Witness accounts

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What ever injuries GZ had are a result of TM trying to save his own life, unfortunately a bullet to the heart trumps a punch if it ever occurred.
 
jjenny said:
I think people are watching too much CSI. Forensic evidence never is going to be all perfect like it is in the movie.
Which appears to be what some expect around here.
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I think you're right. I was about to do a bit of research and propose 3-4 cases where DNA wasn't found under the fingernails and there WERE scratches, but meh.. it's Sunday and I'm being lazy.
 
mikeysmommom said:
There are medical pictures,responders,and also police and EMT reports stating the extensive injuries that a 28 yr old man received within a very short but brutal assault. I do not understand now that documents have been released how it could be stated that George Zimmerman injuries are that he
supposedly suffered a broken nose, two black eyes , head being bashed into the sidewalk that was written above.He did receive these injuries there is proof. I have watched boxing since I was very young and can remember Ali being in the ring looking "Pretty" as he always called himself and his opponent looking a bleeding mess in 1 round. The Length of a Boxing Round for men is 3 min ,of course TM was not a pro boxer but if you have ever watched a match that 3 minutes sure seems like a long time.TM surprised GZ with his first punch and TM did not stop fighting until GZ had no choice but to stop him IMO.Most people do not bruise after death that could be why TM hands didn't bruise.There was nothing supposed about GZ injuries,the fact is he was beaten by TM without a doubt.
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Every injury GZ sustained, either from a fall or an assualt (we have no proof of either) were SUPERFICIAL ABRASIONS & CUTS.

GZ had no documented broken bones, bruising on his hands, forearms, shoulders, torso or legs and feet. He had no contusions (goose eggs) or concussion.

Perspective & Proportion Please.
 
AJ Noiter said:
I'm not sure what to think of that. It's not the redacted copy that was released in the mini-doc dump. It also doesn't have Officer Smith's supplemental - so at the very least it's not complete. It's only 3 police reports, and do we have the EMT's report yet? I've been out for a couple days due to construction in the area, so there may be new information that was released that I haven't read.
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That is from a report released by SPD early in the case. It struck me and others as odd that it appeared Officer Smith's report was filled with exculpatory information for Zimmerman. Out of all the things Officer Smith saw and did at the scene he reported seeing grass on Zimmerman's back that does not show up in the pictures he heard Zimmerman say to the EMT that he was yelling for help and nobody helped him. An important comment like that and the EMT states Zimmerman was just quiet.

Recording of EMT's statement.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/vide...ecalls-scene-Zimmerman-s-injuries#pl-68832490
 
jjenny said:
I think people are watching too much CSI. Forensic evidence never is going to be all perfect like it is in the movie.
Which appears to be what some expect around here.
Click to expand...
never watched it. I follow real cases and sadly dna is found under the nails of little children who fought for their lives while being raped and murdered. Im thinkin in this case where gz claims to be beaten so severely that he had to take the life of TM, there would be dna.... but thats me......
 
Dr.Fessel said:
That is from a report released by SPD early in the case. It struck me and others as odd that it appeared Officer Smith's report was filled with exculpatory information for Zimmerman. Out of all the things Officer Smith saw and did at the scene he reported seeing grass on Zimmerman's back that does not show up in the pictures he heard Zimmerman say to the EMT that he was yelling for help and nobody helped him. An important comment like that and the EMT states Zimmerman was just quiet.

Recording of EMT's statement.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/vide...ecalls-scene-Zimmerman-s-injuries#pl-68832490
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Ok, now that I've heard that I can reply appropriately. Thanks for the link. It's not a big deal really, like I've pointed out before the human brain isn't perfect and studies have shown that most people forget 50% of things that happened the day before. No big deal, really.
 
AJ Noiter said:
Ok, now that I've heard that I can reply appropriately. Thanks for the link. It's not a big deal really, like I've pointed out before the human brain isn't perfect and studies have shown that most people forget 50% of things that happened the day before. No big deal, really.
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It is just one more thing adding to the hinky of the case in my book with the reports and statements.
 
IMO

There was contact, talking, more talking, pulling, pushing, grabbing, falling and chasing, wrestling and scuffling possibly from close to the poop disposal can or the first tree and maybe even the hedgerow beside the first house.

Each witness saw only a snapshot or the part within their view...unless John watched all of it before he shut his door, locked it and went "upstairs" to call 911 and heard heard the "pop". That would assume he did not see the last several seconds and why he didn't know if it was a gunshot or a rock.

If there was a fight or as John described it, a "throwdown," that part occurred near the beginning but not were TM obviously ran to...
 
AJ Noiter said:
Ok, now that I've heard that I can reply appropriately. Thanks for the link. It's not a big deal really, like I've pointed out before the human brain isn't perfect and studies have shown that most people forget 50% of things that happened the day before. No big deal, really.
Click to expand...

Which is why the 911 calls describing what witnesses are seeing or have just seen carry more weight than statements made after others have had input or even after the witness sees the scene with different lighting, etc
 
Just K said:
Every injury GZ sustained, either from a fall or an assualt (we have no proof of either) were SUPERFICIAL ABRASIONS & CUTS.

GZ had no documented broken bones, bruising on his hands, forearms, shoulders, torso or legs and feet. He had no contusions (goose eggs) or concussion.

Perspective & Proportion Please.
Click to expand...

I agree with that. Those injuries in the photos are minor and appear to be scratches to me. The slight cut on his nose doesnt mean his nose was broken. As I read the Dr's report, GZ "Might have" a broken nose. That doesn't mean his nose was broken at all. It means it might be and IMO it is in the report as a result of GZ insisting his nose was broken. The Dr. instructed him to go to an ENT specialist, but GZ declined. Why is that? Maybe GZ feared the ENTwould determine his nose was not broken. And those scratches? If they were caused by TM his body would have had DNA under his fingernails. I think GZ either hid in or fell in some bushes. In fact, if one looks closely, what might at first appear to be lacerations are merely blood trickles from the scratches. There is nothing serious and certainly nothing life-threatening shown in those pics. I also think that if TM slammed GZ's head into a cement walkway a number of times, TM's knuckles would be abraded in some way because while slamming GZ's head, TM's knuckles could not but have come into contact with the cement too. Yet, the only injury is a 1/4" cut on his left ring finger, not on the knuckle at all but below his knuckle. The injuries GZ claims could not have been caused by TM who's body was not injured save for this tiny cut and a gaping hole in his chest caused by GZ's use of hollow-point bullets, and a shredded heart and lungs.
 
Lovelymountains said:
I agree with that. Those injuries in the photos are minor and appear to be scratches to me. The slight cut on his nose doesnt mean his nose was broken. As I read the Dr's report, GZ "Might have" a broken nose. That doesn't mean his nose was broken at all. It means it might be and IMO it is in the report as a result of GZ insisting his nose was broken. The Dr. instructed him to go to an ENT specialist, but GZ declined. Why is that? Maybe GZ feared the ENTwould determine his nose was not broken. And those scratches? If they were caused by TM his body would have had DNA under his fingernails. I think GZ either hid in or fell in some bushes. In fact, if one looks closely, what might at first appear to be lacerations are merely blood trickles from the scratches. There is nothing serious and certainly nothing life-threatening shown in those pics. I also think that if TM slammed GZ's head into a cement walkway a number of times, TM's knuckles would be abraded in some way because while slamming GZ's head, TM's knuckles could not but have come into contact with the cement too. Yet, the only injury is a 1/4" cut on his left ring finger, not on the knuckle at all but below his knuckle. The injuries GZ claims could not have been caused by TM who's body was not injured save for this tiny cut and a gaping hole in his chest caused by GZ's use of hollow-point bullets, and a shredded heart and lungs.
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So TM was just laying on GZ? TM tripped and fell on GZ and then laid on him, with his face in his GZ's chest...as GZ imanaged to beat his own nose, and manuver his hands (underneath TM now) draw a gun ...and shoot him?

WWhy would GZ beat himself instead of TM?

I'm trying to fairly understand this scenario.

Have you seen The Fight Videos purported to be TM? If they are false, no problem. If Defense can verify...they will be very telling. We shall see.
 
jjenny said:
I presume because he wasn't. I am pretty sure Mary C and her roommate claim GZ asked them to call 911.
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One of the pics of GZ from that night show him on the phone to someone. Who might that have been? He asked someone to call 911 and someone else to call his wife. Who was GZ calling?
 
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[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171440"]The PayPal Defense Fund - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
 
stmarysmead said:
So TM was just laying on GZ? TM tripped and fell on GZ and then laid on him, with his face in his GZ's chest...as GZ imanaged to beat his own nose, and manuver his hands (underneath TM now) draw a gun ...and shoot him?

WWhy would GZ beat himself instead of TM?

I'm trying to fairly understand this scenario.

Have you seen The Fight Videos purported to be TM? If they are false, no problem. If Defense can verify...they will be very telling. We shall see.
Click to expand...

How does referring a fight show anything damaging against TM?
 
Just K said:
IMO

There was contact, talking, more talking, pulling, pushing, grabbing, falling and chasing, wrestling and scuffling possibly from close to the poop disposal can or the first tree and maybe even the hedgerow beside the first house.

Each witness saw only a snapshot or the part within their view...unless John watched all of it before he shut his door, locked it and went "upstairs" to call 911 and heard heard the "pop". That would assume he did not see the last several seconds and why he didn't know if it was a gunshot or a rock.

If there was a fight or as John described it, a "throwdown," that part occurred near the beginning but not were TM obviously ran to...
Click to expand...

--john isn't sure who was screaming that night either.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/na...in-evidence-witness6-20120518,0,1900533.story

Key witness in Trayvon Martin shooting: I'm no longer sure Zimmerman was crying for help
 
jaded cat said:
How does referring a fight show anything damaging against TM?
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First of all, these Fight Club videos need to be verified. Secondly, I don't think they damage TM at all. We are discusing witness statements. These videos may have defense value in rebuttal.

They do show he can really throw a punch and is an aggressive fighter. If witness accounts need to be rebutted or...supported...videos (if true) can show that TM was a very talented fighter. He could take on GZ with no trouble.
 
If we can't link these so-called fight club videos, should we even be discussing them?
 
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