qualifying questions of the caller. These are questions like, is he breathing, do you feel a heartbeat, etc. The 911 caller may or may not be comfortable touching an unresponsive person to check for heartbeat or breathing. I worked in the ER for many years. When a patient registered to be seen in the ER in the main lobby, we were immediately prompted to the basic complaints. Our staff then had a room ready to include necessary equipment to best treat the incoming patient. Examples are ; the patient complaining of chest pain and SOB,(shortness of breath), we communicated that with the description "a heart" is coming to ER suite 100. Staff had an EKG machine, cardiology on stand-by, lab for cardiac enzymes etc., Everything needed to address a potential heart attack. A patient registering with laceration, we had a room ready with wound care, possibly x-ray and lab for microbiology testing etc. This 911 call could reflect this basic standardization of communication to insure an efficient response. The possibility that whoever called 911 saw an unresponsive person only, without blood still exists. It's possible the person wasn't a victim, rather someone else who was passed out in the house. In this day of overdoses, the dispatch may ask if there are any other passed out people. It could be then or even before the 911 call that as they walked through the house they found locked doors and became panicked, calling friends to come over. They may have had no awareness of the attacks. They may not have recognized the "unresponsive" person at that point. It's a party house, people in and out, someone's passed out, they call friends over, discover locked doors, things get weird, everyone's a little hungover... MOO
 
Sillybilly said:
We don't quote post numbers because those can change over time due to Mods having to remove posts.

The following will help everyone know how to quote a post from elsewhere and then your link will not change due to moderation:

How to Quote a Post from Another Thread
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Thanks for this info!

Here is a post with a video showing the tree with all its berries. I had seen a close-up photo of the porch berries too but can't find that again... still looking.

www.websleuths.com

ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 7

What NO ONE is paying attention to with the house plan, and it’s easily confusing, is, THERE’S TWO SETS OF STAIRS!!! Only one set of the stairs go up to Maddie & Kaylee’s floor. On the 3rd floor, you have the stairs in the front coming up from the first floor, & then the stairs that led up...
www.websleuths.com www.websleuths.com
 
diabeticrockstar said:
My personal theory, formed after reading a collection of opinions thru threads 12&13, several unusual discrepancies in the timeline & official releases, and statements given by family members to traditional media outlets:

I believe the intended target was Xana. (Secondary Q's: Has she always had the 2nd floor BR? What was father referring to when he stated she had "recently turned her life around"?). I believe there was a triggering event that occurred earlier in the night; the timeline given by LE still does not account for several hours. First they released X & E were at party from 8p to 130a. Then they changed it to 8p to 9p five days ago. Yesterday they ammend their timeline to say that X/E arrived back home at 130 but did not say they attended the party entire time. (Additionally, this would explain the specific request for tips about the frat party. There has been rampant, thus far not founded, rumors of an incident at that party. Frat also went dark online unlike the girls' sororities). Conflicting the released info is X'S father stating he talked to her around midnight. (Partying at a frat...take 5 min to call dad at midnight?). She told her dad that her and E were "staying at home to watch a movie"--if this is true I doubt police would leave the timeline as-is.
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I'm with you at the moment. I'm very curious about where X and E were in those unaccounted-for hours, and whether they were together the entire time. I went to a frat-heavy uni and I can't imagine Sigma Chi was the only house with a party that night, but in my experience a brother wouldn't only stay at his house's party for an hour.
 
Something happened to me in college that I want to share.
I lived off campus and my roommates and I were having a party. At some point a group of us went into the bathroom and were chatting. All of a sudden a guy opened the shower curtain and ran out of the bathroom and out of the house. We did not catch him, nor did we call the police.
Got me thinking, is it possible that this person was already hiding in the house when they arrived home.
 
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