MD MD - Upper Marlboro, WhtFem 18-30, UP2260, bus ticket, deformed foot, tattoos, Sep'79

I'm not an expert, but I'll share what I know.

They do sometimes do retouched autopsy photos. The issue is that depending on the condition of the face, the degree of swelling from injuries, and so forth, LE may not feel that the death photo accurately reflects what the person looked like in life. Since the point of the reconstruction/composite/whatever they call it is to produce an image that will be recognized by people the victim knew that may mean making a sketch or reproduction of some kind.

A composite sketch is put together by a police artist using a set of standard features, usually the FBI's Facial Identification Catalog. Usually there's a witness giving the description and picking out the features. Here's a link that explains the process: COMPOSITE DRAWINGS
In this case, I'm not sure whether the artist worked from a witness who had seen Jane while she was alive, or if the artist worked by looking at the victim's face or the autopsy photos. Probably a combination.

A reconstruction usually works from the postmortem photos or the victim's remains, often using the skull as the basis for detailed analysis of bone structure, depth of fat and muscle tissue, and all the rest.

Artist's revision would mean that the new artist worked from the composite, giving it a more realistic look. I've seen some very useful versions of this where the artist gives a variety of possibilities for what the person might have looked like--dressed up, different lengths and colors of hair, different body weights, etc. These look pretty basic.

The current trend is for very realistic, almost photographic reconstructions, like the ones CarlK does. But when I took a forensics class a couple of years ago, they said that often the exaggerated "caricature" style produces better results than more realistic images, because friends or relatives recognize things like "that looks like old Joe with his big ears. whatever happened to him? Maybe I'd better call." Whereas if a photo-like picture isn't exactly right, it sometimes gets dismissed.

Thanks for that information. I used to work with LE and knew a few individuals who did the reconstructions of remains. One LE had literally hundreds of pictures of missing people pinned to boards in his office. He would put a skull on a stand that had a swivel or gimble on it. He would enlarge a photograph and put on a projector then move the skull around to imitate the angle of the head then superimpose the picture to see if it would line up with the skull. A civilian staff member recreated a couple of UIDs that were identified.
 
I find it so weird that no one seems to have any records of her tattoos. It doesn't make any sense. As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. If they had taken images way back when maybe there would be a record of them. Now, after 40 years I wonder what concrete evidence is even around.

yes exactly and what is also weird is her profile mentions some tattoos but then the video mentions other tattoos on her leg which her profile did not mention. Below is a snip of an early post I wrote. Just makes me wonder if there were any others. Or anything else is different.


Several tattoos:

"LOVE" at the upper right arm then "143",
"Rudy", a red heart and "C.S." on right forearm/
"F.A.L." and a star on outside of left wrist.


In the video above it mentions the tattoos but a bit differently

Right arm she had " LOVE " "143" "Rudy" and a heart with CS.

F.A.L. on her left forearm
a Star on her left wrist

a Heart with and arrow on her upper right leg
 
Thanks for that information. I used to work with LE and knew a few individuals who did the reconstructions of remains. One LE had literally hundreds of pictures of missing people pinned to boards in his office. He would put a skull on a stand that had a swivel or gimble on it. He would enlarge a photograph and put on a projector then move the skull around to imitate the angle of the head then superimpose the picture to see if it would line up with the skull. A civilian staff member recreated a couple of UIDs that were identified.

Oh that is really really interesting. That is amazing people were identified by just projecting the image over the skull!!

I do have to give people that do reconstructions on bare skulls credit it’s definitely a skill to make it look like a person and then to make it look like the person when they were alive. Definitely an artistic skill.
 
Oh that is really really interesting. That is amazing people were identified by just projecting the image over the skull!!

I do have to give people that do reconstructions on bare skulls credit it’s definitely a skill to make it look like a person and then to make it look like the person when they were alive. Definitely an artistic skill.

Well, they weren't always successful. His methodology was to ensure that the basic facial structure of the missing person - cheekbones, jawline, etc lined up with what they could see on an image before they would even attempt to do the clay build up.

It made me wonder what would happen if there were two missing people with very similar bone structure who could be matches but you only have the image of one of them that shows they have a hooked nose or very full lips or fat cheeks. Would it be possible to create an image of the wrong missing person? Hopefully by the time you got that far you could extract some DNA from the remains before misidentifying someone.
 
Well, they weren't always successful. His methodology was to ensure that the basic facial structure of the missing person - cheekbones, jawline, etc lined up with what they could see on an image before they would even attempt to do the clay build up.

It made me wonder what would happen if there were two missing people with very similar bone structure who could be matches but you only have the image of one of them that shows they have a hooked nose or very full lips or fat cheeks. Would it be possible to create an image of the wrong missing person? Hopefully by the time you got that far you could extract some DNA from the remains before misidentifying someone.


I do often wonder how many people have been misidentified:eek:
 
Yes Yes I found that early on also when I was looking into her tats. It’s on this thread in the beginning. I believe that is prob what the star on the wrist is.
Should have known that you’d already be on top of this @madamx :p
I truly appreciate your NYC smarts and knowledge about alternative culture, fashion, and music.
What I would have given to have fully experienced those eras when all the most exciting artists and musicians got their start in your city...Warhol, Dylan, Basquiat, Patti Smith, the Bitter End, Blue Note, CBGB’s....
Sigh.
My daughter lived next door to the Bowery Ballroom a few years back (Her Park Avenue grandmother sadly didn’t live to see the day). I asked my kid if she felt safe coming home at night, she assured me she did; the Ballroom Bouncers knew her and had her back. Love love, love New York.
 
Should have known that you’d already be on top of this @madamx :p
I truly appreciate your NYC smarts and knowledge about alternative culture, fashion, and music.
What I would have given to have fully experienced those eras when all the most exciting artists and musicians got their start in your city...Warhol, Dylan, Basquiat, Patti Smith, the Bitter End, Blue Note, CBGB’s....
Sigh.
My daughter lived next door to the Bowery Ballroom a few years back (Her Park Avenue grandmother sadly didn’t live to see the day). I asked my kid if she felt safe coming home at night, she assured me she did; the Ballroom Bouncers knew her and had her back. Love love, love New York.

Awwww Iam sorry if I sound like a crazy know it all... I just try and apply the real life knowledge that I have of the time and culture to the cases that I see fit. Especially when it comes to NYC or like you said Alternative.

It’s strange, I think Iam attracted to cases that remind me of people that I’ve known ( I met so many from so many walks of life) or places I have been. I feel there might be something or details that just might help with something that could of been overlooked I guess. I don’t know.

Omg the Bowery Ballroom! yes, I seen shows there.. ahhh CBGBs yes yes yes.. The Ritz before it moved to the old Studio 54 location..oh how I miss seeing shows oh don’t get me started ha!!

Oh your daughter Iam sure definitely has stories and her grandmother ( Park Ave ...ooh Fancy) omg how I would of loooove love to hear her stories!!!! I wonder if I ever crossed paths with either of them?! Ha! ...

Believe it or not NYC was not as big as it seemed. I remember (this was memorable we still talk about it) yeeeeeeeears ago my ex boss (Still friends she’s from Brooklyn) and I walked down from Times Square to 8th and 1st ave and on the way we literally bumped into 9 different people ( in different locations) that between the both of us we knew. We even walked past Benicio Del Toro ( before he was big star) on that same walk. That day I remember we saying geeeze I guess we really have been here a Long time or NYC is That small.
 
Well, they weren't always successful. His methodology was to ensure that the basic facial structure of the missing person - cheekbones, jawline, etc lined up with what they could see on an image before they would even attempt to do the clay build up.

It made me wonder what would happen if there were two missing people with very similar bone structure who could be matches but you only have the image of one of them that shows they have a hooked nose or very full lips or fat cheeks. Would it be possible to create an image of the wrong missing person? Hopefully by the time you got that far you could extract some DNA from the remains before misidentifying someone.

That's why LE will almost never make an identification just from photos. People can and do have very similar features, sometimes nearly identical.
 
Yes your right.. Good point and you know Dr. Martens became the punk boot of choice ( I got my first pair in 1985 and still wear Docs) BUT they started out as an orthopedic shoe. This unidentified woman had a deformed arch. She could of been wearing them for both comfort and style.

How I wonder if there were photos of her tattoos and her clothing that they just never released.

Relative to the sexual orientation possibility: Doc Martens were pretty popular with the lesbian crowd around then.
 
Elizabeth Ellen Palmer 3979DFVA

It's possible in the 5 years between 1972 and 1979 she could've acquired those tattoos and gained weight to account for the differences. ?

3979DFVA - Elizabeth Ellen Palmer

Date of Birth: March 16, 1952
Age: 20 years old
Race: White
Gender: Female
Height: 5'4"
Weight: 115 lbs.
Hair Color: Dark brown, She usually wore it around her shoulders, but right before she left she had cut it really short.
Eye Color: Blue
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Freckles, Bent right pinky finger

214UFMD

Estimated Age: 18-30 years old
Race: White
Sex: Female
Height: 5'5"
Weight: 173 lbs.
Hair Color: Brown, 4 inches long
Eye Color: Blue
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Medium build. Old deformity in arch of left foot. 1 1/2 inch scar beneath right elbow. Several tattoos: "LOVE" at the upper right arm then "143", "Rudy", a red heart and "C.S." on right forearm/"F.A.L." and a star on outside of left wrist.
 
Well, after doing more research it states on Elizabeth Ellen Palmer's WS page she has been found but didn't want any contact with her family. Her Namus and Charley Project profiles are no longer active, however the Doe Network still has her profile active. So, I'm not entirely sure how to confirm one or the other.


Elizabeth Ellen Palmer 3979DFVA

It's possible in the 5 years between 1972 and 1979 she could've acquired those tattoos and gained weight to account for the differences. ?

3979DFVA - Elizabeth Ellen Palmer

Date of Birth: March 16, 1952
Age: 20 years old
Race: White
Gender: Female
Height: 5'4"
Weight: 115 lbs.
Hair Color: Dark brown, She usually wore it around her shoulders, but right before she left she had cut it really short.
Eye Color: Blue
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Freckles, Bent right pinky finger

214UFMD

Estimated Age: 18-30 years old
Race: White
Sex: Female
Height: 5'5"
Weight: 173 lbs.
Hair Color: Brown, 4 inches long
Eye Color: Blue
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Medium build. Old deformity in arch of left foot. 1 1/2 inch scar beneath right elbow. Several tattoos: "LOVE" at the upper right arm then "143", "Rudy", a red heart and "C.S." on right forearm/"F.A.L." and a star on outside of left wrist.
 
It would seem that this young woman had hitched a ride and was let out at the Maryland Route 4/Pennsylvania avenue exit of I-95. She might have been struck on I-95 and her body ejected from I-95 to the area of the Route 4 underpass.

It is possible that she intended to get off there and travel into Washington DC via Pennsylvania Ave (Maryland Route 4) - OR it is also possible that her ride got off at that exit and that she intended to continue on I-95 (probably headed north) and was trying to hitch another ride.

That area is closer to Camp Springs or Forestville, Maryland rather than Upper Marlboro, which is ten miles further south on Route 4. There seems to be no evidence linking her to Upper Marlboro or to suggest that she was either travelling to or from there.
 
It would seem that this young woman had hitched a ride and was let out at the Maryland Route 4/Pennsylvania avenue exit of I-95. She might have been struck on I-95 and her body ejected from I-95 to the area of the Route 4 underpass.

It is possible that she intended to get off there and travel into Washington DC via Pennsylvania Ave (Maryland Route 4) - OR it is also possible that her ride got off at that exit and that she intended to continue on I-95 (probably headed north) and was trying to hitch another ride.

That area is closer to Camp Springs or Forestville, Maryland rather than Upper Marlboro, which is ten miles further south on Route 4. There seems to be no evidence linking her to Upper Marlboro or to suggest that she was either travelling to or from there.
Thank you Richard for all that info, do you think her thread info be changed?.
 
Thank you Richard for all that info, do you think her thread info be changed?.
It probably won't be. I do not know who first listed her as being found in Upper Marlboro, but it could be that it was because Upper Marlboro is the county seat for Prince Georges County - or that the County Sheriff Headquarters is based there.

I feel that she was simply transiting through the area and met with a very unfortunate and fatal accident. She was probably from some where along I-95 either in Florida or somewhere north of Washington DC. I don't think that she had any family in the local area where she died.
 
It probably won't be. I do not know who first listed her as being found in Upper Marlboro, but it could be that it was because Upper Marlboro is the county seat for Prince Georges County - or that the County Sheriff Headquarters is based there.

I feel that she was simply transiting through the area and met with a very unfortunate and fatal accident. She was probably from some where along I-95 either in Florida or somewhere north of Washington DC. I don't think that she had any family in the local area where she died.
She had the bus ticket which was from Florida to Georgia. I have the same feeling as you I don’t think she was from that area. I think she was just passing that area and like you said probably got let off and possibly going to hitch another ride.
 
Unidentified Female: three different composite drawings

214UFMD2.jpg
214UFMD.jpg
214UFMD1.jpg

Date of Discovery:
September 30, 1979
Location of Discovery: Upper Marlboro, Prince George's County, Maryland
Estimated Date of Death: Hours prior
State of Remains: Recognizable face
Cause of Death: Hit and run accident
 

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