IA IA - Johnny Gosch, 12, West Des Moines, 5 Sept 1982 #4

[nanny2five]

Sorry then, I took you up wrong. I didn't realise you were speaking hypothetically, I get what you mean now.

no problem at all, Cappuccino, please forgive me for my gruffness ((hugs)) i am interested to know, do you think there is any possibility of the Franklin Conspiracy having any merit at all? most of what i have read about it seems very out there, but then some of it isn't so far fetched. given what we know of human nature, in your opinion, could there be any truth to it at all? it is almost too disturbing to even contemplate.

 

[Cappuccino]

No problem, (hugs back).

The Franklin Conspiracy? Anything's possible, but I tend to work on the principle that claims should be backed with evidence, and extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. All we have here is wild claims made from some very dodgy people. Unless I saw something in the way of solid evidence I would dismiss the Franklin Conspiracy as a distraction.

IMO, its far more likely that there was a serial killer active in West Des Moines during the 1980s and Johnny, Eugene and Marc all fell prey to him. I especially can't get over the fact that Johnny and Eugene's disappearances are almost identical, and that looks to me like a lone, single perpetrator, not a paedophile ring. I can understand why Noreen Gosch doesn't want to believe that, in her place I would also prefer to believe anything that allowed me to think my son was still alive. But looked at through more objective eyes, I think the Franklin Conspiracy is about as realistic as George Bush plotting 9/11.

 

[believe09]

Some new information regarding LE in this case:

This week it was announced through the media that the State of Iowa was discontinuing the "Cold Case Task Force" in Polk County. During the news report on NBC, they sited Johnny Gosch's kidnapping as well as a few other case, saying they did not have the money to continue this Task Force.
Well it is news to the Johnny Gosch Foundation that there was a Cold Case Task Force, no one ever contacted Noreen or the Foundation regarding the case. I would suspect no one ever talked to the Martins or the Allen's either. The police in West Des Moines and the FBI have done prescious little since the case began but absolutely nothing in the past 14 years.
It would have been nice if they had at least sent some kind of notice to the families of this Task Force being shut down so that they did not have to learn of it on a TV show.
Could this just be another way of closing these kidnap cases forever so that it was as though "it never happened"?????? That would be my guess, since they have hounded Noreen for her DNA for the past two years and she declined to give it to them. We know they would have used it to claim some body in a morgue somewhere in the country, saying it was Johnny and closing the case. Noreen was advised by her attorney to decline to give her DNA to them for this reason. The police were upset when she refused to give it to them.
Earlier in the year when a corpse was suspected to be Johnny in Colorado, the medical examiner called Noreen and said the WDMPD had sent Johnny's dental records. She also told Noreen that the "WDMPD were pressuring her to say it was Johnny's body". The examiner then stated that in the dental records there was a "tooth restoration" (filling) in a certain tooth. Noreen replied "your corpse is not Johnny, he had a tooth restoration but in a different tooth". There was dead silence on the phone and the examiner then said " oh so you have seen the dental records then"??? Noreen replied " oh yes I have a set of them and know for certain your corpse is not Johnny so you should ask yourself why would the WDMPD try to pressure you to say it is Johnny when they know full well it is not"?
Following that phone call, Jim Rothstein contacted the medical examiner and also told her what has been going on in the Des Moines area concerning the cover up on the three kidnap cases.
This is just part of the latest activity on this 29 year old case.

Luke

http://www.franklinfiles.net/t45559241/cold-case-task-force/

if Johnny's mother refuses to give DNA thenit wouldn't surprise me that any task force would be shut down. if she's not cooperating, then I can see the state not wasting its resources on a long cold case.

 

[believe09]

Here is a MSM link to the budget issue with the cold case task force:

http://www.whotv.com/news/who-story-cold-case-20111012,0,3622593.story

Here is a link to the task force website, I believe:

Iowa Cold Case Task Force

 

[believe09]

I am not sure I understand why Noreen was unaware of their existence?

 

[anneonymous]

I'm almost embarrassed to bump this posts with such a trivial detail, but I didn't see it posted in any of the other JG threads. The 'violent foreign movie' from the March 2007 Johnny Gosch Foundation posts is well known to PC gamers. The Witcher was a "sword and sorcery" roleplaying game released in 2007. Known for its graphic depictions of (adult) sex and violence, gamers who grew attached to the characters would have searched the internet for the live-action movies based on the same series of Polish fantasy novels.

There's no more pedo content in The Witcher than in Lord of the Rings. (That being said, I still don't know if NG was thinking *everything* on a filesharing network is kiddie *advertiser censored*, or if she happened upon a molester's secret stash of network television specials.)

The Witcher

 

[SnowAngels]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...s&icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk3|111562

Only at the rumor stage right now, but still.

Does the Franklin Scandal "hoax" still seem so ludicrous?

 

[8truthseeker8]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...s&icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk3|111562

Only at the rumor stage right now, but still.

Does the Franklin Scandal "hoax" still seem so ludicrous?

Snowangels,

That was the first thing I thought of when this Sandusky story broke...... the Franklin Scandal.

 

[believe09]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...s&icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk3|111562

Only at the rumor stage right now, but still.

Does the Franklin Scandal "hoax" still seem so ludicrous?

Snowangels,

That was the first thing I thought of when this Sandusky story broke...... the Franklin Scandal.

IIRC, the Franklin Scandal involves politico's and high ranking people in Omaha.

I dont think there is any evidence that Sandusky was involved in a ring that pimped out children. Sandusky's MO was pretty consistent and he pursued the kids like a rejected lover when they were old enough to refuse contact with him.

I mean, the Catholic Church has not been accused of pimping out kids because the priests abused them.

Again, this is JMO.

ETA: The Franklin Scandal has been firmly debunked. The purported victims were charged with perjury, and the charges resulted in one being convicted and sentenced to 9-15 years.

 

[Jbrown324320]

Believe,
Time will tell about Sandusky. Hopefully they find no evidence of him selling children. I personally think he was too greedy.
Yes, the Catholic Church has had instances of priests sharing victims. Please see "Behind the Pine Curtain" for examples.
I also believe the Franklin scandal has not been 100% debunked. Just because a judge decided someone was lying doesn't mean the person was actually lying. Judges are human and have margins of error. Maybe the judge decided not to believe the witnesses because it would cause a major scandal or hurt some high ranking friends. They have been known to cover up things in the past and recently. Not all judges are honest.

 

[believe09]

Believe,
Time will tell about Sandusky. Hopefully they find no evidence of him selling children. I personally think he was too greedy.
Yes, the Catholic Church has had instances of priests sharing victims. Please see "Behind the Pine Curtain" for examples.
I also believe the Franklin scandal has not been 100% debunked. Just because a judge decided someone was lying doesn't mean the person was actually lying. Judges are human and have margins of error. Maybe the judge decided not to believe the witnesses because it would cause a major scandal or hurt some high ranking friends. They have been known to cover up things in the past and recently. Not all judges are honest.

Wasnt it a grand jury that twice shot down the idea of an organized pedophile ring?

ETA: And I just want to make sure I am understanding you-you are saying priests pimped out children to parishoners or other members of the community?

 

[Cappuccino]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...s&icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec1_lnk3|111562

Only at the rumor stage right now, but still.

Does the Franklin Scandal "hoax" still seem so ludicrous?

Yes, its still ludicrous.

Those of us who dismiss the Franklin Conspiracy have never done so because we were under some naive idea that paedophile rings don't exist. We all know they exist. So if this Sandusky rumour turns out to be true, it won't make any difference to the credibility of the Franklin conspiracy.

The reason people who have examined the evidence dismiss it is because....well, we've examined the evidence. None of their claims stand up to scrutiny, so while paedophile rings certainly exist, that particular paedophile ring seems to be a figment of John DeCamp's imagination.

 

[Leprikawn]

I for one, get information overload when I read about this case, and the cover ups, and pedophile rings. I, like everyone else, dont know what is true and what is not, and probably the truth is somewhere in the middle.

I do think his mother has boxed herself into a corner, and maybe its a corner she wants to be in. Maybe its better to live in this world, than a world where her son is dead. I think that might show in the fact she refuses to give DNA to find a match to find her son.

I have been on her website and I dont think she trusts a person on this planet. Maybe its justified and, maybe its not.

Its truly sad this little boy had this happen to him and the monster who did it may never be caught.

 

[Wondergirl]

I am just starting to read on this case, but, it seems very confusing.

Is there a good place to start?




.

 

[elepher50]

I am just starting to read on this case, but, it seems very confusing.

Is there a good place to start?




.

Honestly I have read the whole thing and there is no good place to start IMO.

eleph

 

[blah956]

i saw a couple of posts that said that paul had disappeared. did he ever *reappear*

 

[SnowAngels]

Yes, he had been participating on the Franklin Files website. Don't know if he still is.

 

[perico]

i saw a couple of posts that said that paul had disappeared. did he ever *reappear*

Bonnaci has a landscaping business in Nebraska (or at least that kind of business- repair, landscaping, etc...). I think he disappeared from the message boards a couple of years ago.

 

[OneLove]

I for one, get information overload when I read about this case, and the cover ups, and pedophile rings. I, like everyone else, dont know what is true and what is not, and probably the truth is somewhere in the middle.

I do think his mother has boxed herself into a corner, and maybe its a corner she wants to be in. Maybe its better to live in this world, than a world where her son is dead. I think that might show in the fact she refuses to give DNA to find a match to find her son.

I have been on her website and I dont think she trusts a person on this planet. Maybe its justified and, maybe its not.

Its truly sad this little boy had this happen to him and the monster who did it may never be caught.

If the mom won't provide DNA, two possibilities pop into my mind (other than not wanting remains identified).

Could she know with certainty that her son is living and shields him from becoming a public spectacle?

Or could she have "guilty knowledge" of what happened to him and want to keep that door shut forever to protect herself or someone close?

 

[celticthyme]

This case has always fascinated me, because of Jacob Wetterling, whose search I was a part of when he went missing. From time to time that case comes up and I return to the Internet to see if there is any more information. I just can not dismiss the information in the Franklin Scandal out of hand. Especially since what he was trying to say about all the various coverups seemed to support the fact that Paul Bonacci and Alishia Owens, Troy Boner were part of this horrid situation and they all reported being taken to these various political gatherings and right into the white house for sexual gratification of the upper echelons in government, at both the state and federal levels. The deaths of Troy Boner and Gary Caradori, the webs of corruption, cover ups and sex trafficking are endless. And there were hundreds of people trying to cover up the tracks of all that was happening. The fact that the kids were groomed and supplied with drugs in order for them to be pimped out by Franklin and his henchmen is well documented

Check out the many sites of information about the sex scandals in Washington DC, starting with the Bushes.The fact that Bonacci claims he was in the car when Johnny Gosch was taken, that Troy Boner speaks of the killing of Jacob Wetterling . . it is a cess pool of power and abuse whose tentacles reached to all levels of government. I have no idea of MKUltra had anything to do with this or not, but whatever happened to these kids is an abomination.