Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #35

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Goodness me, way too complicated(as I am discovering with all my assignments). Despite web links being easy to link and refer to, they are buggers to put in the right order for the Harvard system!

I prefer Chicago referencing as it lends itself to citing online sources. Also MS Word footnotes fit nicely into Chicago. Really throws me out when a non law lecturer wants Harvard referencing.

Totally off topic
 
Oh please don't take my posts the wrong way. I am not for a moment questioning Hawkins' value here - as I said, I enjoy his posts as much as the rest of you.

All I was doing was asking about verification, so that when he posts something like the hint that there is more to come and it will be confronting to a jury, that sounds very much like inside information to me. Now if it came from a verified source, then we could take it as such. But from a non-verified source, surely it has no MORE standing than any other comment by the rest of us? I was purely interested in finding out how much veracity I could place on comments like that.

Just by way of example, if somebody posted that the ribs were connected to the thigh bone (joke) then it wouldn't mean much. But if I posted that, then hopefully it would carry a bit more weight (even if I did get the anatomy wrong....;) )

By the way - the ribs are NOT connected to the thigh bone.... ;)

Some people don't verify - for a variety of reasons. Some people do. It's amazing who drops in here for a look but don't register or verify - equally interesting those that post! We are not meant to sleuth other posters but it's not that hard to hazard a guess at some:) I myself am in the process of verifying but haven't sent in my docs to Kimster as I've been absolutely swamped this week. Important to know that there are differences in verification, ie. inside knowledge professional and being a local or all. I, for example, am a professional psychologist. I probably do get bits of info. on many criminal cases as I work in the field, but I am not a Brookfield local yet live at Kenmore. Unless you personally know the family quite well or are a verified insider then we are all just basicslly sleuthing - even the experts amongst us. Even locals are sluething btw:)

Some posters can offer a professional opinion, and some facts on our field of expertise/experience but many are not intimately connected with the case it appears. Solicitor, psychologist, doctor or whatever, mostly we are theorizing on this case like everyone else unless asked specific technical questions I guess. And everyone has a right to an opinion. We can entertain them, rule them out or put them down to salacious attention-seeking behaviour but some might hold truth for all we know.

I'm always interested in who gives thanks to particular posts or posters in general. I try to be objective. Some posts and indeed posters can make others on here frustrated and irate when they are mostly just offering opinions it seems. I see the attacks form quickly where some jump down a persons throat demanding a link etc. when some are simply just offer opinions. Hints are different but they can still be opinions. Take it or leave I guess.

I'm well aware of the rules, about links and opinions etc. However, It's best to decide quietly if you take it or leave it or perhaps message the person privately if you want to clarify. I don't think verified posters or insiders are being objective if they "thank" someone who is being confrontational or berating a poster who gives an opinion. I find that unprofessional if you're verified as no one has the right to suppress another's opinions or idea regardless of who and what you are. In that case it's better to say nothing at all. I am not making any specific reference to ANY verified poster on here be it professional, insider, local or ANY other poster. I am speaking broadly hoping we all play nice otherwise people drop off and with such a long wait there won't be many to chat and hypothesize with. Again...just saying that's all. Each to their own.
 
Oh please don't take my posts the wrong way. I am not for a moment questioning Hawkins' value here - as I said, I enjoy his posts as much as the rest of you.

All I was doing was asking about verification, so that when he posts something like the hint that there is more to come and it will be confronting to a jury, that sounds very much like inside information to me. Now if it came from a verified source, then we could take it as such. But from a non-verified source, surely it has no MORE standing than any other comment by the rest of us? I was purely interested in finding out how much veracity I could place on comments like that.

Just by way of example, if somebody posted that the ribs were connected to the thigh bone (joke) then it wouldn't mean much. But if I posted that, then hopefully it would carry a bit more weight (even if I did get the anatomy wrong....;) )

By the way - the ribs are NOT connected to the thigh bone.... ;)

Geez Doc, saw what you were saying, understood it completely and pow!!


feel for you brother, no intent there whatsoever!
 
Goodness me, way too complicated(as I am discovering with all my assignments). Despite web links being easy to link and refer to, they are buggers to put in the right order for the Harvard system!

So true but eventually you get used to it and it's 2nd nature. Like doing statistics...horribly frightening initially but through repetition the fear goes:) you'll be right!
 
Methinks vertebrae at the back and sternum at the front - but not all

Are we still talking about prawns?
I hate peeling them , but love eating them yummy
I am not saying NBC or gBC or OW are prawns :maddening:
Now... Read my post again....
:woohoo:
 
Thanks for sharing MM!

Does anyone believe that more than one person may have involved in a premeditated way, with Allison's death? My feeling has been definitely yes to involvement of others, but AFTER the murder. However, I recently heard from a sensible source (I would still treat it as rumour of course, not fact) that there was indeed involvement of more than one, in terms of premeditation. I was a bit gobsmacked by this - does anyone have a view on this? I just can't see what they had to gain - the life insurance payout really isn't worth the risk taken in my opinion (especially not when shared!), so is there much more we don't know, I wonder...

If it was a planned thing, the others involved must be furious with GBC as he sure made a mess of things.

What did they have to gain? Hmmm... I agree that the insurance money really isn't worth it, is it? But then people have done far worse for less.
Perhaps it may be more to do with what she KNEW... dodgy deals , could be anything... things we haven't even imagined... yet. {Give us time, I'm sure we will. lol}
I'm hoping it wasn't planned, makes it even worse. However I'm still thinking it falls somewhere in between... planned yet happened when he didn't expect it so it didn't work out the way he thought... and he got caught out. Horrible to think someone else supported him even before it happened.
 
Prawnies here too Amee. If the water is shallow enough prawns will feed on whatever is there. Allison may have been only partly submerged. I've been prawning in calf deep water and the little critters latched onto my leg. Not a nice feeling but they tasted nice the next day. The four to five days around the new moon are the best time to prawn. The prawns like the cover of darkness and prawning during a full moon is a waste of time.

MOO.

Oh Wow really, small world lol Ive only been prawning on our trawlers way out.
Maybe different gulfs are a bit different. Yep 5 days either side of the new moon is when we start over here.
There is a prawn conference in Cairns very soon :blushing:

http://www.pir.sa.gov.au/fisheries/commercial_fishing/prawn_spencer_gulf__and__west_coast_fishery
 
Doc I am going to assume that you have been reading from the beginning - I am quite surprised by your question to be honest.
Hawkins as has already been stated, has answered a lot of legal questions on here for members.
Verification has never come into it for me - his knowledge speaks for itself.

I think there are members on here who mix in legal circles and who know members of the QPS and who could probably post a lot more but are holding the integrity of those friends and relatives.

I think Hawkins legal knowledge is immense and when he is back on here, I am sure that he will continue to explain the situation in legal terms to us, as it arises.

All MOO
I agree. He never crossed any lines, we were the ones doing the asking and he always answered respectfully and politely. I loved his posts... and hope we do see him again soon.
 
So true but eventually you get used to it and it's 2nd nature. Like doing statistics...horribly frightening initially but through repetition the fear goes:) you'll be right!

Thanks! I think that there is an institutional fondness for Harvard system. As most of my references seem to be from journals that are written in collaboration they are ridiculously long to acknowledge all the authors!! Brain is suffering from lack of use - back to uni after 25 years - but repetition seems to be key (second nature to kids especially when asking for new toys!!)
 
Pulps - what do you make of placing Allison near or in water when she has a fear of it and also the Little Ugly Creek nearby????
Does that ping any thoughts about profiling for you?

It's a very good question Mani. I've thought a lot about it. My gut feeling and it's pure speculation is that she was placed there as its close to the Brisbane River and also perhaps because it might have been the most convenient place to dump a body in that area - even though a distance from the house. Often a body is easier found when buried. In water it's a little trickier but in a creek that is quite snaggy it's risky. The water also makes a difference to decomposition and trace evidence - but that's dependent on when the body is found. I think it seems apparent finding her was needed for the insurance money but I think GBC hoped she'd make it out into the river as:

1. More decomposition.
2. Further away reducing the likelihood he did it that night
3. Less chance for evidence and of course accurately determining cause of death - meaning it opens up the argument for suicide or abduction.

I personally think GBC wouldn't plead guilty as he's hoping the circumstantial case is weak and he'll get off via reasonable doubt. As Allison was found (and I think he was surprised perhaps by that) his MMO (means, motive, opportunity) are more established perhaps.

The creek is interesting. I know it but not well. The scout grounds is interesting also. One would have to think he knew that area reasonably well. As for where she ended up and started? Don't know. Lots of rain had to have played a part, and I don't think that was a factor considered by the dumper.

Just don't know - like the rest of us:) plenty of great ideas on here though. I think surveyors being seen there is important as someone reported on here.
 
I agree, and furthermore anyone in the mids of a murder and possible cover up would be confused. IMO even the most switched on healthy minded individual would have difficulty dealing with a situation like that, never mind a elderly man.

Well said Rational. :rocker:
 
Re Hawkins

In this world and in INDEED the world of forums there are givers and takers. Hawkins has since day one been a giver and I appreciate his posts.

Hawkins is very giving with their time when they are obviously a busy professional. They go to the trouble to explain things in great detail to us simple folk, while not being condesending or trying to STIR THE POT for their OWN entertainment.

As far a verification goes, it is not FOOL proof so it means nothing to me anyway(sorry to genuine verifieds). I think the wonderful group of people who are here to see Justice for Allison are smart enough to know not to take everything that is written on any forum as fact.
 
It's a very good question Mani. I've thought a lot about it. My gut feeling and it's pure speculation is that she was placed there as its close to the Brisbane River and also perhaps because it might have been the most convenient place to dump a body in that area - even though a distance from the house. Often a body is easier found when buried. In water it's a little trickier but in a creek that is quite snaggy it's risky. The water also makes a difference to decomposition and trace evidence - but that's dependent on when the body is found. I think it seems apparent finding her was needed for the insurance money but I think GBC hoped she'd make it out into the river as:

1. More decomposition.
2. Further away reducing the likelihood he did it that night
3. Less chance for evidence and of course accurately determining cause of death - meaning it opens up the argument for suicide or abduction.

I personally think GBC wouldn't plead guilty as he's hoping the circumstantial case is weak and he'll get off via reasonable doubt. As Allison was found (and I think he was surprised perhaps by that) his MMO (means, motive, opportunity) are more established perhaps.

The creek is interesting. I know it but not well. The scout grounds is interesting also. One would have to think he knew that area reasonably well. As for where she ended up and started? Don't know. Lots of rain had to have played a part, and I don't think that was a factor considered by the dumper.

Just don't know - like the rest of us:) plenty of great ideas on here though. I think surveyors being seen there is important as someone reported on here.


Hi Pulp.... Just a quickie message to you to say thankyou for your posts, I enjoy reading them and appreciate the time you take to be here.

Shell
 
What did they have to gain? Hmmm... I agree that the insurance money really isn't worth it, is it? But then people have done far worse for less.
Perhaps it may be more to do with what she KNEW... dodgy deals , could be anything... things we haven't even imagined... yet. {Give us time, I'm sure we will. lol}
I'm hoping it wasn't planned, makes it even worse. However I'm still thinking it falls somewhere in between... planned yet happened when he didn't expect it so it didn't work out the way he thought... and he got caught out. Horrible to think someone else supported him even before it happened.

I tend to mull this over as well. Something snapped. It may have been planned but the killing is the secondary behaviour. The primary behaviour is the motive. There was reason, there nearly always is even if a stranger is killed. So what made GBC go through with his plan or snap that night I wonder? The money is only a part of it I feel. I don't think he could be thinking TM was the one, because the risk of prison is too great if caught (and there was little doubt he'd be a prime suspect) and he had other women (at some point). If it was premeditated then it's the worst murder planned Ina long time. That's why I think he snapped that night. He could have planned to kill her in much simpler way without raising the suspicion he has is what I feel. The execution seems so sloppy with so many variables present he could have easily eliminated. I wonder if we will find out everything. There was certainly a bit that the jury never heard about Max Sica!
 
What is this phenomenom that keeps us glued to this forum, knowing that we have examined every theory every which way, the QPS are keeping tighter than a turtle's bum and MSM have gone home for the weekend? Can't someone just make something up? Surely SOMEONE saw the caterpillar driving the captiva!

Well, actually, now that you ask... I did see it that night, near the roundabout... no seatbelt on either... I was horrified. I didn't want to mention this earlier incase it started something.

There was actually another caterpillar too, looked a bit suss also.
 
Goodnight fellow sletuhers. Have the flu and should have pulled the pin an hour ago. Got to be up early tomorrow for child's school sport :( No sleep ins here unfortunately.
 
Well, actually, now that you ask... I did see it that night, near the roundabout... no seatbelt on either... I was horrified. I didn't want to mention this earlier incase it started something.

There was actually another caterpillar too, looked a bit suss also.

Was he sitting at the bus stop holding his head in his many hands?
 
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