George Zimmerman's Injuries #1

[AJ Noiter]

Maybe we were the one's who misunderstood her. She clearly understood what she wanted to say whether or not we misunderstood her or not. If she misspoke it was never intentional and pointing it out seems like she is being criticized for not being truthful. The statement had nothing to do with the crime and she was not trying to mislead anyone. No wonder attorneys tell you to just say "no comment". jmo

Yet Mr. Taaffe (? I'm still not even sure if I'm spelling his name right) and Mr. Zimmerman's family doesn't see the same treatment from members of this forum on the opposing side? It works both ways, but I still say what you thought was criticism wasn't.

 

[LambChop]

BBM Not sure about you, but it only takes me miliseconds to extend my arms and lock my elbows.

Wouldn't that indicate that TM was about 3 foot away from GZ and because he was found face down he may have been in the process of getting up? Papa has posted pictures of positions where men are fighting with one on top of the other and it is clear that GZ would not have been able to get to his gun easily unless TM was getting up because TM would have been sitting on it. So if TM moved to try to get up it would have freed up access to the gun allowing GZ to shoot him if he had to extend his arm and lock his elbow, would it not???? jmo

 

[magnolia]

Plus some of the injuries on GZ are scratches and the ME report says TM has none of GZ's DNA under his nails so it is doubtful GZ received them from TM. If TM was hiding from GZ near those bushes it's possible they struggled there first and some of GZ's injuries came from the bushes, maybe they fell and TM was able to get away, ran GZ caught up with him and they landed where TM died.

With no bruises or cuts to TM's hands or DNA from GZ it does appear TM had little contact with GZ's face because something would have been there. There are a lot of fluids in the facial area. The nose, the mouth, GZ was bleeding. GZ claims TM had his hand over his mouth. There would have been some DNA on TM. So I do think a more likely sceniaro would have been TM was swinging his arms around but not because he was hitting, he was fighting to get loose from GZ's grip.

Also if those calls for help were continuous how was GZ yelling when his mouth was covered up by TM? I believe this is why Gilbreath is saying his statements are inconsistent. jmo

Will you please point out any scratches you see in this photo? ~Thanks~

 

[LambChop]

Yet Mr. Taaffe (? I'm still not even sure if I'm spelling his name right) and Mr. Zimmerman's family doesn't see the same treatment from members of this forum on the opposing side? It works both ways, but I still say what you thought was criticism wasn't.

That kinda proves my point because the way I read it, that is exactly what I thought. So I was reading it and not listening to someone speak in an excited utterance and misunderstanding what she is saying. Why bother mentioning it if it isn't even clear what she has said, that was my point. At the end of the day she will say "that is not what I said" and a listener will say that is what I heard. It has nothing to do with anything pertaining to the case.

This forum is a victim friendly forum. GZ's family is expected to support him and rightfully so. And so is Mr. Taaffe, I can understand them doing that. However whatever they say in support of GZ is fair game because he is the one with the charges. TM was never charged with doing anything wrong. An investigation has concluded that GZ should be charged and charged with 2nd degree murder which is more than we ever expected he would be charged with. This leads many people to believe TM was, in fact, a victim more so than just because he's dead from GZ shooting him.

TM's family was not there when this happened. They received a lot of misinformation themselves and I understand their frustration in trying to get to the truth when they see the son of a judge was set free under SYG without so much as an investigation. I know RZ said he never told the Chief or SA he was a former judge but that was one of the first things that was reported. Someone from LE gave that information out to the press because according to RZ he never mentioned it. jmo

 

[AJ Noiter]

Wouldn't that indicate that TM was about 3 foot away from GZ and because he was found face down he may have been in the process of getting up? Papa has posted pictures of positions where men are fighting with one on top of the other and it is clear that GZ would not have been able to get to his gun easily unless TM was getting up because TM would have been sitting on it. So if TM moved to try to get up it would have freed up access to the gun allowing GZ to shoot him if he had to extend his arm and lock his elbow, would it not???? jmo

It just indicates that the barrel of the gun was between 8in and 3ft (based on the 2"x2" stippling that occurred). You do not have to have your arm fully extended or locked to fire a shot.

Also, on the picture that Concerned Papa keeps posting - that's an image from training. They're not really fighting, and I think it's a rather old picture - I seem to recall seeing that same picture when I was in basic training. It is no real indication of how Mr. Martin would've been on Mr. Zimmerman - if it were you would expect to see defensive bruises on Mr. Zimmerman's arms or Mr. Martin having bruises from being punched. I think more realistically is something like this, though they're still not really fighting:

I say this image because Mr. Zimmerman could rotate his arms to get the gun, then as Mr. Martin turned to see what he had in his hand he could be shooting squarely in the chest. I'm not saying this is exactly how it happened, but it's probably a lot closer than the army training picture.

 

[LambChop]

One on his forehead and one possible one on his nose. jmo

 

[suzihawk]

Will you please point out any scratches you see in this photo? ~Thanks~

What are those little prickly looking marks on the tip of his nose from?

 

[stmarysmead]

<modsnip>

Justice requires we look at the whole truth. Sometimes the truth is not 100% flattering to the victim. It is not "blaming" or demonizing TM to know everything about him, his problems in the last year, his Facebook, his words on the Internet, videos that might be CONFIRMED as him on the Internet...this all goes to understanding the individual that was encountered by GZ that night.

We also need to know about GZ. But we cannot dig through every aspect of GZ's life and then say, TM is off limits. That is not justice.

By the way, trying to cast TM in such "perfection" can backfire. The Defense wlll be able to access his words on the Internet, videos and pictues TM posted. Is it wise to have the jury shocked to find out he had imperfections?

Death is not a trump card. If GZ had died that night from the beating, wouldn't we want TM to be able to present a full picture...without being shouted down and having HIS defenders called liars and HATERS of White-Hispanics?

The truth, I think, is that neither of these individuals was perfect. There is no angel or villian...just a perfect storm of events that put them on a collision course. I respect the grief of the Family. But I am weary of the media OVERKILL...spewing all hate toward GZ...and bestowing a teenager with MSM-Sainthood.

 

[jaded cat]

Will you please point out any scratches you see in this photo? ~Thanks~

On the bridge of his nose.

 

[jjenny]

What I'm suggesting is that it was extremely sloppy police work. One of the many reasons for this, in my personal opinion, is that the SPD had already made up their collective minds that the shooting of this unnamed and unknown young black man was of little importance compared to one of their own known citizens. One that they quite possibly already knew was the son of a magistrate judge.

What difference does it make? All of the omissions and inconsistencies in this investigation make a great deal of difference and call the entire sloppy investigation into question, IMO.

Normally, if police work was sloppy and guilt can not be proven, defendant isn't put on trial.
Prosecutors normally don't get to go to court and claim-well we really can't prove anything because police work was sloppy. It's not how it should work.

 

[jaded cat]

Justice requires we look at the whole truth. Sometimes the truth is not 100% flattering to the victim. It is not "blaming" or demonizing TM to know everything about him, his problems in the last year, his Facebook, his words on the Internet, videos that might be CONFIRMED as him on the Internet...this all goes to understanding the individual that was encountered by GZ that night.

We also need to know about GZ. But we cannot dig through every aspect of GZ's life and then say, TM is off limits. That is not justice.

By the way, trying to cast TM in such "perfection" can backfire. The Defense wlll be able to access his words on the Internet, videos and pictues TM posted. Is it wise to have the jury shocked to find out he had imperfections?

Death is not a trump card. If GZ had died that night from the beating, wouldn't we want TM to be able to present a full picture...without being shouted down and having HIS defenders called liars and HATERS of White-Hispanics?

The truth, I think, is that neither of these individuals was perfect. There is no angel or villian...just a perfect storm of events that put them on a collision course. I respect the grief of the Family. But I am weary of the media OVERKILL...spewing all hate toward GZ...and bestowing a teenager with MSM-Sainthood.

There is a huge difference between what the media might spew out and what posters here are saying. I never considered TM an angel and never said he was but on that night it was irrelevant. He wasn't the one with a gun and he's the one who ended up dead.

I've seen people ridicule FT because after the shooting, he was all over the TV, on any station that would have him. Same with Joe Oliver. They shouted to the mountaintop that GZ would never have done anything wrong, he was acting within his duties as a member of NW, he's never been a racist, etc. They were wrong and the fact that GZ didn't have an attorney to tell these guys to shut their mouths is unfortunate for GZ. Those guys didn't help GZ one little bit.

What the media says has nothing to do with what posters on this board say. I don't appreciate being the target of your anger when I had nothing to do with what ABC, NBC, CBS or any other TV network had to say, nor did any other poster here.

 

[ladonna]

The did find Zimmerman's blood on Trayvon's shirt, so Zimmerman's DNA in fact was on Trayvon's clothing. Also, another interesting piece of information. The gun was so close when it was shot, it was touching Trayvon's clothing. So shot at a very close distance.

"And crime-lab experts found that Zimmerman's blood was on several pieces of evidence: his shirt, his jacket, his gun and Trayvon's shirt."

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...rosecutor-angela-corey-new-evidence-documents

Hi Jenny

Can you direct me in the documents where to find this evidence?

And crime-lab experts found that Zimmerman's blood was on several pieces of evidence: his shirt, his jacket, his gun and Trayvon's shirt."

 

[stmarysmead]

There is a huge difference between what the media might spew out and what posters here are saying. I never considered TM an angel and never said he was but on that night it was irrelevant. He wasn't the one with a gun and he's the one who ended up dead.

I've seen people ridicule FT because after the shooting, he was all over the TV, on any station that would have him. Same with Joe Oliver. They shouted to the mountaintop that GZ would never have done anything wrong, he was acting within his duties as a member of NW, he's never been a racist, etc. They were wrong and the fact that GZ didn't have an attorney to tell these guys to shut their mouths is unfortunate for GZ. Those guys didn't help GZ one little bit.

What the media says has nothing to do with what posters on this board say. I don't appreciate being the target of your anger when I had nothing to do with what ABC, NBC, CBS or any other TV network had to say, nor did any other poster here.

You are not "the target of my anger." The Media reportingis. And certainly we are ALL influenced by it. How many of us have personal knowledge of evidence or private dectectives working the case. We rely on the media for our information.

Respectfully, a tragedy has occured...not necessarily a crime. GZ friends have yet to have their comments disproven. If statistics in that neighborhood support a high level of teenage crime, then calling GZ a racist is problematic AT BEST. They said he was no racist and he was doing his job. Nothing has disproved that.

Thank Heavens for true friends. How hard is must have been when the POPULAR thing to do was trash GZ. That's what makes them all the MORE believable IMO.

 

[RANCH]

Hi Jenny

Can you direct me in the documents where to find this evidence?

And crime-lab experts found that Zimmerman's blood was on several pieces of evidence: his shirt, his jacket, his gun and Trayvon's shirt."

The FDLE DNA reports begin on page 104 of this link.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/93951121/State-v-Zimmerman-Evidence-released-by-prosecutor

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Will you please point out any scratches you see in this photo? ~Thanks~

Sure, no problem.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Will you please point out any scratches you see in this photo? ~Thanks~

Here is a close up of the scratches on his nose.

 

[LambChop]

You are not "the target of my anger." The Media reportingis. And certainly we are ALL influenced by it. How many of us have personal knowledge of evidence or private dectectives working the case. We rely on the media for our information.

Respectfully, a tragedy has occured...not necessarily a crime. GZ friends have yet to have their comments disproven. If statistics in that neighborhood support a high level of teenage crime, then calling GZ a racist is problematic AT BEST. They said he was no racist and he was doing his job. Nothing has disproved that.

Thank Heavens for true friends. How hard is must have been when the POPULAR thing to do was trash GZ. That's what makes them all the MORE believable IMO.

BBM: Here in lies the problem. It was not his job. He only had to report it to LE. This is why an innocent young man is dead, not guilty of the crimes GZ was suspicious of. No one else in the neighbor misunderstood what they were instructed to do if they saw a crime, they reported it. Did not interfer but reported it to 911. Why was it that only GZ misunderstood a program he helped put together and supported 100%. He knew what he was suppose to do and yet he ignored those instructions. I guess we could say he now has a better understanding of why LE did not want him to pursue TM. jmo

 

[jjenny]

BBM: Here in lies the problem. It was not his job. He only had to report it to LE. This is why an innocent young man is dead, not guilty of the crimes GZ was suspicious of. No one else in the neighbor misunderstood what they were instructed to do if they saw a crime, they reported it. Did not interfer but reported it to 911. Why was it that only GZ misunderstood a program he helped put together and supported 100%. He knew what he was suppose to do and yet he ignored those instructions. I guess we could say he now has a better understanding of why LE did not want him to pursue TM. jmo

While its all true, if all people did only what they were supposed to, world would have been a much better place.

 

[LambChop]

Here is a close up of the scratches on his nose.

With all those scratches and nothing under TM's nails I find it hard to believe they came from TM because we know he didn't have time to wash his hands. jmo

 

[LambChop]

While its all true, if all people did only what they were supposed to, world would have been a much better place.

And when they don't they have to expect to be held accountable for it. And that is why he was charged, IMO. jmo